Shootout at drug sting and police culpability ? by Fremdfirma

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Shootout at drug sting and police culpability ?

POSTED BY: FREMDFIRMA
UPDATED: Wednesday, August 13, 2008 13:06
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Wednesday, August 13, 2008 9:29 AM

I want some opinions on this one...

Drug sting results in shootout at Westland strip mall
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080813/METRO/80813
0378/1409/METRO

My own personal take is that this was criminal negligence and reckless endangerment on behalf of the police, and it's just sheer dumb luck that no civvies got hurt yesterday.

But even so, what if some civvie CCW holder, bullets whizzing past his face, decided to return fire as he headed for cover, only to find out later (if the enraged cops LET him survive) that he was shooting at an undercover cop ?

I mean, when this thing blew up, how the hell could anyone tell the good guys from the bad guys ?

Police acknowledge and accept the risks when they take the job, but nobody in that mall agreed to risk THEIR lives so the cops could make a bust, and putting them at risk was fucking irresponsible, if not criminal.

I especially wanna hear Zero's piece on this, since the property owners and the customers seem to have a legit gripe here, you ask me.

Westland is not "the hood" neither, this ain't gone over well with the locals, and they're pissed.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Wednesday, August 13, 2008 9:37 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Quick second thought:

Offering to BUY drugs as a sting, well that's just SOP, sure.

Offering to SELL drugs ? WTF - first off, there's an entrapment angle, and secondly, come on dammit, that's practially ASKING for an armed ripoff.

Shit, they might have well have done THAT in uniform, since it's no secret whatever that the DPD and local depts have no problem ACTUALLY selling drugs, yanno.

-PissedOffJustALotFrem

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Wednesday, August 13, 2008 10:28 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
I especially wanna hear Zero's piece on this, since the property owners and the customers seem to have a legit gripe here, you ask me.

Their gripe is with the criminals here, not the police.

Quote:

Charles Kirby, Romulus director of public safety, said the suspects decided on the site.

"The police never pick the location. Bad guys want to do this in a public location," Kirby said.

I'm sure if they could have arranged a better location...perhaps in front of the local Police Station or on the Police firing range or in a field 300 yards from the nearest structure or perhaps asking the criminals for time to secure the area and make sure there are no innocents around...the criminals might have suspected something was up.

Are you mad because the criminals acted like criminals and the cops acted like cops? I think your being a bit childish if you are.

H

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Wednesday, August 13, 2008 10:43 AM

FREMDFIRMA

I am annoyed because they put innocent lives at risk for the sake of a bust, not to mention damage to the property of the business owners - NONE of whom agreed to the risk beforehand.

Which is more important, the bust ?
Or the safety of the public ?

And the Police are every bit as responsible, they had to be aware of the potential for this thing to go south, and proceeded with it regardles of the obvious risk to innocents, that makes THEM the more responsible party since this was their sting to begin with.

In fact, it was them that baited the crime in the first place - if they had not gone around TRYING to sell drugs (at least ficticiously) NO CRIME WOULD HAVE EVER OCCURED.

That makes them every bit as much a bad actor as the others guys, since their own actions CREATED the crime in question, which would have not otherwise existed.

Tell me Zero, is it ok for a cop to keep buying some guy drinks at a bar, then wait for him to get in his car and drive away, putting the public at risk, just to have a fucking DWI bust - even though it was the cop buying the drinks in the first place ?

A police officer should never CREATE a crime for the sake of busting it, never ever - and should under no circumstances whatsoever put any member of the public at needless risk in order to create one.

What I want from you, isn't snark - but a real, logical, legal defense of these actions from your perspective as a prosecutor, complete with cites and precedents, and you know damn well why I want it, too.... don't you ?

Dealer stands, raises two - your bet, mister.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Wednesday, August 13, 2008 12:42 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

Surprised no one has brought this one up before.

Quote:
Federal officials have opened a civil rights investigation into a police narcotics raid on the home of a Maryland mayor in which police burst in without knocking and shot the mayor's two dogs to death.

Mayor Cheye Calvo of Berwyn Heights, Maryland, and his mother-in-law were handcuffed and forced to kneel on the floor during the July 29 raid, which police said was part of an investigation into a scheme in which drugs apparently were sent to unsuspecting people.

Prince George's County police, who were in charge of the raid, issued a statement Friday clearing the couple of involvement and expressing "regret."

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/08/08/maryland.mayor/?iref=mpstoryview

Guys were smuggling pot by having a FedEx delivery buddy drop packages at addresses (in this case the mayor's wife) they got from various public sources and grabbing them before the unsuspecting homeowners found them.

Apparently, the PG cops intercepted the package, put it on the mayors doorstep themselves, then rushed the house (without a warrant, BTW) when the mayor arrived home early and picked up the box.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Wednesday, August 13, 2008 1:06 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Oh yes, I been watchin that one, just didn't think anyone here would much care.

If it had been one of us lowly peons, it wouldn't have even been news, they just happened to assault one of the other nobles, you see....

I sincerely hope he chews their asses up but good, maybe it'll be a little more deterrent to their excesses.

Although I doubt it, the PG county police are pretty scummy, and me and them have a personal vendetta dating back to the George Burdinsky case, since the locals had to use underworld contacts to find out where he was, and then FORCE them to go do something about it by threatening to rouse a lynch mob instead.

That whole mess was how I got into the game of harassing online predators in the first place, but that's a tale for another day.

The PG county police are pretty awful, with a history of some really awful conduct, so if this guys wrath thins the ranks of bad actors, so much the better....

It's just that had that not happened to a fellow "elite" - it wouldn't have even been news.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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