Browncoats that think the West is on track with world politics. by chrisisall

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Browncoats that think the West is on track with world politics.

POSTED BY: CHRISISALL
UPDATED: Monday, September 4, 2023 05:43
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Friday, April 21, 2006 3:56 PM

Interesting info... of course, you see that the U.S. is NOT on that list. That says something very important, and I believe pertinent to the questions of this thread.
As to the specific questions:

Trust Bush and Blair? Not Bloody likely.

Torture necessary? Realistically, yes.

No!No!No! The economy is in danger of tilting worse that the magnetic poles did in the past, in other words complete reversal of fortune for the majority of non-rich peoples.

Yes, death and destruction are inevitable as long as some people refuse to "evolve".

"Alliance" world possible? I shutter to think of it.

NO!No!No! Never believe anything any of them say. They all "spin" in their own favor. (Even Clinton: I did not have sex with that woman (meaning: SHE had sex with me. Get it? SPIN!)

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Friday, April 21, 2006 4:25 PM

SASSALICIOUS

Quote:
Originally posted by Crajon:
Chrisisall
I have read the replies to what you asked but one thing I must ask. Have you been in the military ? If you had then you would know the answers to what you asked. I went to Iraq and other places around the world and know first hand the evil that terrorism causes. You sleep safe at night, live in an country where you can speak your mind without fear of being jailed but yet you fail to understand the world.

Yes, terrorism causes a lot of evil. I don't think many people would disagree with that. However, I tend to think that a broadly defined "War on Terror" is ultimately going to be highly ineffective. Terrorism has been a part of human history for at least a few thousand years and it will probably continue to exist for another few thousand years. Unless of course we manage to successfully annihilate ourselves. The form/methods/perpetrators will change, but the concept and idea won't.

And no, I haven't been in the military, but I have a lot of family members that have and a few friends that currently are.

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Friday, April 21, 2006 4:25 PM

AUNTYCHRIS

It is unfortunate that the fanatical beliefs of a few are jeopardizing the hard-won freedoms of so many. And by jeopardizing freedoms I mean the curtailing of free speech, free press, and choice of religion. It is a sad day when Americans cannot express their opinions openly. Frankly, I am confused, when the archaic beliefs of one religion are protected while the commonly held beliefs of this country are maligned. Keep in mind, I am not a Christian, but all that nonsense about "say Holiday, not Christmas" just threw me. This is supposed to be the one place on earth where everyone is FREE to practice (or not practice) their own chosen religion. The only reason I can condone for fighting this war in Iraq is to try to break this hold the radical fundamentalists have on Islam. People must be free to make their own choice when it comes to religion. Unfortunately, this is not really a religious war, it is also a political war, and that, my friends, is a whole other "animal"...

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Friday, April 21, 2006 4:35 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Crayon,

you live in an country where you can speak your mind without fear of being jailed

Really? Tell that to the Quakers and other ordinary innocent Americans who ended up on FBI lists for disagreeing with Bush. The FBI admits it has the lists, says these people are innocent, but says it won't delete them. How about Americans who were secretly wire-tapped? It wasn't haste, it's that Bush says the wire-taps should *never* be reviewed by a court. These people did nothing wrong. All they did was exercise their constitutional right to free speech.

You have to keep in mind what Bush said: "either you are with us, OR YOU ARE WITH THE TERRORISTS." Does that sound democratic to you?

Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.

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Saturday, April 22, 2006 3:27 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Crajon:
Chrisisall
I have read the replies to what you asked but one thing I must ask. Have you been in the military ?

No, but I grew up in rough schools where you had to learn to fight to keep your lunch money, 'cause the teachers didn't or couldn't control the students. Fighting was as natural to me as riding a bike was to most kids. That type of 'combat experience' here in my own 'safe' country count?

Quote:
If you had then you would know the answers to what you asked.

I actually pretty much know (or think I do) the answers to my questions; just seein' if there are any perspectives new to me out there.

