I don't know about that. Given my Jim, and all the married men I know/knew, it's the opposite. Or what they mean by "antisocial" is antisocial BEHAVIORS,..."/>

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Married men are less antisocial?

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Thursday, December 9, 2010 17:57
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Wednesday, December 8, 2010 10:20 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I don't know about that. Given my Jim, and all the married men I know/knew, it's the opposite. Or what they mean by "antisocial" is antisocial BEHAVIORS, which is what it appears. To me, it means they socialize less, which is what I've observed. But, maybe I'm wrong:
Quote:

A good marriage civilizes men. At least, that's what it looks like, since fewer married men are antisocial. Married men are more responsible, less aggressive, less likely to do something illegal and more mentally healthy than single ones. This has been documented in a bunch of studies.

A new study in the Archives of General Psychiatry suggests it's both. S. Alexandra Burt, a behavioral geneticist at Michigan State University, looked at 289 genetically identical male twins to ascertain what difference getting hitched made to these otherwise very similar men.

A new study in the Archives of General Psychiatry suggests it's both. S. Alexandra Burt, a behavioral geneticist at Michigan State University, looked at 289 genetically identical male twins to ascertain what difference getting hitched made to these otherwise very similar men.

The study, which looked at the twins when they were 17, 20, 24 and 29, found that men who had fewer antisocial behaviors at 17 and 20 were more often married by 29. Once the men had gotten hitched, their antisocial activities decreased even more. That is, the married twin was less likely to be doing something obnoxious than the unmarried twin.

So it's chicken and egg: men who are less antisocial get married and then become even more civilized after they get a wife.

Of course, Burt acknowledges, this may not be the marriage talking. It may be that a guy who has a wife doesn't hang out with his ne'er-do-well friends so much or that he's learned, by dating, to bond better. Or that he knows that if he drives drunk/gets in a fight/gets arrested again and manages to escape unscathed, his wife will kill him. Which leads to a different question, how much is the fact that we are getting married later contributing to, or a factor of, our prolonged adolescence?

http://healthland.time.com/2010/12/07/why-married-men-are-less-anti-so
cial/#ixzz17YM3Rgun



Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off





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Wednesday, December 8, 2010 11:35 AM

CANTTAKESKY


In this article, antisocial = irresponsible, aggressive, likely to engage in illegal activities, and mentally "unhealthy" (whatever that means).

It may not be marriage at all. It may be anything that requires a man to be accountable to another human being. It might be that business partnerships or having a kid (without getting married) would help an otherwise reckless man become more responsible and healthy.

I would hypothesize that "connected" men are more likely to become more responsible/healthy than "unconnected" men. Marriage is only one example of a connection.

--Can't Take (my gorram) Sky

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Wednesday, December 8, 2010 11:59 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Excellent point. They also made the point that the kind of men who DO marry might be something to take into account. But I think your point is more valid; commitment of any kind makes it harder to act irresponsibly, for most people.

Actually, I would have used "irresponsible" in the title rather than "antisocial", as antisocial to me means "less social"--obviously that's not what it means, but we use it that way in the vernacular.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off




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Wednesday, December 8, 2010 1:45 PM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
... as antisocial to me means "less social"

Technically, antisocial, as used by psychiatrists, means psychopathic. But that is not what they mean in this article either.

I agree irresponsible is more appropriate. But then the results would seem very obvious. Men with no responsibility tend to remain irresponsible more so than men with responsibility.

Duh.

--Can't Take (my gorram) Sky

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Wednesday, December 8, 2010 2:33 PM

THEHAPPYTRADER


Not sure why, but I find it easier to be social when I'm committed to someone. Maybe it's the confidence booster of knowing someone's gonna be there. Or maybe when I'm single, part of me is always on the prowl, searching for a partner. Not entirely sure, but while I may not be social as often when I'm committed to someone I think I am better at being social, more socially social perhaps... if that makes any sense.

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Thursday, December 9, 2010 8:41 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Makes perfect sense to me, Happy. I experienced some of the same thing myself. Never liked parties, always felt out of place tho' I could fake it pretty good. In our early days, I was more "social" with Jim than without, and it had to do I know at least in part with having someone there "with me" to give me a base, if you will.

