Out-of-control name-calling by xed

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Out-of-control name-calling

POSTED BY: XED
UPDATED: Thursday, November 20, 2003 15:53
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VIEWED: 8049
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Saturday, December 21, 2002 1:44 PM

We're all feeling pretty sad, what with the cancellation of Firefly. Especially after getting treated to one of the great 2-hour pilot films in all of series TV last night.
(Sigh)
Still, that's no excuse for out-of-control name-calling.
A character who styles himself SergeantX has gone wayyyyyyy over the top with envenomed character assassination.
Here's SergeantX's latest berserk tirade:
"That wasn't baseless name calling.(I'll get to that momentarily) As for your pretense of reason and argument, I don't find your 'critique' worth a response. You could have summed up your entired self important litany with "It confused and depressed me." It would have saved the board a lot of drive space. Your opinions are your own and I respect that, but to pretend you are some kind of authority, fit to criticize those who are creating Firefly is fraudulant and inexcusable."
Ladies and gentlmeen, is this really the impression the fans of Firefly want to give the general public?
That anyone who regards A*N*Y episode of Firefly as anything less than absolutely perfect must be villified, insulted, spat upon, sneered at, buried in excrement, called every vile name imaginable and unimaginable, smeared with blood libel backwards and forwards, howled obscenities at every way till Sunday?
Is this _really_ the way fans of Firefly want themselves to be remembered by the general public?
This is something out of the Taliban, isn't it? "Thou shalt worship the one true God or die!"
Joss Whedon is a fine writer...but no god. Firefly was an excellent show...but no graven idol in whose name we must proclaim jihad.
At its best, Firefly was a damn fine show. The first couple of episodes turned many of my friends off even though I urged 'em to watch. "Hang in there," I told 'em. "This is Joss Whedon we're talkin' about here. It's gonna hit on all 12 cylinders. This show will get up to speed and become the best thing on TV."
And guess what?
Firefly did get up to speed.
It did become the best thing on TV after a rocky start. (And mind you, only 2 poor episodes. That's a pretty good track record, ain't it?)
Alas, Nathan Fillon was right. Joss and company _were_ fighting the Fox Alliance.
What's saddening is that some Firefly fans seem to brook no discussion whatever of any possible reasons why the show might have failed.
According to some people on this forum, like the out-of-control character assassin SergeantX, Firefly was *the* perfect show. No faults. No flaws. And the only reason these people (like the rabid name-caller SergeantX) can give for Firefly's failure is that everyone in America is apparently an idiot -- except SergeantX, of course.
Now, does that make sense?
You tell me.
When someone's argument boils down to "everyone else is stupid but me," don't you begin to smell something rotten in Denmark?
Personally, I don't buy the argument that everyone in America is stupid and that's why Firefly failed.
I mean -- think about it...if everyone in America is so stupid, then how could the same allegedly idiotic adueince that failed to recognize Firefly's glories...somehow get clueful to the fact that Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angel are such excellent shows?
The argument that anyone who crticizes Firefly in any way is (I'm wuoting the vacuos name-calling here) "jerk, a pompous idiot, a sad little twerp" and that the American public are imbeciles for refusing to watch Firefly in droves, just doesn't hold together does it?
For that argument requires that the American TV audience be both so stupidly blind they wantonly ignored Firefly...yet so wisely inightful that they made Buffy and Angel big hits.
Does that argument even pass the straight-face test..?
I maintain that the explanation for Firefly's failure to garner ratings must lie elsewhere than the alleged stupidity of the entire American viewing audience, or the sole and exclusive idiocy of Fox network.
As proof that Fox Network's idiocy alone can't be the whole explanation, consider the original Star Trek. NBC killed the orignal Trek pilot (citing non-reasons eerily similar to the bizarre excuses confected by Fox executives)... Yet what happened to Trek?
Killing the original Trek pilot didn't spell the death knell for Trek TOS.
Roddenberry took that hit in stride, hired Sam Peeples to write a slam-bang second pilot (arguably even better than the original "The Cage") and Trek TOS was off and running.
Most of the basic relationships in Trek TOS got sketched out deftly and with economy and great power in Peeple's 2nd pilot "Where No Man Has Gone Before."
In only 50 minutes, we got 90% of the basic relationships that make Trek TOS the legend it deserves to be.
If Roddenberry could overcome that kind of hit (same deal, cancelled pilot, new second pilot needed with no warning) in 1966, why can't Joss Whedon and Marti Noxon overcome the same setback today, in 2002?
So I contend that Joss and Marti and company took a big hit, but they could've overcome it the way Roddenberry did when NBC deep-sixed "The Cage." If so, then the fault isn't all Fox Network's.
Yet in response to these kind of analyses of Firefly's problems, what do we get on this forum?
Here is SergeantX's closely reasoned response:
"`Put up or shut up?' How about f*ck you? How about you quit trying to pretend your [sic] intelligent and go away?"
------------------
Sadly, I think that's just the way the general viewing audience reacted to Firefly. They just went away.
In the hope that we might all learn something from Fireflys unjustifiable and untimely demise, I've made some posts offering suggestions as to why it might have failed.
In response, naught but hysterical character assassination and crazed name-calling.
SergeantX: "How about f*ck you?"
Now there's a compelling argument if I ever heard one.
In between the berserk name-calling and the envenomed verbal abuse by a handful of people like SergeantX, this forum is leaving a very bad taste in everyone's mouth courtesy of out-of-control character assassination.
Consider, if you will, SergeantX's response to my remarks that the first couple of episodes of Firefly were clogged with expositoin, stopped dead in the middle when the narrative flow hit a brick wall, and full of depressing Friday-the-13th-style slasher ultraviolence:
SergeantX: "Now for the baseless name calling! You're a jerk, a pompous idiot, a sad little twerp.."
It's sad that this is the way people will remember Firefly -- as a show whose supporters are Joseph McCarthy-style smear artists like SergeantX who refuse to admit that A*N*Y episode of this fine show was A*N*Y*T*H*I*N*G elss than 100% totally perfect.
Firefly -- the show with so-called "fans" whose only reaction to the show's cancellation is to scream vicious insults at everyone in close proximity.
EXIT QUESTION:
With fans like SergeantX and other like-minded name-callers and character assassins, does Firefly really need enemies?

