REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

This Gal Really Really Needs Her Abortion Rights, Really!

POSTED BY: JONGSSTRAW
UPDATED: Thursday, July 24, 2014 18:11
SHORT URL:
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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:13 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Byte was & is wrong on this matter.

Period.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:18 AM

BYTEMITE


I was wrong about one thing. Not so sure about the others.

But like I said before, it doesn't matter to you anyway. You'll go on making the same kind of comments with your three fireflyfan friends.

I am actually sorry for bringing it up, and not in a snarky way. It's not my place to judge you. Your comments aren't the worst out there, or even the worst I've ever heard.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:21 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Facts really DO matter, Byte.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:28 AM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Facts really DO matter, Byte.



I'll leave you with this rappy. You have shown facts to mean very little to you.

Example: 97 percent of scientists say the facts show man is contributing to climate Change and we need to act now. According to you they are lying.







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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:49 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Climate change isn't the issue here & the 97% claim is wholly bunk

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts.

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 12:14 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Climate change isn't the issue here & the 97% claim is wholly bunk

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts.

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall



This is what I love about you rappy. You have been going back and forth for a while now with myself and others, yet you still do not see the topic has changed to you and your hateful posts. You rappy are the issue so your bleiefs being used to show your ignorance is apropos.

Perhaps you should tone it down a bit.





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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 1:58 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Byte got it wrong, from the very start here. There's nothing at all about my views on trial here, in the least. You're barking up the wrong tree, after Byte's lead, and seem to be too stubborn & full of false pride to admit that here.

Seems it's far more a YOU problem than anything to do with me.

Ya might want to see to that.


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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 2:20 PM

BYTEMITE


I chimed in after them. Stop trying to make this out into a witch hunt and people picking on you, because it's not. I don't have a posse, and as is evident I can't affect you here or in real life. We're allowed to emotionally react to the things you say.

Me being wrong on one thing doesn't negate all of my objections - and it definitely doesn't negate theirs.

The real question, one that I am forced to consider, was if it was even worth objecting in the first place considering the slim probability of any change.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 2:32 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


But you being wrong was the genesis of all this misdirected vitriol.

I can't overlook or overstate that enough.

Whether you or others want to admit it.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 2:45 PM

THGRRI


Bytemite he is in complete denial about my confronting his attitude going back to my very first post.

“I did not bother to watch the video because it was posted out of meanness. You who posted it and you who take great pleasure and delight in her plight should look into the mirror and see what you have become.”

As far as you thinking perhaps you should not have confronted him because it would do no good. I disagree. I think it was long overdue. The kind of hate being practiced here by some is sickening. I live under no delusion my confronting any of them will change them in the least, but ignorance needs a foe.






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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 2:58 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
But you being wrong was the genesis of all this misdirected vitriol.

I can't overlook or overstate that enough.

Whether you or others want to admit it.



How about no. My being wrong was not the "genesis" like I'm the demiurge come to Earth to inflict the curse of flesh upon you, and this is not misdirected or vitriol in the slightest.

Again, I didn't post in this thread until later, in regards to misdirected we all know you couldn't care less if you HAD made a race or rape joke, I mean come on, you hate PC bullshit and you'd be proud of defying those conventions, and as for vitriol I'm not really mad and you still don't care.

You're not outraged by what I said, you're merely annoyed that you think I misrepresented you. I disagree that I did, and it still does not really matter to either of us.

So why are we still talking about it?

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 3:03 PM

JONGSSTRAW


How many times are you gonna say it doesn't matter and you're done? I mean, girl get on with it will ya? Jump off a bridge or whatever.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 3:07 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Byte - it's not that I'm annoyed you misrepresented me , you admitted you did. I'm at a loss as to why we're still talkin about this.

ETA -

Quote:

I disagree that I did, and it still does not really matter to either of us.


Actually, you ADMITTED that you did! That's what's so confusing.

Quote:

I was wrong about one thing. Not so sure about the others.


You were wrong about ALL of them.

The premise that I had said anything remotely suggesting 'rape', the whole " Bubba " cross up, ( I can't believe you never heard Bill Clinton referred to as 'Bubba' ) , and THEN the imaginary claim that I ever said Bill 'raped' Monica ! Hell, she stalked the guy ! Went to D.C. with her Presidential knee pads ! Or do you forget all that stuff ? I know it's been a damn long while, but still.

