REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

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POSTED BY: GEEZER
UPDATED: Saturday, August 23, 2008 16:21
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Friday, August 22, 2008 4:45 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

BOISE, Idaho -- A man who kidnapped, raped, tortured and murdered a 9-year-old Idaho boy was deemed eligible for the death penalty by a jury on Friday, soon after the killer himself came close to thanking prosecutors for showing the panel sickening videos of him abusing the child.

The jury deliberated for two hours before issuing its unanimous ruling. When the hearing resumes next week, jurors must decide whether Joseph Edward Duncan III should be put to death for killing Dylan Groene in 2005.

Friday's verdict was not surprising after Duncan's closing argument, in which he told the jurors they didn't yet "have a clue" about the depths of his "heinousness."


http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2008132094_webduncan22
m.html



"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Friday, August 22, 2008 6:27 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Yanno, I'm against the death penalty - it's too slow in coming, rife with racism and abuse, and the plain fact of the matter is that if it is used at all, sooner or later some dickheaded prosecutor is gonna use it to off someone innocent to close a case, or for other more nefarious reasons.

I've done some research work for The Innocence Project, you see, and it's pretty clear our so called "Justice" system sends innocent folk up the river so often I myself have begun to wonder if they get it right even HALF the time.

But this guy, we can NOT keep him in our society, it's just too damn much of a risk given the known recidivism rate of sex offenders of this type being SEVEN TIMES that of any other crime.
(USDOJ-BOS, and I can provide the report if needs be)

And almost every single one that comes to this pass has been given a free second bite by an initial light sentancing often involving no more than probation or house arrest, statistically only after twenty-five to thirty victims, few if any will ever come forward about it.

That would make the second offense, which is usually pretty heinous, at a point of fifty to sixty victims total, for the hardcore bastards like this one.

There's NO WAY we could reform such a being, nor could we ever allow them in our society again, and to be blunt about it, their own actions have effectively destroyed any right to it they might have had initially.

I might not hold with killin him, but I am pretty sure y'all know I wouldn't shed a bitter tear neither - at the VERY least throw his ass in Remora, a max-max facility JUST for these predators off the Washington State coast which makes Alcatrazz look like a county work farm.

Oh, and lemme mention, I have not looked into the particulars of the case (will after this post) but I can just about GUARANTEE that this is the perps second bite, isn't it ?

Again...

We need to get them out, and keep them out, of our society - put them in a fucking cage and keep them there, kick out some pothead they caught holding to make room for his ass, the potheads only a danger to the fridge, THESE creepers are a danger to the weakest link of our entire society.

Funny that, we lock up the most pathetic, and give probation to the most dangerous, does that seem right to you ?

And it's kinda funny how kids are only considered "people" after being victimized by slime like this, when up to that point they're less than pets, eh ?

Seriously though, I consider these predators probably THE most dangerous criminal element we have, and whether we kill em or not, we must never, EVER let them run loose again.

I don't favor approaching that with a sledgehammer, as I noted in the case of Genarlow Wilson, sometimes the folk applying these laws get a little out of hand - but when dealing with a hardcore, proven and admitted predator, there's no excuse whatever for loosing them on our society ever again.

If they're gonna do him though, best make it clean and quick - one of my alternate bitches is that none of our methods of execution are, not even lethal injection (do some homework, you'll see) and thus we don't really have a quick, clean end for those who's crimes are so heinous that folk feel there's no other recourse.

But that's really morbid mental territory, innit ?

In the end, I don't much care what happens to him, long as he's never, EVER, a threat to members of our society ever again.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Friday, August 22, 2008 7:45 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

If I was on that jury, I'd do my best to make sure this criminal got life in prison without the possibility of parole.

I can't imagine a more horrifying fate, nor one that is more likely to make him understand the plight of his victim.

May he live a long life, costing us less money than if we put him on death row.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, August 22, 2008 10:40 PM

RIVERLOVE


All rapists should be put to death. A nice clean thrust with a Roman short sword would be ideal; giving the rapist just a few short moments to contemplate his depravity and his violation of a human being before he's no longer a threat to anyone.

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 1:52 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Quote:

"I got out and I got even. But I did not get caught. So I got even again, and again did not get caught. I got even twice (actually more The world will know who I really was, and what I really did. I am scared, alone, and confused, and my reaction is to strike out toward the perceived source of my misery, society. My intent is to harm society as much as I can, then die."

