REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Firemen arrested for setting fires

POSTED BY: PIRATENEWS
UPDATED: Thursday, January 15, 2009 04:38
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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 12:48 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Quote:

6 volunteer firefighters held in fires tied to 35 arsons

A federal AG report last year noted that 64% of forest fires in the 1990's were started by federal forest service employees or contractors who profited from fighting forest fires.

www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/local/articles/2009/01/14/20090114fi
refighters0114.html


We're from the govt and we're here to help ourselves.

As the Depression deepens, the arsons will increase.

University of Tennessee fired 700 employees today. But the president still gets $750,000/year, football coach gets $2-million/year, and the ex-coach gets $6-million severance pay for getting fired (a $24-million pay cut).

That's 10,000 employees fired this week in Knoxville TN.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 12:53 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Oh... SHEET!

---------------------------------
Let's party like its 1929.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 1:36 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


"A federal AG report last year noted that 64% of forest fires in the 1990's were started by federal forest service employees or contractors who profited from fighting forest fires."

This isn't part of the story, it's a comment about the story by John Q Public. I tried to validate the information, but couldn't find any reference that even came close.


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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 2:03 PM

KIRKULES


Don't know if this story is true, but if I was a pyromaniac I'd become a Fireman, if I was a control freak I'd become a cop. Nothing new here, it's been happening since the beginning of civilization.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 2:14 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


I couldn't find any US reports, I did find a report for Virginia which said 20% of all fires on public lands (including storage sheds and the like) were started by arson. It stands to reason that if 20% of fires were started by arson, then a smaller number than 20% would be started by firefighters. It doesn't come close to 64%.

(I provided the cache url since the original page seems glitchy)

http://209.85.173.132/search?q=cache:9QeVv_3LnhoJ:www.dof.virginia.gov
/fire/fire-causes.shtml+virginia+forest+fires+arson&hl=en&gl=us&strip=0


***************************************************************

ETA: It's just another one of those mantras that people repeat early and often so that it gets mistaken for truth. You know - government is wasteful and corrupt, you can't trust anyone in a uniform ... blah blah blah

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 2:32 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
"A federal AG report last year noted that 64% of forest fires in the 1990's were started by federal forest service employees or contractors who profited from fighting forest fires."

This isn't part of the story, it's a comment about the story by John Q Public. I tried to validate the information, but couldn't find any reference that even came close.



5 seconds on Google, "attorney general report fireman arson", top search item:

U.S. Fire Administration/Technical Report Series
Special Report: Firefighter Arson
USFA-TR-141/January 2003
US Dept of Homeland Security
www.usfa.dhs.gov/downloads/pdf/publications/tr-141.pdf

The report does not include ethnic clensing by robber barons, mainly in Western states.

We have a huge problem with this here in East Tennessee, including police-approved arsons of corporate buildings for insurance fraud, which is not included in the report.

When a building next door to my condo became a towering inferno, I tried to give photos of the aronnist setting the fire, holding a flame in his hand with an evil grin on his face.

A fire dept supervisor told me, "If you say the word arson one more time, I have a jail cell with your name on it! We know the cause of the fire. It was an accident."

This was 6 hours before the towering inferno was extinguished, which totally destroyed a building 3 blocks from the fire station downtown. It was owned by a billion-dollar govt contractor, that burned down its own HQ 6 months later. When I checked my credit report 8 years later, somebody had cashed a policy in my name for that fire damage, but I never had insurance, and never got paid. This is a common scam between police, banks, mafia insurance companies and crooked business owners in Knoxville. The private investigator my family's law firm hired told me, "We never look at arson - that's how you get killed." By "you", did he mean me specifically?

Quote:

“I’ll burn your house down, set your dog on fire and there won’t be a member of your family left, do you understand me? I won’t hire it done, I will do it myself! Do you understand me?”
-Blount County TN sheriff James Berrong, United States Court of Appeals, Sixth Circuit, Nuchols v. Berrong, No. 04-5645, July 11, 2005
www.ca6.uscourts.gov/opinions.pdf/05a0586n-06.pdf


Berrong is still the sheriff...

The first fire dept was in ancient Rome, where the Mafia extorted businesses and homeowners for "protection" from arson. Jewish emperor Nero ordered his firemen to burn Rome, then blamed the Christians, who were massacred in public "sporting events".

The British Empire burned Washington DC and White House in the War of 1812, and blamed the patriots.

Jewish president Abraham Lincoln Rothschild burned Atlanta in the first US Civil War, and blamed the Confederacy.