See, one misconception leads to a whole cascade of false starting points for you to jump off from and accuse me of things of which I am not nor have I ever been guilty ! But since you've convinced yourself so thoroughly that , even if what you said wasn't exactly right, you're still in that mindset that has me guilty anyways, of SOMETHING. And then others just hop on and follow suit, not really paying attention to the facts, and instead bringing their own distorted biases to the conversation, which have even LESS to do w/ the topic !

Might not mean all that much to you, but being falsely accused matters to me.

Quote:

Me being wrong on one thing doesn't negate all of my objections


Yeah, it pretty much does, as far as they're concerned with me. If you have issues /w others, I can't speak to that.


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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 3:10 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

Actually, you ADMITTED that you did! That's what's so confusing.


EDIT: I admitted I got the specific wording of one of your posts wrong, not that I misunderstood the meaning, tone or intention. I swear I do remember you saying Bill took advantage of Monica, and then you just said he DID rape someone, the fact that you think he might have raped anyone taints the comment. And race was very much an issue in one of your comments, even if the girl in the video made it first.

Quite simply we disagree about your meanings, but it's not worth arguing about.

Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
How many times are you gonna say it doesn't matter and you're done? I mean, girl get on with it will ya? Jump off a bridge or whatever.



Finished now. The argument reached its inevitable conclusion, I merely had to demonstrate the futility of it for everyone involved.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 3:21 PM

JONGSSTRAW


You ought to take your desire to "demonstrate futility" over the the General Discussion Board. Try the 76th Independent Battalion thread. Two people who bitch about the weather every day ... ev er y day. I guarantee your calm won't be damaged there.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 4:19 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
You ought to take your desire to "demonstrate futility" over the the General Discussion Board. Try the 76th Independent Battalion thread. Two people who bitch about the weather every day ... ev er y day. I guarantee your calm won't be damaged there.



I've never actually been in that thread before.

That's amazing. I gotta check this out.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 7:19 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
In all fairness, I must add, that I don't like pictures of aborted fetuses being displayed on public street corners. It's way over the top in bad taste.


Those aborted babies might disagree with you, had they been given the chance at life and liberty. Many would consider it a far greater example of bad taste to actually allow the fetuses to be aborted. Maybe you also think rapes and pedophilia should be kept behind closed doors so nobody gets too offended and the practices can continue without interference?

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 7:30 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Are you fucking kidding me?

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 7:40 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:

One small problem - I made no 'rape' joke, or Bubba rape joke. Nor did I make any 'race' joke. So I guess that's 3 problems, not just one.


You don't even realize when you're doing it anymore.




Might be because I've never done it in the first place ? Seriously, if you can't cite an example of what you're saying, then put down the claim and slowly back away.

Quote:

That's why I'm not sure it was even worth the effort of trying to point it out to you.


Oh yeah ? Or could be, you're just not able to, because there's nothing THERE in the first place TO point out to me!

Quote:



It makes me sad for everyone. I spend a lot of time hating everyone myself, but every now and then I look at all of humanity and I think, "wow, we are screwed." It's not very satisfying and it makes me wish I drank alcohol.



You're sad because others don't see things you see ? Might be its because the things you see aren't actually there.

MAYBE if you shed some light on what specifically it was that has you so miffed, out of sorts, what ever... such matters could be resolved. But if you're just gonna say ' why bother', then what have you really accomplished at all, other than make a baseless accusation and then walked away ?

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts.

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall


I am thankful to see that somebody else has as much difficulty as I do trying to wade through that thought process. Byte's arguments can go from "able to be followed" to this in random frequency.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 7:52 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:

Byte - you misquoted me completely. I used no such words as ' have a turn with her ' even remotely .


Huh. That's... Weird. I remember that whole thing differently. I even thought I double checked this morning to see exactly what you said and copied it into my post. But now I'm not sure.


Please relax your preconceived notions more often. Gaining clarity as you have here on a more regular basis would help the rest of us follow you better.
Quote:


Bubba is racial too, it's just racial towards white people.


Please relax your preconceived notions.
Quote:


I'd never heard Clinton be called that,


???
What???
Bubbadent? Bubbagate? Bubba magazine (with the free $3 Clinton bills)?
????
Please relax your preconceived notions.
Quote:


or Bubba used in the context of a guy who likes larger women, but I suppose it does logically follow your conversation with Jongs.

It doesn't help your cause with either the race or the rape thing though, since I've heard you suggest you think Bill Clinton raped Monica Lewinski. The undertones were present and clearly intended, whether consciously or subconsciously. And as such the comments remain disturbing.



Please relax your preconceived notions. Just because the conclusion you started with would be supported by the evidence you imagined does not mean what you imagined actually existed.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 7:57 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


RapKnight continues to protect us from the dim....

Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
But you being wrong was the genesis of all this misdirected vitriol.

I can't overlook or overstate that enough.

Whether you or others want to admit it.


Beyond Thanks, RapKnight, for taking the time and effort the rest of us don't have. And having the extreme patience!!

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 8:08 PM

BYTEMITE


It can hardly be said to be imagined if others interpretted the same way. Now it might not have been intentional or stated outright, but there was a sort of tone that likely lead to the perception. If it was unintentional or wholly imagined, I do apologize, and I admit my stake on sanity is tenuous on the best of days.

As for dim, I am always pleased to be the obscurity that clouds certainty


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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 8:17 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Oh yeah, and as a side note... I have known a Bubba in my life. Nick name, of course, but that's how he chose to be addressed. White guy, too. From Florida. No idea where anyone gets the notion that it's 'white racial' or what ever.

Oy vey!

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 8:32 PM

BYTEMITE


Maybe from all the news stories about white southerners decrying it as an offensive charicature and stereotype from elitist northerners. Google is your friend.

www.cnn.com/2012/04/14/us/bubba-southern-stereotypes/

And no, never heard Bill Clinton called Bubba before.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 8:48 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Sometimes google doesn't tell the full story. I choose to believe my own personal experiences, having actually KNOWN a Bubba in real life.

But speaking of Google, did ya try that for Bubba Clinton ? Guess what comes up at the top of the list.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 9:04 PM

BYTEMITE


I didn't, because at the time I didn't know Bubba was Clinton, as you didn't say Clinton, and I didn't have the context to relate it to Jong's part of the conversation. I thought you must've been writting that while Jongs posted because I didn't realize the comments were connected.

I now know that this is a thing.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 9:23 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:

I now know that this is a thing.



Learnin' new things is an always job, I know.

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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 9:52 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
This board has officially died.

Move along. Nothing of interest to see here.



Did I not call it? Signym is outed,so thgrri is the new one to engage the rap in all matters and keep him at the center of everything.

Just watch.


*-------------------------------------------------*
What trolls reveal about themselves when they troll:
http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=57532
*-------------------------------------------------*



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Tuesday, July 15, 2014 10:06 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
Quote:

Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
This board has officially died.

Move along. Nothing of interest to see here.



Did I not call it? Signym is outed,so thgrri is the new one to engage the rap in all matters and keep him at the center of everything.

Just watch.


*-------------------------------------------------*
What trolls reveal about themselves when they troll:
http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=57532
*-------------------------------------------------*





Boy you do think a lot of your deductive skills don’t you. Are you the group councilor? Just out of curiosity. When did you post that? I would like to check it out.






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Wednesday, July 16, 2014 4:38 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Here comes my baby ...





Here she comes now ...



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Wednesday, July 16, 2014 4:49 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Maybe from all the news stories about white southerners decrying it as an offensive charicature and stereotype from elitist northerners. Google is your friend.

www.cnn.com/2012/04/14/us/bubba-southern-stereotypes/

And no, never heard Bill Clinton called Bubba before.


It must be true if the source is cnn. They would never, ever lie.

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Wednesday, July 16, 2014 5:22 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

It must be true if the source is cnn. They would never, ever lie.


I never said cnn wouldn't lie. They lie their asses off. I'm not sure why they'd lie about this though.

This was only one of the articles I saw on it, but it had the more recognizable brand name.

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Wednesday, July 16, 2014 7:13 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
In all fairness, I must add, that I don't like pictures of aborted fetuses being displayed on public street corners. It's way over the top in bad taste.


Those aborted babies might disagree with you, had they been given the chance at life and liberty. Many would consider it a far greater example of bad taste to actually allow the fetuses to be aborted. Maybe you also think rapes and pedophilia should be kept behind closed doors so nobody gets too offended and the practices can continue without interference?



So, you want them to put rape on billboards.



“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”? Isaac Asimov

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Wednesday, July 16, 2014 10:19 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
In all fairness, I must add, that I don't like pictures of aborted fetuses being displayed on public street corners. It's way over the top in bad taste.


Those aborted babies might disagree with you, had they been given the chance at life and liberty. Many would consider it a far greater example of bad taste to actually allow the fetuses to be aborted. Maybe you also think rapes and pedophilia should be kept behind closed doors so nobody gets too offended and the practices can continue without interference?



So, you want them to put rape on billboards.






Hold on. I myself actually don't think that we should censor or destroy images about really sad/tragic/gorey/horrible stuff.

