REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Right wing solution to Failed Election: Go Further Right

POSTED BY: ANTHONYT
UPDATED: Thursday, October 25, 2018 17:33
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Friday, November 9, 2012 8:59 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
When you lose by 5 touchdowns it's time to review your playbook.

When you lose by a fieldgoal it's time to review your execution.





And when you lose by 126 points, it's time to sell the team.

Quote:


I will say that bronze age philosophy doesn't have a place in 21st century politics. Especially when most of the population is not religious and suspicious and fearful of those who are.




Cites? "Most of the population is not religious"? Huh. That's news to me. I must have missed all those atheists who got elected President in between the 44 christians in a row...



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Friday, November 9, 2012 9:01 AM

HKCAVALIER


Quote:

Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
I may be wrong, but I think prominent party supporters and party representative positions on abortion, contraception, and rape were even more damaging than their immigration stance.

It turns out a lot of people in this country are women, and some of them vote. Of those, a few vote in their own interests.


Certainly,

But so far the Right-wing mouth-pieces have yet to do any abouts face on those issues. Something tells me they ain't gonna either. After all, we have never been at war with Eurasia and there is no war on women.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, November 9, 2012 9:12 AM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
When you lose by 5 touchdowns it's time to review your playbook.

When you lose by a fieldgoal it's time to review your execution.





And when you lose by 126 points, it's time to sell the team.

Quote:


I will say that bronze age philosophy doesn't have a place in 21st century politics. Especially when most of the population is not religious and suspicious and fearful of those who are.




Cites? "Most of the population is not religious"? Huh. That's news to me. I must have missed all those atheists who got elected President in between the 44 christians in a row...




Romney lost by less than a million votes. Or 0.7% of the popular vote.

So, you WANT religion in politics? I'm surprised. This is a big turnaround for you, Kwindbago. Or are you just looking to pick a fight over WHY you shouldn't have religion in politics? I'll spell it out for you.

FIRST AMENDMENT.


Kwindbago, hot air and angry electrons

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Friday, November 9, 2012 9:18 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Quote:

Romney lost by less than a million votes.


Hello,

That does not match the reality I perceive.

--Anthony


Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

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Friday, November 9, 2012 9:22 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
Romney lost by less than a million votes. Or 0.7% of the popular vote.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012

Romney lost the popular vote by over 3 million votes, or about 2.5%.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

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Friday, November 9, 2012 10:05 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
When you lose by 5 touchdowns it's time to review your playbook.

When you lose by a fieldgoal it's time to review your execution.





And when you lose by 126 points, it's time to sell the team.

Quote:


I will say that bronze age philosophy doesn't have a place in 21st century politics. Especially when most of the population is not religious and suspicious and fearful of those who are.




Cites? "Most of the population is not religious"? Huh. That's news to me. I must have missed all those atheists who got elected President in between the 44 christians in a row...




Romney lost by less than a million votes. Or 0.7% of the popular vote.



Wrong answer. Try again.

He lost by 126 electoral votes. That's a landslide, according to right-wing pundits.

Quote:


So, you WANT religion in politics? I'm surprised. This is a big turnaround for you, Kwindbago. Or are you just looking to pick a fight over WHY you shouldn't have religion in politics? I'll spell it out for you.

FIRST AMENDMENT.




I didn't realize this was a thread about what I *WANT*; I thought it was a thread dealing with WHAT IS, not what should never be.

You said that most of the population is not religious. I question that view. Certainly *I'M* not religious, but your right-wing fucknut friends never tire of telling me I'm going to hell for that, which amuses me to no end.


CaveTrolLOLOLOLOL, part-time plagiarist and full-time douchebag.

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Friday, November 9, 2012 10:45 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Oh, Anthony, sweetie, I'm SO sorry! I never meant for you to go to all that trouble--I sincerely appreciate it, and thank you (I, too, am beginning to save some of the worst--all of it, by the way, from our righties! If I see anything equally hideous from a leftie, I will certainly save that too, I guarantee).

