...sigh...it's not "global warming", it's "climate change", and a heat wave isn't the only thing that shows it, so do the extraordinary cold last Winter ..."/>
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REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
Will Russia's Heat Wave End Its Global-Warming Doubts?
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 9:03 AM
NIKI2
Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...
Quote:Russians are not used to heat waves. When the high temperatures that have overwhelmed Russia over the past six weeks first arrived in June, some 1,200 Russians drowned at the country's beaches. "The majority of those who drowned were drunk," the Emergencies Ministry concluded in mid-July, citing the Russian habit of taking vodka to cool off by the sea. But while overconsumption of vodka is a familiar scourge in Russia, extreme heat is not, and as the worst heat wave on record spawns wildfires that are destroying entire villages, Russian officials have made what for them is a startling admission: global warming is very real. "A woman covers her nose from smog as she walks next to a fire hydrant in the town of Vyksa, some 93 miles (150 km) southwest of the Volga city of Nizhny Novgorod. At a meeting of international sporting officials in Moscow on July 30, Russian President Dmitri Medvedev announced that in 14 regions of the country, "practically everything is burning. The weather is anomalously hot." Then, as TV cameras zoomed in on the perspiration shining on his forehead, Medvedev announced, "What's happening with the planet's climate right now needs to be a wake-up call to all of us, meaning all heads of state, all heads of social organizations, in order to take a more energetic approach to countering the global changes to the climate." For Medvedev, such sentiments mark a striking about-face. Only last year, he announced that Russia, the world's third largest polluter after China and the U.S., would be spewing 30% more planet-warming gases into the atmosphere by 2020. "We will not cut our development potential," he said during the summer of 2009 (an unusually mild one), just a few months before attending the Copenhagen climate summit, which in December failed to reach a substantial agreement on how to limit carbon emissions. But even that pronouncement, grim as it seemed to the organizers of the Copenhagen talks, was mild compared with the broader Russian campaign against the idea that global warming is taking place. Two months before Copenhagen, state-owned Channel One television aired a documentary called The History of a Deception: Global Warming, which argued that the notion of man-made climate change was the result of an international media conspiracy. "Broadly speaking, the Russian position has always been that climate change is an invention of the West to try to bring Russia to its knees," says Vladimir Chuprov, director of the Greenpeace energy department in Moscow. But Medvedev's climate-sensitive comments on Friday, Chuprov says, could finally mark the start of a policy shift. "You don't just throw comments like that around when you are the leader of the nation, and if you look at what is happening with this heat wave, it's horrible. It's clearly enough to shake people out of their delusions about global warming."
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 1:50 PM
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 1:56 PM
AURAPTOR
America loves a winner!
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 1:58 PM
ANTHONYT
Freedom is Important because People are Important
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 2:04 PM
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 2:06 PM
STORYMARK
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: The planet really has no concern for humans....
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 2:09 PM
WHOZIT
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 2:15 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: The planet really has no concern for humans.... Neither, clearly, do you.
Tuesday, August 3, 2010 2:32 PM
Quote: Mark Antony : Caesar has many more legions than the Thirteenth. Scipio: Yes, on the far side of the Alps. Mark Antony: Winter does not last forever. Spring comes. Snows melt. Scipio: That is a threat! Mark Antony : No, I assure you, that is no threat. Snows always melt.
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 6:11 AM
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: The planet really has no concern for humans.... Neither, clearly, do you. You're right. I have no regard for phony man made concepts such as global warming. Or those who buy into such nonsense.