The main problem of course if you're going to have anything like that around is making it so people don't fetishize it. Even if it's really awful and graphic, nightmare inducing even, in order to discourage people and ruin their probably much cleaner fantasies, some asshole will probably manage to fetishize it anyway.

Probably not a good idea on a billboard either. And not the best idea to force nauseating stuff into people's faces, they have some right to not have to be molested with brain bleach worthy material just from walking down the street.

But it is important that such information exists.

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Wednesday, July 16, 2014 11:49 PM

THGRRI


Let me ask you. Why is it people demand their rights to have pictures of aborted fetuses yet think it's ok to deny others the right of not having them shoved into their faces?


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Thursday, July 17, 2014 10:28 AM

BYTEMITE


I kinda just said that they're equally valid rights.

Tends to be the case with lots of murky issues. Society doesn't always work together neat and clean.

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Thursday, July 17, 2014 10:54 AM

THGRRI


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
I kinda just said that they're equally valid rights.

Tends to be the case with lots of murky issues. Society doesn't always work together neat and clean.



No society does not which is why I say the middle is where the sane hang their hats. The middle is where sane people manage to work together. Hear each others views and come to a consciences.

People criticize their elected officials for being corrupt. I don't disagree but I also realize that politicians bend to the absurd demands of their base. Demands that lead to irrational decisions like government shut downs or programs that are supported by one party while the other try's to destroy it.

Those on the fringes with closed minds can not recognize they are the problem. How would you like to sit in a group tasked with trying to get something done with some of those in these threads. Holly shit the thought is scary, even for the Reaper.

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Thursday, July 17, 2014 11:36 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

People criticize their elected officials for being corrupt. I don't disagree but I also realize that politicians bend to the absurd demands of their base.


Ehh. More like give lipservice to the absurd demands of their base long enough that their base stops paying attention, then they wave in the lobbyists. A politician only has to care about the base long enough that they can be reelected, the rest of it is fundraising, deals, and lining their pockets. These are professionals, and catering to the whims of mere voters doesn't turn a profit.

I don't really like it when people blame the powerless parts of society for the problems in society, absurd demands or not. This whole elected representative stuff is a shambles and has been since the founding fathers, which was the whole point. The founding fathers didn't actually trust the common man because they thought they were such enlightened gentlemen, thus perpetuating the same lord and peasantry nonsense we fought a war against England to escape from.

If your voice means so little that you have to elect a slicker and richer person to vote on things in your stead, you're gonna have a bad time no matter who you are or what your politics/needs/interests are.

And if you're really desperate and frightened, it's going to be easy to convince you that you should be making absurd demands. It's hard for me to hate people for that.

Quote:

How would you like to sit in a group tasked with trying to get something done with some of those in these threads.


The trick is to not sit in the group trying to get something done, but to be the one that goes out and does it. Rule by committee is mind-numbingly obnoxious, to the point that I think pretty much all committees will degenerate into the place where ideas and projects go to die. Used to be true just for the congressional subcommittees, now it's true for the entirety of Congress. It's the fatal flaw of the political-socio-economic system. We've become too specialized.

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Thursday, July 17, 2014 12:12 PM

THGRRI


Quote:

…Byte
Ehh. More like give lipservice to the absurd demands of their base long enough that their base stops paying attention, then they wave in the lobbyists. A politician only has to care about the base long enough that they can be reelected, the rest of it is fundraising, deals, and lining their pockets. These are professionals, and catering to the whims of mere voters doesn't turn a profit.



While that is true it applies in fewer and fewer instances. With all the gerrymandering most Republicans in congress are being so obstinate because of their crazy base. They are guaranteed at least for now reelection by pandering to the farthest extremes so that is where they govern from.

Quote:

….Byte
I don't really like it when people blame the powerless parts of society for the problems in society, absurd demands or not. This whole elected representative stuff is a shambles and has been since the founding fathers, which was the whole point. The founding fathers didn't actually trust the common man because they thought they were such enlightened gentlemen, thus perpetuating the same lord and peasantry nonsense we fought a war against England to escape from.



That is very complicated. Throw a dart and you will hit upon some sort of truth. It is also true that in England the first born got everything so younger siblings left so they could make their fortunes. It is true that Americans wanted to embrace science over religion because they saw the destructive nature religions had on progress. Progress that allowed for anyone to rise up through the ranks to wealth. We allowed for the success of the everyman much better than elsewhere at the time. We are moving away from that because of disparages in incomes.

Quote:

…Byte
If your voice means so little that you have to elect a slicker and richer person to vote on things in your stead, you're gonna have a bad time no matter who you are or what your politics/needs/interests are.
And if you're really desperate and frightened, it's going to be easy to convince you that you should be making absurd demands. It's hard for me to hate people for that.



