[quote]But that doesn't mean they won't fight. It is a lesson BP executives or anyone else who would underestimate them ignores at their peril. At times ..."/>

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Gulf Coast folks will fight for their rights

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Friday, July 9, 2010 15:26
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 601
PAGE 1 of 1

Friday, July 9, 2010 8:19 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

But that doesn't mean they won't fight. It is a lesson BP executives or anyone else who would underestimate them ignores at their peril. At times of crisis, those in the claims division of corporate giants often reason that residents who've lost everything will take anything. So they offer shrimpers, oystermen and those who fish the Gulf Coast waters pennies on the dollar for their losses.

Many insurance companies did the same after Hurricane Katrina. The people fought back. And they will this time. But they shouldn't have to.

Some have asked if the response would have been as bungled if oil gushed into the waters off New York City. A fisherman's wife in Louisiana with a front-row seat on BP's response fumes at the company's talk of a need to cut cleanup expenses, and the "dog and balloon" shows BP says it puts on for visiting politicians. The politicians come, shake hands and leave -- at which point the cleanup workers and rows of skimmer boats disappear. I have heard from Gulf Coast residents trained and ready to work on cleaning everything from beaches to oil-covered birds who say they have found their skills either ignored or wasted.

Hurricane Katrina was like an amputation -- a swift, crippling, traumatic blow. But afterward it was clear what was lost and what had to be done to recover. The oil spill is like a slow-moving plague. Residents don't know where it's going, how long it will last, who it will infect next, whether its effects will be fatal or survivable. The resulting sense of helplessness and dread is devastating.

Already, reports are emerging that cleanup workers and Louisiana residents are becoming sickened from their exposure to the oil and its fumes. There has been at least one suicide. The mental and emotional anguish in the phone calls, e-mails and text messages I get daily from family and friends on the Gulf Coast is heartbreaking.

Let's hope they're as tough as she says they are!


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
signing off



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Friday, July 9, 2010 8:27 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


As a real question, why do lib/progs only talk about fighting for their rights when its in the abstract? Or against a faceless enemy? Or against a corporation, or a so-called social injustice?

And yet, if someone says "I shot him to protect my life/lives of my family", there is all this hooplah about "shooting them in the leg"?

It seems a simple way to not have to do anything, or if you fail, well... its cus the "man" was too "big" for you.

ETA: I dont mean it as a snark. Im really curious. It seems to me that if libs/progs want to claim to be able to stand up for something, they need to make it real. Something tangible.

Like: "Yeah, they were beating up on this guy, so I stopped it." Not: "I saw these disadvantaged youths perpetrating an aledged crime, so I went and donated to the NAACP".






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Friday, July 9, 2010 11:33 AM

FREMDFIRMA



Something real, something tangible ?

Go find me a Pathway Family Center that isn't deserted, foreclosed, abandoned or destroyed, go on, find even ONE.

Find even ONE facility run by WWASPS directly.

And mind you, that starting from the position of a mid-teen considered a fekkin nobody, without an ounce of political power, no resources, legally considered subhuman, and facing up against a powerful machine that was so horribly effective it was thought naught more than a myth, an urban legend, a conspiracy theory.

Sure, takin on the little things is handy, and you're making a damn fool assumption that they don't - I know I do, Anthony does, even with a small but quality documentary as evidence, Niki does, so you are making a false assumption in direct opposition to the evidence at hand, trying to convince YOURSELF of something you know is not true because facing reality would require you to question your core beliefs - something you seriously need to man up and do if you ever wanna get taken more seriously than some crazy on the corner.

Oh, and since the topic of WWASPS has been brought up, this oughta appeal a little bit to your bloodthirsty sense of vengeance.
Son's trial begins in `hit' on parents
http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/07/08/1720439/sons-trial-begins-in-hit
-on-parents.html

Quote:

Witnesses also told police Sutton hated his parents for shipping him off to the Paradise Cove program in Western Samoa, a boot camp style program with a history of abuse complaints from participants.
His parents even obtained a court order to ensure he stayed there after he turned 18.


Gee, cause sending your child to a fucking death camp is such good parenting - this is one of the few instances where my morals conflict with most peoples, his only "crime" IMHO was not doing the deed himself and making sure they were dead.

Sometimes "The Law" is wrong, sometimes "Society" and "Convention" are wrong, and if you choose to stand against them you *will* be considered a villain, you *will* be considered evil, a cost most people won't bear, so they content themselves with doing "good" in a way that fits the social structure built by those who profit from it, unknowingly contributing and supporting, despite their intentions, or because they lack the power to shake the towers individually, so they knock out single chips while going about their lives.
Quote:

The plans and schemes of tyrants are broken by many things. They shatter against cliffs of heroic struggle. They rupture on reefs of open resistance. And they are slowly eroded, bit by little bit, on the very beaches where they measure triumph, by countless grains of sand. By the stubborn little decencies of humble little men.

In the Heart of Darkness-David Drake.