Of course, now we're both quite a bit older, we're both completely isolated, and I'm content with it that way. Don't know if I'd be less content or make more of an effort to get out if I didn't have the internet for my socialization, and Jim doesn't use it that way at ALL, so I can't say. But social gatherings, large or small, no longer hold ANY attraction for me.

I'll pose my own question: Why is it most of the men I know who are married or in relationships, as they get older, become more and more entrenched in sitting around watching TV and not having any interests, while the married, etc., women I know, as they get older, get interests and make the effort to stay active?

My perceptions are unquestionably subjective, but throughout my later working years I heard it from other married women as well, so it seems to hold true to at least some extent.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off




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Thursday, December 9, 2010 9:34 AM

MALACHITE


When a psychiatrist uses the word, "antisocial", he isn't talking about how much the person socializes. He is referring to specific traits that make up the diagnosis of antisocial personality disorder -- that is "a pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of the rights of others...as indicated by three or more of the following: ...repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest, deceitfulness, impulsivity, aggressiveness, reckless disregard for safety of self or others, consistent irresponsibility and lack of remorse" (excerpts taken from the DSM-IV TR).

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Thursday, December 9, 2010 9:52 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Mala, I understand that and mentioned it previously. But the fact is, that in general conversation, "anti-social" is understood to have numerous meanings, and one of them is "less social", "less sociable", etc.

Even Webster puts that definition first:
Quote:

1 : averse to the society of others : UNSOCIABLE

2 : hostile or harmful to organized society; especially : being or marked by behavior deviating sharply from the social norm

So I don't think it's inappropriate--yes, it appears from reading it that the article is talking about the second definition, but initially I read it as referring to the first, and that was my question.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off




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Thursday, December 9, 2010 10:31 AM

FREMDFIRMA


But what if that "society" is something awful, something harmful ?

See, to go against social norms, to actively work towards the subversion or destruction of a society - this is by conventional morality considered an act of evil...
WITHOUT REGARD TO THE NATURE OF THAT SOCIETY.

Which is, in effect WHY I accept and even mock the technical alignment category that lands me in.



-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Thursday, December 9, 2010 11:35 AM

MALACHITE


Niki said, "But the fact is, that in general conversation, "anti-social" is understood to have numerous meanings, and one of them is "less social", "less sociable", etc."

While this is statement is true, the article is not a "general conversation". It is a summary of a study published in a psychiatric journal -- a study that would mainly be read by those in the mental health field.

Anyways, I only mentioned it because people still seemed to be misunderstanding the context of the use of the word "antisocial" in the article. But, if people want to continue discussing how their experiences in relationships "contradicts" the findings of this study, by all means, continue...


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Thursday, December 9, 2010 12:33 PM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:

Originally posted by Malachite:
Anyways, I only mentioned it because people still seemed to be misunderstanding the context of the use of the word "antisocial" in the article.

It's an honest mistake, Mala. While the research paper measured traits of antisocial personality disorder, the ARTICLE in Healthland made it sound like they were measuring traits of prolonged immaturity or adolescence. The article didn't discuss the flagship characteristic of APD, lack of empathy or remorse, at all, but made it sound they were just looking at how responsible and impulsive these men were.

Can't Take (my gorram) Sky
------
Everything I say is just my opinion, not fact.

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Thursday, December 9, 2010 1:00 PM

MALACHITE


CTS said: "It's an honest mistake, Mala..."

I'm not disagreeing -- that is why I originally decided to step in and clarify...


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Thursday, December 9, 2010 1:17 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


My husband has being saying this for years, that it's better for men to be in a relationship than not, otherwise they have a tendancy to become smelly, weird and slightly feral if the 'singleness' goes on too long. That's his view.

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Thursday, December 9, 2010 5:57 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Hey now, I take offense to one of those...

Weird and Feral I'll give ya, but smelly ?
Given how much of a prissy libertine I can be ?
That is unless you're counting the scent of bubblebath....

<--more Libertine than Libertarian.


-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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