The "stupid fucking bitch" I see was a condensation of that post of Wulf's. I saved the thread when he first wrote it, just didn't realize you'd condensed it.

Six doesn't surprise me...for some strange reason he really went off the deep end when I started ignoring him. I didn't recognize until I saw the "ignore me" in the original that it was part of that.

And of course Raptor's is no surprise and I remembered it when he wrote it.

I'm sure equally vicious things have been said to/about others here, but until now I hadn't saved them. Am doing so in future, not PURELY out of spite (tho' yup, that's in there) but because of a personal desire to remind people of who we're "talking" to.

Thanx again Anthony; those are keepers!

By the way, Wulf also called me a "barren succubus"--but that was before I started noting URLs and dates, so I can't prove it. Just sayin'.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Friday, November 9, 2012 10:55 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Oh, and just for fun, there are a few others I saved--again, before I started keeping track of URLs, so they can call me a liar if they want to, but they DID post the following:
Quote:

Whozit: "Barry and ALOT of Demorats are going to lose BIG in November even if they get most of the minority vote, and then I will LAUGH AT YOUR PAIN!!"

SixString: "When we get Mitt into the President's Chair (which is an inevatibility now), I will vote for Dems in the congress in 2014. But seriously.... Mitt IS going to win in November. There is NO QUESTION about that."


Cave, you also posted "Cavetroll "Don't worry. the democrats will get their turn to play politics by obstruction." So we'll see just how "obstructive" Democrats are when they get the power. Make a note.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Friday, November 9, 2012 11:32 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


google knows all


http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=51450&mid=8
90266


Quote:

Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
"Oooo, there's another goodie to remember when anyone tries to defend Wulf."

Please do, you barren succubus.





"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"




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Friday, November 9, 2012 11:45 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:

Romney lost by less than a million votes. Or 0.7% of the popular vote.



Do you even TRY to look for facts before spouting bullshit??




Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, November 9, 2012 11:49 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Oh, dear, Anthony, look what you started...

Per my frustration with people responding to Rap asking for cites, etc., let us not forget this pearl:
Quote:

I do speak off the cuff, mostly, as I view these forums as more as free flowing conversations, and not term papers, to be accompanied by voluminous pages of cut and paste, or twenty seven eight-by-ten colour glossy photographs with circles and arrows and a paragraph on the back of each one.

But that's just how I roll. Your usage may vary.


Given his own words, I ask again: WHY does anyone bother asking him to back up what he says??

And Wulf; why does anyone bother with him when he posted the following, when asked "Do you TRY for Epic Fail, Wulfie - or does it just come natural to you?"

"I DO try. Its amusing to watch people foam at the mouth."

We all, of course, remember these gems from Rap after the gulf spill: “Mr. President--you're a god damn, mother fucking liar. Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.... oh, go fuck yourself, Mr. President”

...and his remarks to you, Anthony, at the same time: "Anthony--go fuck yourself...make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard”

and Frem, same time: ”Frem--You miserable piece of shit”

aaaand Mike: ”Kwicko--You're the putrid slime which oozes between troll's toes, you're so low.”

He seems to have been quite upset with everyone for a while there... (/sarcasm)

Toward Nick from Raptor, 10/28/12:
Quote:

And Nickerson ? You're a fucking moron. Go fuck yourself.
http://beta.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53367

I particularly liked this one: September 22, 2008 ( in response to Malbadinlatin, who said “I cite Iraq, the economy, and coming soon...energy shortages and environmental disasters. When Obama wins he will be saddled with an economy that waits for four to eight years for people to buy houses again. And a goat fuck of a war...among many other goodies Obama will inherit”)) Auraptor’s response: “There will be no envirmental disasters, any more than happens on a routine schedule. We need not worry about Obama winning. So he won't have to be burdened w/ anything.”
Quote:

Gems from Raptor regarding Dubya:

August 13, 2005: “When has Bush done anything but keep his word ?”

May 6, 2006: “After all, Bush was responsible for some damn good choices.

October 3, 2006: “Bush never once said Gitmo 'has to be ended'. To the contrary, he specifically said he would NOT close Gitmo, and is proud of the purpose for which it serves.”

