More than just an ugly face ... by 1kiki

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

More than just an ugly face ...

POSTED BY: 1KIKI
UPDATED: Tuesday, January 21, 2014 09:32
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Saturday, January 18, 2014 3:21 AM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

http://www.wwltv.com/news/Pope-Benedict-defrocked-400-priests-in-2-yea
r-period-for-molesting-children-240863061.html

Pope Benedict defrocked 400 priests in 2-year period for molesting children

A document obtained by The Associated Press on Friday shows Pope Benedict XVI defrocked nearly 400 priests over just two years for molesting children.

An AP review of the reference books shows a remarkable evolution in the Holy See's in-house procedures to discipline pedophiles since 2001, when the Vatican ordered bishops to send cases of all credibly accused priests to Rome for review.

Then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger took action after determining that bishops around the world weren't following church law to put accused clerics on trial in church tribunals. Bishops routinely moved problem priests from parish to parish rather than subject them to canonical trials -- or turn them into police.

According to the 2001 norms Ratzinger pushed through, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith reviews each case sent to Rome and then instructs bishops how to proceed, either by launching an administrative process against the priest if the evidence is overwhelming or a church trial.

By NICOLE WINFIELD and JOHN HEILPRIN / Associated Press

VATICAN CITY (AP) -- A document obtained by The Associated Press on Friday shows Pope Benedict XVI defrocked nearly 400 priests over just two years for molesting children.

The statistics for 2011-12 show a dramatic increase over the 171 priests removed in 2008 and 2009, when the Vatican first provided details on the number of priests who have been defrocked. Prior to that, it had only publicly revealed the number of alleged cases of sexual abuse it had received.

The document was prepared from data the Vatican had been collecting to help the Holy See defend itself before a U.N. committee this week in Geneva.

Archbishop Silvano Tomasi, the Vatican's U.N. ambassador in Geneva, referred to just one of the statistics in the course of eight hours of oftentimes pointed criticism and questioning from the U.N. human rights committee.

The statistics were compiled from the Vatican's own annual reports about the activities of its various offices, including the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which handles sex abuse cases. Although public, the annual reports are not readily available or sold outside Rome and are usually found in Vatican offices or Catholic university libraries.

An AP review of the reference books shows a remarkable evolution in the Holy See's in-house procedures to discipline pedophiles since 2001, when the Vatican ordered bishops to send cases of all credibly accused priests to Rome for review.

Then-Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger took action after determining that bishops around the world weren't following church law to put accused clerics on trial in church tribunals. Bishops routinely moved problem priests from parish to parish rather than subject them to canonical trials -- or turn them into police.

For centuries, the church has had its own in-house procedures to deal with priests who sexually abuse children. One of the chief accusations from victims is that bishops put the church's own procedures ahead of civil law enforcement by often suggesting victims not go to police and keep accusations quiet while they are dealt with internally.

The maximum penalty for a priest convicted by a church tribunal is essentially losing his job: being defrocked, or removed from the clerical state. There are no jail terms and nothing to prevent an offender from raping again.

According to the 2001 norms Ratzinger pushed through, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith reviews each case sent to Rome and then instructs bishops how to proceed, either by launching an administrative process against the priest if the evidence is overwhelming or a church trial. At every step of the way the priest is allowed to defend himself.

The Congregation started reporting numbers only in 2005, which is where Tomasi's spreadsheet starts off. U.N. officials said Friday that the committee has not received the document.

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Saturday, January 18, 2014 9:37 AM

WHOZIT

And so many people hate this guy, this should be a bigger story...and the NYC board of education should do the same.

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Saturday, January 18, 2014 10:01 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:

http://www.wwltv.com/news/Pope-Benedict-defrocked-400-priests-in-2-yea
r-period-for-molesting-children-240863061.html

Pope Benedict defrocked 400 priests in 2-year period for molesting children

And that's a good thing, isn't it ? Rather than do nothing ?

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts.

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Saturday, January 18, 2014 6:33 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Defrocking is just the wrong term.....

