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CBS claims no political bias...hmmmm

POSTED BY: CONNORFLYNN
UPDATED: Friday, January 14, 2005 18:10
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Wednesday, January 12, 2005 10:17 AM

CONNORFLYNN


Quote:



Richard Thornburgh and Louis Boccardi, chairmen of the independent panel investigating CBS News, talked to MSNBC's Dan Abrams about their finding of their finding of "no bias" over the reporting of CBS' Bush National Guard story. Click here to read the full report (PDF file).

Below is a transcript of their interview:

DICK THORNBURGH, FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL: We didn't find any political agenda on the part of any of the people involved in this. There were a lot of other news organizations following the story. We did find, however, an insensitivity to appearances. Most of the sources for this story had a strong anti-President Bush agenda of their own. And the contact between the producer of this segment and the Kerry campaign was universally condemned within and without CBS News.

DAN ABRAMS, HOST, 'THE ABRAMS REPORT': I mean, when a producer calls up an ally of the Kerry campaign to say, “Hey, I want to put you together with someone,” how is that not political?

THORNBURGH: It was a dreadful mistake to be sure, but we didn't find that there was an intention to further the political interest of the candidate. What it really was an attempt to exert some further leverage on the source to make some documents available.

ABRAMS: You had said, “You could not find a basis to accuse those who investigated, produced, vetted or aired the segment of having a political bias.” Accusations aside, is it fair to say this might not have happened if the people involved had more of a conservative bend?

LOUIS BOCCARDI, FORMER ASSOCIATED PRESS CHIEF EXECUTIVE: I don't see any basis on which I could make that judgment, no. I think it's clear that they did things that could lead those who think there was a bias here to be convinced of it. But you know we didn't want to make the same mistake that the program made.

ABRAMS: How involved was Dan Rather in producing, in researching, in asking the tough questions about this piece?

BOCCARDI: Before the show aired, his involvement was minimal. He had been in a very busy 10 or 12-day period with the Republican Convention, chasing a hurricane in Florida, so he was not deeply engaged in the preparatory part of the program.

ABRAMS: We know that very often, correspondents rely on producers for a lot, but a piece this sensitive, this important, and this close to the election, was coming from the voice of Dan Rather. Should he have done more?

BOCCARDI: I think Dan Rather was doing what CBS assigned him to do, which was a convention, the hurricane, and so forth. We make a recommendation that CBS News management should look at the problem of whether correspondents have enough time to contribute their insights and their abilities and their news reporting ability to a segment, and if they can't, then that's something that needs to be addressed.

ABRAMS: If you were going to describe the single biggest journalistic problem here, what would you say that it was?

THORNBURGH: I think there are probably three different areas I would focus attention on in terms of the process shortcomings. One was the failure to authenticate the documents or to report accurately upon what the experts said. Second was to thoroughly examine the background of the principal source to see what his history was, what his biases were. And the third was the whole vetting process that was gone through by the management of the program— the failure to ask the tough questions, the follow-up questions that would bring out these shortcomings.



Wild really..



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Wednesday, January 12, 2005 5:34 PM

NEUTRINOLAD


I have no way to know this for sure, and I am not in a position to know any better than anyone else, but what bothers me is not so much that Dan Rather, et al, had a political bias, but that he seems to have had a personal bias, a grudge if you will, against W. Knowing that, he really should have had the good judgement to recuse himself from the story altogether. Doesn't that seem right?

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 6:42 AM

CONNORFLYNN


Well..he wouldn't have needed to recuse himself, IF and it's a big IF..if the documents and the whole story had been authenticated. Personally, I don't blame Rather. Ultimately, I think those who felt they could get away with it (network Heads) should've been held responsible.

Network news has become the equivalent of "World Weekly News" LOL or "The Enquirer". This whole situation has pushed forward the death of Network News. In my opinion there are alot of amazing journalists out there, unfortunately most have compromised their integrity to further the Network's goals.

Thus the birth of "The Blogger Nation".

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 9:33 AM

REEQUEEN


If Dan Rather should have to recuse himself from covering anything and everything W related, because of his bias, shouldn't FoxNews abstain for the same reason?