August 8, 2007:” Bush, keeping America safe from Islamic Terrorist for 6+ years sicne 9/11, while cutting taxes, increasing revenue to the Treasury with 4 1/2 years of steady, economic growth” ... “there was no Illegal wiretapping, so excuse Bush for that too”

August 11, 2007 (defending the Katrina response): “it is imparitive that the state and local Governments acts as the primary responders” ... “The Fed Gov't can't and should never be expected to keep us safe from everything, all the time, everywhere” “We invaded Iraq because , after 10 yrs of sanctions, it did not live up to the obligations the U.N. had determined necessary ... “Iraq was invaded because it left us no choice

August 12, 2007: “Under Bush, the U.S. took in more tax revenue in history.” (Sig posted figures showing that untrue) “We have record revenues under Bush. Sorry, but they simply are ... Fed Revenue under Bush is higher than under Clinton. Had the US spent LESS than a drunken sailor, we'd have a surplus budget now. Had the US spent less than a buzzed sailor, our defecit would be less than 1/2 of what it is now. But we didn't, so it'll take longer to balance the budget. BFD. ... Aren't you glad we have real growth under Bush rather than the phony crap that Clinton's administration touted from the Dot Com charade ?”

March 8, 2008: “Bush is a fine American”

March 6, 2008: “Where ahs Bush lied ? Don't compare Bush to a pathological liar ( Clinton ) when he isn't.... Bush didn't lie per Iraq. Get over it.

July 8, 2008: “Mikey, what did Bush lie about ?”

March 11, 2008: “We don't torture.

March 12, 2008: “We don't torture.... WE DON'T DO THAT, MORON. ... Frem, you're a liar, a moron and an idiot ... We don't torture, and no matter how many times you suggest we do, I'll be right here, correcting you.”

Jan 20, 2009: “Since Bush committed no crimes, there's no possible chance he can get arrested.”


Just for reference, regarding Bush having "not lied":
Quote:

FROM THE WHITE HOUSE ARCHIVES:
Quote:

We found the weapons of mass destruction... and we’ve so far discovered two. But for those who say we haven’t found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they’re wrong, we found them.


To clarify that, seems I saved the following:(Text of an Interview of the President by TVP, Poland, FROM THE WHITE HOUSE, which can be found at http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/g8/interview5.html ).

Later, in an interview with Diane Sawyer, excusing his lie that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, by claiming that there was no difference between having weapons and wanting to have them. "So what's the difference?" http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/18/politics/18PREX.html?ex=1387083600&a
mp;en=8eb2b57b65a77b8d&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND


There is lots and LOTS more at http://mindprod.com/politics/iraqlies.html#LIES about the various lies that led up to the war.


Then there are the Rap de rigueurs, which we've all read so many times no cite is needed:
Quote:

And that's the sum total of your argument. You can't offer up any substantive, reasonable reply, other than dole out insults and dismissive, personal comments.

I'm always amused when the petulant little children pretend they're on the moral high ground and call others petulant children.

Quit making up shit. Either show some evidence or admit you can't.

I just would rather you do less projecting onto others and try comprehending more.

Why not just answer the question, and stop trying to change the subject or hurl mindless, petty insults ?


Ahh, a gentle walk down memory lane, what fun...

While I kept some of the, as Frem called it, "fullisade of jerkass rhetoric", I didn't keep URLs...I will in future. ;o)

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Friday, November 9, 2012 11:50 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Whozit: "Barry and ALOT of Demorats are going to lose BIG in November even if they get most of the minority vote, and then I will LAUGH AT YOUR PAIN!!"



http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=51825

Quote:

SixString: "When we get Mitt into the President's Chair (which is an inevatibility now), I will vote for Dems in the congress in 2014. But seriously.... Mitt IS going to win in November. There is NO QUESTION about that."


http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=51766&mid=8
94431





Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, November 9, 2012 11:54 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Ahh, thank you Kiki, I had no reference for that one.

