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MINGORA, PAKISTAN A Taliban gunman walked up to a bus taking children home from school in Pakistan's volatile Swat Valley on Tuesday and shot and wounded a 14-year-old activist known for championing the education of girls and publicizing atrocities committed by the Taliban, officials said.

The attack in the city of Mingora targeted 14-year-old Malala Yousufzai, who is widely respected for her work to promote the schooling of girls — something that the Taliban strongly opposes. She was nominated last year for the International Children's Peace Prize.

The Taliban claimed responsibility for the attack, calling Malala's work "obscenity."

"This was a new chapter of obscenity, and we have to finish this chapter," said Taliban spokesman Ahsanullah Ahsan by telephone. "We have carried out this attack."

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Third, make it damn clear that we're not going to allow them to shoot little girls, or saw off the heads of innocence ( like Daniel Pearl ) and get away with it. And make no apologies for hitting back at them, twice as hard, every time they blow up a car, fly a plane into a building, or go on a shooting spree in a down town market.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

Watch Kwickie and Niki et al call Lara Logan a 'teabagger' or some such next.

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the goddamn radical christofascist scum, which differ NOT ONE WHIT from the goddamn Taliban

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

First and foremost, stop pretending and kidding ourselves, and start actually listening to who they, the radical Islamists say they are. Because they're telling us, all the damn time. We just refuse to listen.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Second, stop lying to the American public. Call the terrorists by their name, Islamic radicals, and cease w/ this crap about 'man caused disasters' or 'work place violence', when talking about the Ft Hood shootings.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Third, make it damn clear that we're not going to allow them to shoot little girls, or saw off the heads of innocence ( like Daniel Pearl ) and get away with it. And make no apologies for hitting back at them, twice as hard, every time they blow up a car, fly a plane into a building, or go on a shooting spree in a down town market.

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

I think just about everyone knows who these groups are and what they stand for.

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They are Islamic radicals, they are also terrorists. Also the Fort Hood shootings where by definitions those things as well. I'm sorry if you have a problem with semantics.

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I'm pretty sure we do hit them back. We have drone strikes all the time. It make no sense if we just start large wars and kill a bunch of innocent people in countries we are trying to protect innocent people in.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
This govt refuses to name them. Why ?

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Yes, I do have a problem w/ a govt which is so PC, it won't face reality, and deal with who it is we're fighting, why they're fighting us, and how to defeat them. As Lara said, we've only killed the slow and stupid Jihadists. The smart ones we didn't kill, they're still fighting. Or, more importantly, they're just getting started.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
We give the Muslim Brotherhood billions of dollars, aid in the revolt in Libya, and we get repaid by our embassies being attacked, our ambassador raped and murdered. We need to stop the flow of $ to those who want us dead.

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As Lara said, we've only killed the slow and stupid Jihadists. The smart ones we didn't kill, they're still fighting. Or, more importantly, they're just getting started.

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
This govt refuses to name them. Why ?

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I know for a fact that the President and others in the government have talked about many such groups, some on regualar basis.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Yes, I do have a problem w/ a govt which is so PC, it won't face reality, and deal with who it is we're fighting, why they're fighting us, and how to defeat them. As Lara said, we've only killed the slow and stupid Jihadists. The smart ones we didn't kill, they're still fighting. Or, more importantly, they're just getting started.

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Lara is wrong. We are fighting them as effectivly as we can without adding even more to their ranks. Each time we miss step and kill innocent people by accident it fuels their cause. Stepping up attacks would result in more mistakes as such.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
We give the Muslim Brotherhood billions of dollars, aid in the revolt in Libya, and we get repaid by our embassies being attacked, our ambassador raped and murdered. We need to stop the flow of $ to those who want us dead.

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Do you have a citation that we gave money directly to the Brotherhood, or that they conducted the attack in Libya?

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

Lara is wrong.

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Originally posted by Storymark:
And here we see an example in the disconnect between rality and propoganda that those on the hard right embrace.

Rappy think's we're all ignoring the problem of Muslim extremists, because we don't think all Muslims should be suspect, which is based on nothing more than our pointing out that not all Muslims are extremists - ignoring the fact that this little girl is one of the non-violent ones that we speak up to defend.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Do you even know who she is, or what she's endured ? I think she knows a hell of a lot more about what's going on over in the middle east than you.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
And FYI , I'M the one who started this gorram thread, ABOUT the little girl who got shot. I stand with HER. I support HER views. Does that fact completely escape you ? Seems like.

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Do you even know who she is, or what she's endured ? I think she knows a hell of a lot more about what's going on over in the middle east than you.

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Yes, and yes. I think those events have most likely clouded her outlook on things.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
What, the outlook of actually having faced that medieval thuggery , first hand, and lived to tell about it ?

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Originally posted by AURaptor:


And FYI , I'M the one who started this gorram thread, ABOUT the little girl who got shot. I stand with HER. I support HER views.

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
What, the outlook of actually having faced that medieval thuggery , first hand, and lived to tell about it ?

