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Originally posted by Niki2:
It's a paradox. In the past year and a half, the Obama Administration has tackled a number of "third-rail" issues o other president has been at all successful in dealing with...if they even tried. They've made strides in financial reform, health care, student loan reform, stimulus package, DADT, and at least tried on energy. And don't forget the Lilly Ledbetter. Yet all we hear is how "evil" they are.

You may not agree with what they've done--certainly I don't, in that the final bills have been so watered down as to be ineffective, and in some cases will have the opposite effect than intended, but it's a START, and some of it IS good.

So why do we hear nothing about that? Why is the grinding cry "bad President, bad President" ALL the time? Yeah, he's caved on too much, he hasn't done enough to repair the damages Dumbya left us with, and he's too wishy-washy. But how many Presidents have even TRIED this much in this short a time? And how much of it, now that it's law, can we improve to make what he (and we) wanted...which is the first step?

The hatred of Obama seems to be so strong that NOTHING is being seen as positive. Not only that, but the Repubs "party of no" tactics have made sure the bills ended up being only semi-helpful, even tho' they BACKED some of the ideas until he came into office. Anyone know who FIRST was in favor of Cap and Trade...who used it as a campaign promise? Clinton failed at health care; all Repub Presidents have wanted to do is privatize Social Security, Medicare, and keep the health-insurance companies Big Oil and Wall Street fat and happy. All three had carte blanche during Dumbya's time; Obama TRIED to get a moratorium to make sure things were safe and revisit the issue (anyone notice that judge's affiliations with Big Oil?).

Just think how GOOD those bills could have been if the Republicans had participated. As it was, a lot of their suggestions were incorporated, and still they voted "no".

What exactly is their platform on these issues, how do they suggest fixing things? I haven't heard anything from them except "Obama Bad"...I'd like to know what ideas they have, if any, to show their being in power would have improved this or WOULD improve things in the future.

Mind you, I am NOT happy, but I'm willing to give the man his due, and applaud him for at least TRYING.

Here are a few things he's begun or accomplished thus far:

•"Returning science to its rightful place" by lifting the Bush restrictions on federally funded embryonic stem cell research.

•Signing laws to expand children's health insurance (financed by a 61-cent per pack increase in the federal cigarette tax the adviser did not tout).

•Signing a law meant to improve the ability of women who allege pay discrimination to sue their employer.

•Lifting travel and remittance restrictions for Cuban Americans who seek to travel more frequently to the island and send more US currency to their immediate family.

•signed a law supporting increased financial aid to severely injured war veterans, and their caretakers.

•Put a hold on Artic oil exploratory digging until environmental impacts are clear.

•Passed health care reform.

•signed a hate crime bill.

•passed financial reform.

•Passing the "largest" economic stimulus bill in American history.

•Established a National Performance Officer charged with saving the federal government money and making federal operations more efficient. Reports to the deputy director of the Office of Management and Budgets. Specific duties require finding new efficient ways of operating.

•Ordered all federal agencies to undertake a study and make recommendations for ways to cut future spending.

•Ordered a review of all federal operations to identify and cut wasteful spending and practices.

•Initiated changes in federal procurement policies and procedures.

•Implemented 'PayGo' procedures by telling congress that no bill will be signed if there is not a way to pay for it.

•Placed limits on lobbyist's access to the White House.

•Placed limits on White House aides working for lobbyists after their tenure in the administration.

•Required lobbyists to be removed from federal advisory study panels.

•Suspended acquisition of expensive fleet of 28 new (foreign built) Marine One helicopters that was projected to be over budget by billions of dollars. A new domestically produced modified version of current production civilian helicopters is being looked at by the Pentagon.

•Limited salaries of senior White House aides and cut maximum salary to $100,000.

•Initiated housing rescue plan.

•Improved loan guarantees to small businesses and lowered small business loan interest rates.

•Initiated policies that allow the public to meet with federal housing insurers to refinance a mortgage if they are having trouble paying. Has further reinforced the policy to improve usage of the program.

•Instituted a new focus on reducing mortgage fraud.
Closed offshore tax safe havens.

•Negotiated deal with Swiss banks to permit US government to gain access to records of tax evaders and criminals.

•Ended the previous policy of offering tax benefits to corporations who outsource American jobs. Initiated a new policy is to promote in-sourcing to bring jobs back.

•Ended the previous practice of protecting credit card companies. Replaced it with new consumer protections from credit card industry's predatory practices. Moved dates of implementation forward when credit card companies arbitrarily upped rates ahead of planned reform date.

•Increased student loans while reducing the costs to the federal government by 87 billion dollars over ten years.

•Increasing opportunities in AmeriCorps program.