Jew Adolf Hitler Schicklegruber Rothschild burned the Reichstag parliament in Germany, and blamed the Commies.




"Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it."
-Old Dead Guy

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 2:49 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


As per the report:

"In the past decade there has been an average of 116,000 wildfires per year in our nation’s forests. According to Federal statistics, 102,000 of them were person-caused, both accidentally and intentionally.
A miniscule number of arson fires in our National forests are set by federally-employed firefighters; nevertheless, a retired Forest Service fire administrator estimates that 10 to 20 wildfires per year are deliberately started by firefighters."

Not even close to 64%. Not even close to 1%.

***************************************************************

PS - The statistic from the data is that 88% are person-caused; with the vast majority of those fires being accidental. In other words, just b/c a person caused the fire, doesn't mean it was arson.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 2:59 PM

BYTEMITE


Hello Fahrenheit 451. :/

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 3:02 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


64% would be true for acreage arsoned by firefighters, perhaps a low-ball. One good fire can burn 100,000 acres and 1,000 homes.
Quote:

FIREFIGHTER ARSON: LOCAL ALARM

By Ken Cabe
SC Forestry Commission (1994)
Published in Fire Management Notes Vol. 56, No. 1 (1996)

Day care workers who molest children, religious leaders who seduce parishioners, police officers who brutalize citizens—unfortunately, our icons seem to crumble regularly in the national news. They break a sacred trust and public outrage becomes the expression of private fear. Righteous indignation comes easy when the guilt is somewhere else. But when the headlines scream “Fireman Arrested for Arson,” it gets downright personal.

The South Carolina Forestry Commission began looking closely at this phenomenon in 1993. By the end of the year, the tally of confirmed arrests was truly alarming—at least 33 fire department volunteers had been charged with arson. In 1994, 47 more were arrested. Forestry Commission and South Carolina Fire Service officials alike were astounded at the extent of the problem. “We knew it happened occasionally,” said Miles Knight, fire chief of the Forestry Commission, “but we were surprised by numbers like this.”

This may be the case in other southern states as well. Most forestry agencies in the south acknowledge that firefighter arson does occur to some extent. The Alabama Forestry Commission says they investigated five or six cases in 1993; Arkansas has had five or six cases over the past few years; Kentucky has a “significant problem” with individuals setting fires so they can be hired to put them out; and Louisiana notes that wildland firefighters sometimes set fires to gain overtime pay.

In South Carolina, those firemen who were charged with serial arson were unpaid volunteers. Why do they set fires? Obviously not for monetary gain, so the answer is necessarily a lot more complicated.

The descriptive profile suggests that these young men have very little to bolster their self-esteem except their role as heroic firefighters. Noted arson researchers Lewis and Yarnell (1951) support this idea in their description of the “would-be hero” arsonist:

“ . . . men with grandiose social ambitions whose natural equipment dooms them to insignificance.”

But in North Carolina, where the firefighter arson problem seems similar, one arrested arsonist was already planning to take his heroics a step further. His goal, according to a State Bureau of Investigation agent, was to burn an occupied home so he could rescue the occupants.

www.state.sc.us/forest/lear.htm


And this beauty:
Quote:

A Los Angeles County Fire Department public information officer and his wife were charged with arson Thursday for allegedly setting ablaze an unoccupied Pasadena house last summer after their attempt to buy it failed.

Roland Lee Sprewell, 37, was arrested by the San Gabriel Valley Arson Explosives Task Force for allegedly lighting a fire that severely damaged the house at 1541 N. Raymond Ave., Jane Robison, a spokeswoman for the district attorney’s office, said.

Heidi Sprewell, 36, was charged with one count of arson related to the fire on July 26, 2001.

Prosecutors allege that the Altadena couple set the fire after a bank refused to return a deposit on the home that they had tried to buy.

http://articles.latimes.com/2002/feb/15/local/me-arson15


And this TV show is rerun every couple of months:
Quote:

Jury convicts firefighter of murder, arson

LOS ANGELES (AP) _ A former firefighter faces the death penalty after being convicted of murder Friday for a hardware store fire that killed a woman, her grandson and two employees.

Investigators said John Orr set fires to develop material for a novel he was writing about an arsonist who got sexual pleasure from his crimes.

Orr, 49, was found guilty of four murder counts for the fire at Ole's Home Center in South Pasadena.

He was also convicted on several arson charges for a series of brush and house fires in the Los Angeles area in 1990 and 1991, one of which destroyed 67 hillside homes.

