... and these children that you spit on as they try to change their world... by Kwicko

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

... and these children that you spit on as they try to change their world...

POSTED BY: KWICKO
UPDATED: Monday, December 20, 2010 13:55
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 1612
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Friday, December 17, 2010 6:08 AM

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

For Wulfie, who seems to think that only his side is willing to fight. Here's a little video clip that shows him that those "lib/prog/hippies" have a bit of scrap left in them as well. This kid is fifteen years old, and speaks more eloquently than most people twice his age.

http://www.i-am-bored.com/bored_link.cfm?link_id=55066

"And these children that you spit on
As they try to change their worlds
Are immune to your consultations
They're quite aware of what they're going through..."

This Space For Rent!

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Friday, December 17, 2010 10:01 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Don't forget Notorious Nicky either, Mikey.
http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2010/12/12/uk-govt-moves-against-12-year-o
ld-dissident/

Hell, for that matter, was about that age that *I* decided to actually go for broke and try to change some of the outrages I saw every day, that people older than me had conditioned themselves to be all but blind and uncaring about, to not even SEE, much less notice.

My Math teacher actually had that quote taped to her desk, as a reminder to her colleagues that kids were not as society pretends they are, and that given how when adults try to change their world it's usually for the worse, they're within their rights to be pissed about it - I know this cause I asked her and she told me, though we did not much get along otherwise.

Seriously, where the hell does anyone think Justin and the rest of VI came from anyway, given that all the original members besides me are pushin up daisies - but the very kids who *did* stand up, and got chucked in a Hellcamp for their troubles, hammered down by the entire weight of a society that considers them little more than livestock, and their efforts a threat to be managed, rather than a voice that needs to be heard.

And then, a dark miracle happened - someone stepped in, someone stepped up, and showed them that this world is not wholly without justice, even if you won't find any in a courtroom, that one CAN help better the world by a tiny bit even if you have to knock some heads together in the process - we might not be the best example of a shining beacon of hope, but to find even ONE faction of society not complicit with, or condoning, the abuses they railed against, to many was a miracle itself, however dark.

The Essential Role of an Enlightened Witness in Society
http://www.alice-miller.com/articles_en.php?lang=en&nid=41&grp=11

Quote:
For this process to succeed, the adult who has grown up without helping witnesses in his childhood needs the support of enlightened witnesses, people who have understood and recognized the consequences of child abuse. In an informed society, adolescents can learn to verbalize their truth and to discover themselves in their own story. They will not need to avenge themselves violently for their wounds, or to poison their systems with drugs, if they have the luck to talk to others about their early experiences, and succeed in grasping the naked truth of their own tragedy. To do this, they need assistance from persons aware of the dynamics of child abuse, who can help them address their feelings seriously, understand them and integrate them, as part of their own story, instead of avenging themselves on the innocent.

Those voices, they NEED to be heard, for if they ARE heard, the result is visionaries who change society for the better, but if they are NOT heard, if all they get is hammered down, silenced, dismissed and ignored...

The childs cry of "I HURT" becomes a prophecy, a warning, the battlecry of a monster who has nothing left *but* hatred and destruction, from a society that has, in effect, taught them nothing else, and we've only ourselves to blame.

Quote:
"I wish all mankind had one neck so I could choke it!"
-Carl Panzram

If you ever wanted an example of such a thing, it's this individual, a very scourge against society who gave back what he took from it, and was self-aware enough to realize every bit of it, and oh how he hated us for that - even Manson admitted it, stating that he could be seen "looking back at you from the eyes of your own children", because all of these monsters are our own creations.

-Frem
I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, December 17, 2010 10:18 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Sides.

What a joke.

There are only 2 places to be.

You want to turn our entire country, our HOME, into places like Detroit, Newark, etc? You want to bring us all low, so that maybe you can be on the high and mighty side? Bring everyone down to your level? So that you can break things up along the high and low?

If you want that...you ain't no friend of mine.

However, if you want to give everyone a chance to do well on their own, do well by their own... then step on up son, cus we have lots to talk about.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, December 17, 2010 10:33 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
You want to turn our entire country, our HOME, into places like Detroit, Newark, etc? You want to bring us all low, so that maybe you can be on the high and mighty side? Bring everyone down to your level? So that you can break things up along the high and low?