Quote:
I went to Iraq and other places around the world and know first hand the evil that terrorism causes. You sleep safe at night, live in an country where you can speak your mind without fear of being jailed but yet you fail to understand the world.

*fuzzy* In what way do I fail?
Did I get a 'D' or an 'F'?
My knowledge of muzzle velocities is rather limited...

Relativly safe at night Chrisisall

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Saturday, April 22, 2006 3:34 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:

To him even suggesting 'America in Vietnam' is grossly anti-American and makes you a terrorist supporter.

Spot-on I wager.
Thanks for the quote, too, I'd not read that one!

Chrisisall, Alliance supporter

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Saturday, April 22, 2006 6:20 PM

CRAJON

Chrisisall,
Rough schools,eh.Not the same but if in your mind it is then okay. Someday you will may learn what you failed in.
I do know muzzle velocities and seen , treated the damage that is caused by them to people both military and civilian. Hope never to do that again but if I am asked to do it once more, then I will.

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 5:13 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by Crajon:

Rough schools,eh.Not the same but if in your mind it is then okay. Someday you will may learn what you failed in.

I was being somewhat sarcastic, no non-life or death experience compares to armed combat; I know that. I just don't 'get' your attitude. Are my questions at the top invalid because I've never been shot at (directly)? Or because my mother died from cancer and not shrapnel?
Care to elaborate, dude?

Curious Chrisisall

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 7:54 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

I've made a point of baiting the bushbabies. It's not that they don't know what's what, they're acutely aware of the gap between bushbaby and normality. They try to paper it over in every post. So I would expect resopnding personal attacks.

What's interesting to me is their pathetic level of argument. They are attacking everyone as moronic, homo, unpatriotic cowards in every thread, rather than debating issues. It comes across as desperate.

Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 7:58 AM

CHRISISALL

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
they're acutely aware of the gap between bushbaby and normality.

Question: Bushbaby?

Acutely un-aware Chrisisall

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 8:28 AM

CHRISISALL

Belay that answer, Rue, I figgered it out.

I feel a "D'oh" comin' on...

Slow Chrisisall

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Sunday, April 23, 2006 8:47 AM

ROCKET333

The us goverment is good at us politics and not at world politics...wait a minute...they aren't good at politics period.

throughout history the pendulum has swung back and forth. Just now we have so much technology so quick we can blow ourselves all up. wait a minute not us all, them really, THey can blow us all up. If there where no skyscraper coperations, yachts and other marveouls frillious things. I wonder if people would want money so much. Anyway. YOu know I really am just rambling forgive me...

Well. I think once you get real rich, and you have anything money is not even important enough to get you the best yacht, cause you already have it so mabye you just need more and more and more of anything you can get your hands on. Life expectancy is longer now too. So imagine when people start living to be 150 they will have alot more time to live out there power monging fanatsies. Peasents... well we have militas...THankfully I don't really live in reality too much. I wonder if donald trump has his own personal army. God I hate that show. I have enough of a time in life to buy a pack of ciggerettes I don't care who gets fired or not.

Hey. I read somewhere that the the goverment of the world thinks the world is destroying itself they have plans for evacuation and they are bringing some cooperative peasents withthem to mars. I really read this too. I don't know...who even knows whats true or not now.

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Wednesday, April 26, 2006 6:36 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

EU Lawmakers Allege Numerous CIA Flights By JAN SLIVA, Associated Press Writer
1 hour, 32 minutes ago

The CIA has conducted more than 1,000 clandestine flights in Europe since 2001, and some of them secretly took away terror suspects to countries where they could face torture, European Union lawmakers said Wednesday.

Legislators selected to look into allegations of questionable CIA activities in Europe said flight data showed a pattern of hidden operations by American agents, and they accused some European governments of knowing about it but remaining silent.

Cases of terror suspects being secretly handed over to U.S. agents did not appear to be isolated, the lawmakers said in a preliminary report on their inquiry. European human rights treaties prohibit sending suspects to states known to torture prisoners.

