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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Anyone want to wager that Bush doesn't do a thing against Iran, militarily, for the next 16 months ?

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Anyone want to wager that Bush doesn't do a thing against Iran, militarily, for the next 16 months ?

I'll bet cashy money that says we don't fire a shot.

Any takers ?

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Originally posted by leadb:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Anyone want to wager that Bush doesn't do a thing against Iran, militarily, for the next 16 months ?

I'll bet cashy money that says we don't fire a shot.

Any takers ?

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Heh. He better not. He's already spread the military so thin it will break if he does. Which, ironically, may be the greatest shame if action -is- actually needed on another front, we won't be able to.

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Originally posted by SergeantX:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Anyone want to wager that Bush doesn't do a thing against Iran, militarily, for the next 16 months ?

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I'll bet that you'll defend him with ever more ridiculous rationalizations regardless.

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

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Originally posted by leadb:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Anyone want to wager that Bush doesn't do a thing against Iran, militarily, for the next 16 months ?

I'll bet cashy money that says we don't fire a shot.

Any takers ?

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Heh. He better not. He's already spread the military so thin it will break if he does. Which, ironically, may be the greatest shame if action -is- actually needed on another front, we won't be able to.

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I'll take that as a solid 'no '. Thanks!

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Originally posted by leadb:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

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Originally posted by leadb:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Anyone want to wager that Bush doesn't do a thing against Iran, militarily, for the next 16 months ?

I'll bet cashy money that says we don't fire a shot.

Any takers ?

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Heh. He better not. He's already spread the military so thin it will break if he does. Which, ironically, may be the greatest shame if action -is- actually needed on another front, we won't be able to.

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I'll take that as a solid 'no '. Thanks!

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The problem is, I think he may do it anyway. So, since you said 'a shot', I'll put down $10 that he will 'take a shot' before he goes.

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Some of the rhetoric coming from him and Condi does almost as much to flame up the situation as military action would....

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

Because there's no rhetoric coming out of Iran, now is there ?

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
The way you word it, he could do nothing and I'd praise him...

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Originally posted by Geezer:
The very fact that he can say what he has said, and still be running around free, contradicts a good bit of what he writes.

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Originally posted by SergeantX:
The ability to simultaneously love our country, while defying leaders who would squander it, is about the most 'American' thing I can think of.

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Originally posted by SergeantX:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
The way you word it, he could do nothing and I'd praise him...

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Actually, what I'm saying is that he could do foolish things that get thousands of people killed (have you been paying any attention?), and you'd still defend him.

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Which is to say: The screeching of the Christian right, the shrill alarmism from cultural conservatives regarding everything from sex and drugs and music to gays and nipples and creationism, the rejection of science, the attacks on women's rights, the abuse of the environment, all the way up to the bleakest and ugliest manisfestation of all, a brutal and unwinnable war -- taken as a whole, these can, if you so choose, be seen as merely the embers of a hugely failed -- and yes, nearly extinct -- worldview.

Here is the hesitant optimism, the hint of the new, the tentative suggestion that all is not lost: By many measures, the worst of it is over. There really is light coming, a new awareness, a shift away from the bleakness and the rot and the wallowing in bland violence. Perhaps you can feel it. Or perhaps you need to be ready to feel it. Either way, it's there. You have but to do the most easy/difficult thing of all: you must look behind the veil, see the two dueling Americas, and make your choice.

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Originally posted by SergeantX:

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Originally posted by Geezer:
The very fact that he can say what he has said, and still be running around free, contradicts a good bit of what he writes.

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The fact that we still have our freedom of speech is indeed a very good sign. But if we fail to use that freedom to reign in our government, if we sit in silent fear of being labeled an 'Americ-Haters', we'll undercut the very principles our nation is founded on. The ability to simultaneously love our country, while defying leaders who would squander it, is about the most 'American' thing I can think of.

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Seen anybody in the USA failing to use their freedom of speech because they're afraid of being labeled pretty much anything? Not bloody likely!

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Then, regardless of how you feel about whether we should have been in Iraq in the first place or not, we will have to decide if we want to give the folks trying to build a better government and life there a fighting chance,

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Chris - we don't torture.