Joseph Duncan's blog
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/notorious/joseph_dun
can/1.html




Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
Hello,

If I was on that jury, I'd do my best to make sure this criminal got life in prison without the possibility of parole.

I can't imagine a more horrifying fate, nor one that is more likely to make him understand the plight of his victim.

May he live a long life, costing us less money than if we put him on death row.

--Anthony



The jury voted for the death penalty, after the prosecutor and judge made the jury, and entire courtroom including the boy's family, WATCH THE FRAKKING VIDEOTAPE OF THE MONSTER TORTURING, RAPING AND KILLING THE KID.

The jury was freaking out, the kid's father threatened to kill the judge in the courtroom, etc.

But the judge and prosecutor were right to make the jury watch it, to kill any chance a juror would vote against a death penalty.

Unless the prosecutor and judge are psychopathic pedophile rapists and serial killers, like so many judges, prosecutors and politicians are...

Quote:

Duncan pleaded guilty to 10 federal felonies for the trauma he inflicted on Dylan Groene and his then-8-year-old sister, Shasta, in May 2005 after murdering their older brother, their mother and her fiance in the Coeur d'Alene area. Duncan pleaded guilty to those three murders in state court, where he also could be sentenced to death.

He kidnapped the two young children and took them deep into the Lolo National Forest, where he sexually abused and tortured them for weeks. He ultimately shot the boy point-blank in the head while his sister watched. He was arrested after returning with Shasta to Coeur d'Alene, where a waitress recognized the girl as the two ate at a Denny's restaurant.

Jurors cringed and cried when they viewed videos Duncan made in which he molested, tortured and hanged Dylan Groene until the boy was unconscious and nearly dead. Duncan told the panel that government lawyers helped him victimize the jurors by making them watch and listen to the evidence.

"I should actually thank the government for helping me get my eye for an eye by showing you the evidence that you've seen, the videos," Duncan said during his closing argument Friday.

Duncan, a convicted pedophile originally from Tacoma, Wash., told jurors that by presenting the evidence, the government was "helping me to take away your heart and your innocence."

"That's what they have done, and I should thank them but I won't," he said.

Duncan, originally from Tacoma, Wash., was a convicted pedophile before the killings. The rampage was the culmination of years of planning, he said, and he originally intended to rape and kill until he was killed.

Duncan has a long string of arrests and convictions for crimes ranging from car theft to rape and molestation. He is suspected in the slayings of two half-sisters from Seattle in 1996 and is charged with killing a young boy in Riverside County, Calif.



This guy really needs to be put out of his misery ASAP.

Quote:

The Murder of Dylan Groene

When Duncan returned to camp, he made Shasta watch the videotape. Four days later, Shasta heard a gunshot and turned to see Dylan holding his stomach where he had been shot. Duncan then held the gun next to Dylan's head and pulled the trigger, but the gun failed to fire. He reloaded and fired again.

Shasta was so close that blood spattered on her clothing.

"The way this little girl describes it is: her brother's head exploded," Moss said. Duncan then "wrapped the body in a tarp, threw it on the campfire and let it burn for several days, until it was reduced to ashes," Moss said.

http://crime.about.com/b/2008/08/14/duncan-jury-hears-details-of-famil
ys-murder.htm



The kid's guts were hanging out while he was still alive...

Quote:

"The devil is here, boy, the devil himself. The demon couldn't do what the devil sent him to do so the devil came himself. The devil likes to watch children suffer and cry."

Joseph Duncan videotape
http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/08/21/duncan.slayings.ap/index.html?iref
=newssearch




He then made the boy watch the video of his own rape and death by hanging.

If a juror votes for life instead of death, may the Devil himself come visit their kids.


Video: Snuff Kiddie Porn at Bohemian Grove (now with Obama McCain)
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=6497462494231069386

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 2:29 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Quote:

Originally posted by Riverlove:
All rapists should be put to death. A nice clean thrust with a Roman short sword would be ideal; giving the rapist just a few short moments to contemplate his depravity and his violation of a human being before he's no longer a threat to anyone.



Depends on what your definition of rape is. Statutory rape by consenting teens?

If sex slavery is rape, then Hillary, Billary and the Bushes get the death penalty. Ask Cathy OBrien.

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 4:41 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Quote:

Originally posted by Riverlove:
All rapists should be put to death. A nice clean thrust with a Roman short sword would be ideal; giving the rapist just a few short moments to contemplate his depravity and his violation of a human being before he's no longer a threat to anyone.



Hello Riverlove,

I guess you are more forgiving than I am.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 5:27 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Personally, I'd study the guy.