"The committee deplores the fact that, as established during the committee's investigation, the CIA has used aircraft registered under fictitious company names or with private companies to secretly transfer terror suspects to other countries including Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Afghanistan," according to a copy of the report obtained by The Associated Press.

The CIA declined to comment, as did European Union officials, who have said previously that there was no irrefutable proof of such hand-overs, which are known as "extraordinary renditions."

The investigation began in January after news reports that U.S. agents had interrogated al-Qaida suspects at secret prisons in eastern Europe. But the focus shifted after people gave detailed accounts of being abducted by U.S. agents in Europe and whisked away to jails in the Middle East, Asia and North Africa.

Few of those who testified at the committee hearings touched on the alleged secret prisons in eastern Europe first reported by The Washington Post in November. Italian lawmaker Giovanni Fava, who wrote the report, said the committee would look into those allegations later.

The lawmakers based their initial report on data provided by Eurocontrol, the EU's air safety agency, and more than 50 hours of testimony by EU officials, rights groups and individuals who said they were kidnapped and tortured by U.S. agents.

Eurocontrol said the number of clandestine CIA flights over Europe was likely to be higher than 1,000 because the agency checked only flight plans for fewer than 50 aircraft used by the CIA.

"We were requested by EU Parliament to make an analysis of the flight routes for these planes. There may be others," said Jean-Jacques Sauvage, a senior official of the Brussels-based agency. He said Eurocontrol did not keep track of who was on the planes.

The report said that on a number of occasions the CIA was clearly responsible for detaining terror suspects on European territory and transferring them to countries where they could face torture.

Fava told the AP it was unclear how many people were transferred by the CIA on undeclared flights. He also said there was no evidence proving complicity by European officials, but called it unlikely that some governments, such as in Italy, Bosnia and Sweden, knew nothing about the CIA operations.

He accused the CIA of breaching the Chicago Convention, an international treaty governing air traffic. It requires aircraft used in military, customs and police operations to seek special authorization to land in signatory states.

U.S. officials previously said that as of late December, some 100 to 150 people had been seized in "rendition" operations involving detaining terror suspects in one country and flying them to their home country or another where they were wanted for a crime or questioning.

The officials, who agreed to discuss the operations only if not quoted by name, said the action was reserved for people considered by the CIA to be the most serious terror suspects. But they conceded mistakes had been made and were being investigated by the CIA's inspector general.

Fava cited as one example of "extraordinary rendition" the case of an Egyptian cleric, Osama Moustafa Hassan Nasr, who allegedly was abducted by U.S. agents on a street in Milan, Italy, in 2003 and returned to his homeland, where he says he was tortured.

Another case involved German citizen Khalid al-Masri. Documents provided by Eurocontrol indicated he was taken to Afghanistan in 2004 by a plane that originated in Algeria and flew via Palma de Mallorca, Spain; Skopje, Macedonia; and Baghdad, Iraq.

Al-Masri, who was born in Kuwait, told the committee that he was arrested by U.S. agents on the Macedonian border while on vacation. He said he was kept at a hotel in Skopje for several weeks before being flown to Afghanistan and jailed for five months. He said he was flown back to Europe in May 2004 and released in Albania.

Fava said the bulk of the clandestine CIA flights passed through Germany and Spain, where the United States has several air bases. Neither government had any comment.

The European Union also declined to address the committee's preliminary report.

"We have no comment. We will wait for the investigation to finish," said Friso Roscam Abbing, spokesman for EU Justice Commissioner Franco Frattini.

Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.

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Monday, September 4, 2023 5:43 AM

JAYNEZTOWN

How China became the king of new nuclear power, and how the U.S. is trying to stage a comeback
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/08/30/how-china-became-king-of-new-nuclear-p
ower-how-us-could-catch-up.html

Iran, Saudi Arabia among 6 invited to BRICS
https://www.nwaonline.com/news/2023/aug/25/iran-saudi-arabia-among-6-i
nvited-to-brics/

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