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The secret facility is part of a covert prison system set up by the CIA nearly four years ago that at various times has included sites in eight countries, including Thailand, Afghanistan and several democracies in Eastern Europe, as well as a small center at the Guantanamo Bay prison in Cuba, according to current and former intelligence officials and diplomats from three continents.

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The notorious Operation Phoenix, set up by the CIA to wipe out the Vietcong infrastructure, subjected suspects to torture such as:
electric shock to the genitals of both men and women
insertion into the ear of a six-inch dowel, which was tapped through the brain until the victim died
suspects were also thrown out of airborne helicopters to persuade the more important suspects to talk, although this should probably be categorized as murder of the ones thrown out, and a form of torture for those not.

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Originally posted by Geezer:
Just noting for the record that, in most of the world Mark Morford, the author of this piece, would have been either jailed or disappeared. The very fact that he can say what he has said, and still be running around free, contradicts a good bit of what he writes.

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Originally posted by SignyM:

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Seen anybody in the USA failing to use their freedom of speech because they're afraid of being labeled pretty much anything? Not bloody likely!

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Well, I WAS pretty spooked about being followed by the FBI (or whomever) for three days because I made a bang-on prediction about biowarfare right b4 the anthrax letters. I have to say, it creeped me out. I've become a lot more circumspect about what I say and how I say it, believe it or not.

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Originally posted by Geezer:
Seen anybody in the USA failing to use their freedom of speech because they're afraid of being labeled pretty much anything? Not bloody likely!

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Originally posted by Geezer:
Then, regardless of how you feel about whether we should have been in Iraq in the first place or not, we will have to decide if we want to give the folks trying to build a better government and life there a fighting chance, or run off and leave them twisting in the wind.

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Originally posted by SergeantX:
... and before any bushies try to make the point, requests from our duly installed stoolies don't count. Of course the 'leadership' wants us to stay, they'll be the first ones strung up after we leave.

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Originally posted by chrisisall:
...and the Lemur Liberation Front of Madagasgar knows this...

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Originally posted by SergeantX:
The ability to simultaneously love our country, while defying leaders who would squander it, is about the most 'American' thing I can think of.

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Originally posted by SignyM:
Shortly after that, while leaving home extra-early one AM I found a person in a white car with a blacked-out windshield waiting for me at the end of of driveway. This car followed me halfway to work, to be replaced by another white car with a blacked-out windshield, and for the next few days I led my own little two-car parade.

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Originally posted by Hero:

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Originally posted by SergeantX:
The ability to simultaneously love our country, while defying leaders who would squander it, is about the most 'American' thing I can think of.

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Without comment on your motives, by failing to support the government effort in Iraq you have de facto placed yourself in common cause with the terrorists. I don't place you there by calling you un-American, I don't support saying anyone exercising their rights as being not patriotic, but you have chosen where to stand. I'm merely noting those standing next to you happen to be the same folk who'd chop your head off on live TV if given the chance.

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I note for the record that the FBI uses black cars, your 'white car'

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Without comment on your motives, by failing to support the government effort in Iraq you have de facto placed yourself in common cause with the terrorists.

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Originally posted by SignyM:

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I note for the record that the FBI uses black cars, your 'white car'

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Whoever it was had illegally tinted windshields. I couldn't see the driver using my rearview, and that was the first and last time I've never seen so many drivers. Following me. For three days.

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Always look upstream.

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Originally posted by SignyM:
OH I KNOW! The Sunni tribal leader who visited Bush and who got assassinated!

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Originally posted by leadb:
It's possible that they wanted to you to know.

The question is, what was following you once the white cars stopped?

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Originally posted by leadb:
I do not believe Sarg's statement comes anywhere near it would take to classify someone as being on the side of the terrorists. Sorry to say; but the gov. sometimes needs reigning in.

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Originally posted by SignyM:

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Without comment on your motives, by failing to support the government effort in Iraq you have de facto placed yourself in common cause with the terrorists.

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Without commenting on his motives, HERO is anti-American. He has placed himself in common cause with those who would seek to destroy our Constitution, and therefore in opposition to the military which is sworn to defend it. HERO is a traitor.

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