Bouffant Nation by AURaptor

Actually, I cut my own hair. I employee people because I have a business, not because I consume. Screw Keynes. The economy runs best when the fewest jobs are created. More jobs means more work required to run society. The more free labor that is available, the cheaper the labor and the more new tasks that can be done.

Oh screw it, I just agree with you on this.

When the local govt. debates the budget, anything that is their own revenue, they take very seriously about how it should be spent. When it's state aid, they actually *try* to waste it, because if they don't spend it all, their allotment goes down.

Govt. doesn't have an incentive *not* to waste.

I've been noticing lately how poorly societies that accept any kind of outside help do vs. those that do not (look at Ireland) but even locally. It seems to be a universal rule. If you do it for yourself (like Iran) you boost your own ability to take care of yourself.

Actually, on that note, apply this logic: I support Israel for personal reasons, but they could earn my respect more by rejecting American aid. People make a lot of noise about it, but really, it's a drop in the bucket to Israel, they don't need it, and the US uses that aid to dictate policy. Israel should refuse it.

And yeah, I support Iran because they work their asses off and ask for nothing.

I don't support N. Korea because whenever it wants something, it asks momma China to fork it over, on the backs of Chinese workers and taxpayers.

This is where a lot of my foreign policy attitudes come from. If you take care of your own and don't expect someone else to take care of you, then you deserve a little respect.

Here's someone else that has earned my respect: The Amish. They opt out of our society, but they pay their own bills, grow their own food, build their own houses and buy their own land. Nothing to argue with there. The only interaction they really have with us is to sell us stuff.

That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 15, 2011 8:27 PM

KANEMAN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Bouffant Nation

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You probably don’t think of yourself as an employer, but you are: you create a job every time you hire someone to cut your hair. So let me ask you something: why do you create that job?

Do you create that job to help the economy recover? Do you create that job to reduce the unemployment rate among stylists? Do you create that job to correct a trade imbalance? Do you get your hair cut more often because President Obama or Governor Walker wants to create more jobs?

Would you get twice as many haircuts to earn a $5 rebate from the government? Would you go get yourself a B52-style bouffant if the government paid half through cash-for-coifs? If your state put a $100 tax on each haircut, would you pay it or create that job across the state line where there is no haircut tax? See - this employer stuff is not so complicated.

Unless you are a muttonhead, you only hire someone to cut your hair because you need a haircut – keyword need. And you hire a stylist with skills that meet your requirements – keyword skills. And you hire someone you can afford – keyword afford.

Job creation only happens when those three things come together: demand, skill, and price. No demand, no jobs; no skilled workers, no jobs; too pricey, no jobs. Can government compel those three things to heel? I think you know.

Government fiscal and monetary policy can do little to stimulate demand, as the past three years under both President Obama and President Bush have demonstrated. All the Keynesian multipliers in the universe cannot make your hair grow any faster, and deficit spending merely borrows from Friday to make Monday’s appointments more expensive. See - economics isn’t that complicated, either.

Government schools have diminished employable skills – reading, math, courtesy, ambition, competitive drive, achievement, standards, loyalty, discipline, accountability, respect – for decades. Government Affirmative Action programs and feel-good academic silliness have dumbed-down standards for college entrance tests, civil service exams, and professional certifications, diluting skills to achieve dubious social engineering objectives.

Government’s economic interventions almost always increase the price of labor. Regulation, taxation, unionization, and protectionism all add costs, but do not add any value.

So if government can not create demand, improve skills, or make labor more affordable, what can it do to help the private sector create jobs?

Watch it. Stand back and leave it alone; take as little as possible in the way of taxes, regulate only enough to make regular, and protect the sanctity of the exchange instead of picking winners and losers. Did you need government intervention to get your last haircut? Can you imagine how hideous a one-size-fits-all government-issued haircut would look like?

When this nation was founded, 95 out of 100 Americans grew food to feed themselves and the other 5. Today, with modern farm equipment and chemicals, 3 out of 100 Americans feed the whole nation and a good bit of the rest of the world. The industrialization of America spanned two centuries; the de-industrialization is occurring at a much faster pace. Since 2000, manufacturing employment has dropped by 63% to just over 11 million. And government has grown to 22.5 million and unemployment to over 15 million.

Our great-grandparents left the farm to work in the factories. Where will our kids go to make their dreams come true – the DMV? Subway? Paychex? Is the future going to be 10 of us driving around in Volts writing up carbon violations against the 3 of us that make windmill parts to fill up a warehouse until the tax subsidies run out and the Dutch owners close up shop? That seems to be the Obama/Biden vision. And trains, because…well, because.