And of course I, in particular, will never forget a certain "Kane":
Quote:

: "Niki--condescending arrogant fat old bi-polar hag .... You are an asshole ... one does not need a sockpuppet to tell you to fuck off".... eat shit you big government whore .... I do hate you ... You are an arrogant douche” ... “you fucking fat twinkie eating, money stealing whore” “but what else should I expect from a fucking shit-eating libtard mind. Now go do your research you fucking idiot”...”You are an old whore... fuck off” “You filthy dirty rotten old hag. You are an old cunt of a women. Go sit on a bike with no seat. Read what I just wrote, again, once more.....now go die”...”She is talking out of her old fat ass. Who is the bigger fucking idiot...you or that fat old white-haired, Buddhist, vegetable loving, hemp wearing, chronic masturbator?”...”I tell two douche bags that they are either gay or a stupid whore)...just a girl telling liberal idiots to fuck themselves. How is that trolling? You need to reevaluate your last two posts...or eat dick...or a lot of dicks....” "My guess is it won't just be your ugly face you dislike....if you had a soul.”

And PN, who's always been a staunch ally:
Quote:

PN: "Yes niki, you're Taliban. You can't be anything-ovich though, you have to be -ovna or -ova Nikita Nicovna Talibani. You are a triple agent, you clearly work for al Qaeda, the Mossad, and Obama Sotero Hussein of the Mao Mao rebels. Your mission here is to uncover the true identity of firefly posters, and their secret agendas, or is it agendae. Although, at times, when tracking down the wild whozit, you feel a bit like you have been sent on a false lead by Maxwell Smart."

Lovely people, all of them...

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Friday, November 9, 2012 12:00 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

Kane threatened to rape you and your roommate. I am not a good enough Christian to forgive him.

--Anthony


Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

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Friday, November 9, 2012 12:14 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Good gawd, Anthony, why would we bother FORGIVING Kane? Sweetie, far as I know (unless he WAS a sickpuppy...in which case he'll show up under another personna no doubt), he is long gone, and in my opinion wasn't important enough to pay attention to at the time, much less waste energy trying to forgive!

You are, nonetheless, AWFULLY sweet to feel that way.

I DO seem to rile some people up, don't I? I still occasionally (when I bother to think about it) wonder if Kane was someone's sickpuppy--someone here who wouldn't otherwise want to own up to the things he said...

...not that it's of the slightest importance.
Quote:

I will say that bronze age philosophy doesn't have a place in 21st century politics. Especially when most of the population is not religious and suspicious and fearful of those who are.

May not have occurred to you, Cave, that it's not about being suspicious and fearful of people who are religious, but of people who clearly indicate how they would CONTROL others to fit their beliefs. I have no problem whatsoever with anyone following any faith, only of those who would impose their faith on ME.

Oh Maaark...has someone been keeping track, hmmmm? Thank you; now I have links to back up the quotes. Goodie.

Chortle...Rap got all twisted in a knot at the idea of Obama saying the best revenge was to vote--which, by the way, beats the hell out of getting violent, as some Republicans seem to now be espousing--and it occurred to me after looking this stuff up that "The best revenge is to QUOTE!"

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Friday, November 9, 2012 12:22 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:

I DO seem to rile some people up, don't I?



There's a lot of late stage cro-magnons still lurking about, who clearly feel threatened by a woman with an opinion, and info to back them.

Funny how they always seem to fall under the same political umbrella...




Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Saturday, November 10, 2012 2:19 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

While I kept some of the, as Frem called it, "fullisade of jerkass rhetoric", I didn't keep URLs...I will in future. ;o)




Well, if you have the quotes, some quick Google-fu will get you the URL. Plug the quote into a Google search and it should pop up pretty quickly.

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Saturday, November 10, 2012 3:01 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:

I DO seem to rile some people up, don't I?



There's a lot of late stage cro-magnons still lurking about, who clearly feel threatened by a woman with an opinion, and info to back them.

Funny how they always seem to fall under the same political umbrella...




Yep, interesting that Kane zeroed in on Niki with vile sexually threatening language. He really is a sicko. I suspect he is in jail on methamphetamine charges.

