Buffy nitpicks by Spideyslinger

BUFFYVERSE

Buffy nitpicks

POSTED BY: SPIDEYSLINGER
UPDATED: Friday, October 14, 2005 19:46
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Friday, September 16, 2005 1:14 PM

I have just started watching the show and am on the Season 3 DVD's now. Great, great show! Every once in a while though these nitpicks pop into my head.The bad guys could hide and pick Buffy off with a scope rifle anytime they wanted to. I try not to think of it but many episodes have villians carrying rifles. Bad guys could wait outside and grab her Mom too. Basically all the things that would happen if Batman or any other superhero's identity was discovered could happen. Any thoughts on this?
P.S. Don't get me wrong, I love the show, just was wondering if this has ever been addressed.

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Friday, September 16, 2005 4:51 PM

BATMARLOWE

It hasn't been particularly addressed. Buffy can't use a gun against vamps so she doesn't have one. Buffy rarely has a human enemy (those snipers in the episode you're referring to may be the only ones). Vampires don't need them against a normal human and they like the "personal touch", anyway.

Wouldn't it be smart for a vamp to use a gun to elimate a Slayer? Sure would. I think most of us are willing to suspend disbelief on that point because guns aren't usually a part of vampire lore so we're not expecting to see them.

Joyce is pretty safe, actually. It not common knowledge among vamps who the Slayer's mother is. Even if they did they can't get to her during the day and they can't go in uninvited when she's home. The only vamp who knows and can walk in is Spike and he rather likes Joyce as it turns out (Spike is a bit of a walking contradiction).

Throughout the series Buffy occasionally will come across a gun and toss it away and she always has something disparaging to say about them.

It's not really a nitpick, it's a logical question. But if we're going to enjoy the show we just have to suspend our disbelief when it comes that point.

I find it pretty easy to do with BUFFY.

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Friday, September 16, 2005 6:21 PM

OURMRREYNOLDS

Possibly the idea is that just capping the slayer is useless because 1. another pops right up and 2. you get no vamp "cool points" for just plicking her from 400 yds. It seems to me that while some vamps take her on for the street cred it would be a better idea to either turn her so's you've got an super-vamp or cripple her so she's useless but no new girl gets the slayer whammy. Not that I believe there is anything in the Buffyverse that supports this, but I hate the idea of plot-holes as much as anyone, and its what I could come up with.

Cynicism is the smoke that rises from the ashes of burned out dreams.
"I am planning on growing a big black moustache. I'm a traditionalist."

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Friday, September 16, 2005 6:44 PM

EMBERS

well Darla brings a gun to the fight in season one,
but I think the deal is that most vampires really really want to drink the blood of someone who is still alive...
so shooting someone from a distance is just not really their thing.
Vampires come equipped with the sharp teeth and I think that that is supposed to be their weapon of choice.
(other demons have other weapons, but guns are a little modern and 'human' for most of them I think)

At heart it comes down to the fact that Joss (Firefly not withstanding) doesn't like guns and didn't want them central on the show...and when Warren picks one up in S6 it is a big shocker because it is such a rarity on Buffy.

Just as gun-slinging Wesley was such a surprise in the later seasons of Angel....

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Friday, September 16, 2005 6:52 PM

STAKETHELURK

In addition to the already mentioned exceptions and Whedon's anti-gun stance, there is another factor, I think. In one of the commentaries or special features, they mention that they liked the contrast of the hip teenagers using medieval weapons. They don't want it all to be modern, they want to show the Scoobies live both in the contemporary world and the quasi-medieval demon world. So neither demons nor Scoobies use guns that much, but the Scoobies are dressed much better. It's aesthetics.

EDITED TO ADD: And from a story-telling point of view, guns make things too easy and diminish from the metaphor. Anybody can use a gun, but only the Slayer and her enemies have superstrength and other supernatural powers. That's why they need a Chosen One and not a Special Forces team (case in point, the Initiative was barely competent at best). Guns make everything too impersonal; that's why in many action films the final battle between the hero and the villain is a physical or mental struggle, rather than a shoot-out.

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Friday, September 16, 2005 8:07 PM

TJACK

As a matter of fact there was an episode where Spike during his "I love Buffy, but I can't admit it to my self." grabbed a shotgun and was going after the Slayer that way.
It was so out of character, that even Harmony said something about it.
He found Buffy sitting on her porch crying and couldn't go through with it.