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Yes. Going though something like that tends to taint a person's perspective.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Taint a person's perspective ? So her 13 + years of field reporting from N.Ireland, Africa and Baghdad, all that first hand experience, and being embedded w/ militants fighting Allied forces,BEFORE being viciously attacked in Cairo, did THAT taint her perspective as well ?

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Taint a person's perspective ? So her 13 + years of field reporting from N.Ireland, Africa and Baghdad, all that first hand experience, and being embedded w/ militants fighting Allied forces,BEFORE being viciously attacked in Cairo, did THAT taint her perspective as well ?

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I would say no. I would also say that all those experiences are not as powerful as her being attacked.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
That they weren't as personally impactful on her life, is understandable, but that's not the question being asked. She didn't just hop on a plane and stroll into Cairo one day, and then got nearly gang raped to death, and that "tainted " her view of what's going on in the middle east. She is a seasoned reporter, with a bonafide resume' of field work, first hand knowledge, and a far better understanding of what's going on , at the street level, than most.

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

Yes she is all those things, but she is also a person that had something very traumatic happen to her. All of her experience as a reported has been at a dispassionate emotional distance. The attack on her was not. So yes I think that that attack my cloud her outlook and override her other experiences.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Authorities have arrested three men suspected of having a role in the shooting of Malala Yousafzai, the 15-year-old activist who demanded an education for girls.

NBC News reports:

"Police said the suspects, aged between 17 and 22, had claimed the person who organized the attack Tuesday — in which two other young girls were shot and injured — was a man called Attaullah."

"'During raids in Swat on Thursday night, we captured three culprits involved in attack on Malala,' Swat police chief Gul Afzal Afridi told NBC News by phone. 'During initial interrogation, they revealed that Attaullah was mastermind of the attack and he is still at large,' he added."

Voice of America, the official United States news agency abroad, has some good news on Malala's condition.

They report she is in "satisfactory" condition. "Yousafzai was airlifted from a hospital in the northwestern city of Peshawar to the Armed Forces Institute of Cardiology, the country's top military hospital in Rawalpindi," VoA reports. "Doctors have said Yousafzai has a 70 percent chance of surviving."

As we've told you, Malala was targeted by the Pakistani Taliban for advocating for the education of women, which the group has banned in the Swat Valley.

The shooting has sparked a national conversation that laid bare a that nation's deepest fault line.

The BBC reports that the country has called for a day of prayer today. The BBC adds:

"On Friday, school children dedicated prayers to her recovery in morning assemblies and special prayers will also be offered after weekly prayers at mosques across the country.

"Schools in the Swat Valley closed on Wednesday - the day after the shooting - in protest at the attack. Protests and rallies have also been held in Islamabad, Peshawar, Lahore, Multan as well as in Malala's hometown of Mingora."

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Wow... the excuse making going on here is unreal.

Even though Lara is an experienced, season reporter, with time spent embedded with militants, and having interviewed Jihadists leaders, talked to the fighters, heard how they view us, the West, and what they're fighting for, you're willing to dismiss ALL that she saw, experienced and reported, for the fact that she was violated and attacked in a square in Cairo. All her experience and knowledge she had on the matter of radical Islamists goes right out the window, because she was beaten, groped and assaulted ?

Just damn.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

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Originally posted by Storymark:
And here we see an example in the disconnect between rality and propoganda that those on the hard right embrace.

Rappy think's we're all ignoring the problem of Muslim extremists, because we don't think all Muslims should be suspect, which is based on nothing more than our pointing out that not all Muslims are extremists - ignoring the fact that this little girl is one of the non-violent ones that we speak up to defend.

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Storybook - what I say is irrelevant. What Lara Logan says on this matter, I think deserves a hell of a lot more credence and respect.

And FYI , I'M the one who started this gorram thread, ABOUT the little girl who got shot. I stand with HER. I support HER views. Does that fact completely escape you ? Seems like.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:

No they do not go out the window you mental midget. They have to be taken with a bit of understanding about why she views things the way she does.

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"1. "Your deadliest enemies on the Afghan battlefield have completely freedom of movement inside Pakistan with the blessing of the Pakistanis. And every commander that's sat in your shoes has had to try and build a relationship and go through the same motions time and time again. And the effect on the battlefield remains exactly the same: American soldiers continue to die because of the support Pakistan gives to America's enemies."

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"2. To think there is any similarity between this and Viet Nam is ridiculous. The Viet Cong didn't care what you did when you went back to America. The Viet Cong weren't fighting for an Islamic caliphate. The Viet Cong didn't have a global struggle. And it's amazing to me that we constantly ignore what Al-Qaeda and the Taliban and [...] all these groups tell us every day in their own newspapers, in their own statements."

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3. Our way of life is under attack, and if you think that's government propaganda, if you think that's nonsense, if you think that's warmongering, [then] you're not listening to what the people who are fighting you say about this fight. In your arrogance, you think you write the script.

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4. If you fail to identify the ideological component to this fight, if you fail to identify what your enemy is really fighting for, if you lie about who they really are, I don't see how you could possible have the right strategy.

