REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Afghanistan holds landmark vote

POSTED BY: GEEZER
UPDATED: Monday, September 19, 2005 04:33
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Sunday, September 18, 2005 12:32 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


From the Beeb. Could democracy actually be a viable political system?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4255816.stm

Quote:

Voting has ended for the first parliamentary and local elections held in Afghanistan in more than 30 years.
More than 12 million voters had a choice of almost 6,000 candidates. Voting was steady through the day.

Thousands of foreign and Afghan security forces were on high alert after a campaign marred by violence.



Brave people, to go to the polls in such numbers despite the threat of death.



"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Sunday, September 18, 2005 1:11 PM

GINOBIFFARONI


Is it really a free election though...

" Election authorities did disqualify 32 candidates—commanders who had maintained links to armed factions—but this did not include some of the more senior commanders implicated in past abuses. "

http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2005/09/15/afghan11745.htm


" Many Afghans have been dismayed that warlords blamed for rights abuses have been able to run in the elections. "

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/DA217754-0301-4AF2-BCF3-5815B75
98D9B.htm


Perhaps if the Taliban, the communists, and who ever the hell else wanted to run, could... they would either A) be able to achieve their goals in a peacefull fashion and B) If they lost, they wouldn't be able to draw the popular support needed for a guerilla campaign...


By picking and choosing canidates ( by the amount they support the US I would think ) it makes the concept of democracy as much as a sham as the " elections " in Iraq.

By discluding a segment of the population, you only play into the argument that the foreign puppets have to go... and the fight goes on




Don't think they give a shit

I'm with Signy and Rue

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Sunday, September 18, 2005 2:20 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Is it really a free election though...

" Election authorities did disqualify 32 candidates—commanders who had maintained links to armed factions—but this did not include some of the more senior commanders implicated in past abuses. "

http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2005/09/15/afghan11745.htm


" Many Afghans have been dismayed that warlords blamed for rights abuses have been able to run in the elections. "

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/DA217754-0301-4AF2-BCF3-5815B75
98D9B.htm


Perhaps if the Taliban, the communists, and who ever the hell else wanted to run, could... they would either A) be able to achieve their goals in a peacefull fashion and B) If they lost, they wouldn't be able to draw the popular support needed for a guerilla campaign...


By picking and choosing canidates ( by the amount they support the US I would think ) it makes the concept of democracy as much as a sham as the " elections " in Iraq.

By discluding a segment of the population, you only play into the argument that the foreign puppets have to go... and the fight goes on




Don't think they give a shit

I'm with Signy and Rue



So, because things aren't 100% perfectly run and this utopian society hasn't formed instantly, you feel there's a need to crap on what's gone over over there?

" By discluding (?) a segment of the population , you only play into the argument that the foreign puppet..blah blah blah blah "

12 MILLION people voted. Seems to me they were willing to risk being attacked for that right.

There are those who do, and then there are those who do nothing but bitch and whine.



" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Sunday, September 18, 2005 4:03 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Is it really a free election though...

" Election authorities did disqualify 32 candidates—commanders who had maintained links to armed factions—but this did not include some of the more senior commanders implicated in past abuses. "



6000 candidates and they disqualified 32? Not too bad, I'd say. And if thay want to elect commanders implicated in past abuses, that's their choice. Funny thing about democracy, the people elect who they want, not who you want.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Sunday, September 18, 2005 4:25 PM

GINOBIFFARONI


Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Is it really a free election though...

" Election authorities did disqualify 32 candidates—commanders who had maintained links to armed factions—but this did not include some of the more senior commanders implicated in past abuses. "



6000 candidates and they disqualified 32? Not too bad, I'd say. And if thay want to elect commanders implicated in past abuses, that's their choice. Funny thing about democracy, the people elect who they want, not who you want.

"Keep the Shiny side up"



That was 32 that were allowed to apply that were disqualified...

This election will not advance peace, or even slow the fighting...

" Funny thing about democracy, the people elect who they want, not who you want. "

If that is the case, why not let the former Taliban run for office ?

Denying Islamic groups the right to participate in their various political processes is pretty much how this " war on terror " began... and it will simply continue unless the process starts to include everyone.



Don't think they give a shit

I'm with Signy and Rue

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Monday, September 19, 2005 3:48 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
If that is the case, why not let the former Taliban run for office ?

Denying Islamic groups the right to participate in their various political processes is pretty much how this " war on terror " began... and it will simply continue unless the process starts to include everyone.



You should read the links you post sometimes.

Quote:

And former high-level Taliban officials and commanders running for office include: Mohammed Khaksar, the Taliban’s deputy interior minister; Wakil Ahmad Mutawakil, the Taliban’s foreign minister; and Qalamuddin, the minister of the department of vice and virtue, which enforced the Taliban’s severe social restrictions.


From http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2005/09/15/afghan11745.htm


"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Monday, September 19, 2005 4:33 AM

HERO


Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:

If that is the case, why not let the former Taliban run for office ?


Same reason why we didn't want Jeff Davis running from President in 1868. Then there's the Nazi Party being banned in Germany after WW2.

We can't let them run because their values are contrary to ours and those of the Afgan people and/or they cannot be allowed to hold office or legitimate status because of their past abuses.

Then there's the fact that the winners get to dictate to the losers after the war. We won, Afgans are free, rather then conquered by the US, but in exchange, the Taliban is Tali-banned.

H

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