People who commit these kinds of crimes are either born that way (schizo or other serious neuropsych disorder) or made that way through horrific abuse when young. Considering the recidivism rate, it might be useful to see if an effective therapy can be developed.

Quote:

Only a few months ago, ex-convict Joseph Edward Duncan III warned that his "demons" were overtaking him. "These demons are stronger than even I gave them credit for," Duncan, 42, stated in April in an online diary on what police said is his own Web site. "I'm afraid, very afraid. If they win, then a lot of people will be badly hurt, and they've had their way before, so I know what they can do," said Duncan, who had a previous molestation conviction.
Sounds very much like "Son of Sam".




---------------------------------
Any idea, no matter how much you may agree with it, can be radicalized and employed as an excuse for violence. There is no such thing as a righteous or untouchable philosophy, and when you start thinking that there is, you have become an extremist.- Finn Mac Cumhal

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 6:14 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


This guy spent 18 years in prison, so he had more than a "slap on the wrist". There was something wrong with him from an early age.

www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-07-05-idaho_x.htm

I know that things like this make us want vengeance, but I don't see vengeance as the solution to anything (except maybe to provide us with a target for our anger. And then, if we exercise our bloodlust, are we any better than him?)

---------------------------------
Any idea, no matter how much you may agree with it, can be radicalized and employed as an excuse for violence. There is no such thing as a righteous or untouchable philosophy, and when you start thinking that there is, you have become an extremist.- Finn Mac Cumhal

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 6:15 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Actually he puts to my mind echos of Carl Panzram, although Panzram was far more unrepentant.

We DO study these guys, and we're not the only ones, Andrew Vachss, Alice Miller, Bruce Perry, and many others could tell you in detail what's going through their head tick by tick - Perry and Miller could probably tell you in pretty accurate detail how they got that way.

This one is far past the "Calcification" period before which they might be treatable, that's why early intervention is so all-fired critical to the nature of this problem.

While one can never have enough data, we most certainly have enough to do accurate behavioral predictions, which is why Wayne County's internet crimes task force is (to my neverending glee) a trolling freaks worst nightmare.

Thing is, we KNOW what creates these monsters, we know in explicit detail how they come to be, but the problem comes from no one wanting to invest the effort on non-adults (read: non-persons) since they don't vote or contribute to political campaigns.

That's what PROTECT.ORG is for, as far as the political front, but what we really need is a social change in that we need to regard our young as people, human beings, instead of something lesser with only the rights we choose to give them.

A child cries "I hurt!", unheeded, this cry becomes a prophecy, a warning, and over time, a battlecry - as those victimized by our society spend the rest of their lives getting even.

Of course, some very very rare few get even by attempting to destroy the social acceptance of that abuse which created them in the first place.

I'll leave that one for you to think about.

-Frem
http://serialkillercalendar.com/Detailed-Bio-of-Carl%20Panzram.html
(Note: I do not care for the sensationalism and seeming veneration of this site, but sadly their info is far more accurate and detailed than wikis)

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 6:17 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Yeah, but as the Stanford experiment proved so well, Prison is hardly an environment suitable to reform, treatment or therapy.

More like Crime-College, where they fester in their hates and miseries, justified by the behavior of the screws.

-F

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 8:40 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Jeeze Frem, get with the program. Prison isn't about preventing or solving problems - it's about revenge, er, I mean, justice.

***************************************************************
Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice.

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 11:12 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

A child cries "I hurt!", unheeded, this cry becomes a prophecy, a warning, and over time, a battlecry - as those victimized by our society spend the rest of their lives getting even.



Frem, you amaze me. That sentence is astonishingly profound. Poetic in its truth, horrible in its clarity.

A Child cries,

"I hurt!"

A plea,

a prophecy,

a warning,

a battlecry.







Mike

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence[sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

I can't help the sinking feeling that my country is now being run by people who read "1984" not as a cautionary tale, but rather as an instruction manual. - Michael Mock

The Myrmidons were an ancient nation of very brave and skilled warriors as described in Homer's Iliad, and were commanded by Achilles. - Wikipedia

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 11:24 AM

KHYRON


http://www.vachss.com/av_dispatches/disp_9101_a.html
Quote:

The maltreated child cries, 'I hurt.' Unheard or unheeded, that cry becomes prophecy.

'Do unto others' becomes a battle cry.

Did I find your source, Fremd?

------------------------------

This isn't my signature. I have to type this every time I make a post.