The penalty phase begins ...

www.highbeam.com/doc/1P1-19765320.html


I started my own arson tonight... in my own fireplace.

Arsonists are lazy. It's a lot more work to build your own fire, carry your own wood, chop your own wood, etc.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 3:02 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Bytemite

Does your post mean anything ? B /c it doesn't seem to apply.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 3:05 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


PN

What does your post have to do with this ?

"A federal AG report last year noted that 64% of forest fires in the 1990's were started by federal forest service employees or contractors who profited from fighting forest fires."


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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 3:06 PM

KIRKULES


According to the FBI they solve less than 20% of the arson cases committed in a year, so any statistics about who is committing these crimes is based on a very small subset of these criminals. Those that are caught are probably not typical of the group as a whole because those that do it professionally are much less likely to be caught.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 3:23 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Let's hammer some more nails in that coffin.
Quote:

Terry Lynn Barton was trained to spot the first glimmerings of fire in the Pike National Forest in Colorado, where she worked as a seasonal employee for the United States Forest Service.

Leonard Gregg was a part-time firefighter on the Fort Apache Indian reservation in Arizona.

So it was perhaps predictable that the arrest of Ms. Barton and Mr. Gregg, who are charged with starting the largest wildfires in the histories of their respective states, would revive the notion that firefighters and others whose work involves putting out fires were also more prone to set them.

Arson, an environmentalist in the Northwest declared confidently in newspaper accounts after the arrests, is wildfire fighters' ''dirtiest little secret.''

A former fire department engineer in Arizona told a reporter that most arson fires were started by active or retired firefighters -- a fact he said he had learned in his training.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C03E5D81630F93AA35754C
0A9649C8B63


FD commanders also set arsons.
Quote:

The former commander of an elite team of wildland firefighters faces arson charges, prosecutors said. The defendant, Van Bateman, 55, was indicted Wednesday, accused of setting two fires in the Coconino National Forest in 2004.

Mr. Bateman was a Type I incident commander, the head of a wildfire management crew that is called in for the most severe wildfires. He also aided in recovery efforts at the World Trade Center.

He faces two federal counts of setting timber afire and two counts of arson on public lands. Setting timber afire carries a maximum prison sentence of five years, while arson is punishable by up to 20 years, federal prosecutors said.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D00EED7123EF932A25752C
1A9639C8B63


FDNY arsoned the World Trade Center on 9/11/2001, using Thermite and explosives, under orders from Jew Larry Silverstein and Mafia mayor Giuliani, whose father was a Mafia enforcer convicted of armed robbery.

BBC predicts demolition of WTC 7



CNN predicts demolition of WTC 7



Fox News predicts demolition of WTC 7
http://www.infowars.com/?p=7132

Quote:

MSNBC and FDNY predict demolition of WTC 7

"This was a 40 story building. It's like watching the collapse of an active volcano. You guys knew this was comming all day?" FDNY: "We had heard reports it would be taken down, or would come down on it's own."




FDNY heard demolition COUNTDOWN at WTC 7



Amy Goodman and Democracy Now with prior knowledge at WTC 7 demolition
http://prisonplanet.com/articles/september2007/280907_b_goodman.htm

CBS News says WTC 7 was a controlled demolition:

Quote:

"For the third time today, a building was deliberately destroyed by well-placed dynomite to knock it down."
-Dan Rather on controlled demolition of CIA HQ in WTC7

http://infowars.com/video/clips/news/010506_rather_wtc7.htm



PBS TV America Rebuilds - Jew Larry Silverstein, Australian renter of entire WTC complex, who profited by $7-billion insurance claim on 9/11, confesses on TV that he and Mafia mayor Sir Rudolf Giuliani Knight of the British Empire bombed CIA's WTC7 with 100s of prepositioned explosive charges. Webster's New World Dictionary - "PULL: to tear down, demolish, or overthrow".
http://pentagonresearch.com/action.html


CIA HQ in WTC 7 on 9/11/2001

The 3 9/11 arsons alone probably puts firefighters as the cause of 99% cause of all fires, based on financial loss and square footage. Murdering 350 firemen was just an added rush of pyromania.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 3:52 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


"According to the FBI they solve less than 20% of the arson cases committed in a year, so any statistics about who is committing these crimes is based on a very small subset of these criminals. Those that are caught are probably not typical of the group as a whole because those that do it professionally are much less likely to be caught."

And yet, if you look at Virginia - with 20% of fires on public land arson-related, less than 20% will be set by firefighters. No way does it add up to 64%. It's not even close.