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Saturday, December 21, 2002 2:27 PM

HOOK

Xed,

I would like to point out that you are not the only one who criticizes the show. UFO put out a thoughtful criticism of the show here: http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=1229#9882

and so have I. Post found here:
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=1144#9327

well mine might not be so thoughtful...thats for others to decide.

As to why SargentX has singled you out for name calling might be because you have singled him out as well. I admit that his language is a bit harsher then yours...to harsh, and I am glad that you have taken the high ground and not degraded to his level, but still you are singling him out. Try responding in a way that isn't directed right at him but at his arguments...ie don't use his name (yes i do see the irony that my response to you does single you out).

SargentX (or any single person on this board for that matter) does not represent all fireflyfan.com fans, please keep that in prospective.

hook

http://diogenes.gotdns.org

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Saturday, December 21, 2002 7:20 PM

XED

Sir -- thank you for redeeming my faith in Firefly fandom. Thanks also for your civil and carefully thought-out response.
SergeantX has made some insightful points. Just wish he didn't stoop to name-calling, is all.

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Saturday, December 21, 2002 8:49 PM

ALLRONIX

I don't give a flying whatever. We're getting nowhere if we snipe at each other.

Now, this may just be the activist in me talking, but I've seen what infighting in a crisis can do. It can take what's about to hit critical mass and completely derail it. Folks, take the bickering and namecalling elsewhere. Serenity doesn't need it, Joss doesn't need it, and none of us need it.

Secondly, I'm wondering if we can do outreach to other fandoms with shows in hot water. Build some coalitions, back each other up, see the same enemy and start attacking full throttle. Anyone hitting up Scapers? Scoobies? Trekkers? I've sent out alerts on EFC boards, Galaxy Rangers boards, and my pals who know FOX all too well from Lone Gunmen.

With Galaxy Rangers, I got a taste of how Space Western could work, and what can happen when a series creator gathers as much as he can to make something cool. (CGI in 1986, members if the Allan Parsons Project on soundtrack, Broadway actors as voice talent, one of Japan's best animation houses for the drawing, and a writing staff full of sci-fi authors). Robert Mandell went balls to the wall for his Space western - only to run into network interference, "dumbing down," and "toy ad" cartoons swamp him in the ratings. Like Firefly, Galaxy Rangers ALSO had its pilot shelved for being too "talky" (it was also "too dark"), and had its airing schedule hacked to bits, given a rotten time slot, and then canned for "low ratings."

I see Whedon getting the same shabby treatment, and the same "go-se," different era. Add to it my frustration with FOX network dating back to Alien Nation and continuing from there! The last thing I'm looking forward to is the concept of Robert Mandell and Joss Whedon toasting "what could have been." I'd rather see Robert Mandell write and direct an episode of Firefly while Joss whedon gets producing credit on a Galaxy Rangers live-action movie.