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 6:22 AM
KANEMAN
Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: The planet really has no concern for humans.... Neither, clearly, do you. You're right. I have no regard for phony man made concepts such as global warming. Or those who buy into such nonsense. Like scientists and.... people with an education and a capacity to reason. You're right, you're much better off hanging with teabaggers and hillbillies, cuz they believe what they beleiev and facts be damned! "I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 6:33 AM
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 7:00 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: I was waiting for that. Sorry, but as much as the right loves to decry the term "elite", some folks are dumb, many of them by choice. If you want to label those who are not, particularly those who choose to educate themselves rather than avoid information in order to maintain a simpler worldview, as elite, then so be it. "I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 7:15 AM
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 8:09 AM
Quote:6/1/10-6/7/10: You may have heard about the idea that the world's temperature may have been going up slowly over the past 100 years. What is your personal opinion on this - do you think this has probably been happening, or do you think it probably has not been happening? Probably has been happening 74 Probably has not been happening 24 (Assuming it’s happening) Do you think a rise in the world’s temperature is being (would be) caused mostly by things people do, mostly by natural causes, or about equally by things people do and by natural causes? Things People Do 30 Natural Causes 25 Both Equally 45 Some people believe that the United States government should limit the amount of air pollution that U.S. businesses can produce. Other people believe that the government should not limit air pollution from U.S. businesses. What about you? Do you think the government should or should not limit air pollution from U.S. businesses? Government should limit air pollution from U.S. businesses 86 Government should not limit air pollution from U.S. businesses 12 Some people believe that the United States government should limit the amount of greenhouse gasses thought to cause global warming that U.S. businesses can produce. Other people believe that the government should not limit the amount of greenhouse gasses that U.S. businesses put out. What about you? Do you think the government should or should not limit the amount of greenhouse gasses that U.S. businesses put out Government should limit greenhouse gasses from U.S. businesses 76 Government should not limit greenhouse gasses from U.S. businesses 20
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 8:12 AM
KWICKO
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)
Quote: Probably has been happening 74 Probably has not been happening 24
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 8:17 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Quote: Probably has been happening 74 Probably has not been happening 24 74%, folks. Nearly 3/4 of all people accept reality.
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 8:21 AM
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 8:25 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: 74% of the people say you're wrong. And that's not just in Missouri; you're wrong everywhere!
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 9:22 AM
Quote:National and international science academies and scientific societies have assessed the current scientific opinion, in particular on recent global warming.Quote:An increasing body of observations gives a collective picture of a warming world and other changes in the climate system... There is new and stronger evidence that most of the warming observed over the last 50 years is attributable to human activities.No scientific body of national or international standing has maintained a dissenting opinion
Quote:An increasing body of observations gives a collective picture of a warming world and other changes in the climate system... There is new and stronger evidence that most of the warming observed over the last 50 years is attributable to human activities.
Quote:The world's leading climate scientists said global warming has begun, is very likely caused by man, and will be unstoppable for centuries.... The phrase very likely translates to a more than 90 percent certainty that global warming is caused by man's burning of fossil fuels. That was the strongest conclusion to date, making it nearly impossible to say natural forces are to blame. The report said that an increase in hurricane and tropical cyclone strength since 1970 more likely than not can be attributed to man-made global warming. The Associated Press summarized the position on sea level rise:Quote:On sea levels, the report projects rises of 7-23 inches by the end of the century. That could be augmented by an additional 4-8 inches if recent polar ice sheet melt continues.
Quote:On sea levels, the report projects rises of 7-23 inches by the end of the century. That could be augmented by an additional 4-8 inches if recent polar ice sheet melt continues.
Quote:The evidence that global warming is happening now and that human activities are the primary cause is overwhelming. Indeed, recent research indicates that Earth's climate is changing more quickly than scientists had projected just a few years ago. Last week NASA and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reported that 2010 has been the warmest year worldwide so far recorded.
Quote:The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) was established in 1988 by the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) and the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) in recognition of the problem of global warming. Through the IPCC, climate experts from around the world synthesize the most recent climate science findings every five to seven years and present their report to the world’s political leaders. The IPCC has issued comprehensive assessments in 1990, 1996, 2001 and most recently the Fourth Assessment Report (AR4) released in 2007.