Fair's fair, you cannot ask that one biased person stop pickin' on somebody, when an entire network deifies everything that same person does. That's what we call "hypocrisy" and it's an ugly, ugly, thing.

I'm just sayin'.


"You mean they have the internet on computers now?" Homer

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 10:15 AM

CONNORFLYNN


Quote:

Originally posted by ReeQueen:
If Dan Rather should have to recuse himself from covering anything and everything W related, because of his bias, shouldn't FoxNews abstain for the same reason?

Fair's fair, you cannot ask that one biased person stop pickin' on somebody, when an entire network deifies everything that same person does. That's what we call "hypocrisy" and it's an ugly, ugly, thing.

I'm just sayin'.


"You mean they have the internet on computers now?" Homer



Hehehe.. like I said before..Network Media are no longer "Fair and Balanced" even if they say they are. Fux isn't the only partisan news out there..you have the liberal CNN, MSNBC, CBS, PBS etc..etc..

The problem is they spend too much time being partisan and spinning everything in a negative light one way or the other. It's too bad really..instead of gathering news without spin, the spinmasters try to manipulate their viewers rather then inform.

Dan Blather and Bill "Oh' Really?" both should be off TV..unless it's on a TV Reality Show "Who wants to put a foot in their mouth?"

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 10:29 AM

HERO


Quote:

Originally posted by ReeQueen:
If Dan Rather should have to recuse himself from covering anything and everything W related, because of his bias, shouldn't FoxNews abstain for the same reason?



No. I never saw Rather as professionally bias. He had issues with the Bush family, but his reporting was on par with the other networks...that is tilted to the left.

His slant, like that of ABC, NBC, MSNBC, and most print journalists does not invalidate their reporting. Likewise FoxNews is not invalid simply because they take a similar slant in the oppisite direction (I find FOX to be fair and balanced, but since the mainstream media is slanted left anyone fair appears slanted to the right...turn your TV on its side, you'll see what I mean).

A slant is merely a perspective. The problem did not arise until they failed to do what any highschool newpaper reporter does: check the facts. The documents were provided by a man with a suspect history. He claims he got them from a man who does not exist. The documents are obvious forgeries to anyone who knows what to look for, I wouldn't, neither would CBS execs, but they used experts who failed to authenticate them at best and told them they were fakes at worst. CBS news then made material false statements in the story regarding their efforts at authentication.

Here is where this whole business falls short. The investigation fails to reach a conclusion on the authenticity of the documents. Every expert they employed said they were fake, witnesses say they are not govt documents, and the source is false and misleading, yet they cannot reach this ultimate conclusion. So in the absense of any evidence in favor of the documents and in spite of overwhelming evidence that they are false, the investigation fails. This taints the process, much like a mistrial. CBS has now more reason for shame.

Was there political bias? Again the investigation does not indicate. Yet CBS news put the man who provided the documents in touch with the Kerry campaign and made other political contacts on his behalf. Given the election timing there can be no doubt that all of this was happening in a politically charged atmosphere. Therefore, while I doubt political bias on the part of CBS and Dan Rather, I cannot believe there was no bias in those who put this story together and willfully ignored the obvious.

Never the less CBS news and/or its agents committed a deliberate slander on the President during the height of an election and during time of war. That should give us all pause and there should be consequences for everyone involved.

I'm a lawyer. I voted for Bush, so I can't sue. But if there is anyone out there who voted for Kerry (or more accurately, against Bush) because of this story, let me know and I'll file a lawsuit on your behalf. Bush can sue for slander, but he probably will not, but a person who was defrauded of their vote can sue.

How much is your vote worth? Hmmm...Maybe we could figure out a market value by calculating the amount spent by everyone seeking to influence the election (its in the billions) and dividing it by the hundred million or so voters. Then add in punitive damages in the millions. Then when we own CBS we can make them run a new Firefly series. Moday nights...after Everybody Loves Raymond.

H

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 1:50 PM

NEUTRINOLAD


Quote:

Originally posted by ReeQueen:
...shouldn't FoxNews abstain for the same reason?