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5. When I look at what's happening in Libya, there's a big song and dance about whether this was a terrorist attack or a protest. And you just want to scream, "For God's sake! Are you kidding me?" The last time we were attacked like this was the USS Cole, which was a prelude to the 1998 embassy bombings, which was a prelude to 9/11.

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6. And you're sending in FBI to investigate. I hope to God that you're sending in your best clandestine warriors who are going to exact revenge and let the world know that the United States will not be attacked on its own soil, that its ambassadors will not be murdered, and the United States will not stand by and do nothing about it."

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Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Yeah, but a 30-year old female law student in suburban Georgetown wants and demands free birth control from the taxpayers! And although we're supposed to have separation of church and state, religious institutions must now cover items for female employees that violate their long-standing religious tenets. Granted these female employees knew their institutions' policies and views beforehand, they somehow recklessly made a free choice to work there nonetheless. THAT's the real war on women, and speakers at the Democrat Convention spent a lot of time trying to educate us all to the grave urgency of the situation. Muslim brutality in the third world? Oh golly gosh, if you're gonna well up like a big softie every time a Muslim girl or woman is honor-raped, or attacked with acid, or whipped, or stoned to death, or shot, or hanged you won't be able to focus on the desperate plight of American women right here at home. It's well-known that Republicans are more evil than the worst of the Muslim mullahs and their good-natured followers. American women are smart and know this, and that's why they're overwhelmingly not supporting their true enemy Mitt Romney.


Okay.

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Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:

Rap, your arguments sucks. Something terrible happened to a young brave girl who deserves the attention of the world's media. She does not deserve to be used as a political handball for American political purposes.

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Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
I looked at a transcript of Logan's speech. Sorry, I don't often watch videos.

Here is what I found.

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"1. "Your deadliest enemies on the Afghan battlefield have completely freedom of movement inside Pakistan with the blessing of the Pakistanis. And every commander that's sat in your shoes has had to try and build a relationship and go through the same motions time and time again. And the effect on the battlefield remains exactly the same: American soldiers continue to die because of the support Pakistan gives to America's enemies."

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I believe this to be 100% true. I have seen other reports on this. American's relationship with Pakistan is extremely compromised. I doubt anyone in power trusts the Pakistanis or see this as in any way new information.
What do you suggest the US do about this?

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Rap, your arguments sucks. Something terrible happened to a young brave girl who deserves the attention of the world's media. She does not deserve to be used as a political handball for American political purposes.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

Per the Vietnam comparison, you got it completely wrong. She's right. Even ignoring the comments by Khrushchev, " We will bury you! ", there is no where near the fervor from any political movement which rivals the blinding zealotry of religious fanaticism. You have 1 country in N.Korea, ruled by a mad gang's unbelievable world view, as they have brain washed an entire country, but that's about it. Heads sawed off, planes flown into buildings, school buses blown up, in than name of Communism = 0. Can't say the same thing for Islamic zealots.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:


Lora Logan was born and raised in S. Africa. SHE is saying these things, and is NOT being used by anyone.

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Lara is wrong.- Mac

ROFLMAO!!!Do you even know who she is, or what she's endured ? I think she knows a hell of a lot more about what's going on over in the middle east than you.-rappy

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Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
I never made any comments to that affect. Please do not accuse me of saying things that I did not.

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There are certainly people, citizens, governments and countries who despise the US. Again, what are you going to do? Declare war on everyone who hates the US? That would be a lot of war and to what end?

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

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Lara is wrong.- Mac

ROFLMAO!!!Do you even know who she is, or what she's endured ? I think she knows a hell of a lot more about what's going on over in the middle east than you.

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Yes, Lara IS wrong. She's speaking from fear, and is no more accurate about the ME than a person who has just nearly drowned speaking about ocean swimming.

Fear is never a good guide. Let me repeat that: Feat is never a good guide.

Now I could pick out about 5 of Lara's statements that are so fundamentally flawed, which show such a complete and utter lack of perspective, that they completely negate any point she thinks she's making.

But I'm not going to do that. Instead, I'm going to talk about rappy. I think I finally understand him, and it goes back to the "Saddam had WMD" discussion. Now, rappy starts out with a known fact: Saddam had WMD in the 1980s. Then, step by step he discounts all of the other relevant facts... chemical weapons have a shelf life, they need to be produced in TON quantities over and over in order to be significant, they need delivery systems in order to be a threat, they require special precursors and supply lines, no satellite or ground evidence or intel was found of ANY production after the 1980's.... and constructs increasingly implausible scenarios (They were shipped to Syria! Saddam MIGHT have done something) in order to maintain his fear. Ultimately, that fear is used to justify any and all action: Nuke 'em all!.

And that, really, is the point. Rappy WANTS to be scared, because he WANTS to have a justification for anger, and for violence. It makes him feel powerful and in control. He's not trying to solve a problem, he's trying to get high. Over the years he's gone from being an uncertain right-winger afraid of "the other" to a frightened ditto-head to the full jack-boot.

That's why discussing anything with him is useless... you're just getting between him and his high, and his high will not be denied.

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