Quote: The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) was established in 1988 by the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) and the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) in recognition of the problem of global warming. Through the IPCC, climate experts from around the world synthesize the most recent climate science findings every five to seven years and present their report to the world’s political leaders. The IPCC has issued comprehensive assessments in 1990, 1996, 2001 and most recently the Fourth Assessment Report (AR4) released in 2007. AR4 is the most comprehensive synthesis of climate change science to date. Experts from more than 130 countries contributed to this assessment, which represents six years of work. More than 450 lead authors have received input from more than 800 contributing authors, and an additional 2,500 experts reviewed the draft documents.
Quote:It is a fact, not a theory. Global warming is a measurable process that is already underway. Temperature changes, alterations in rainfall patterns, and an increased frequency of storms are occurring and being measured around the world as we speak. The evidence against global warming is not convincing in light of the effects we are witnessing already.
Quote: 1) There is "no real scientific proof" that the current warming is caused by the rise of greenhouse gases from man's activity. Technically, proof exists only in mathematics, not in science. Whatever terminology you choose to use, however, there is overwhelming evidence that the current warming is caused by the rise in greenhouse gases due to human activities ( http://www.newscientist.com/blog/environment/2007/05/climate-myths-special.html) . 2) Man-made carbon dioxide emissions throughout human history constitute less than 0.00022 per cent of the total naturally emitted from the mantle of the Earth during geological history. Misleading comparison. Since the industrial age began human emissions are far higher than volcanic emissions ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11638) . 3) Warmer periods of the Earth's history came around 800 years before rises in CO2 levels. In the past 3 million years changing levels of sunshine triggered and ended the ice ages. Carbon dioxide was a feedback that increased warming, rather than the initial cause. In the more distant past, several warming episodes were directly triggered by CO2. ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11659 4) After world war 2, there was a huge surge in recorded CO2 emissions but global temperatures fell for four decades after 1940. In fact, temperatures fell during the 1940s and then remained roughly level until the late 1970s. The fall was partly due to high levels of pollutants such as sulphur dioxide counteracting the warming effect. 5) Throughout the Earth's history, temperatures have often been warmer than now and CO2 levels have often been higher - more than 10 times as high. Which shows that higher CO2 means higher temperatures, taking into account the fact that the sun was cooler in the past. The crucial point is that civilisation is adapted to 20th century temperatures ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11647) . 6) Significant changes in climate have continually occurred throughout geologic time. Yes. And sea level has been up to 70 metres higher during warm periods. If that happens again, there'll be no more London or New York. 7) The 0.7 °C increase in the average global temperature over the past hundred years is entirely consistent with well-established, long-term, natural climate trends. Wrong. The rapid warming since the late 1970s has occurred even though other factors that can warm the planet, such as the sun's intensity, have remained constant ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11650) . 8) The IPCC theory is driven by just 60 scientists and favourable reviewers, not the 4000 usually cited. Untrue, as even the briefest look at the scientific literature can establish. 9) Leaked e-mails from British climate scientists - in a scandal known as "climategate" - suggest that that has been manipulated to exaggerate global warming Nothing in the emails undermines any of the key scientific conclusions ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn18238) . Independent groups have come to the same conclusions. 10) A large body of scientific research suggests that the sun is responsible for the greater share of climate change during the past hundred years. The sun may have contributed to the warming in the first part of the 20th century but it has not caused the rapid warming since the late 1970s ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11650) . 11) Politicians and activists claim rising sea levels are a direct cause of global warming, but sea levels have been increasing steadily since the last ice age 10,000 years ago. Wrong. Sea level rose very rapidly as the North American ice sheet melted after the last ice age but levelled off and has been nearly stable for the past 2000 years or so. Now it is starting to rise rapidly again ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20327151.300) . 12) Philip Stott, emeritus professor of biogeography at the School of Oriental and African Studies in London says climate change is too complicated to be caused by just one factor, whether CO2 or clouds. He is right. All sorts of factors affect climate, even the lead in petrol. However, the recent warming is mostly due to rising greenhouse gases ( http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20327151.300) , and if we pump out more CO2 it will get even hotter.
Wednesday, August 4, 2010 11:02 AM
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