No clever subject line, the story speaks for itself. by AURaptor

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

No clever subject line, the story speaks for itself.

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Monday, September 20, 2010 09:34
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VIEWED: 4002
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Monday, September 20, 2010 3:23 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
RL, I have taken Mike to task several times, both on the board and off. Chris just now started getting nasty, and explained why; it doesn't excuse it in my mind and I do understand, but it DOESN'T excuse it.

To your credit, I know you've made some efforts there. I especially liked your response to Kwicko when he called Glenn Beck, and the many religious leaders who spoke, and the enormous crowd a Nazi rally. You took a stand then, and I give you credit for that.

And for the record, I never said I would change how I feel about politics and social issues. I only said I would not use profanity or vulgarity. And I am proud to say that I have not slipped back into the gutter yet, not once, despite numerous vile provocations from some here. But never expect me to abandon my beliefs, and you shouldn't be shocked when I post against Liberals, Democrats, or whoever. I'm not that different from you in that regard, that I will never be intimidated by clowns, idiots, and nasties. I would be more engaged with your posts, which I usually detest as well, but they're so darn long I can't typically even get started. Hope I cleared all that up for ya. Live long & prosper!

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Monday, September 20, 2010 6:21 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

I didn't expect any more, RL, I was just expressing my dismay at the same intensity of pejorative terms as I read from others, when you WERE making really good points before you "disappeared"--I you didn't post for a bit there (unless my senile brain missed it) and reappeared the past couple of days.

You know better by now that to imagine I expect you to abandon your beliefs; it was the tone, not the content, that dismayed me...tho' the content kind of WAS the tone, now I reread it.

I just hate seeing people who I KNOW might have something valid to say do nothing but snark and sneer and repeat worthless rhetoric over and over. On either side. As to diving into the gutter, there are a couple of people here who do nothing BUT dive into the gutter, seemingly only coming into a post to spew their ugliness. Aside from Mike, and Story sometimes, I don't think that holds true as much on the left--just my perception, largely from how my posts are responded to perhaps.

The reason, by the way, that the claim of "sockpuppet" come up is most likely because people admitted to having them and/or have been tripped up pretty clearly, so it's a known fact, not a come-back of no substance. I will probably never be convinced that you're not one, RL, sadly, but I take you how you post, as I do now with everyone. Too much has been shown for me to do lose my distrust of some, unfortunately; now I CHOOSE to respond as if each is individual, and it doesn't bother me if someone is being "nice" in disguise, it's just easier to take people at their word, and if they're snickering behind the screen, that's their problem, not mine.

Sorry my posts are too long for you; as I explained, the best way for me to feel I'm communicating what I mean clearly is to do it with a lot of words. Others here manage it more concisely and I admire them for it; I'm just me and stuck with my own method.

Yes, Mike's argument was weak at best and ridiculous at worst, and nitpicking either way. But for Raptor to say we have "nothing with which to repond" is equally ridiculous, as I've seen many refute/respond to points all the time, and heaven knows he's as quick to game the thread as anyone else.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Monday, September 20, 2010 6:21 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

As to Raptor's

Quote:
In their minds, being able to show that you were wrong about anything, means that your entire point of view is flawed, and to be ignored completely. The Left argues like a collective group of stubborn, petulant children, even when they know they have no case to argue.

That is such an absurd statement, and so "pot calling kettle black" that it's amusing.

Something I noticed some time ago but haven't mentioned, is that when I come in the morning, I check threads, and began to notice that when evidence--facts with backup--gets too clear and refutes points made by, especially Raptor and Kane, there are no further posts by them. You can say the "lost interest", but there comes a point where there's no valid refutation and they just disappear rather than confront the facts. It's kind of disappointing, because I'd like to hear what they have to say, if it's valid, but that's the end of it.

Ergo: Ignore, and "disappear". Also, I far more often see posts which are merely name-calling and have no facts in them at ALL in response to valid points offered. What Raptor said above is a perfect description of people on both sides, and I resent the constant reference to "they"--meaning all libs, as everyone knows, when I see valid points put up politely by Anthony, myself, and others. It's what I keep hearing arguments called--a "strawman argument"--it means nothing and is just posturing to avoid addressing the issue. Yes, it happens on the left, but if one keeps track and actually READS these threads, it becomes obvious who does it most often: Raptor and Kane and Mike.

Speaking of which: what happened to Wulf? I miss him, much as he frustrates me most of the time.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Monday, September 20, 2010 6:36 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Niki

It comes to a point where your 'facts' or conclusions based on what you call as 'fact' leaves much to be desired. It's not an issue of ' no valid refuting ' of your side of the story, but simply that I fail to see the point of trying to debate the matter any further. You see things from a certain point of view, all conservatives are christian bigots, who are greedy, hate filled racists, and I see things in terms of left wing, big gov't types as being evil, because of their desire to infringe on mine and everyone's rights, " for the good of us all " , or some such nonsense.

"The modern definition of 'racist' is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal."

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Monday, September 20, 2010 6:52 AM

BYTEMITE

I'm more disturbed really that the "FBI urged her to go into hiding."

This isn't "a witness program, only she's picking up the tabs." Concerns about Muslim extremism might have been the justification, but this is a government entity who's actually doing the censoring and making with disappearing.

o.O

I'm going to find a cardboard box, and label it "Secret Hideout" in black permanent marker, and I'm going to stay there for a while. Anyone who wants to join me, you're welcome to.

Actually I'm laughing imagining a parade of cardboard boxes wiggling around in front of the capital building in DC. But don't tell anyone my diabolical master plan.

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Monday, September 20, 2010 7:07 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Byte, I love your vision! I'm grabbing my box, where shall we meet?

