Watch out what you put on your face, ladies...it's not just about organics, look at what's IN some of this stuff! Glad I stopped wearing cosmetics years..."/>

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Dirty secret about organic cosmetics

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Wednesday, April 14, 2010 04:09
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VIEWED: 511
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Sunday, April 11, 2010 8:15 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Watch out what you put on your face, ladies...it's not just about organics, look at what's IN some of this stuff! Glad I stopped wearing cosmetics years ago, especially after reading this:
Quote:

Organic products, from oranges to shampoo, normally cost more than their conventional counterparts. Despite this price difference, many people are willing to pay more for products they believe are better for both them and the earth.

You can generally trust organic label claims on food products when you see the Department of Agriculture’s “USDA Organic” symbol.

But consumer groups warn that when it comes to organic cosmetics and personal care products, you may not get what you expect.

“It’s the Wild West out there,” said Ronnie Cummins, national director of the Organic Consumers Organization. “We want consumers to be able to trust the organic claim on a cosmetic product and not have a bunch of snake oil salesmen out there claiming to be organic when they are not.”

At Consumers Union, Urvashi Rangan, director of technical policy, describes the marketplace as a “free for all” where cosmetics that “contain loads of synthetic ingredients” are called organic.

Right now, as long as the manufacturer does not use the “USDA Organic” logo, these claims do not have to be verified or certified.

“We’ve seen products that claim to be organic that don’t have one single organic ingredient in them,” Rangan says. “We’ve seen companies call themselves organic in their brand name and yet they are not certified as organic.”

Consumer groups believe USDA has jurisdiction in this area. They have repeatedly asked the department to require personal care products making the “organic” claim to meet the same standards as organic food. But so far, USDA has refused.

Billy Cox, the director of public affairs at the USDA’s Agricultural Marketing Service says the agency is currently “evaluating” organic labeling on personal care products. But for now, USDA has decided:

It has no authority over the production and labeling of cosmetics, body care products and personal care products that are not made up of agricultural ingredients, or do not make any claims about meeting USDA organic standards.
Cosmetics, body care products and personal care products may be certified to other, private standards and marketed to those private standards in the U.S.
Frustrated by USDA’s refusal to more vigorously regulate these products, Consumers Union and the Organic Consumers Organization are trying a different tactic. Last month, they petitioned the Federal Trade Commission to investigate what they call “the widespread and misleading” use of organic claims on personal care products.

“We feel this is an unfair and deceptive business practice in the marketplace and as such the Federal Trade Commission has jurisdiction,” Rangan tells me.

The petition says organic personal care products that do not meet USDA standards can contain petroleum-derived ingredients, conventional agricultural ingredients that have been treated with pesticides, preservatives and unnatural colorings or fragrances.

The Federal Trade Commission has responded to the petition by saying it will “consider carefully” the information provided.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/36224250/ns/business-consumer_news


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Sunday, April 11, 2010 10:45 AM

FREMDFIRMA



Pftth, dunno about cosmetics, but when I went to get some chicken soup for the ex when she was sick, I did a rather careful label inspection of the brands being offered...

And the so-called "organic" brands contained MORE MSG and additives than the ordinary stuff!

I had a fun discussion with one of them "health food" nuts, mocking his preservative and MSG laden diet bar, toxic diet soda, the fact that he had to load up on heavy amounts of dietary supplements to, yanno, not DIE, on his supposed "natural" diet...

But the real rumringer I threw at him ?
"Petroleum occurs naturally too, does that make it good to eat ?"

Something to think about whenever you see "All Natural" or "Organic" on the label.

-Frem

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Sunday, April 11, 2010 10:55 AM

FREMDFIRMA



Also, most cosmetics contain Titanium Dioxide.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium_dioxide

I know this cause that is what the chem plant I did security for back in Baltimore produced, via both Chloride and Sulfate processes, and I tellya, Titanium Tetrachloride is some seriously nasty stuff - that plant was part of the REASON for the siren-based early warning system, cause any open air release (that they couldn't cover up) would be blown by the wind off the water by the key bridge right back into the neighborhood where I lived.
And that stuff is extraordinarily lethal even at near trace concentrations.