Yeah, yeah. Pipe f--ing dream, but I'm giving up when Joss does, not a gorram second before it. His baby, his call.

Co-founder of the Evil Writing Crew - causing hell, one hero at a time!

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Saturday, December 21, 2002 11:54 PM

SILVERADO

Dear Diary,
Today I was pompous and my posts were crazy.

Today, I was called names by SergeantX and somehow he was right. It was the best day ever.

Free drink for the first person telling me whose diary I just found.

Regards:

Silverado.

~Ruttin proud Keeper of Mal's boot kicking a
certain sucker into a certain hungry engine.

_________________________________________________

"You had the law on you, criminals and savages... half the people on the ship have been shot or wounded including yourself, and you're harboring known fugitives."

"We're still flying."

"That's not much."

"It's enough."

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Sunday, December 22, 2002 12:41 AM

HOOK

Quote:
Originally posted by Silverado:

Dear Diary,
Today I was pompous and my posts were crazy.

Today, I was called names by SergeantX and somehow he was right. It was the best day ever.

Free drink for the first person telling me whose diary I just found.

Regards:

Silverado.

~Ruttin proud Keeper of Mal's boot kicking a
certain sucker into a certain hungry engine.

_________________________________________________

"You had the law on you, criminals and savages... half the people on the ship have been shot or wounded including yourself, and you're harboring known fugitives."

"We're still flying."

"That's not much."

"It's enough."

What the hell is wrong with you people...are you reading the same posts I am....I can understand not agreeing with a person's opinion but this is just dumb and vicious...look no one on this board got the Show canceled...so don't take it out on the people here. we all like the show...we all get different things from that show...and the point of a fan site is to discuss the various opinions we have about the show...if you want to make rude derogatory venomous remarks then go to slashdot they will love you there. If the posts are to long for you or take ideas to places you don't want to go THEN DON'T READ THEM!!

hook

http://diogenes.gotdns.org

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Sunday, December 22, 2002 1:18 AM

SILVERADO

Hook wrote:

"if you want to make rude derogatory venomous remarks then go to slashdot they will love you there."

Rude and derogatory?

How about humorous?

Or didn't you see "Safe"?

Relax, Hook.
Breathe.
Out with the bad air.
In with the good one.

;)

Silverado.

~Ruttin proud Keeper of Mal's boot kicking a certain sucker into a certain hungry engine.

_________________________________________________

"You had the law on you, criminals and savages... half the people on the ship have been shot or wounded including yourself, and you're harboring known fugitives."

"We're still flying."

"That's not much."

"It's enough."

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Sunday, December 22, 2002 1:23 AM

SILVERADO

Whoops.

Forgot something.

You earned yourself a free drink of course, Hook.

Beer or bourbon?

Silverado.

~Ruttin proud Keeper of Mal's boot kicking a certain sucker into a certain hungry engine.

_________________________________________________

"You had the law on you, criminals and savages... half the people on the ship have been shot or wounded including yourself, and you're harboring known fugitives."

"We're still flying."

"That's not much."

"It's enough."

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Sunday, December 22, 2002 11:59 AM

NOVAGRASS

It seems as though the contention of this thread involves two forum members. Please deal with this between yourselves.

As a forum moderator, I politely request that no one perpetuate the negativity thus far shown in this thread. If this tone continues, administraive action will be taken.

--Dylan Palmer, Pretentious Bastard at Large--

"Oh my god, I'm a hack!" - Joss Whedon

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Sunday, December 22, 2002 2:59 PM

MIKE

I dont think anyone thinks firefly is perfect, no tv show is but it was and is great entertainment and a really differant and interesting concept, something sorely missing from a lot of current tv shows. I think instead of getting on each others case about minor things we should send those postcards and emails to network execs at W.B. and C.B.S. and try to get one of them to pick up Firefly for next year. Lets not give up on Firefly yet, there is still hope that we can help to save a really good and origional tv show.

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Sunday, December 22, 2002 2:59 PM

MIKE

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Thursday, November 20, 2003 3:53 PM

SPACEANGLER

Hey, I love out-of-control name calling as much as the next guy. That's what Troll Country is for.

--------------------------------------------
"Can he, you know, chase us? Because I know if I woke up looking like that, I'd just run towards the nearest living thing, and then kill it." ~Aqua Teen Hunger Force

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