And just for you, although I am likely wasting my time, if you DO manage to find the balls to start questioning the core beliefs you're desperately trying to cling to as harsh reality shreds them to tattered rags....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kohlberg%27s_stages_of_moral_development

Evolve or Die, idiot boy.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, July 9, 2010 11:48 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


"Evolve or Die, idiot boy."

Does that work? Ever? I mean, I get the whole reverse psychology of "force". Its Child Psych 101. But really?

I mean, does insulting and berating people into your way of thought... how often does that work with kids outside of the standard norm? I mean, those on the far right side of the curve?

Sure, it might work with the middle line, or the left... but whats your hit rate on the others? (For the slow ones, no... Im not talking about the right or left of politics.... tho that does seem to fit the pattern..)



Now, I know you are all about reprogramming people. AND, I even allow that it is needed in some cases.

But, how often does that technique make for good followers to your camp?

And of what kind? Broken, sad, horrible little ones looking for answers and a purpose. Well they make great anarchists, don't they? They've seen how bad things can get, have "looked into the black and seen it staring back" so to speak, and are now fighting to make order of their existance. Yet, they run in the pack that would cause total anarchy, because that is what they know.

Now. Im not against the governement being so limited as to have little or no meaning in our individual lives, but I realize that there MAY come a time when we all need to band together. Pack law, such as it is.

However, to argue FOR NEVER being able to band together, at all? Naww. Thats a one way ticket to being conquored by the in-line steppers.

ETA: Ooooo now I've done it, oh yes I have...

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Friday, July 9, 2010 12:31 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Ah, now we get to the meat and bones of it - was that so hard, kiddo, to take your rage and smash the wall which keeps you from actually... THINKING ?

Felt good too, didn't it, that little endorphin rush of blowing off the artificial limits on your own behavior, that wind of freedom blowing through your head, shredding the cobwebs and allowing the gears to finally turn ?

I push, you push back - and in doing so you exercise a part of your own mind you've allowed to atrophy, critical thought and reasoning.

I do not necessarily desire you to come into "my way of thought" so much as to actually THINK in the first place, and turn that rage upon the folk who convinced you not to, the folks you honestly believed were on your side but just use you to shift the leash from another tyrants hand to their own.

Hell, I don't try to drag folk to my camp, in fact I encourage them to go live their own lives quite strongly, cause if you concentrate too much focus on a single loci you lose effectiveness and it eventually becomes like all large organisations, existing only to serve itself no matter what it's original purpose was, which can only be forestalled via sand castle heirarchy, but past a point no longer suppressed - in short, to hell with joining my org, go build your own, and if we ever happen to be coming at the same goal by different means I wish you all the blessings I can muster, even as I try to steamroller your ass.

As for your point about many Anarchists, did it never occur to you that is perhaps why I do not get along with them, because they are hypocritical pretend-nihilists up against my Rosseau-Kropotkinism ?

Severing the LEGAL bonds which force us together when we do not want to be, would not sever the social bonds which bring us together because we DO want to be, if anything, those would strengthen because the mutual alliances would be by choice and necessity rather than arbitrary to fit someone elses quota.

You wanna talk banding together, let's talk Kropotkin, shall we ?
http://dwardmac.pitzer.edu/Anarchist_Archives/kropotkin/mutaidcontents
.html

Quote:

However, as soon as we come to a higher stage of civilization, and refer to history which already has something to say about that stage, we are bewildered by the struggles and conflicts which it reveals. The old bonds seem entirely to be broken. Stems are seen to fight against stems, tribes against tribes, individuals against individuals; and out of this chaotic contest of hostile forces, mankind issues divided into castes, enslaved to despots, separated into States always ready to wage war against each other. And, with this history of mankind in his hands, the pessimist philosopher triumphantly concludes that warfare and oppression are the very essence of human nature; that the warlike and predatory instincts of man can only be restrained within certain limits by a strong authority which enforces peace and thus gives an opportunity to the few and nobler ones to prepare a better life for humanity in times to come.

And yet, as soon as the every-day life of man during the historical period is submitted to a closer analysis and so it has been, of late, by many patient students of very early institutions -- it appears at once under quite a different aspect. Leaving aside the preconceived ideas of most historians and their pronounced predilection for the dramatic aspects of history, we see that the very documents they habitually peruse are such as to exaggerate the part of human life given to struggles and to underrate its peaceful moods. The bright and sunny days are lost sight of in the gales and storms. Even in our own time, the cumbersome records which we prepare for the future historian, in our Press, our law courts, our Government offices, and even in our fiction and poetry, suffer from the same one-sidedness. They hand down to posterity the most minute descriptions of every war, every battle and skirmish, every contest and act of violence, every kind of individual suffering; but they hardly bear any trace of the countless acts of mutual support and devotion which every one of us knows from his own experience; they hardly. take notice of what makes the very essence of our daily life -- our social instincts and manners. No wonder, then, if the records of the past were so imperfect. The annalists of old never failed to chronicle the petty wars and calamities which harassed their contemporaries; but they paid no attention whatever to the life of the masses, although the masses chiefly used to toil peacefully while the few indulged in fighting. The epic poems, the inscriptions on monuments, the treaties of peace -- nearly all historical documents bear the same character; they deal with breaches of peace, not with peace itself. So that the best-intentioned historian unconsciously draws a distorted picture of the times he endeavours to depict; and, to restore the real proportion between conflict and union, we are now bound to enter into a minute analysis of thousands of small facts and faint indications accidentally preserved in the relics of the past; to interpret them with the aid of comparative ethnology; and, after having heard so much about what used to divide men, to reconstruct stone by stone the institutions which used to unite them.