Only if they wish to change their reputation.
FoxNews has zero credibility as a source of information. One need only listen to any on-the-hour news summary on any FoxNews affiliate to come to that realization.
CBS News,the NY Times, the London Times, Le Monde, etc. wish to be recognized as institutions with integrity and credibility, and that is why they are held to a higher standard. If they want to compete with the comPost or the Sun, they need only say the word, and we'll measure their output differently.

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 2:09 PM

NEUTRINOLAD


Quote:

Originally posted by Hero:

...his reporting was on par with the other networks...that is tilted to the left.



When I read words like this, and is it ever a common sentiment these days, I often think that it isn't a matter of left vs. right in the press. It's a matter of cosmopolitan vs. colloquial. Sashimi only seems weird if you don't grow up eating it.

Quote:

Likewise FoxNews is not invalid simply because they take a similar slant in the oppisite direction...


No, FoxNews is laughably bad because they are so frequently wrong not, just as a matter of individual error, but as a matter of company-wide policy.

Quote:


The problem did not arise until they failed to do what any highschool newpaper reporter does: check the facts.



This, combined with previous reactions by Rather, is what makes me think this was a combination of personal vendetta and hubris, as in, "This will be a great last story to go out on as CBS news anchor."

Quote:

Never the less CBS news and/or its agents committed a deliberate slander on the President...


It's only a slander if it's substantially false. As a lawyer you know well why they would never pursue such a case. And, let's be adults here, much as we may not like it, it is clear that W got the Rich Boy's E-Ticket during Vietnam. There can't be a whole lot of debate about that.

Quote:

Then when we own CBS we can make them run a new Firefly series. Moday nights...after Everybody Loves Raymond.


Can't we bump Raymond to the 8 o'clock time slot and put it on at 9?

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 4:31 PM

FINN MAC CUMHAL


According the Center for Media and Public Affairs(CMPA) Kerry had the most favorable coverage of any presidential candidate since 1980 with 58% favorable coverage and 42% negative. During the same time period, Bush’s coverage was only 36% favorable and 64% negative. With the most favorable election coverage of the last seven election going to the democratic candidate it would seem that the Liberal bias in the media is still alive and well.

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 4:50 PM

NEUTRINOLAD


Quote:

Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
...Kerry had the most favorable coverage of any presidential candidate since 1980 with 58% favorable coverage and 42% negative. During the same time period, Bush’s coverage was only 36% favorable and 64% negative.




That might just may be because of the media's liberal bias.
-OR-
Or it might just be due to the fact that one candidate had a record of serving in elected offices, seemed to take his education seriously (writers are real partial to folks who read), and was a decorated veteran, while the other had a record as a selfish wastrel with a history of frequently questionable ethics both in commerce and in his short political career.

Not saying those characterizations are completely correct, just saying, may be a reason.

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 5:27 PM

FINN MAC CUMHAL


Maybe, but 7 elections in a row all for the democratic candidate? I think, Liberal bias is probably the more likely reason.

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 6:48 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Is this a new liberal bias that only showed up for the last election?

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 8:05 PM

NEUTRINOLAD


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
Is this a new liberal bias that only showed up for the last election?



Quote:

Originally posted by Finn:
...the most favorable election coverage of the last seven election going to the democratic candidate...



So I think the study he is quoting says there has been a bias in favor of the Democrats in the last 7 elections.

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Thursday, January 13, 2005 8:18 PM

NEUTRINOLAD


Quote:

Originally posted by NeutrinoLad:
So I think the study he is quoting says there has been a bias in favor of the Democrats in the last 7 elections.



OK, I'm a big dummy. I referred to a reference to a study I had not actually seen. Sorry.
So I did go to the CMPA's website. Dear lord, please tell me that does not say what I think it does. Yup,

Quote:

From the front page of http://www.cmpa.com/ :
CBS Fails To Excape Cloud of News Bias



I kid you not. Then I went to mediatransparency.org to see how the CMPA is funded.

Well, at least I learned a valuable lesson, and a real time saver at that. Any time I hear that the source is the CMPA, I can discount anything they say.

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Friday, January 14, 2005 3:17 AM

CONNORFLYNN


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
Is this a new liberal bias that only showed up for the last election?