The difference between the 19th century and the 21st century is that federal, state, and local government back then consumed less than 10% of GDP, so free enterprise was 90% free. Today, our runaway government spends over 60% of GDP, nags and nannies us to death, and deprives us of the energy we need to sustain our living standards based on a superstition that honest science has already abandoned.

Should we wonder why the recovery didn’t come again this time around like the Easter Bunny always does? The more our governments do to “help”, the more we prolong the deep recession and high rates of joblessness we have become mired in. You can’t be for jobs and against the corporations that provide them.

And we cannot just be Bouffant Nation, where the Fed prints scads of money and we all cut each other’s hair. We need to invent things here, to make them here, and to export them from here all over the world. That takes energy, a skilled workforce, sound money, and less government than we have now – a lot less.

The trick to free enterprise is the “free” part. Get government out of the way and we will quickly discover that American ingenuity did not die; it has been napping until the day when it can again thrive free of government interference.

“Moment Of Clarity” is a weekly commentary by Libertarian writer and speaker Tim Nerenz, Ph.D. Visit Tim’s website www.timnerenz.com to find your moment and order his new book, “Tooth Fairy Government.”

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

Fantasic...it will be lost on many here...you know that?

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 15, 2011 8:30 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Hmmmmm, the government here developed a stimulus package to boost the economy at the start of the GFC. Guess it worked, seeing as though we are one of the few nations still experiencing economic growth.

*raspberry*

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 2:00 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Hmmmmm, the government here developed a stimulus package to boost the economy at the start of the GFC. Guess it worked, seeing as though we are one of the few nations still experiencing economic growth.

*raspberry*

And wet streets cause it to rain.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 4:09 AM

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Quote:
Government schools have diminished employable skills – reading, math, courtesy, ambition, competitive drive, achievement, standards, loyalty, discipline, accountability, respect – for decades.

Apparently the author went to a "government school", then, because he also seriously lacks the ability to do any research or reading on the matters he chooses to comment on.

High school education rates in this nation were at below 6% in 1900, and above 85% by 1985, and haven't gone down since.

But according to the author, "employable skills" (and are courtesy, ambition, and loyalty really "skills", or are they character traits?), have been on the decline for decades.

So he's saying Obama *ISN'T* responsible for the high unemployment rate, right?

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 5:05 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Some people still believe the world is 4000 years old. They keep telling themselves the same ol lies because it suits them, despite evidence to the contrary. Have a nice day :)

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 5:17 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I think courtesy is definitely a skill. It takes a great deal of practice and honing of will. I am constantly struggling with myself in attempts to develop this skill. I do not think I have the innate talent for it. That having been said, the *desire* to be courteous cannot be trained. The desire must come from within for any training to be useful.

I can endorse the fact that ambition is not a skill. You can 'whip' someone into paying lip-service about ambition, or give them ulcers over their lack of ambition and what to do about it. Some cultures, for instance, are rife with social pressure to be ambitious and succeed. But true ambition seems to spawn from within. Those that don't have that inner drive, or fall short of expectation, seem more likely to suicide.

Loyalty is best when it is not a skill, though it can become learned behavior. Like Teamwork.

I think the people who are most Loyal are the ones who did not have to learn the value of loyalty through 'training,' but rather absorbed its importance through life experience.

In any event, I do not think any serious student of history would fail to ascribe some value to public education. One can debate whether it was better in 1950 or today, but one can not debate whether it was better in 1700 or today.

--Anthony

Assured by friends that the signal-to-noise ratio has improved on this forum, I have disabled web filtering.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 6:08 AM

Quote:
Government Affirmative Action programs and feel-good academic silliness have dumbed-down standards for college entrance tests, civil service exams, and professional certifications, diluting skills to achieve dubious social engineering objectives.

I'd be curious to know where this "doctor" got his doctorate. I certainly *hope* it didn't come from one of those diploma mills with dumbed-down professional certifications! Or, fates forbid, a STATE school of some sort, or a school that ever received even a penny of public (taxpayer) funding.

Because then he'd have to utterly dismiss even his own esteemed "wisdom".

One thing is clear from his babbling and incoherence, though: he didn't get his doctorate in economics.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 7:06 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Some people still believe the world is 4000 years old. They keep telling themselves the same ol lies because it suits them, despite evidence to the contrary. Have a nice day :)

I'd ask " what evidence ", but then that'd be swaying away from the topic of the thread.