It is the hate that comes from ignorance that I confront. If you are desperate and frightened find out if what you are frightened of is valid. Don’t just tow the party line. Without making that effort you are just destructive noise, then it is fair for others to point that out so you may be excluded from the conversation. If you look at a chart and you want to find the middle sometimes the extreme elements are excluded. They are called outliers.

Quote:

….Byte
The trick is to not sit in the group trying to get something done, but to be the one that goes out and does it. Rule by committee is mind-numbingly obnoxious, to the point that I think pretty much all committees will degenerate into the place where ideas and projects go to die. Used to be true just for the congressional subcommittees, now it's true for the entirety of Congress. It's the fatal flaw of the political-socio-economic system. We've become too specialized.



You can be a leader yes but without followers you do not exist. If you lead without compromise in business you are more likely to fail as not. If you lead without compromise in government you also will fail. We need our elected leaders to show success in building rather than in blocking progress. We could have more of that if we had more moderates and less outliers.

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Thursday, July 17, 2014 2:16 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

With all the gerrymandering most Republicans in congress are being so obstinate because of their crazy base.


That "crazy base" doesn't have very many options to replace them with. They're all playing the money and favours game with each other to get ahead, not actually fulfilling any of their campaign promises.

Source: I live in Utah. It's ridiculously gerrymandered. But that's not the reason we have awful people like Shurtleff and Swallow for Attorney General.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/58185969-78/arrested-shurtleff-swall
ow-john.html.csp


Around here some of us are calling it the mormon mafia, because that's what it is. And those two are only the tip of the ice berg.

Quote:

It is true that Americans wanted to embrace science over religion because they saw the destructive nature religions had on progress.


The puritans/pilgrims were pretty intolerant cheerless religious jerks. They were practically kicked out of England because no one wanted to deal with them after Oliver Cromwell.

The rest of the people who founded the colonies just wanted to make money. And did so with a cash crop that kills people.

England has it's church of England, but you'll find no shortage of people in America who will say that our Constitution was based on religious principles. (It wasn't it was based on the British Magna Carta, and we almost didn't get a Bill of Rights)

The US isn't not and has never really been more scientific or progress minded than England. We were just slightly faster than England replacing yes m'lord with yes sir Mr. CEO and land tenants with desk jobs. But then, Brits were quicker on the uptake with the Industrial Revolution that set the stage for us.

It's hard to say really that one country was particularly more friendly towards upward mobility than another. Remember, America had slaves a lot longer than Britain did, and the people from older wealthier families that got established in the colonies looked down quite a bit on rabble. They even had their own socialites and arranged marriages and sense of class. America has never NOT had elites and dynasties, and neither has Britain, and in both cases there's a tendency to look down on "lower classes." This in turn contributes to feelings about wages for lower classes.

Quote:

Don’t just tow the party line.


Fair point... Although, my gut tells me that actual independents who don't like either party are the silent majority. So just saying that it's the fault of the voters I'm not sure is fair, considering your own mention of gerrymandering.

Quote:

You can be a leader yes but without followers you do not exist. If you lead without compromise in business you are more likely to fail as not. If you lead without compromise in government you also will fail.


I'm not talking about a dictatorship. I'm talking about cutting out the bullcrap.

Ideally you shouldn't need a government for your daily life and activities. But barring ideally, the way we organize our "leadership" and the people who become "leaders" is rubbish.


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Thursday, July 24, 2014 6:11 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:

With all the gerrymandering most Republicans in congress are being so obstinate because of their crazy base.

That "crazy base" doesn't have very many options to replace them with. They're all playing the money and favours game with each other to get ahead, not actually fulfilling any of their campaign promises.
Quote:

It is true that Americans wanted to embrace science over religion because they saw the destructive nature religions had on progress.


The puritans/pilgrims were pretty intolerant cheerless religious jerks. They were practically kicked out of England because no one wanted to deal with them after Oliver Cromwell.


The US isn't not and has never really been more scientific or progress minded than England.
But then, Brits were quicker on the uptake with the Industrial Revolution that set the stage for us.


A bit tragic hand was dealt, but recall that much of American industry was built DURING WWII, and then had that to build upon after (Babay Boom 50's) - and Britain REBUILT after the War, leaping forward with even more modern facilities, technology, and less rationing (post-war), and thus had those advantages for decades. Societies are always less willing to tear down their own infrastructure to make improvements, but in Britain the Nazis did it for them.

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