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Saturday, January 18, 2014 6:58 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

B/c the pope was extremely quiet on the topic - and with a lack of publicly available information to the contrary - I'd concluded that if he wasn't complicit, at least he lacked appropriate zeal in the face of this horror.

With this new information, I've reevaluated my original conclusion and found it was in error.

That's what I like to think rational people do, which is to be ready to rethink old conclusions in the face of new information.

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Sunday, January 19, 2014 2:32 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

He should have informed the police.

A entity should never investigate and police itself. There are far too many conflicts of interest for such a process to succeed.

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Sunday, January 19, 2014 3:16 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

He was and is pretty deeply into the church system. The church allows for two remedies - internal policing and defrocking, or external legal systems. At the point he stepped in (before he became pope) the church hierarchy was doing neither, simply shuffling priests around to avoid exposure. I think reporting it to the police was unthinkable to him, given his frame of reference and the inertia of the system he stepped into. Like a corrupt police department, there's the tendency for newcomers to accept that things have always been done this way, and to pass along the problem. Instead he did vigorously and with a will seek to eradicate that scourge in his own way. So while I don't give him a full pass on his actions, I acknowledge that he did something radical for his time and place, and see it as a better course than anyone else took.

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Tuesday, January 21, 2014 9:15 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Defrocking is just the wrong term.....

I just shot beer out of my nose, bitch. ;)

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Tuesday, January 21, 2014 9:32 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
He was and is pretty deeply into the church system. The church allows for two remedies - internal policing and defrocking, or external legal systems. At the point he stepped in (before he became pope) the church hierarchy was doing neither, simply shuffling priests around to avoid exposure. I think reporting it to the police was unthinkable to him, given his frame of reference and the inertia of the system he stepped into. Like a corrupt police department, there's the tendency for newcomers to accept that things have always been done this way, and to pass along the problem. Instead he did vigorously and with a will seek to eradicate that scourge in his own way. So while I don't give him a full pass on his actions, I acknowledge that he did something radical for his time and place, and see it as a better course than anyone else took.

I "grew up" Catholic, although I only had one year of CCD very late and never have been confirmed. I do believe there is a god, but I don't believe in the Catholic vision of God.

If there is only ONE argument against the Catholic faith, it is that priests have to remain "celibate" and not marry. WTF?

Speaking as somebody who for the past few years might as well have been a Catholic priest since there has been nada in the "action" department, I can tell you that being left to your own devices sexually without a partner can be, well.... "dark" for lack of a better word.

Plenty of people who have sex all the time are messed up, for sure, but to willingly live a life where sex is taboo for the rest of your life????

A life without sex is NOT NATURAL. It's NOT RIGHT. Best case scenario if you're a Catholic churchgoer, you lucked into the priest who only beats off one time a day to "normal" porn and washes his hands ten times a day. Worst case.... who knows?

I get goosebumps around Catholic Priests when at funerals or the very rare occasion I join somebody for a Mass. To me, it's like that little white spot poking out of their collar is a Badge that says to the world "I'm "X" years old, I don't have sex with women and I'm proud of it.

F.U. Padre. I haven't had sex for a while either, but I don't advertize the fact to everyone I meet with a smile on my face and a "bless you brother/sister". Without sex, and WITH the internet, my mind has tapped into some very strange kinks I didn't know I had and wouldn't have even known had existed circa '95, sans internet. Goddamned kids aren't a part of it though.

If the "gremlin"-looking Pope burned a bunch of them on the cross before he left, then good for him I say. If I blindly sent my children to church and they were abused by the priest, I'd be the guy who was locked up for years for beating him to death and jamming whatever giant crucifix I could find in his dead ass.

Maybe our current pope will allow marriages. Just as Campaign Finance Reform is the only way we will EVER get a decent politican in office, the only way the Catholic Church will EVER make right is if the priests can have sex with women.

The only thing that baffles me is why is it always boys that you hear about being molested? How long have they gone without sex and how twisted have their base needs become that they always seem to gravitate towards same-sex-underage debauchery?

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