The Earth is about 4.6 billion yrs old.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 7:07 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:

I'd be curious to know where this "doctor" got his doctorate. I certainly *hope* it didn't come from one of those diploma mills with dumbed-down professional certifications! Or, fates forbid, a STATE school of some sort, or a school that ever received even a penny of public (taxpayer) funding.

Because then he'd have to utterly dismiss even his own esteemed "wisdom".

One thing is clear from his babbling and incoherence, though: he didn't get his doctorate in economics.

Saul Alinksy - 101.

Crassic.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 7:19 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The Earth in about 4.6 billion yrs old.

It in?

Crassic.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 7:20 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:

I'd be curious to know where this "doctor" got his doctorate. I certainly *hope* it didn't come from one of those diploma mills with dumbed-down professional certifications! Or, fates forbid, a STATE school of some sort, or a school that ever received even a penny of public (taxpayer) funding.

Because then he'd have to utterly dismiss even his own esteemed "wisdom".

One thing is clear from his babbling and incoherence, though: he didn't get his doctorate in economics.

Saul Alinksy - 101.

Crassic.

Who?

Remember that thing where I pointed out that you seem serially incapable of learning to correct the exact same "typo" when you make it over and over and over again?h

You're doing it again. You seem to want to claim some knowledge of tactics by someone named "Alinksy", but the i-net doesn't turn up such a person. If you're going to cite the guy (whom you've apparently read much more from than I have, since I've never read his works, but you seem quite familiar with them), you should probably learn his name. Go look it up; Google will auto-correct it for you. ;)

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 7:27 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The Earth in about 4.6 billion yrs old.

It in?

Crassic.

A common intentional misspelling, to make fun of something something blah blah.....

When others do it, it's a typo, but when Kwickie does it, it's intentional.

lame.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 7:56 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Rappy, the person you quoted apparently doesn't understand much about economics. I'm kind of busy today, so I didn't get too far into this piece of crap before I thought "Now wait a minute!" so I'm going to just address the very first thing I stumbled over.

Quote:
Job creation only happens when those three things come together: demand, skill, and price. No demand, no jobs; no skilled workers, no jobs; too pricey, no jobs. Can government compel those three things to heel? I think you know.

Government fiscal and monetary policy can do little to stimulate demand, as the past three years under both President Obama and President Bush have demonstrated. All the Keynesian multipliers in the universe cannot make your hair grow any faster, and deficit spending merely borrows from Friday to make Monday’s appointments more expensive. See - economics isn’t that complicated, either.

First of all, he includes the same factor twice: "demand" and "price". It is a plain fact of economics that demand and price depend on each other. But let's assume he didn't mean "demand", let's assume he meant what he originally said, which was "need". And let's not conflate the two. So we can say that people "need" things: air, water, shelter, food, clothes... even haircuts. However, as long as people have NO MONEY to PAY for these needs, there will be no "demand", economically-speaking. So looking at housing as an example, even if there is a large influx of immigrants into a city, while the theoretical "need" for housing goes up, the "demand" may not go up much at all, simply because the people may be too poor to pay. So they will live 20 to a room, the landlord gets paid, but not nearly as much as if each one could afford their own room.

How CAN you stimulate demand? Keynes realized that the reason why the economy was slowing down was because money was concentrating in the hands of a few. Therefore, the vast majority could no longer afford apartments, clothes, food, washing machines... all of the goods and services that are the fundamental basis of an economy". Although the "need" was there, the "demand" was low because there was no money behind it. He thought that if you increased the money supply and injected it AT THE BOTTOM you could improve DEMAND and because of that you would increase JOBS. In addition, he introduced the idea of widespread consumer debt. And the answer is, it DID work. There is a cost, of course, and that cost is "inflation", which acts as a hidden tax on those who hold a lot of currency. What Keynes proposed was a compromise: a system which would keep capitalism going, which the wealthy might not grumble about too much. The clean answer to the loss of demand would be politically too expensive.

But if you inject new money AT THE TOP as George Bush and Obama did... into the investment banks, hedge funds, insurance companies and large corporations... "demand" doesn't rise. People STILL can't afford houses, haircuts, cars, and food. Nonetheless, the cost is still inflation..

... Now with bubbles!

You have the worst of both worlds.