Raptor--my gawd, a complete post with no name calling or obscenities aimed at me! That might well be a first...many thanx.

I grant you might not have an interest in continuing, I think what bothers me most is that the points I make and facts I provide (some of which are actual words spoken by the person in question) aren't even MENTIONED during the discussion, and I'd actually like to hear the other side or discuss the point. Foolish of me, I realize, to wish for such a thing here, but the only things I think I actually dismiss are talking points which have already been proven false and "they" generalizations followed by name calling.

What's interesting about your statement of how I view people is that it's wrong, I don't view "all" of ANY group as being the same. when somene posts remarks that are the charcature of the right, it has little meaning to me.

But, for example, nobody ever responded to my remarks that our Constitution and laws shouldn't BE at the whim of the "majority"; the same argument kept on being put forth, but nobody ever addressed that. That's what I find frustrating, in large part.

As to infringing on people's rights, could you (as I asked before several times) tell me then why you back candidates on the right who have SAID they want to dictate to us how we legally have to behave? Because there are several candidates who won their primaries this time around who have indicated such. Isn't that infringement?

That's kind of the crux of it; I bring up a point and back it up with what I believe (from my reading of several different sources) are valid, and they never get addressed. Repeatedly. They're not posts about "Republicans are all bigots" (which I do not believe), they're real points, debatable.

By the way, the generalizations I USUALLY use about the right are about the rather flamable and predictable things I read from people here, who tend to epitomize what I learned about RWA thinking. I'm not USUALLY talking about Republicans as a whole, in fact almost never--maybe Republican POLITICIANS, who tow the party line, but I don't think "all" Republicans are anything, any more than "all" Democrats.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Monday, September 20, 2010 7:52 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
As to infringing on people's rights, could you (as I asked before several times) tell me then why you back candidates on the right who have SAID they want to dictate to us how we legally have to behave? Because there are several candidates who won their primaries this time around who have indicated such. Isn't that infringement?

Those the words aren't found in the Constitution, the idea of allowing an individual to live as they see fit, so long as they don't infringe on another's rights through acts of force of fraud, are what I'm basing my views on.

Naturally, since we live in an organized society, we're going to have laws and rules which rub some of us the wrong way.

Seat belt laws, for example. Silly, I know, and not something I lose sleep over. Even a little, but just an example.

However, taxing to dictate how we live, instead of raising $$ for the proper function of operating the Gov't, is, imo, wrong. Obama wants to raise taxes, not because it'll generate more income to the Gov't, but because of a " fairness " issue. Who the fuck is HE to decide that ? Neither Obama nor Bush or anyone who thinks that way, has no business in office.

"The modern definition of 'racist' is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal."

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Monday, September 20, 2010 8:15 AM

KANEMAN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
River,

The limited intelligence crowd, like Kwickie, know they have nothing with which to respond, so they resort to trying to find the most menial, tiny issue to disagree with or point out something, ANYTHING, just to claim you're wrong.

It's how they roll. They can't deny that Theo Van Gogh was murdered, in broad day light, by a Muslim Jihadist. So, in an attempt to 'win' the argument, they'll ignore all the relevant issues, and instead focus on whether it was on a Tuesday, and not a Wednesday, if he was 'nearly' decapitated, or merely had his throat cut, or they'll point out some typo, to PROVE that you're wrong.

In their minds, being able to show that you were wrong about anything, means that your entire point of view is flawed, and to be ignored completely. The Left argues like a collective group of stubborn, petulant children, even when they know they have no case to argue.

"The modern definition of 'racist' is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal."

I've ignored this thread, because it is the same old crap. You and RL are the only ones making any sense...How do you even post to these clowns without using the kaneman "you are a fag" approach? Really, do you think Kwicko is a Texan?
They call any conservative a troll or one person(they are in denial that we are the majority) but they troll anything we post. We are on the side of most Americans on most issues....Rub it in their faces...You can't change their minds...We should laugh our asses off in Nov. and 2012.....in the time between call her an out dated hippie, Kwicko gay(has to be), Mince a god, and the rest of the Obamaa ball lickers they idiots they are

You keep forgetting they get the news from MSNBC...Allah help them

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Monday, September 20, 2010 9:34 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Quote:
Originally posted by kaneman:
I've ignored this thread, because it is the same old crap.

But here you and I are, and it's still the same old crap.

Quote:
You and RL are the only ones making any sense...How do you even post to these clowns without using the kaneman "you are a fag" approach?

Can't speak for Rap or RL, but the "you are a fag" approach has its' limitations sometimes. I like when you use it though.

Quote:
They call any conservative a troll or one person(they are in denial that we are the majority) but they troll anything we post.

So what, who cares? This is just a place to come to kill time at work, isn't it? Don't tell me you think it's more than that. As if any of it means anything.

Quote:
We are on the side of most Americans on most issues....Rub it in their faces...You can't change their minds...We should laugh our asses off in Nov. and 2012.

Yes we are, yes we do, and no we cannot. But we can, on rare occasions, find humor in our mutual detestment, and sometimes even get a word of support from unlikely sources. Laugh our asses off in November? For me, more like a big sigh of relief if it actually materializes that way.

Quote:
in the time between call her an out dated hippie, Kwicko gay(has to be), Mince a god, and the rest of the Obamaa ball lickers they idiots they are..You keep forgetting they get the news from MSNBC...Allah help them

You may not like Niki or her posts, but you certainly have to admire her energy and intelligence, don't you? The name-calling on a regular basis can get old, at least for me.

Question for ya....If Repubs win big in November, and after you've laughed and laughed and rubbed "their" faces in it....then what comes next? They'll laugh and rub right back at you as soon as the next story hits the air. Wheel never stops turning.

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