I find PN kind of hilarious. It reminds me of the insults 5 year olds say to one another.


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Saturday, November 10, 2012 5:32 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)




Can't say I've ever heard a bunch of five year-old boys call each other dirty Jew operative Nazi Illuminati Satan-worshipping Molech-bowing Bohemian Grove attendees, but maybe I run with a more bourgeois crowd...



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Saturday, November 10, 2012 5:33 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:

I DO seem to rile some people up, don't I?



There's a lot of late stage cro-magnons still lurking about, who clearly feel threatened by a woman with an opinion, and info to back them.

Funny how they always seem to fall under the same political umbrella...




Tea Party, Taliban...



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Sunday, November 11, 2012 12:03 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:


Can't say I've ever heard a bunch of five year-old boys call each other dirty Jew operative Nazi Illuminati Satan-worshipping Molech-bowing Bohemian Grove attendees, but maybe I run with a more bourgeois crowd...





Ah too true. Though I guess I was speaking mentality rather than vocabulary.

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Sunday, November 11, 2012 2:39 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


For me, I find the kind of "reparte" others engage in more akin to the schoolyard stuff...PN actually offends me (if I read him, which I pretty much don't anymore); there's your prime example of what was discussed in the "Fauxhahontis" thread, in a nutshell. And we ignore it, which is, in essence, not calling it out. Every time and essentially every ONE of us. We just go "oh, that's just PN". So how are we any better than the person who doesn't call out an ugly racist joke in social situations?

I think what's become acceptable in America is sickening, especially the last few years. One only has to go on a right-wing site on the internet to hear the very UGLIEST racism aimed at Obama, especially since he won re-election, and maybe if one did, one would see that I'm not just ultra-sensitive to it, the racism, homophobia, sexism are overt and very real...and not by a miniscule minority of Americans. It doesn't do any good to call it out, either, as the right-wing media/pundits/politicians ENCOURAGE it, overtly or subtly. I would say this country has gone to the dogs, only that would be a slur on dogs!

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Sunday, November 11, 2012 8:25 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"... the racism, homophobia, sexism are overt and very real...and not by a miniscule minority of Americans ..."

I keep thinking about that.

If one were to test people in ... France ... Iceland ... China ... the San bushmen ... what would the percentages of RWAs be? I think it's a stage of development most children go through that some outgrow, but not others. Do differing societies result in different percentages of RWAs? Different intensities? Does the category RWA even make sense in all societies?

My SENSE is that it's a category that is meaningful across cultures. I SUSPECT that children - being the survival machines that they are - adopt whatever mode seems the most likely to ensure they fit in with their society (or at least pretend to).

But whether that's true or not, and what the biological mechanisms of such different processing schema could be, is not something I know.

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Sunday, November 11, 2012 2:23 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
My SENSE is that it's a category that is meaningful across cultures. I SUSPECT that children - being the survival machines that they are - adopt whatever mode seems the most likely to ensure they fit in with their society (or at least pretend to).


Which is why I have such "issues" with our established public education and so-called-parenting systems, as they tend to produce such lost creatures in droves, especially the later cause that abusive form of upbringing creates and forments a cycle of abuse as each generation passes it down unto the next.

On a macro scale, it has lead to what I consider the insanity of an entire society, but even so human empathy wins out in any case worth a mention on an overall scale - still, one RWA can do so much damage out of proportion to their percentage of population, especially since as our society has curdled, they wind up the ones with the most substantial resources and writing the rules for everyone else, you see.

But the ROOT of it comes to the essential mistreatment of a child in order to produce a mindset like that, they don't spring, fully formed, from some nefarious well of horror, we CREATE them.
http://www.vachss.com/av_dispatches/lifestyle.html

Note the date, hell, the YEAR, of this speech - and as we rewarded that conduct so long as it was done with a socially acceptable gloss (religious leaders, corporate bigwigs, miltary and political leaders) it became the new normalised mainstream, this *IS* effectively what they are, what they have become, not by virtue of crossed wires (barring a rare few) but by LEARNED BEHAVIOR that has become so calcified it no longer makes any difference that they weren't born sociopaths.

