REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

House Science Member Says Earth is 9,000 years old

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Wednesday, October 17, 2012 09:01
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Wednesday, October 17, 2012 4:35 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Are you slow?

It is lying if you state your beliefs as facts when you know they are not.



So now you're making the assumption that everyone who believes things you don't consider "facts" is consciously lying about their belief, because they couldn't believe anything that you "know" is not true.

The thing is, if people believe in an omnipotent deity, they can believe that such a deity can do pretty much whatever it wants. It could create the world in seven days and litter the place with false leads as a test of faith, for example. Who knows why such folk believe what they do? But, having been around such folks for most of my life, I know that they can. I consider them wrong, but I'm still not sure how you determine they're lying if they're sincere in their belief.


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Wednesday, October 17, 2012 6:47 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...




What's truly shocking about this is that the crazy man is running UNOPPOSED!
Quote:

here's the thing that should stick in everyone's craw.

Congressman Doctor Paul Broun is running for re-election and he is unopposed.

The Democratic Party in his home district couldn't find a single person to stand up and offer the voters in that district a chance not to be represented in Congress by an obvious crackpot. No local assistant DA. No ambitious college professor; the University of Georgia is in this district. Nobody wants to stand up and make the argument that it is better for all concerned that your congresscritter not be a nut. Nobody?

"You're the third person to ask me this question over the last few days," said Joe Wisenbaker, the Democratic Party chairman in Clarke County, a piece of which also is part of Broun's district, when I spoke to him just now. "The last one was a Republican woman who was very, very angry that we don't have a candidate. So here's what I tell everyone who asks: We do everything we can to encourage people to engage politically and to run as Democrats. Last time, we had a good candidate, a lawyer named Russell Edwards, and he went to work full-time to run against Paul Broun, and he got a third of the vote."

Since then, the district's gotten sliced and diced good and proper, but, if we're ever going to get out of the god-enfeebled fever swamp into which the radicalized Republican Party is pushing the nation, sooner or later, there has to be organized, relentless push back at the ballot boxes everywhere in every election, whether that turns out to be ultimately futile or not. (Of all the things about which Howard Dean was right, this is the most important.) To his everlasting credit, an Army veteran named Stephen Simpson primaried Broun last August, and that was a good thing, even though Simpson got beaten pretty badly. If the Republicans could come up with a candidate to a least raise the question of why we should have frothing loons in our national legislature, the Democrats should do their part as well.

"I've got a great number of people telling me that they don't want to be represented in Congress by a nut," says Wisenbaker. "I mean, we're all embarrassed here." http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/paul-broun-running-unopposed-135
75035
]
Damned friggin STRAIGHT they should be embarrassed!! I think someone should start a write-in campaign TODAY to defeat this asshole, and I'm disgusted the Dems didn't do a better job of finding someone. We need people like this in our governing body like we need MORE holes in our heads!

As to Geezer's dead horse, "it's the manufacturer's handbook....it teaches us how to run all our public policy and everything in society. And that's the reason, as your congressman, I hold the Holy Bible as being the major directions to me of how I vote in Washington, D.C., and I'll continue to do that." That is really all that needs being said. That he considers the Bible to give his major directions as to how to run public policy is a very clear statement of his intentions, period. Nowhere did he mention the Constitution, only the Bible, as giving him directions.

There's a chart at http://www.govtrack.us/congress/members/paul_broun/412252 which pretty much shows where Broun stands compared to the rest of the House.
Quote:

Broun is a far-right Republican according to GovTrack's own analysis of bill sponsorship.

Use this chart to compare Broun to other members of the House of Representatives on leadership and ideology.


It's pretty revealing...there are only TWO (possibly three) House members more hard right than him. It's my own opinion, but I find that rather telling in that this isn't someone I want representing the American people.

(Magons, I find it amusing that your cartoon comes from Down Under and is about climate change, hee, hee, hee! "That, too")


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Wednesday, October 17, 2012 8:40 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:
So now you're making the assumption that everyone who believes things you don't consider "facts" is consciously lying about their belief, because they couldn't believe anything that you "know" is not true.



First lets be clear, it is not what I considar facts, but what are facts.

Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:
The thing is, if people believe in an omnipotent deity, they can believe that such a deity can do pretty much whatever it wants. It could create the world in seven days and litter the place with false leads as a test of faith, for example. Who knows why such folk believe what they do? But, having been around such folks for most of my life, I know that they can. I consider them wrong, but I'm still not sure how you determine they're lying if they're sincere in their belief.



Being sincere in a lie, it is still a lie. There is always that very philosophical argument that the universe could have just popped into being a few seconds ago and we would never know. Like an omnipotent deity that can't be proven, nor disproven. So it is a belief and nothing more. Simply believing something, no matter how hard, does not make it true. If someone knows it is not true, that it is not supported by facts, and touts it as such it is a lie.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.

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Wednesday, October 17, 2012 8:50 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Nick, you keep missing the basic point that if someone DOES believe something, they can't be lying to say it. Whatever your opinion of facts, there are millions of people in America who believe in God and the Bible, and they're not lying when they do so.

I get your point, but it doesn't change that if someone BELIEVES something, they're not lying about it.


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Wednesday, October 17, 2012 9:01 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Nick, you keep missing the basic point that if someone DOES believe something, they can't be lying to say it. Whatever your opinion of facts, there are millions of people in America who believe in God and the Bible, and they're not lying when they do so.

I get your point, but it doesn't change that if someone BELIEVES something, they're not lying about it.




I would not say that belief in God is a lie. Stating that you know for a fact that God exists maybe one. It depends on that persons understanding.

In this thread we are talking about a highly educated individual who knows for a fact the earth is older than 6000 years in age. When he makes a statement to the contrary and states it as a fact it is a lie.

If I show you that 1+1=2 and you turn around a state that 1+1=3 simply because you believe it, I'm sorry, that is a lie.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.

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Wednesday, October 17, 2012 9:01 AM

STORYMARK


Yep, I have to agree.

Someone can be wrong - stupidly, blindly, staggeringly wrong - and not be lieing. Dumb, maybe, but not nescessarily lying.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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