If you want that...you ain't no friend of mine.

So licking the boots of the "high and mighty" hoping against hope they might pat you on the head is better, collaborator ?

And for the record, despite all the whinging and the whining, Detroit endures, and it endures best when the fucking government leaves those people the hell alone, instead of trying to "solve" their problems - and the solution of you and your racist little buddies down at Stormfront is not something I'd be too keen on replacing it with you quisling prick.

Cause, yanno, a lot of people in Detroit, they're darker than you, and YOU seem to have a problem with it, for no logical reason other than you wanna make excuses for a world that your own actions, and those of people like you, have turned to shit - in fact you remind me just a little of The Comedian, from Watchmen, a pathetic son of a bitch always looking to put the blame on others despite his own contributions being a major PART of the disaster, the kind of asshat like you cheering freedom-freedom even as they hammer the chains on their fellow man.

The only "side" people like you ever got is whoeever appears to be winning at the time, wrapped around their boots, licking for all their worth... and just as quick to abandon it, flee and cower and pretend they didn't really mean it, when the going gets tough, or requires actual effort on their part, like the whining, puling little bitches that they are.

And anyways... I don't want to talk to you no more, you empty headed animal food trough wiper.
I fart in your general direction!

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, December 17, 2010 10:33 AM

STORYMARK

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
Sides.

What a joke.

There are only 2 places to be.

You want to turn our entire country, our HOME, into places like Detroit, Newark, etc? You want to bring us all low, so that maybe you can be on the high and mighty side? Bring everyone down to your level? So that you can break things up along the high and low?

If you want that...you ain't no friend of mine.

However, if you want to give everyone a chance to do well on their own, do well by their own... then step on up son, cus we have lots to talk about.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

That's what you don't get Wulfie. We all want to do right by the country and it's people. But you think that someone having a different idea about HOW to do so makes them your enemy - making this cute little statement of your ultimately hollow.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

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Friday, December 17, 2010 10:59 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Uhhh, you guys are trying to make sense to WULF??

By offering logical arguments?!?

...no, wait, by trying to communicate at ALL??!

Wow. Been gone a couple of days; things are much clearer when you go away and come back, it's easy to see the times it's not worth bothering.

Huh.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, December 17, 2010 11:48 AM

KWICKO

Honestly, Niki, I didn't expect Wulf to get it, at all. Reason he popped into my head was because I was posting up a video clip, and it made me think that was a "very Wulfie" thing to do, and then I realized how much he'd likely HATE the clip if he ever bothered to watch it, because it's showing someone who Wulf would undoubtedly like to see clubbed to death, clearly stating and advocating a position that is no doubt anathema to the things Wulfie claims he holds dear.

Frem, I must confess - I'm guilty of being taken aback by the realization that this was a fifteen year-old boy giving this speech. Upon reflection, I shouldn't have been surprised. What shocked me was his eloquence, his level-headedness, his cool, and his demeanor as he stood astride a stage and spoke simple truth to power.

It struck me as unreal, because it seemed so "mature" and so REAL, so human, of him to do that. That's when it struck me: wasn't I thinking of him as "human" before? Because he's a child? Hell, he's every bit as human as anyone else. In fact, probably MORE human, since he has yet to have the humanity and empathy beaten out of him!

"And a child shall lead them..."

As you've noted before, many times, maybe if we actually fucking started LISTENING to our children, instead of lecturing them, there'd be hope for us yet.

This Space For Rent!

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Friday, December 17, 2010 12:20 PM

MINCINGBEAST

I am not a mean old man, yet, but eagerly anticipate the day.

There is absolutely no reason to listen to children. They have nothing of interest to say, and are not wise and unspoiled by virtue of not knowing anything.

The observations of a twelve year old are no more profound than those of a twelve month old. So I will spit on the children, especially those that presume to change the world, but only if I'm out of pee-pee or poo-poo.

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Friday, December 17, 2010 1:12 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Exactly, Mikey... EXACTLY, that little moment of realization kinda hits like a ten ton hammer when it comes, doesn't it ?

When some kid says something to you that actually penetrates your consciousness and unavoidably reminds you that this is a PERSON, not a thing.
"Wait, what ?!... holy shit!"
And you begin to understand, REALLY understand, where I've been coming from all along.