...cause Justice is the one thing you should always find.

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Friday, September 16, 2005 10:16 PM

BATMARLOWE

I always wanted to see a story about a turned Slayer. In fact sometimes I ponder what would have happened if seasons 6 and 7 were BUFFY, THE VAMPIRE. I'm sure there's fan-fic about that.

But crippling a Slayer...that's just diabolical. I suppose she might just kill herself.

You may get no cred if you cap a Slayer, but if she's an immediate threat, it's not an impractical solution. And the next will pop but she will be far away from you. Like Jamaica...and then come to Sunnydale, or Boston...and then come to Sunnydale.

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 3:16 AM

HONORBOUND

I always wondered why, after it was determined that a new slayer was called when Buffy drowned but was revived, why the evil Watchers Council didn't just take a slayer and hole her up in some lab and kill/revive her over and over to create a slayer army.

Of course there could be a lineage thing where you only create one after you and it's the next slayer that needs to die to create the next in line... but still...

A kind word turneth away wrath, but not as well as superior firepower

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 6:44 AM

CHRISISALL

Buffy 'knows' when a vamp is near; she'd 'know' if one had a gun pointed at her.

The simple answers Chrisisall

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 8:38 AM

SPIDEYSLINGER

Is it possible that a Slayer can't be turned into a vampire? Something in her blood turns her entire body into a vampire fighting machine, maybe it would fight the vampire infection also.
Also was Buffy always strong or did she only become strong after starting the slaying?
P.S I'm only through Season 3 if these questions are later answered.

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 8:39 AM

OURMRREYNOLDS

SPOILER ALERT IF YOU HAVEN'T FINISHED THE SERIES!!!

I believe that is canon. Once Kendra is killed Faith arrives, and I believe the slayer line follows her. If Buffy dies there is no replacement for her, she's already been replaced, so I don't think killing her multiple times would do anything.

Cynicism is the smoke that rises from the ashes of burned out dreams.
"I am planning on growing a big black moustache. I'm a traditionalist."

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 10:45 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

The real answer, of course, is that there's no good reason for it. The vamps ought to be using sniper rifles and submachineguns. Not against their prey, but against their hunters. "I'll get my street cred by staying undead, thank you very much!"

It's a stylistic choice, and one that the show doesn't really attempt to explain.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 12:02 PM

STEVETHEPIRATE

I don't think it's simply a choice determined by the intended style of the show.

Killing Buffy from afar with a sniper rifle would serve little to no purpose for the bad guys in the series, other than she would no longer be there to hunt/kill them. Think about it. Early-series Spike grabs a sniper rifle, climbs on top of Buffy's roof and picks her off as she returns from school. He smiles, maybe even laughs a bit. What's he do then? Have a sandwich?

There's nothing evil about a high efficienty rate.

----------------------------------------------
"MY APOCALYPTIC TENOR HAS NOT BEEN DISPELLED!" - T-Rex ( www.qwantz.com)

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 5:13 PM

STAKETHELURK

Quote:
Also was Buffy always strong or did she only become strong after starting the slaying?

It's pretty well established that Buffy's superpowers came about after she was "called" as a Slayer. They get a bit more indepth about the nature and origins of the Slayer later in the series.

Quote:
There's nothing evil about a high efficiency rate

This is an important point. Vampires, when they actually want to fight the Slayer as opposed to avoiding her, want a victory they can brag about. Guns don't work on vamps, so they wouldn't be impressed by a vampire who used one. Hence, fisticuffs.

Also, demons in BtVS (as opposed to Ats) are almost always show as being either dumb or devoted to old traditions. They would either not consider or would reject using modern "human" weapons and would prefer the old ways.

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 7:03 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Sorry guys, if all of my enemies fell from a 7.62 NATO slug placed between the eyes from 400 meters away, I'd get a heck of a rep.

And if my enemies were vamps, phosphorous works wonders.

Even if I wanted to cut off my opponent's head with a sword or stake them through the heart, an ounce of double-aught buck shot is aces for a momentary incapacitation before the kill. I think a semiautomatic shotgun would be recommended for close-in encounters.

Heck, the Slayer's team might even benefit from a semiautomatic paint-ball gun loaded with holy water balls.