•Provided new funds for school construction in stimulus program.

•Ended the previous stop-loss policy that kept soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan longer than their enlistment date.

•Insured that better body armor is now provided to our troops.

•Increasing pay and benefits for military personnel.

•Ended media blackout on covering the return of fallen soldiers to Dover AFB.

•Proposed increasing the amount of government and private money spent on scientific research to three percent of the nation's economic output.

•Ended previous practice of having White House aides rewrite scientific and environmental rules, regulations, and reports.
Increased infrastructure spending (roads, bridges, power plants) after years of neglect.

•Initiated efforts to expand broadband Internet access to rural areas.

•Ended the previous practice of forbidding Medicare from negotiating with drug manufacturers for cheaper drugs. The federal government is now realizing hundreds of millions in savings thus lowering the drug costs for seniors.

•Re-established diplomacy and the state department as a significant factor in foreign policy.

•Visited more countries and met with more world leaders than any president in his first six months in office. Re-establishing good relations with both friends and others.

•Ended the previous administration's torture policy and returned US to compliance with the Geneva Convention standards.

•Restarted the nuclear nonproliferation talks and building back up the nuclear inspection infrastructure and protocols.

As to the two wars:

•Ordering the closing of Guantanamo Bay military detention facility and abolishing "enhanced interrogation techniques."

•Setting a fixed timetable for withdrawing U.S. combat forces from Iraq.

We'll have to wait and see how those turn out.

You might not agree with any of those, but doesn't he get credit for SOME of them? Why is he so universally considered the "Evil Overlord" and why does nobody mind the Repubs styming everything they can yet offering nothing of substance in return? I don't get it.

I know we're supposed to hate whatever government is in office, but I happen to think some of these are GOOD things.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of __________________, code name ‘Nike”,
signing off

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Originally posted by FutureMrsFIllion:
Bottom line? Because he is a black man ane white conservative amwrica can't handle it.

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Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
The Tea Party people deserve the blame for standing up against a tyranical government, and doing it in the most democratic way, while allowing for their identities to be known.

Silly them. Trying to affect change in a non-violent way.

Well, we will see how it works.

There are always other ways.

"Being called a racist by a Liberal is a badge of honor."

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
The Tea Parties deserves [sic] the "blame" for daring to stand up to the ever expanding , free spending , hyper taxing Imperial Federal Gov't.

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The Tea Party deserves the "blame" for attending town hall meetings, asking sincere and honest questions of their Representatives, and daring to not be treated like little children by over paid, glorified public servants.

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Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
Aww Kwick.. are we bothering you? Ok.

We'll stop trying to make things better. For you.

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Originally posted by Niki2:
You're forgetting a couple of things, Wulf:

a) She's not "my girl"...she's just the one journalist I've noted who has her people do her homoework, so I trust her more than I trust a lot of MSM. I don't trust the MSM in general, but history has shown she's pretty reliable most of the time.


I believe there's enough blame to go all around, from Obama to administration, Republicans, and the Tea Party.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of __________________, code name ‘Nike”,
signing off

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Maddow is a journalist? Really? I'm out of touch. I thought she was all opinion Man, you are a piece of work. How does the tea party take any blame?

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Originally posted by antimason:
this talking point on the left to blame "Dumbya" for this abysmal, non existent 'recovery' just isn't holding water anymore. Obama isn't cleaning up any mess that the democrats weren't also equally responsable for. the democrats have had majorities in the house and senate for 4 years, and total control for almost 2 years now. not coincidentally, the deficits have exploded exponentially since then(although in conjunction with liberal republicans). but just under the current president, the trillion dollar stimulus was a failure, the healthcare bill is a nightmare, and financial reform and cap and trade will all be huge tax increases on everybody. and the Bush tax cuts expire soon, on top of everything. in other words, we've basically turned a crash, similar to '29, into what will become a another 15 year long great depression. and, just as it was then, this is the fault of flawed economic theories, wich will result in the same predictable outcome. so because i fundementally disagree with the agenda of the current party in power, i don't see a whole lot to be praiseworthy about towards president Obama and the dems

if he was a libertarian, as charasmatic a person as he is, you want to like him- he could be one of the greatest presidents in modern history. and how oppertune a time, when we need his abilities of persuasion and charisma to advocate the principles liberty. you notice he never talks about these concepts though.. he truly believes in a command and control, top down centralized society. and you just cant run peoples lives, in will never work

about the surpluses under Clinton, does any of that credit go to the republican party, who took control of the house and senate for the first time in 20-30 years? it was a generation of Reagan era conservatives who did that. eventually the power corrupted them though, and they became socially conservative liberals. but when Bush was elected in 2000, republicans had an oppertunity to decentralize this top heavy authoritarian government, purge the beauracracy and return back to classical laissez faire capitalism, and they blew it! and this perception among the left of massive deregulation during this period, what are you talking about? in fact, what regulations were put in place, such as in housing and banking, turned out to be counterproductive and harmful to the economy, as evidenced by our current situation.