Of course, this one in your video there is one of the kind that makes me hopeful, but sadly, there's plenty of others, sharpening their knives, cursing us, our society, all it stands for.. "Just you wait, some day, some day soon..*hissss*" and those fill me with dread, not just for their intentions, but that I honestly feel I have no moral right to stop them, because they DO have a rightful grudge, and while I can try to show them a better way, I will *not* oppose them and therefore by that action condone what our societies have done unto them...
I. WILL. NOT.

And it's a damn bitter cup to drink from that my niece is one of them, having made her choice to seek retaliation over redemption - but so long as there is life, there is hope, and I really can't feel too damn sorry for her intended targets, besides which, that's how I started out myself, and there's a damn lot of me in her twisted little brain, which is what concerns me the most.

See: several days ago she hit "the magic number", and soon enough, all hell is going to break loose when she makes it clear to folk she ain't takin orders from nobody no more, cause without a doubt, some will try to force the issue...and THEN... well, all I can hope for is minimum casualties.

There has *got* to be a better way, there *is* a better way, just so few dare to try.

Oh, and Niki - that's not "communicating" any more than stomping on a wasp in your kitchen is, which is kinda how I feel about the critter in question, an annoyance to be swatted.

-Frem
I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, December 17, 2010 2:28 PM

KWICKO

Quote:

Of course, this one in your video there is one of the kind that makes me hopeful, but sadly, there's plenty of others, sharpening their knives, cursing us, our society, all it stands for.. "Just you wait, some day, some day soon..*hissss*" and those fill me with dread, not just for their intentions, but that I honestly feel I have no moral right to stop them, because they DO have a rightful grudge, and while I can try to show them a better way, I will *not* oppose them and therefore by that action condone what our societies have done unto them...
I. WILL. NOT.

And it's a damn bitter cup to drink from that my niece is one of them, having made her choice to seek retaliation over redemption - but so long as there is life, there is hope, and I really can't feel too damn sorry for her intended targets, besides which, that's how I started out myself, and there's a damn lot of me in her twisted little brain, which is what concerns me the most.

I hear ya. And I agree - I'm not going to oppose them either, or try to convince them they've got no "right" to do such things as have been done to them. For one, they have no reason to care what I think of their "rights" in the first place, and for another, it would be an outright admission that we either felt they HAD no rights because they were children, and therefore not actual people, or we just flat didn't give a fuck about their rights in any case.

As for your niece, you can't stop her, but you can help guide her, and at least hopefully help her pick her targets well. Some folks will find redemption; others will find that the closest they'll ever get to it is retaliation.

I don't know if I mentioned it before, but another story came out about the London "riots", in which a group of students locked arms in peaceful protest, facing down police who were poised, clubs raised, to deliver a massive beat-down on the kids. A chant arose in the crowd... "YOUR JOBS ARE NEXT! YOUR JOBS ARE NEXT!" - and the police looked at each other, looked at the children, and realized that the people they thought they could just take for granted, whom they could just crush because of the well-known "apathy" of the lazy kids of today... those same kids were telling them who was next on the government's chopping block. And the police realized who was going to stand with them, and who was really standing AGAINST them.

Both of these stories gave me a glimmer of hope in a pretty awful month. And now come the stories of these children, whom the government regards as expendable, as throw-away people, standing arm-in-arm with the transit workers as their jobs, benefits, and healthcare are slashed.

This Space For Rent!

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Friday, December 17, 2010 2:29 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
Originally posted by mincingbeast:
I am not a mean old man, yet, but eagerly anticipate the day.

There is absolutely no reason to listen to children. They have nothing of interest to say, and are not wise and unspoiled by virtue of not knowing anything.

The observations of a twelve year old are no more profound than those of a twelve month old. So I will spit on the children, especially those that presume to change the world, but only if I'm out of pee-pee or poo-poo.

Start practicing now. There are only four words you need to know:

"GET OFF MY LAWN!"

You'll do great as a grumpy old man. Your yard will be the most popular on the block. I bet kids will come from miles around to do donuts in your lawn. ;)

This Space For Rent!

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Friday, December 17, 2010 2:50 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Is he protesting free speech or fee hikes ?