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 11:46 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Yep, that's Vachss's poetry, not mine - I just phrased it differently for clarity to the discussion.

You'll find however, that if you do any research into Vachss, Miller, Perry and many others, we're all saying prettymuch the same thing, but Vachss's "Dispatches from the Front" are slam-bang compelling, distilled into the very essence of what we all believe, and presented in a fashion that's as blunt as a physical blow.

And if you can handle it, well worth the reading, every single one of them.

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Saturday, August 23, 2008 4:21 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!



God save USA

Phi Betta Kappa or Fee Fi Fo Fum?
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-07-05-idaho_x.htm

A debrief takes no longer than 30 days. Then put him out of his misery.

But the prison industrial complex will steal $50,000/year, plus $1-million for his "public defender" appeals, to keep him "alive", drive him more insane, and make widgets for Wackenhut at 5-cents/hour. That's where the money is - slavery.

Of course govt knows how to mass manufacture serial killers in torture factories like China Lake Naval Air Station, where Charles Manson was electrocuted in a cage as a kid. Govt employs armies of these types of serial killers, ready to be unleashed when the police state needs a pay raise.
http://www.xs4all.nl/~sm4csi/nwo/MindControl/chapter02_Science_of_Trau
ma_&_Torture.htm


This is what Joss based his River character on, so he had to be silenced at any cost, before the sheeple catch on.

George W Bush communted the death sentence to life, for Henry Lee Lucas, the partner of cannibal Otis Toole, who chopped the head of Adam Walsh, son of John Walsh host of America's Most Wanted. Toole confessed, but Florida prosecutors refused to indict him for killing Adam Walsh. Toole and Lucas said they worked for a Satanic cult assassination team called the Hand of Death, killing the CIA competition in the coke biz. John Walsh allegedly was running dope in the Carribbean without CIA approval, so he had to be punished as an example to others...
http://www.mayhem.net/Crime/lucas.html


America's Most Wanted: John Walsh, George W Bush and CanniBill Frist

Quote:

"While in medical school, Senator Frist was involved in a lab project which entailed dissecting feline remains. In a 1989 autobiography, Frist described how he "spent days and nights on end in the lab, taking the hearts out of cats, dissecting each heart." After some time, Frist said "[he] lost [his] supply of cats." The project, which needed to be completed as part of the medical school curriculum, could not be finished without another supply of cats. Frist several times obtained cats from animal shelters, falsely suggesting that he wanted to adopt them as pets. In his autobiography, Frist attributed his behavior, which he described as "heinous and dishonest", to the pressures of school."
-Wikipedia, Bill Frist, Main article: Bill Frist medical school experiments controversy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Frist_medical_school_experiments_con
troversy


"It costs only $100,000 to kill 2-million Americans."
—Senator Dr. Bill Frist, MD, MSNBC "Hardball" with Chris Mathews

Dr Bill Frist MD pays $840-MILLION in criminal fines for Medicare fraud, then geot promoted to Speaker of the US Senate in his freshman term:
http://tv.groups.yahoo.com/group/piratenewsrss/message/454



As a heart transpant Dr Frankenstein, CanniBill Frist only harvested organs from living humans... So they made him a billionaire. Now he wants to be my governor in TN.

The meanest monsters run and own the prisons, and run "Child Protective" Services. Child molesters and serial killers run the govt. Only the dumbest and poorest get caught. Over 1,000 foster kids "disappeared" in Florida when JEB was govnuh, 100s found dead.

What do you think happened to the little kids at AbuGrab, raped in front of their parents, with snuff videos sent to the White House for the amusement of the Bush Gang?


"We do not torture." GW Bush


Potato Sticks - yummy


Mission Accompliced

PS: My wife's area director is also in the "national guard", and is now deployed to Iraq for 2 years, starting this week. Will he survive? Will he return maimed or insane? But hey, its opportunity for her promotion. Funny how that military industrial complex corporation with 15,000 employees hires mostly illegal aliens, including management, and wins awards from the Chambers of Commerce. Funny how a US soldier would hire illegal aliens as part of an army of 50-million that already invaded USA, with a history of cannibalism.

Glad she resigned from the national guard. All it took was a letter:
http://piratenews.org/pentagonwhistleblower.html

Bob Woodward: "How's history going to judge this?"
George W Bush: “History? We won’t know. We’ll all be dead.”
-PBS Frontline 2004
www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/choice2004/interviews/woodward.
html



http://www.rollingstone.com/news/profile/story/9961300/the_worst_presi
dent_in_history


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