In order to improve demand and increase the number of jobs without incurring inflation or debt, there is only one answer: straightforward income redistribution. During the Eisenhower era, when America was enjoying an unprecedented economic boom, the top tax rate was 90% and wealth was aggressively redistributed.

Of course, as much sense as it makes, economically-speaking, that will never happen.

See? Economics IS simple!

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 8:03 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The Earth in about 4.6 billion yrs old.

It in?

Crassic.

A common intentional misspelling, to make fun of something something blah blah.....

When others do it, it's a typo, but when Kwickie does it, it's intentional.

lame.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

Hello,

I'm fairly certain you made a typo, Raptor, since there is no value in misspelling 'is.' It would be better to admit the truth, and also say that it has nothing to do with your argument.

I find the spelling debates tedious. We all make mistakes. Mr. Raptor's arguments are not invalidated because of his spelling. They stand on their own merit.

--Anthony

Assured by friends that the signal-to-noise ratio has improved on this forum, I have disabled web filtering.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 8:40 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.

Quote:
See - economics isn’t that complicated

I worry about people whose qualification is not in economics making that kind of statement.

It's not personal. It's just war.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 9:23 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:I'm fairly certain you made a typo, Raptor, since there is no value in misspelling 'is.' It would be better to admit the truth, and also say that it has nothing to do with your argument.

I find the spelling debates tedious. We all make mistakes. Mr. Raptor's arguments are not invalidated because of his spelling. They stand on their own merit.

--Anthony

Of course, *I* made a mistake. But when kwickie does it, it's on purpose.

And you're right, kwickie IS tedious.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 9:37 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

"Of course, *I* made a mistake. But when kwickie does it, it's on purpose."

Hello,

This is typically the case. But as I said, it has nothing to do with the validity of the arguments presented.

--Anthony

Assured by friends that the signal-to-noise ratio has improved on this forum, I have disabled web filtering.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 1:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Of course, *I* made a mistake. But when kwickie does it, it's on purpose.

Oh, hell - I make all kinds of mistakes. But spelling "Rules of teh Interwebz™" in exactly that fashion, with "the" spelled "teh", isn't one of them. Well, no more than your constant "missspelling" of "Crassic" is. ;) Expecting that you could figure out the "in-joke" of the misspelling, or that you wouldn't be a petty, petulant child about it, was probably a mistake. I know now that lack the ability to NOT be a petty child.

Quote:

And you're right, kwickie IS tedious.

Which is why you brought it up in the first place, yes? Just to be tedious?

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 2:00 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Isn't the right to be tedious enshrined in the constitution somewhere?

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 2:12 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Isn't the right to be tedious enshrined in the constitution somewhere?

Yes, in the First Amendment. :)

If you ever said "Support the Troops!", you are a socialist. You've taken money from me, by force and at gunpoint, and you've given it to people who are on a mission I don't support, and are murdering others in my name, and I am given no choice in the matter.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 2:57 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Isn't the right to be tedious enshrined in the constitution somewhere?

Yes, in the First Amendment. :)

Actually, the founders were talking about the freedom of political speech, and not mindless tedium.

But that's well above Kwickie's comprehension level. So there we have it.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 4:12 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Hmmm... noticed you had nothing substantive to say.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 4:44 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Hmmm... noticed you had nothing substantive to say.

Hmm ? Did you say something ?

Didn't think so.

You're asking me to dissect this guys article, and play along w/ your demand = price angle ?

Meh, not so inclined. I think the guy nailed it, pretty good. You don't. Shocker. If you have any issues, write him. I frankly could care less.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Saturday, April 16, 2011 5:05 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Actually, the founders were talking about the freedom of political speech, and not mindless tedium.

But that's well above Kwickie's comprehension level. So there we have it.

1) There's nothing more mindlessly tedious than political speech.

2) Congratulations on being able to correctly spell "comprehension". That's a new high point for you.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, April 17, 2011 2:11 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
You're asking me to dissect this guys article, and play along w/ your demand = price angle ?

MY "demand/price angle?"
Where have you been for the past 200 years of economic theory? Is it possible you think I made this up on my own just for this very thread? Did you manage to blather about economics without even having taken Econ 101 at your local JC??