Worse was the white dust, everywhere, all over everything, all the time, and since it was "perfectly safe", no provisions whatever were made against it, not even dust masks - the only regard to it whatever was a quickie rinse-off booth to wash it off your car if you wanted while exiting the plant, cause after an eight hour shift your car would be dusted pretty heavy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titanium_dioxide#Health_and_safety

Bloody wonderful, of course, not that it matters since living in that neighborhood with all the OTHER chem plants and pollution for even one year reduces your life expectancy by over 50% anyways.

Still, having worked there and peppered with that crap day in and day out, be damned if I would ever voluntarily want it on ME ever again.

-Frem

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Monday, April 12, 2010 6:37 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I read labels, too, and it's pretty astonishing what's labeled as this or that yet contains high amounts of something else that defeats the purpose! People don't bother...advertising of course...and it's a shame.

I only worried about animal testing when I used to wear cosmetics...and I did, albeit not as much as my peers, but some. I never thought about this stuff at all, but now I don't work in an office, I don't have to wear any and believe me, I don't miss it!!

When I see cosmetic ads on TV it sickens me; not because of what this thread is about, as I didn't know any of that, but because of the incredible amount of money and waste involved, given every time something "new" comes out, it's usually really only something old with new packaging or something. We are such an incredibly wasteful society, and so DAMNED plugged into "buy buy buy"...which is another topic entirely...


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Monday, April 12, 2010 1:56 PM

FREMDFIRMA



Well, I've always filed cosmetics under "theatre of the ridiculous" right along with ties, spike heels, and people trying to physically or otherwise mangle their own bodies to fit within a certain standard.

Don't look to me to make any sense of it, cause damned if I could, honestly.

-F

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 6:16 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Oh, I understand it...goes back to caveman genetics and "attracting" a mate...and ego and social pressure... And I kinda had to wear that shit 'cuz I worked in a legal office. But never again!!!


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 6:28 AM

BYTEMITE


I've never seen the point of make-up. I don't use it.

Attracting a mate? Blah. Then why is it required in some business environments? Seems like sexual harassment, then, in addition to being a stupid double standard.

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 6:41 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Definitely a double standard in some ways, but just like wearing skirts/dresses/high heels, it's "expected" in some offices. It's akin to men having to wear suits and ties, so I guess it's not truly a "double standard"--I always felt bad for guys like my Jim who HATED suits...


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 7:04 AM

BYTEMITE


High heels flatter a woman's secondary sex characteristics, don't they? Force the chest forward and the backside up?

Can a dress code requiring high heels possibly bring a woman unwanted sexual attention?

Can a dress/skirt?

Can make-up?

Sexual harassment.

You might be able to make the same argument about ties, considering what they're supposed to symbolize and where they point. The purpose of the ties has been technically lost to meaning, and as such ties do not feel like sexual harassment to men who have to wear them. But to women, what dress codes require them to wear? It definitely can.

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 7:16 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


It's not about "dress code"--I got away with a LOT of stuff, believe me, especially before I was dx'd (hypomanic episodes can lead to sexual acting-out, etc.). It's about what's "expected". When going for an interview, it's virtually mandatory to wear heels, makeup and dress suits, etc.; once hired, you can tone it down. And there are LOTS of offices that don't expect it (once hired); I just worked in a huge law firm, and even then on night/weekend shift we got away with a lot.

High heels are killers for the back...I found that out too late. And yes, certain things can bring about attention, unwanted and otherwise, but they also don't have to...low heels and decent clothing don't bring it about, and if one wants to wear high heels and short skirts, etc., one does so with that knowledge.


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 7:19 AM

BYTEMITE


Why are such expectations okay? I'm being HIRED, not COURTED.

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 9:29 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Amen!

I had a potential employee who wore them things to the interview and I gave her that sideways look (apparently nobody warned her about me) and asked "You're not really gonna walk rounds in them anklebreakers, are you?"

She looked a bit mortified, but I assured her that I wasn't disrespecting her.

We gots ONE uniform, and everyone wears it, no damn rank tabs or any of that bullshit neither, just cause I happen to be the big boss doesn't mean I gotta flaunt it and besides, when I am out on rounds and someone else is covering the main office, THEY have the full comm system and database at hand and I don't - and if they were not capable of making command level decisions they wouldn't BE sitting at that desk to begin with.