Hehe.. I had this discussion with a relative of mine (my wife's Uncle) who is a Prof at NYU who teaches Poetry and English something or other LOL. He's a pretty Liberal Liberal and even he has declared that the media has always been Liberal. His definition was Moderate Liberalism. I agreed with him of course. To be honest there's nothing wrong with Liberalism. In truth the Progressive movement was founded on the backs of intellectuals. Most Liberals are college grads, hell there is even a base degree referred to pleasantly as "Liberal Arts" aka Hippie/Treehugger Degree hehehe..ok ok..so I'm pushing it..but to a degree I think it's safe to say that those associated with Art/Media and Education as well as philosophy tend to be Liberal/ Progressive.

Unfortunately, the Dems have lost their way, instead of continuing to be progressive..they rely solely on the fact that they believe that they own the Minority vote, even though they haven't done shit for them over the past couple decades really except maybe prolong there dependence on government and less on helping them grow, and are really no longer progressive.

The term I would say is "Keep em down and keep em dependent..we need their votes" hehe

The problem lies with the Gorram BIG political groups and parties who I don't think really represent Liberals anymore. The same can be said for Conservatives.. I don't think the Republican party represents Conservatives anymore. They all try too hard to please everyone and end up not having a sound footing on any issue.

I also think that Big Media in general has tried to influence instead of inform for ages. Now that the internet has created new forms of pundits..they are much more easily proven to be manipulative.

Personally, I don't care how they spin the news. My problem lies with the fact that CBS (and I don't think they are the only ones) felt it was OK to try and outright affect the election with out and out lies.

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Friday, January 14, 2005 7:29 AM

REEQUEEN


NeutrinoLand:

While I completely agree with you, re: FoxNews, I think the issue here is whether or not any of the news media are actually unbiased at all.

I don't feel they are, I think (as has been said) they each have their particular prejudices, and they run with them. Which is generally why I try to get my news from the Onion.

There's a profit motive in producing stories that cater to one segment or other of the population. It's more popular right now to slant right than it is to slant left, therefore the vehemence with which FoxNews is defended.

While I agree that the media that trade on their reputations for integrity and so forth should tell news straight, I don't think it's likely to happen. It's just one of those things that is hard to fight, rather like herding cats. Which leaves it up to individuals to use their brains about the more obviously politicized subjects.

The same standard should be used when judging between slanted stories, whether or not the "reputation" is self-promotion, or some form of nostalgia. This is not a recent development, there never has been some mythical golden mean of neutral reportage, no matter what I was taught in my journalism class.

The best we can do is get information from various sources, compare that information, and find some measure of "truth" within that information. Going to sources outside the US (easy if you've got 'net access or BBC America) adds a broader view.

However, it is amusing to note the reactions once the petard has been hoisted. FoxNews clearly places itself in the same category as those you mentioned, while daily redefining itself as the new measure of tabloid journalism. If it wants ('scuse my anthropomorphizing) to be recognized as a legitimate news source, it's fair to judge it by the same standard as the others.

News has never been neutral. Not since pamphlets were first sold by political opponents to slander each other into the mud.

"You mean they have the internet on computers now?" Homer

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Friday, January 14, 2005 7:43 AM

HERO


Quote:

Originally posted by Connorflynn:

Personally, I don't care how they spin the news. My problem lies with the fact that CBS (and I don't think they are the only ones) felt it was OK to try and outright affect the election with out and out lies.



I agree. And they were really BAD lies. Obvious forgeries and no background checking.

The tried to defraud the American people, slander the American President, all during the last weeks of the election and during time of war. The only people this does not bother are the Bush-haters, because they hate Bush first...there is no second.

Bush-haters, when you care enough to hate the very best.

H

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Friday, January 14, 2005 5:01 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


That's why it's important to get your news from many sources, especially foreign ones. They don't have the same biases, economics and agendas as in the US, they have their own set. But it's easier to see those things in a foreign source than a national one, and by doing some compare and contrast, one can usually find out what's important.
CBS is actually right-leaning, just not as right as Faux. I have yet to identify a liberal network-news source.

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Friday, January 14, 2005 6:10 PM

NEUTRINOLAD


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
That's why it's important to get your news from many sources...



Pretty and smart.
What can I say? You're right again Rue.

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