It takes a certain insanity to stand against a tide like that, but be damned if I won't - always and ever.

-Frem

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Sunday, November 11, 2012 3:30 PM

OONJERAH


"racism, homophobia, sexism," and if I may add, militant religion.

The 50's, as I keep saying, were different. We and our Allies had
defeated Hitler and Japan. We were all prouder than peacocks of
our heroism, our justice, our freedoms. I sure was.

Racism: Was practiced, recognised and largely discouraged. Most of
my literature (comic books) contained messages against it.
These days, many people don't know we had black slavery in America
for more than half its history ... or maybe only 89 years if I count
from the Revolution to the Civil War. People who know of the Civil
War today got it from the movies. Not School. Please, someone, tell
me I am wrong about this.

Sexism: We were so steeped in it, it seemed normal, natural. I would
not even become aware of it for decades, when Women Lib began to
make a lot of waves. I did have my own problems with sexism: Wives
were a Ball & Chain. Women were expected to stand on a chair and
scream at the sight of a mouse. What crap!

Homophobia: Can't comment; never heard of gays then. I guess they
were among the very many aspects of reality that were unmentionable
in my home.

Religion. Everyone was Christians, weren't they? Not my Dad so much;
never knew what his belief was, but he was down on churches. Then
there were the Jews and they were OK.
Every Sunday school I went to taught love, compassion, forgiveness,
turn the other cheek, do unto others as you would have them do unto
you, Jesus loves me, & contribute to missionary work in other lands.
Christians I know who are my age still have those principles.
But twenty years younger than me, you start getting this very strange
bunch of people who claim to be Christians but speak as if they are
anti-Christ. They talk about who should be stoned and burned.
Me: "Yeah, but ... what about the teachings of Jesus?"
"You have to be a Christian or go to Hell," they say.

We were taught in school that most of the early colonists on our
Eastern seaboard came to America to escape religious persecution.
No one in my youth Ever suggested the joining of Church and State.
We all knew that it went against 350 years of US & colonial history.


In the 50's, we were very proud of our rights, freedoms, our system
of justice. We were practicing all kinds of discrimination, but most
of us (me) were unaware of it.

Then came the 60's, 70's, endless protests about our hypocrisies. In
general, I think, we the people woke up a bit, recognised our short-
comings and tried to correct them. New thinking became popular as we
tried to extend equal freedom to minorities, women & non-Christians.
As for the gay movement, I don't know. It is popular to support them
now, but weren't they just on their own for the longest while?

We've come a long way, Baby, and now, we're getting the backlash: the
Nasty Neanderthal Reaction. Because somewhere along the way, a move
to dumb down America began, and it's been pretty damn successful.

Why do I keep bringing this stuff up?
Those who don't know History are doomed to repeat it.
Be Here Now is good; perspective makes it better.


=========================

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Monday, November 12, 2012 12:47 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

one RWA can do so much damage out of proportion to their percentage of population, especially since as our society has curdled, they wind up the ones with the most substantial resources and writing the rules for everyone else, you see.

Right on, Frem, to an incredibly sad degree we are learning these days!

Oonj, racism wasn't "discouraged" in America until the civil rights movement...hell, even long after that, and some still "practice" it to this day, tho' now it IS discouraged (at least publicly and by most people). It was practiced and accepted at times in our country against Jews pretty badly, Native Americans (and still is in some places in Idaho that I know of) and of course African Americans. The attitude still pervades in some--didn't one politician just recently say slavery was good for Black folk in some ways, or something stupid like that? Don't kid yourself; while not PC, it still lives and within some subsets of our culture, is quite open.

Even here...back in the '90s when I was working for lawyers, my supervisor had moved here from New York. Looking for places to live, she talked to the landlord of one place on the phone at great length. They had a lot in common and of course she didn't "sound" black, being a middle-class woman from NY. The landlord was excited about the prospect of having her as a tenant (reeely excited!), but when Christine walked up to her apartment building, the landlord blanched, stammered and said the room had already been rented. Less than twenty years ago, in California, where we tend to think such things don't exist!