Anyhows, we go with a white dress/service shirt of a comfy and very durable material with red logo patches, and black pants, the original contracter foisted off some synthetic-polyester crap ones on us, so most of us go with Dickies 874 Flat-front uniform work pants, also comfy and durable while maintaining a professional look - and depending on the site either black work shoes, boots, or at the one site where fast movement is important, black sneakers.

I did spring for a higher quality service jacket, mostly in one size, which is a little big on most of our people, and for a monster like Louis I can get a bigger one.

Why the HELL anyone who might have to run at speed in an emergency should wear dress shoes is beyond me - I always thought most police were morons for that, honestly.

I wanted a grey service look, rather than our fairly intimidating Black & Red, but apparently these things only come in certain standard colors, and it costs more otherwise, bleh.

I'm not concerned about how someone looks so long as they meet a certain minimum standard - I care how they do their JOB, and I hate, hate, hate ties - not only are they useless, in an industrial environment fulla machinery that could catch it and pull you in (one of our new sites) they're actually dangerous!

-Frem

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Tuesday, April 13, 2010 9:43 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Well, of course in your line of work high heels and a skirt would be absurd, even for interviewing, Frem!

Byte, first off, YOU'RE not being courted, you're courting the employer. Second, there are many lines of work where that doesn't apply; where I worked was, as I said, corporate offices, and in the office environment, interviewing in pants, or anything other than a dress suit or skirt, etc., would pretty much count you out right away. There is a corporate "look", and that's just how it is. As I posted elsewhere long ago, the day Jim stopped working as VP, we got rid of every suit and tie he owned.

He delivered newspapers for a while, and we owned a pizza parlor for five years, and for neither did he ever need to "dress", obviously. He went back to it while we both worked for the law office, but sans the tie and suit, and casual stuff since we were word processors and worked night and evening shifts. I wore pants a good part of the time, and t-shirts.

Now he's an Admin. Asst., but there are only a few "office" people (it's a big five-story, City-run garage, so most employees don't work in the office)...aside from the big wigs, they don't give a shit so he wears whatever he wants.

It's just the way it is, especially in big cities like SF. Some offices don't care if you dress down once hired, some expect secretarial and "lower class" employees to "reflect the company". Doesn't have to be fancy, and the insurance company I worked for didn't care if we were "done up", so long as we were presentable.

Buck the trend, you don't get hired; buck the trend if it's important to them once you work for them, the "personnel" person has a quiet talk with you.

Until the world changes, that's how it is.




"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, April 14, 2010 4:09 AM

FREMDFIRMA



It's still asinine, and I still won't cooperate with such a foolish idea.

In fact I never have, from dressing like a "damn libertine" as a child - which the very thought of gives me a great deal of personal amusement looking back and realizing just how *much* my behavior and attitudes must have been offending the status-quo worshipping adults of those times...

To fighting tooth and claw against school uniforms, arbitrary and ridiculous dress codes, contemptible fashion ideas and most especially ties and spike heels, two of the most idiotic concepts ever foisted on mankind.

Any employer who cares more about what a person LOOKS like, than how they do their job, deserves what they get!

I had one job interview go nasty cause I was short, and they weren't going to hire me cause I might have trouble fetching stuff off the top shelf, but the most horrific was for a minimum wage stocking position at a goddamn toystore, the suburbanite bitch doing the interview had the audacity to get on my case for not wearing a nice suit, and then got *royally* pissed when I pointed out to her if I could afford one, I certainly wouldn't be applying THERE!

For me a job interview is as much feeling the employer out as much as them checking me out, and for a fact, I am not a slave, I am not their bitch, and I am not *obligated* to accept the position even if you DO offer it to me - people forget that, in their desperation, and all too often fall into a job or work environment that destroys them mentally and emotionally even faster than abject poverty would destroy them physically - me, I'd rather go hungry than put up with that, cause like one of my buddies said, long as there's three people left on this mudball, end of the day.. someone is gonna want someone else stomped on, ergo, *I* will never lack for work, yanno ?

-Frem

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