No, it's entirely a stylistic choice, and it's best to take it as such. There is no practical reason for Buffy or her enemies to avoid the use of Firearms.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Saturday, September 17, 2005 8:12 PM

BATMARLOWE

I think you're right, AnthonyT, it is a stylistic choice--and one that works because...well...because the show is well done, and also because I think our acculturated conceptions of the tropes of vampire stories allow us to accept the "old-fashioned" approach.

Except for that paintball full of holy water thing. I like that one--not much different than a crossbow, really.

But yeah, realistically speaking both Buffy and vampires would use modern weaponry in their struggle to do away with each other.

But it sure would be a lot less enjoyable to watch.

And I know the Council has its dark side but I don't think they would be so grisly as to capture a teenaged girl, do something to her to make her technically dead, revive her, then capture the next Slayer, and repeat the process over and over until they had an army of Slayers.

I just don't think the Council is that inhuman. Also they wouldn't have an army of Slayers as much as they would have an army of kick-ass chicks who would be verrrrrrrry angry at them.

And once again, it is absolutely canon that the Slayer line runs through Faith! Buffy dies, Kendra's called. Kendra dies, Faith's called. If Faith dies, then the next Slayer is called.

To say anything else about that particular subject would contain too many spoilers.

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Sunday, September 18, 2005 4:01 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
I think a semiautomatic shotgun would be recommended for close-in encounters.

Clearly you are a fan of John Carpenter's Vampires, nes pas?

Mahogony Chrisisall

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Sunday, September 18, 2005 4:32 AM

EMBERS

Quote:
Originally posted by Spideyslinger:
Is it possible that a Slayer can't be turned into a vampire? Something in her blood turns her entire body into a vampire fighting machine, maybe it would fight the vampire infection also.

in season one the nightmare coma boy shows what people fear,
and one of Buffy's fears is that she would be turned into a vampire.
So I think it CAN happen...but they never had an extra slayer to waste on making it happen
(you have to keep the stories going!)

I suppose, technically, if Faith (for instance) was turned into a vampire then she would be dead and a new slayer would be called...
but it would have ruined the hope of those of us who were wanting Faith's redemption and hope of future happiness....
at any rate I'm glad Joss never went there,
but he still could...someday...
(I expect futures shows/spinoffs eventually)

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Sunday, September 18, 2005 5:00 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Any movie that has a scene where a vampire is killed by dragging them out into the sunlight via a vehicle and winch, loses my vote.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, October 14, 2005 12:05 PM

SPIDEYSLINGER

Here's another nitpick - How come Giles gets paid for being a watcher and Buffy gets nothing for being a slayer. Of the two who would you rather hire to get rid of a vampire problem. Maybe Giles is pocketing her check. He seemed to have alot of money saved up to buy that magic store and the new car.

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Friday, October 14, 2005 7:46 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

A couple small points to add and consider:

1) Vampires, according to the traditional lore, have absolutely no use for "dead blood". You kill the person (or slayer), and their blood is now useless. You can't drink them once they're dead, or you (the vamp) will die as well!

2) Going off what Spike says, Slayer blood is the absolute BEST, an amazing rush. So any vamp who knows of Spike (and how many don't?) will have heard of this (he does brag a bit...), and of Spike's having bested two Slayers through the years and fed off their blood.

I think it's these couple of simple reasons (Joss never really seemed to address or acknowledge the "dead blood" part of Vampiria, but it's pretty common in most of the serious Vampire lore) that keep the Slayers "safe"... well, safER.

If you just want the Slayer dead and out of your way, a well-placed bullet is just the ticket. If you want her blood or if you want the "clean kill" mano-a-mano for style points or street cred, then it's gotta be done the old-fashioned way. Save the guns and bullets for Werewolves.

Now, I suppose if you could load your ammo with wooden bullets, you'd really have something... ;)

Personally, I like guns. I like 'em a lot. But I also liked that they were never really an integral part of the Buffyverse. When they do come up, they're usually dispensed with pretty quickly and efficiently; it's almost as if Joss is telling us, "If you've got super Slayer powers, a gun is no threat at all." Someone pulls a gun on a Slayer, and it usually gets taken away, looked at like a dead fish, and tossed aside as useless.

Mike

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