and on the Bush tax cuts, if they were indeed only for the super rich, which is untrue but the common myth among the left, what is the left admitting is wrong with that? its an admission in premise that a tax cut is a benefit to people. why then does the left demonize the Bush tax cuts, which benefit a broad range of people of all tax and income brackets? or, why not propose tax cuts greater then 'Bushs'? i dont get it.. and out of pure partisanship you will let them expire, and punish everyone. but if you think letting these cuts expire will result in greater revenues to the federal government(maybe in hopes to pay off this massive deficit), you've got an important lesson in economics coming to you

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Originally posted by AnthonyT:

P.S. Any chance we can cut out the tea-bagger stuff? Slapping folks who are already polarized isn't gonna mellow 'em out.

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But if one takes into account how it got there, and that it was grown without any attention to infrastructure, with tax cuts and benefits to the rich, and by trashing the economy, that leaves a lot for anyone following Bush to “fix”.

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And yes, those “flawed economic theories” were begun under Bush, copying Reagan’s “voo doo economics”, as even Pappa Bush realized.

You cannot damn any one party without taking history into account, much as you’d like to, I know. No President acts within a vaccum.

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I fully agree with your second paragraph, DT, except I think the reasons are different, as I posted before. Most of the third as well, except for the tax cuts part. I’ve shown over and over that trickle-down does NOT work; so there’s no debating, since you are convinced despite hefty evidence that it does. Tax cuts do increase the deficit, that’s also been shown over and over, despite Republican talking points that they “pay for themselves”—they simply do NOT.
Notice how the debt/GDP ratio was RAISED under Reagan, Bush I and Bush II—Reagan was the big believer in Tricke-Down, so if it works so well and tax cuts work so well, why is that the case?

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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Originally posted by AnthonyT:

P.S. Any chance we can cut out the tea-bagger stuff? Slapping folks who are already polarized isn't gonna mellow 'em out.

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Shall I use Tea Party-backed candidate Ken Buck's words for them, and just call them "those dumbasses in the Tea Party"? After all, they still seem to be backing him, even after he referred to them as "dumbasses" when he was discussing them with a Democrat colleague.

AURaptor's Greatest Hits:

Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.

Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.

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Originally posted by Niki2:


Notice how the debt/GDP ratio was RAISED under Reagan, Bush I and Bush II—Reagan was the big believer in Tricke-Down, so if it works so well and tax cuts work so well, why is that the case?

I already explained the blame I place on the Tea Party, so won’t repeat myself. And I’ll put Maddow’s fact checking up against ANY fact checking done by FauxNews, happily. To say otherwise is to ignore the facts, or to be ignorant of who checks them and who does not. To say she is all opinion is pure partisan bullshit unless proven otherwise, which is impossible. It’s obvious such an opinion is garnered from other sources than actually checking anything out.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of __________________, code name ‘Nike”,
signing off

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Originally posted by kaneman:

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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Originally posted by AnthonyT:

P.S. Any chance we can cut out the tea-bagger stuff? Slapping folks who are already polarized isn't gonna mellow 'em out.

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Shall I use Tea Party-backed candidate Ken Buck's words for them, and just call them "those dumbasses in the Tea Party"? After all, they still seem to be backing him, even after he referred to them as "dumbasses" when he was discussing them with a Democrat colleague.

AURaptor's Greatest Hits:

Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.

Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.

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"Those dumb-asses that keep asking me about birth certificates"....Tea party is not birthers....Only idiots believe he was talking about the tea party and not birthers who are their own one issue morons.

Keep watching olberman and maddow. And next time when you use quotes don't make em up. You have zero credibility on this board. Why don't you go back and change your posts like you do with AuRaptor you little homosexual.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
The Tea Parties deserves the "blame" for daring to stand up to the ever expanding , free spending , hyper taxing Imperial Federal Gov't.

The Tea Party deserves the "blame" for attending town hall meetings, asking sincere and honest questions of their Representatives, and daring to not be treated like little children by over paid, glorified public servants.

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It's a paradox.

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Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
After ramming an illegal and unConstitutional ObamaCare down the peoples throats... after spending their money to bail out compainies undeserving of continuation... after attempting to socialize everything... the free American people hate us?

How can THAT be?

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Originally posted by Wulfenstar:


5. continuing unemployment benefits, and regulating business only DEEPEN our financial hole.

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