Sexism was just the way things WERE when I was growing up in the sixties; like you said, normal, natural. My mom was "forced" to work outside the home when Pan Am laid my dad off (after we returned from Afghanistan)--and she was somewhat outside the mold, having been a secretary in S.F. when younger). Nonetheless, she blamed dad for "making" her work outside the home, and still did the "dress up" thing, making full sit-down dinners for us, dressing me up for school in matching skirts and blouses (anyone remember the "poodle skirt"?), having parties with hors d'oeuvres, the whole schebang. Yeah, the women's lib thing changed things, but not that long ago by time standards, and I have internet friends whose whole point in life is to find a husband, go the "big wedding" method, want to have kids right away and expect a husband who will let them be stay-at-home mothers. Mind you, for the kids' sake I think that's great, but as a mentality...? One put her whole being into the wedding, gave us links to her wedding gown choices, they blew tons on the wedding and honeymoon, soon after he got cancer, lost his job, they were broke with a kid and went through hell. When I think of all the money that fancy wedding gown, the wedding and honeymoon cost and where it left them...

Homosexuality was, I think, unmentionable in MOST families. It's been around throughout history, but most societies never "accepted it" openly like we do now, as much as we DO now...it's still as big a thing as racism in some societies, again not PC but acceptable within the "group". I think

As to religion, my parents were "casually religious"--went to church (all dressed up) every week, I went to Sunday school, mom participated in church functions, but neither of them ever talked to me about God or religion. I know mom was a Christian Scientist as a child, and dad got his best sleep of the week at church; beyond that I know nothing, except that back then America was far more religious than now, and no, the concept of religion and politics was alien...maybe because it was just such an unspoken part of our government?
Quote:

Then came the 60's, 70's, endless protests about our hypocrisies. In general, I think, we the people woke up a bit, recognised our short- comings and tried to correct them.

Yeah, Oonj, the 60s woke people up to a lot of things, but from what I've read, historians believe we were "innocent" back in the 50s and it was Kennedy's assassination (and those that followed) and Vietnam that took away our innocence ... take that away, and all the flaws start becoming visible. Dunno if that's the case or not, just what I've read in several places.

I think our Harvey Milk had a lot to do with raising awareness of the gay movement...I've read THAT in several different places, too. Can't say, wasn't aware back then...stayed with some gay friends in the Castro, but we never talked about "being gay", and I was just a hippie teenager in S.F., gayness was all around and nobody made much of a fuss.

Yes, we've come to a sad pass these days. And I think some of it IS backlash...for a long time on TV and stuff, men have been portrayed as the dumb clucks with women being the smart ones, etc. Haven't liked it myself, since it used to be women were just portrayed as moms and "father knows best", but that may have something to do with it.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Tuesday, November 13, 2012 12:35 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


As I leave you for today, I just had to bump this...given the threats-to-leave-America thread, the threat-to-secede thread, the Turdblossom's-excuses thread, the Five-Stages-of-Grief thread and the Alan-West-is-Out thread, it belongs right up there with them. Put them together, and that pretty much says it all...

See 'ya tomorry.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Wednesday, January 4, 2017 3:10 PM

JAYNEZTOWN


2 which are broadcasting and have become very rightwing or alt-right?
Alex Jones and Stefan Molyneux


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Wednesday, January 11, 2017 8:32 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
2 which are broadcasting and have become very rightwing or alt-right?
Alex Jones and Stefan Molyneux




Thanks for bumping the thread.

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Thursday, January 12, 2017 8:10 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
Romney lost by less than a million votes. Or 0.7% of the popular vote.


Romney lost the popular vote by over 3 million votes, or about 2.5%.


I can understand that you do not comprehend the American Election system, so I will grant you the information that Romney lost by a little over 310,000 votes.

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Thursday, October 25, 2018 5:33 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Here we have a fine example of failed Libtard thinking trying to rationalize reality.
Decent teaching point, learning opportunity.

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