Seems like someone needs remedial education! Fortunately, the internet is here to step in:

Quote:
Supply and demand is perhaps one of the most fundamental concepts of economics and it is the backbone of a market economy. (Something you claim to support, but apparently know nothing about) Demand refers to how much (quantity) of a product or service is desired by buyers. The quantity demanded is the amount of a product people are willing to buy at a certain price; the relationship between price and quantity demanded is known as the demand relationship. Supply represents how much the market can offer. The quantity supplied refers to the amount of a certain good producers are willing to supply when receiving a certain price. The correlation between price and how much of a good or service is supplied to the market is known as the supply relationship. Price, therefore, is a reflection of supply and demand.

There, SIMPLE econ 101. Don't come back till you've read it. It's really basic to understanding modern economic theory.

/ www.investopedia.com/university/economics/economics3.asp

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, April 17, 2011 6:00 AM

America loves a winner!

Know all about supply/demand, honey.

It's why goods go up in price when they're in scarce supply.

The author didn't dismiss or ignore that concept, so I don't know what your issue is.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, April 17, 2011 7:08 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Well then, where is your question?

Is it about the fact that poor people can't afford to buy things and therefore don't create demand, which leads to loss of jobs, which causes demand to fall further and then a self-sustaining downwards spiral?

Was THAT what you were wondering about?

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, April 17, 2011 9:04 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Oh, you don't have any questions. So apparently you agree with me!

Very good, then. Carry on!

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, April 17, 2011 9:04 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

I have my friend down the road come over and cut my hair, she's a beautician, I pay her a little more to come over and do it, plus she's my friend and we always go out to dinner afterwords with her twin sister, I'm friends with both of them.

I do indeed have a problem with the stance this article takes on public education.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Sunday, April 17, 2011 9:10 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

SignyM - you have to remember when you are dealing with Rap you are dealing with a brutally selfish mother-fucker whose biggest source of frustration is living in a society that requires he care if people live or die.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Monday, April 18, 2011 2:01 AM

Quote:
I do indeed have a problem with the stance this article takes on public education.

And there's the rub. Do some digging into "Doctor" Nerenz's education background, and you'll find that he got his MBA in Business from Athabasca University, a STATE-run school in Canada, and then got his PhD in Business from an online diploma mill out of Arizona.

Apparently this "doctor" has no trouble at all attending state schools on the state's dime - he just doesn't want anyone else to be able to benefit from the kind of education he received. Add to that the fact that he's just plain wrong in his conclusions and claims, and it casts serious doubts about his credibility on any subject he speaks of.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 1:32 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
SignyM - you have to remember when you are dealing with Rap you are dealing with a brutally selfish mother-fucker whose biggest source of frustration is living in a society that requires he care if people live or die.

And folks wonder why RWED has become little more than Troll Country II.

You have no point, no basis by which to toss your childish insults.

I have very valid and concrete reasons for my views, and when ever you're rationale enough to ever discuss such matters, feel free to drop the juvenile attitude and join in.

Or not.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 4:24 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Very valid and concrete reasons... Rappy, you have a plethora of "reasons" for your views, but I'm sorry to say that you have never come up with any that stood up to more than three or four exchanges-worth of discussion. For example, in this very thread I noticed that you never replied directly to my points although I replied directly to yours.

It's said we make our own worlds. Well, individually we don't, but we certainly make out own outlooks of them so I feel sorry for you, living as you do in a nightmare world of your own making. I'm here to tell you- it's not as dire as you think.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 4:39 AM

Rap and Mike, and everyone.

Not to be a scolding bumpkin or anything, but you're both part of the trolling, you tend to post contradiction to whatever the other posts. Sometimes it's just name calling.

Everyone should try to get over it and take each post as it comes, and if we know that a poster has a bias, try not to attack them for their bias, only mention when they have perhaps stepped out of line.

I have to mention a couple of recent posts that illustrate the difference between post and poster.

(sorry rap not meaning to single you out here, but you did bring it up, and I agree with your point here, but I have to use an example to illustrate the point and this one fits best)

Not too long ago, Auraptor posted something I considered as reprehensible as anything Pirate News has posted: The idea that if there was one al qaeda(1) suspect(2) at a wedding that it was okay to target that event(3) to teach a lesson(4) to those who would associate(5) with such people(6)

I put 6 footnotes here because each of them is by itself appalling

1) Al Qaeda is a made up name to refer to a collection of groups that are at times pro- or anti- US, and there are always some that are pro-US and they all switch sides. Rap knows this because he works in Military Intelligence.

2) Suspect? What happened to innocent until proven guilty. Al Qaeda suspect means that this is a person who is suspected for working for one of many organization characterized by international non-governmental muslim groups involved in both charity and militia action which may oppose or support the United States, or may be indifferent, whose position may have changed from time to time, while he was a member or wasn't, notwithstanding the timing of his membership, which itself is still not proven.