This is not to say that all firefighters are blameless, b/c without a doubt some are arsonists. But it does easily refute the smear that firefighters as major cause of fires. B/c that simply isn't true.



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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 4:05 PM

KIRKULES


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
And yet, if you look at Virginia - with 20% of fires on public land arson-related, less than 20% will be set by firefighters. No way does it add up to 64%. It's not even close.



Rue I agree with you that these statistics in no way can be used to smear Firefighters, but the fact that 20% of arson fires are set by Fireman only means that 20% of those caught are caused by Fireman. Of the 20% of Fires that are Arson Fires it is conceivable that 64% of them are started by Firefighters. I don't believe this to be true but the statistics do allow it.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 4:12 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Oh. I was just going by PN's statistic -

"A federal AG report last year noted that 64% of forest fires in the 1990's were started by federal forest service employees or contractors who profited from fighting forest fires."

- which indicated that 64% of all forest fires were firefighter-set. Now, that statistic wasn't part of the news story, it was a comment posted by a reader. And so, I tried to verify it, and couldn't. It may be 0.1% as indicated in the federal paper, it may be something less than 20% as indicated by the Virginia statistics, but for sure it's not 64%.

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Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:50 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
Oh. I was just going by PN's statistic -

"A federal AG report last year noted that 64% of forest fires in the 1990's were started by federal forest service employees or contractors who profited from fighting forest fires."


That is not my statistic. That's a Comment on the newspaper website, that accurately named the US Govt Report on arsons caused by firemen, AND CONTRACTORS.
Quote:

U.S. Fire Administration/Technical Report Series
Special Report: Firefighter Arson
USFA-TR-141/January 2003
US Dept of Homeland Security

In the summer of 2002, two Forest Service employees were accused of allegedly setting two of the largest wildfires in this country’s history. The Rodeo fire in Arizona that allegedly was started by a part-time Forest Service firefighter, merged with another blaze and raced across more than 465,000 acres. It destroyed at least 423 homes and devastated the economy of the communities nearby, including an Indian reservation. The fire was difficult to contain, and is estimated to have cost the state of Arizona and the Forest Service over $10 million to control. Prosecutors allege that the fire was set in dry grass and with the hope that the firefighter would be called to fight the fire and earn $8.00 an hour as part of the fire crew.

In Colorado, also in the summer of 2002, a Forest Service employee was accused of starting the Hayman fire in the Pike National Forest. It was a 137,000-acre fire—the largest in that state’s history--and the fire destroyed more than 130 homes, caused the evacuation of 25,000 residents, and threatened the outlying suburbs of Denver. Smoke and ash from the fire could be seen for hundreds of miles, and cost the state of Colorado and the Forest Service an estimated $15 million. While the accused employee maintains the fire was accidental, prosecutors suggest that the fire was set for revenge, attention, and to gain financially.

www.usfa.dhs.gov/downloads/pdf/publications/tr-141.pdf


When you count the total financial losses, and acreage burned, firefighters and other govt employees might cause 99% of all fires, especially if you include govt-approved contractors for arson.

This is a similar statistic to 99% of all lawsuits in US courts are filed by govt against the sheeple (traffic tickets). Those 100-million lawsuits are prosecuted by police who perp 100s of billions of crimes every year (traffic crimes).

When a professional arsonist works with senior FD commanders and police (FBI, CIA etc) in pre-approved arsons, such as insurance fraud, then by legal definition under the RICO Act, the arsonists are govt contractors, thus part of the FD. Those arsonists are never arrested.

Thermite incendiary is commonly used in arson fires. 100s or 1,000s of Thermite cutters were used in the World Trade Center on 9/11, proven by video and scientific testing. That's why folks were jumping out of WTC, since its better to go SPLAT than get cooked alive by Thermite. Thermite = ARSON.


Thermite lava at WTC

WTC Thermite on 9/11




Thermite re-ignited at WTC by Controlled Demolitions Inc

But the Report admits that no govt agency is keeping count of how many arsons are caused by govt employees.

So nobody knows the real statistic. If they did know, they'd cook the books and lie about it. Especially after 9/11.


Molten steel slag at WTC due to Thermite

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Thursday, January 15, 2009 4:38 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


Well now, lookee here...

Its gotten to the point that California is telling folks that they can just defend their homes themselves...

Which leads me to wonder where the great State will decide to send their firefighters...hmmm...


http://cbs13.com/local/california.fire.homeowner.2.908639.html

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