I want a free ( or heavily Gov't subsidized) Caddy Escalade! Leather interior , heated seats, HD screen , on board xbox , with free wireless internet connection so I can play LIVE games.

What's that ? You say I can't have it ? Or that I'll have to pay for most ( though not all ) of it, on my own !!

PROTEST ! YOU SHALL NOT KEEP ME DOWN!! I KNOW MY RIGHTS!

Pity. All the bluster of Guy Fawkes, but as misguided as terrier in a lion's cage.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Friday, December 17, 2010 3:02 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
"GET OFF MY LAWN!"

Watch Gran Torino - Them four words can be damn scary.

And once again, I see our resident lunatic has decided to decry them being pissed off over being charged six times the value of what they're getting... I wonder if he protests grocery markets for having a sale - but oh, start takin HIS money and it's a whole different ballgame, I bet.

And yet he's willing to be so damn free with ours, when does that make sense ?

-Frem
I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, December 17, 2010 3:38 PM

KWICKO

Quote:

I want a free ( or heavily Gov't subsidized) Caddy Escalade! Leather interior , heated seats, HD screen , on board xbox , with free wireless internet connection so I can play LIVE games.

What's that ? You say I can't have it ? Or that I'll have to pay for most ( though not all ) of it, on my own !!

Of course you can have that, paid for by the government. You just have to work for Blackwater. Or Halliburton.

This Space For Rent!

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Friday, December 17, 2010 8:19 PM

DREAMTROVE

Mike,

Bowie fan? Perhaps there's hope.

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Saturday, December 18, 2010 8:28 AM

KWICKO

Quote:
Posted by Wulfie:

Sides.

What a joke.

Oh, I must have misunderstood you. Weren't you the one who has previously claimed that he could *NEVER* vote for any "lib/prog/dem"?

Weren't you the one who was cheering that "our side won!" on election night just a short time ago?

There are only 2 places to be.

Quote:

You want to turn our entire country, our HOME, into places like Detroit, Newark, etc? You want to bring us all low, so that maybe you can be on the high and mighty side? Bring everyone down to your level? So that you can break things up along the high and low?

If you want that...you ain't no friend of mine.

Actually, I'd prefer to bring folks UP to my level if at all possible.

Quote:

However, if you want to give everyone a chance to do well on their own, do well by their own... then step on up son, cus we have lots to talk about.

You don't seem real big on giving folks a chance, Wulfie.

This Space For Rent!

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Saturday, December 18, 2010 10:35 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Oh, thank gawd for youth. Thank gawd for idealism, for those still innocent enough to be enraged, to "stand up and fight back", to make their voices heard in the belief they can change the world. Sometimes they do; all too often we grow up and realize how helpless most of us are, and we give up.

Thank gawd for universities, which is where most of these young people get fired up enough to care, to take a stand. It's always inspiring to see.

And no, it doesn't surprise me he's 15. Kids mature younger and younger, the older and older society gets, it seems to me. Still, we were fired up at 17, so it's not that different.

I wish him and them all the luck.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Sunday, December 19, 2010 5:53 AM

KANEMAN

Most children can't change their underpants let alone change the world. They should be spat on just for thinking they hold some power of change. So, children of the world, go do your homework, rake the yard, and make your fucking beds.....*spit*

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Sunday, December 19, 2010 9:50 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

By the way:

Quote:
The violent escalation of the student protests against the tuition fees hike in London shocked many people, and now one of Britain's top police chiefs is pondering the banning of future marches.

Sir Paul Stephenson, the Metropolitan Police Commissioner, is having to consider new strategies to combat violent groups and individuals who hijack student protests, especially after his own police force was criticized for containing, or "kettling," and assaulting innocent protesters. In a contradiction to the U.K.'s promotion of freedom of speech he has suggested banning protests, a move that observers say would leave the U.K. under a de facto state of martial law. "It is one of the tactics we will look at and something we will keep under review," said Sir Stephenson, "and if we think it is the right thing to do then we will do it," the Independent reports.

