Yelling 'movie' in a Firehouse by Wulfenstar

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Yelling 'movie' in a Firehouse

POSTED BY: WULFENSTAR
UPDATED: Friday, August 28, 2009 02:28
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Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:15 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Ok.

Those who wish to control our freedoms inevitably go back to the idea of someone yelling "Fire" in a movie theater, and the carnage that may happen.

I answer with “I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it.” - Thomas Jefferson.

So where do you stand?

(Btw, I was in a movie theater once, during one of the hottest months in the year. Unfortunately, the theaters AC fraked up.... and it got really, REALLY, hot in there. One man passed out, and when he did, his girlfriend started screaming. Instead of the unorganized panic, that so many claim would happen, nearly everyone simply pulled out their cellphones and called 911. The guy was fine, and they moved us to another theater to finish the movie. Also, they gave us back the money for our tickets.)

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

No takers?

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:53 AM

AGENTROUKA

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
(Btw, I was in a movie theater once, during one of the hottest months in the year. Unfortunately, the theaters AC fraked up.... and it got really, REALLY, hot in there. One man passed out, and when he did, his girlfriend started screaming. Instead of the unorganized panic, that so many claim would happen, nearly everyone simply pulled out their cellphones and called 911. The guy was fine, and they moved us to another theater to finish the movie. Also, they gave us back the money for our tickets.)

I doubt she was yelling "Fire", though. The results might have been quite different.

I think that abusing triggering signal words like warnings of immediate danger that could predictably lead to very dangerous mass panics is not "free speech". It's reckless endangerment and should be treated as such.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:18 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!

You mean "Bird Flu", "Flying Pig Flu", "Anti Semite" and "Arabs did 9/11"?

Yes, arrest all govt employees who say those words.

Then waterboard them to death at Gitmo.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:21 AM

FREMDFIRMA

*shrug*
Again, "the law" isn't gonna magically appear out of thin air and slap it's hand over your mouth to stop you, so while unwise, there's a difference between "you ain't SUPPOSED to", and "you can't".

Sometimes one *HAS* to do things they "ain't supposed to" like speeding to get a sick relative to the hospital, and thanks be that "the law" is NOT a magic wand, eh ?

That said, my take on it is dead bang simple.
You do it, you're responsible for the consequences.

If you're damn lucky and there ain't any, well, you're an asshole, and that's a consequence in and of itself.

Why do folk complicate things with mythical beliefs ?

-F

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:54 AM

BYTEMITE

Is "Someone call 9-11!" a trigger signal? I don't know. I guess that's not likely.

"Bomb!" is.

And so is "He's got a gun!"

"Everybody down!"? Is that one?

*Has cleared out the thread*

Hmm. Oh look! Popcorn!

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:55 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by AgentRouka:
I doubt she was yelling "Fire", though. The results might have been quite different.

Unless the theater was actually on fire...in which case it makes good sense to let folks know.

Somehow this all reminds me of the scene from Airplane where everybody was lined up to smack the screaming woman...

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you"- Chrisisall, 2009.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:58 AM

AGENTROUKA

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:

*Has cleared out the thread*

Hmm. Oh look! Popcorn!

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:04 AM

AGENTROUKA

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Quote:
Originally posted by AgentRouka:
I doubt she was yelling "Fire", though. The results might have been quite different.

Unless the theater was actually on fire...in which case it makes good sense to let folks know.

IF there is a fire in a movie theater, which is usually all covered in fabric where fire can spread very quickly... the benefits of scared people fleeing far outweigh the danger. It's up to intelligent design of escape routes to guide them out when they're not thinking clearly. But the danger of people being injured or trampled exists in either scenario - fire or not.

Though, luckily, I doubt that every instance of fake fire-yelling would lead to a mass panic, anyway.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:37 AM

BYTEMITE

You probably do have a point that it wouldn't always cause panic. There's two large factors: whether the yeller can be heard, and whether anyone's paying attention.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:27 AM

AGENTROUKA

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
You probably do have a point that it wouldn't always cause panic. There's two large factors: whether the yeller can be heard, and whether anyone's paying attention.

Yes. I figure something like "Bomb" would be more dangerous, as this can't be verified safely and quickly by just glancing around. Plus, everyone being flooded daily by reports of explosive terrorist attacks. I figure people are primed to panic at that trigger word these days.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:55 AM

GINOBIFFARONI

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Quote:
Originally posted by AgentRouka:
I doubt she was yelling "Fire", though. The results might have been quite different.

Unless the theater was actually on fire...in which case it makes good sense to let folks know.

Somehow this all reminds me of the scene from Airplane where everybody was lined up to smack the screaming woman...

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you"- Chrisisall, 2009.

lol... classic

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 5:36 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I have a singularly unpopular opinion on this topic. Most people would probably consider it idiotic and dangerous, and I concede that they may be right. I can totally see this from the other side of the equation, and can almost send a spiritual surrogate self to stand with you and declaim me for my idiocy.

That having been said...

How about if, instead of outlawing speech (Fire in a crowded theater) we just teach people not to panic? We teach people that things may happen "Bomb! Fire! Poison Gas!" when they are still in primary school. We teach them that panicking will kill many people, and so they should react to such things in a calm, reasonable manner.

It won't stop people from trampling folks if they are actually on fire or choking on smoke, but it might make people much more reasonable when nothing is going on.

Remember 'stop, drop, and roll?'

How about 'listen, assess, respond?'

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 6:45 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
How about if, instead of outlawing speech (Fire in a crowded theater) we just teach people not to panic? We teach people that things may happen "Bomb! Fire! Poison Gas!" when they are still in primary school. We teach them that panicking will kill many people, and so they should react to such things in a calm, reasonable manner.

Can't do that, it would remove the power to control them with fear, they might stop hopping on command, might start asking QUESTIONS....

Can't have that, can we now ?
*SNARK!*

-F

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 6:51 PM

AGENTROUKA

Anthony -

Sure, that's always a good idea. We already do try and teach people, through firedrills, etc. and it helps.

But I don't think that a dangerous panic is necessarily always due to the majority more or less lacking the wherewithal to try and not panic.

In some cases, it can be an involuntary thing. If the crowd is large enough, escape routes narrow or badly designed and the implied threat doesn't allow for a listen/asses/respond type thing very well (Yell "Bomb" on a bus these days, how many will have immediate associations and immediate reactions?) then it doesn't take that much for panic to take over, and from a certain point on, even the calm ones just get swept along.

While I agree that more safety training like this might have great benefits, I don't think it's fair to use it as an excuse to make their involuntary reaction all the responsibility of the people in the crowd from that point on, and remove the legal implications of intentionally starting a panic.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:05 PM

DREAMTROVE

I think retribution would take care of this. When you meet a dog, you don't start by kicking it. Because a dog has no laws.

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Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:48 PM

CANTTAKESKY

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
I have a singularly unpopular opinion on this topic.

Why is it singularly unpopular? It makes perfect sense.

I can't think of any event that can be better resolved with panic than with calm, rational, educated, and critical thinking.

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Friday, August 28, 2009 2:28 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by canttakesky:
Why is it singularly unpopular? It makes perfect sense.

That's EXACTLY why it is singularly unpopular.

Anthony has a very subtle sense of humor, CTS.

-F

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