Think about that, for every shot exchanged with Pashtun, Sunni or Shiite today, there's also someone up in Dearborn buying some Kebab from one, talking about mutual annoyances like the smoking ban on businesses, or what assholes the local cops are, straight across boundries that you've been told are insurmountable, and they're NOT, it's all a divide and conquer game played by both parties and YOU BLOODY WELL KNOW IT.

Far from pissing me off, you've in fact displayed a in no uncertain terms that you CAN think, once the armor of platitudes and talking points fails you, and having met that standard now, in public, you really think I won't be holding it to you in the future ?

You can try to bullshit me all you like, but most importantly, you need to stop bullshitting YOURSELF.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, July 9, 2010 1:05 PM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


Hey, who knows, you might be right.


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Friday, July 9, 2010 3:26 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Well, since you brought him up...

What makes the Joker so bloody dangerous, or for that matter the Watchmens Rorshach ?

Ain't neither one of em got super powers, what they got, is the ability to THINK, unbounded by conditioning, tradition, convention, diagonally instead of straight lines, even curves, come at you sideways, hit you in the blind spots, turn your own predictability against you.

And you know, you can do it without the crazy - it is only the social perception that someone who doesn't play by the rules *is* crazy, that causes them to be portrayed as such as a discouragement to folk getting...
Ideas.

Or at least ideas that have not been copyrighted, legislated, codified and ruled over by the powers that be, you see ?

They FEAR what they can not CONTROL.

The powers that run this world operate on the philosophy espoused in Dune - he who can destroy a thing, controls a thing - but how do you destroy an IDEA, how do you destroy a THOUGHT ?

Easy, you don't, because it can not be done, and so they take the preventive measure of making sure people never have one, via the "education" they are given, via a thought model that allows no room for them...

Yes/No, Black/White, Them/Us, On/Off - which also conveniently allows them the flip the switches and set one social group against another to prevent any alliance thereof from ever being a threat to them, be it a school, a prison, a community, all the way up to the country, the world, divide and conquer.

Why you think Malcom X had to die - cause somewhere in there he realized that restricting a fight for human rights to one race, one religion, was bullshit, first breaking with the nation of islam, and then coming to a rather bitter realization of what his own racism cost him before he quashed it.
Quote:

I realized racism isn't just a black and white problem. It's brought bloodbaths to about every nation on earth at one time or another.

Brother, remember the time that white college girl came into the restaurant—the one who wanted to help the Muslims and the whites get together—and I told her there wasn't a ghost of a chance and she went away crying? Well, I've lived to regret that incident. In many parts of the African continent I saw white students helping black people. Something like this kills a lot of argument. I did many things as a Muslim that I'm sorry for now. I was a zombie then—like all Muslims—I was hypnotized, pointed in a certain direction and told to march. Well, I guess a man's entitled to make a fool of himself if he's ready to pay the cost. It cost me 12 years.

That was a bad scene, brother. The sickness and madness of those days—I'm glad to be free of them.


See, as long as he was playin ball by their rules, Black/White, On/Off, he wasn't any threat, but when he started to cross the lines, reach across those supposedly uncrossable divides, people started shitting bricks, and make no mistake, a lot of folk playing the divisions are well aware of how this works and even exploiting it for power - smart people do, how many times have I mentioned setting folks with ill intentions toward their fellow man at each others throats, neh ?

And so it is with you, Male/Female, Black/White, Liberal/Conservative, all of it a scam, a sham, a bad bill of goods sold to you by the same folk who are telling you that you need to be controlled for your own good, not just handing you a leash, but encouraging you to distribute them to others...

And now that the mirror has cracked, illusion starting to fade, there you go with the reflexive clinging to the only life and reality you've ever really known, cause there's something comforting about the familiar... even if it's ugly.

And here's me, tellin you it ain't gotta be that way, Crazy Eddie and his third option, offering you power, the very keys to the kingdom, IF, and only if - you can find the courage to snatch them from his hand and USE them.

Can you ?

Or is the illusion so very comforting to you, cause it doesn't sound too comforting when you howl in derision at the folks poking holes in it, it doesn't sound like a pleasant, or a happy existence to me.

The lies we tell ourselves are always the most painful, especially when we start to make the horrible ones true - all black and white, and blind to any shade of grey.

ETA: And most importantly, you need to listen, really LISTEN, to what people are telling you, and at every point, at any point, ask WHY they might be telling you that.

Even me, hell, ESPECIALLY me.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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