The most recent protest took place Dec. 15 and even more are expected to follow, despite the hike being passed by the U.K. Parliament on Dec. 9. One student who spoke to a TIME reporter during a protest (read about why they are protesting) compared the struggle to the riots against the Poll Tax in the early 1990's and said that, "this isn't the end" and, "we will continue to fight it." Martial law would apprehend the student voice, which has historically been conveyed by protest, or as Aaron Porter, the Student Union President puts it, "Peaceful protest is an integral part of our heritage and it is the responsibility of the police to help facilitate that."

Many oppose the violence spurred by the protests, but even Mr Stephenson acknowledges that a ban could "inflame" the situation.

http://newsfeed.time.com/2010/12/17/could-student-protest-violence-lea
d-to-martial-law-in-the-u-k/#ixzz18aYY4qw9

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Sunday, December 19, 2010 4:57 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Anyone who goes to the powers that be and begs "permission" to protest is a fucking wimp I wouldn't want on my side anyways.

Once again, you have no rights you are not willing to *enforce*, and when someone intentionally and purposely violates them, I think meekly surrendering is not only pathetic, but actual collaboration and enabling - you fuck with someones right to peaceably assemble, to be left alone, to not be arbitrarily searched and fondled, I think it's not only reasonable, but morally imperative to resist to ones full ability to do so, because to do less just validates the belief that you and yours will knuckle under when they wave the batons at you, and that is the WRONG message to send.

That's why VI hasn't supported an american protest since 1999, cause if you're gonna run like a bitch, or throw yourself at their feet and whine and beg for mercy, all you do is support the idea that using force against you works.
(Although we did do medevac and field support for a couple)

Wouldn't it be right interesting if protestors got the idea of performing a citizens arrest on police who committed felony civil rights violations within their sight, especially if they have full video and other documentation - while yes, it prolly would get ugly, how the court system chose to handle that would probably seriously inflame the public, and if they did wind up letting the officer in question swing at the windy corner to avoid that, it would engender a certain reluctance on behalf of the rest of em to continue taking such orders, wouldn't it ?

Just musing, is all, cause I still think conventional protest is no longer a viable tactic in the modern era, but if yer gonna do it, then freakin do it - factually, the Watts Riots did more for civil rights than years of rhetoric, something no one else seems keen on admitting.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Monday, December 20, 2010 12:34 PM

DREAMTROVE

Amen to that, Frem

Also, you give me an idea.

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Monday, December 20, 2010 1:31 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Also, you give me an idea.

Well, yeah - that's the whole POINT to my verbosity to begin with, so.. gratifying.

Although Gus has said that if I ever DO go out there in the middle of a protest gone ugly with a megaphone to offer "useful advice" he's likely to shoot me hisself - my ability to wind up a riot out of people is kinda scary sometimes.

Oh, and speaking of kids, this is awesome.

Santa's visit brightens day for needy Muslim students in Dearborn
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20101218/NEWS02/101218
003/1320/Santa-visits-needy-Muslim-students&template=fullarticle

Way cool, since Santa is a cross-theology and mostly Pagan icon anyways, every belief all the way down to primitive harvest cycle beliefs has something similar, and the way we've ALL rolled em into one iconic figure gives me and the local UU a lot of hope for that sorta thing.

Jims a great guy, not that it stops the little mungers from poking me and demanding candy - seriously, HOW do they KNOW?!
*laughs*

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Monday, December 20, 2010 1:55 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
... factually, the Watts Riots did more for civil rights than years of rhetoric, something no one else seems keen on admitting.

Yup, and the Rodney King riots did more to focus the attention of the nation on how inner-city blacks were treated than just about anything else ever had. For years - generations, even - black people had told the stories of how the police treated and mistreated them, but nobody would do anything about it. Then Rodney King's beating at the hands of the police was caught on tape, and there it was, right under everyone's nose: Proof.

When those pigs - and I don't use that word often, but it applies to those fucking worthless bastards - were acquitted, the riots were inevitable. I just wish they'd chosen their targets better.

Governments and their "enforcers" will do whatever they can get away with. And once in a while the people rise up en masse and tell them "THIS FAR, AND NOT ONE INCH FURTHER!"

When I say I hear the blades being sharpened late at night, I'm not kidding. I just really hope when the lit match hits the powderkeg, it blows up in the gated communities this time. Maybe it's time the rich were reminded that they have so much more to lose than the rest of us.

This Space For Rent!

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