REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Bring it on.

POSTED BY: WULFENSTAR
UPDATED: Friday, October 2, 2009 12:51
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VIEWED: 2646
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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:37 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


AnthonyT wrote:
"What is an outside body?"

Anyone who feels their opinion outweighs yours.

ETA: Btw. I DON'T have all the answers for every situation. I would just like to see a system that can handle individual cases without outside interference.

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:42 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello Rue,

I think if the U.S. took up a vote tomorrow, and it was decided to throw everyone's first born into a volcano...

I think I would take up guerrilla warfare as a hobby.

And I may be completely full of it... But if they took up a vote and decided to re-instate slavery...

I think you'd be first in line to set up the underground railroad to Canada- in full violation of the laws of society.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:45 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


I would choose my own actions accordingly - I would not force my beliefs on others.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:45 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


"I would just like to see a system that can handle individual cases without outside interference."

Hello Wulf,

Any 'system' requires de-facto interference from the outside. That's what a system is. Without an authority enforcing a system, the system is just everyone doing whatever the heck they feel like.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:47 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


To me, it still comes back to ends and means.

No matter how genuine your desire to do good, if you impose your will on others through use of force (except in cases of clear self-defense) you have crossed the line into tyranny.

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:48 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello Rue,

The moment you smuggle Mr. Haggleton's slave into Canada, you have forced your will upon Mr. Haggleton and indeed upon all of society. Any time anyone breaks any law, they are forcing their will upon society.

What you mean to say is that you would not force anyone else to force their will upon society.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:50 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


AnthonyT wrote: "Any 'system' requires de-facto interference from the outside. That's what a system is. Without an authority enforcing a system, the system is just everyone doing whatever the heck they feel like."

Which is why I argue that the FF set up a system of "states". A republic. Whereby, even if you didn't like what was decided, at least it was decided by your neighbor.

Not someone hundreds or thousands of miles away.

This is why I have such a problem with "Federal" rules a regulations.

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:51 AM

PEACEKEEPER

Keeping order in every verse


Quote:

Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
AnthonyT wrote:

"It sounds as if you are saying that there are times when the will of the majority must be contradicted, either due to their short-sightedness, ignorance, or greed. And that moving against the will of the majority may be the only way to save them from themselves.

Is this your position?"

Yes, no and maybe.

Yes: There have been many times in history where great wrongs were applied by the majority of the people. (Slavery, the Holocaust, Manifest Destiny) And in these cases, the majority WERE wrong.

I would add any time that the majority wish to create laws which stifle free will, and the application thereof.

No: The majority rules. I have to believe that people are inherently good, and that when there is a majority opinion, it will likewise be good.

Maybe: The majority must not forget that they are individuals, first. And that whatever rule they make MUST free the individual, not limit them.


Are you trying to say(and I quote from the BDM),that in these cases the majority haven,t been told "What" to think but "How" to think. An apt analogy in this instance,maybe?
I have pretty much maintained that ALL governments(no matter how liberal they portray themselves)allow their citizens to think for themselves.However,their thinking is limited by the parameters that their society/government sets for us.i.e we are allowed to think outside of the box, but that thinking is seldom taken notice of because it doesn't sit well within the establishnent.We are all free to think,but we are restricted in how we can express those thoughts. Or am I way off track with your argument?
Peacekeeper---keeping order in every verse!!!

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:54 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello Wulf,

So, you DO advocate an outside body ruling on your personal freedom.

You would simply like it to be a smaller body, composed of people closer to you who may better understand your concerns.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:57 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


AnthonyT wrote: "So, you DO advocate an outside body ruling on your personal freedom.

You would simply like it to be a smaller body, composed of people closer to you who may better understand your concerns."

Maybe. But, there are some personal freedoms that CANNOT be taken/given by anyone. ANY group or singular person. Or ruled on, or judged, or decided.

Some freedoms, some rights, are inherent. Not to be decided, or judged, or infringed.

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:59 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

And which freedoms are those?

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:59 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important



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Friday, October 2, 2009 9:59 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important



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Friday, October 2, 2009 10:04 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


AnthonyT wrote: And which freedoms are those?

The right to say what you want.

The right to defend yourself.

The right to be free from unreasonable search and seizures.

Aww, hell. Here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Bill_of_Rights

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Friday, October 2, 2009 10:06 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Anthony

OOOOoooohhhh - did you get the trifecta ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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Friday, October 2, 2009 10:08 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg


Ok. Gotta run here.

Talk to you guys later.

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Friday, October 2, 2009 10:18 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

Wulf: The Bill of Rights- a common set of rights for all citizens of our great country. Designed to be enforced upon every state and principality of our great nation by a distant outside body thousands of miles away from you. Individual cases of question to be weighed and balanced by another outside body thousands of miles away from you. By wishing for the Bill of Rights to protect everyone, everywhere, you have just installed a Federal body with dominion over you. Welcome to America, at the beginning.

Which is, I suspect, what you'd like to see. America, the way it was at the beginning. Before John Adams became President.

Rue: I did! Now, if only there was a prize beyond a deep sense of personal shame. ;-)

--Anthony


"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Friday, October 2, 2009 12:46 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
[If] you were in Mal's place, would YOU have kicked Crow into the port intake?


The laughing Chrisisall



I doubt I would have. Wouldn't have wanted to risk damaging the engine!

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Friday, October 2, 2009 12:51 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:
Vehicles exceeding this speed are in danger of careening off the road or highway.
There is no easy answer to this problem.


There sure as heck is, just give peeps a closed-road test on a twisty, wet mountain road with occasional obsticals simulating stalled cars or idiot pedestrians, and whatever top speed they can achieve without crashing is what the can be certified to drive.
Jeeze Louise!


The laughing Chrisisall



Man, don't I wish...

Mike

The percentage you're paying is too high-priced
While you're living beyond all your means;
And the man in the suit has just bought a new car
From the profit he's made on your dreams

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