3) Acceptable civilian casualties based on loose suspicion of association? Acceptable known civilian casualties.

4) Teach people a lesson is rule by example, one of the pillars of communism.

5) Association, I want to add a third item up there, because this is what points 4 and 5 define:
c) Universal contamination

6) A policy of targeting Muslim weddings is pretty close to outright genocide.

Last muslim wedding I was at was a lot of fun. A lot of dancing blonde girls. People having a good time, who knew either the bride or the groom. They were all themselves civilians. They did not know one another prior to this event. Our "suspect" only need attend the event. He needn't be the groom.

Here's a little side story. That illustrates many of these ideas in action:

Someone in my family spent 20 years being torture in a prison because she went to the court to question the execution of her father. Her father had been killed the night after he had let an old friend from college he had known some decades earlier spend the night because he was passing through town. He was executed the next day for his hospitality, because, unbeknownst to him, the man had been labeled an "enemy of the state" by some bureaucrat under Mao.

This is the sort of policy Rap and at least one other were supporting, inherent in the statement.

I was appalled.

Then Rap posted a brilliant little video on the truth of human motivation. If I behaved in a universally opposing manner, I never would have watched the video. I would have missed out.

All of y'all are going to post things I disagree with. All of y'all will hopefully post things that impress me. I'm not here to troll or irritate you, and if I take the time to lash out at something, it's because I think this not something they should be promoting, and is perhaps not well thought out.

Pirate News posted "Let's Nuke Israel" I had to post a rant against that. I think Mince posted "PN, Gay marry me." Maybe that was a better response ;) Whatever. I want to say, that kind of position is out of line of what I would find acceptable, if they want me as an audience, they might want to think about that.

And it's up to the rest of you to pick out the singular rare statements that you would find unacceptable for a human to hold. I almost said rational, but even irrational. I'm not about to call Pirate News rational, but I do value his input, and I like the guy, regardless of what he might think of my ethnic group.

But if you guys just go on and oppose absolutely everything that someone says, then your criticism of what's truly appalling will be completely lost because it will carry no weight, because you will have the become the boy (or girl) who cried Wulf!

That's all I got. Keep it shiny.

That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 5:00 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Yeah, but Rappy still hasn't answered me, and I posted what I thought was a very reasonable response.

It's rappy's stubborn adherence to his ideas and rampant lack of logic and fact that drives people crazy, not any particular position he holds. He's just sane enough and functional enough for people to want to try to talk to him, but not SO sane and functional that he can actually think about what's been proposed. (Same with Wulf, but Wulf has PTSD so people know what to expect).

Rappy is a True Believer, just like the bible-thumpers who come to your door, except he's carrying Atlas Shrugged and suggesting that you- as an inferior being (a "moocher")- should agree to be mowed down to create his perfect world. And, like all True Believers, rejection only make him stronger in his faith. That's why he keeps coming back here: For his fix, one more chance to rail against an unbelieving world.

I don't know what happened to him as a child to cause such awful fear... so awful he has to cling to delusions to assuage it... but it must have been horrible. Whatever it was, it has taken its toll on any semblance of rationality. The man is only a shell of a thinking being and should be treated with compassion.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 5:22 AM

Sorry Sig, I was reacting to the overall trolling on the board which has been escalating. It comes and goes, but it was gone, and now it's back on the rise. Your post hadn't appeared, I was responding to Rap, and using his own posts and responses so as to be completely consistent and not blame anyone for it.

Rap made a good point, so I used him to illustrate it. I may have gotten carried away about the bombing of weddings, I don't even think that was Rap's post originally, I think he was agreeing with someone else who suggested it but I don't want to guess.

That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 5:34 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Well, I've been part of that trolling. I guess this is my request to others to read Rappy's post with compassion it deserves, not with the fear and anger that he desires.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 6:46 AM

BYTEMITE

There's a reason I don't normally post on threads like these, and it isn't because of who the OP is. Things around here sometimes take a turn, and maybe that's what the RWED is, but it also turns people away from wanting to talk, discuss, communicate.

There are rare times I'll try to mediate between two people who are fighting, but most of the time, if personal fights start up, I just lurk and vanish. I know the board will still be here, and the same people I see every day will still be here. But I also know, sadly, that it's going to be very rare to see new people wander in here.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 1:44 PM

Perhaps we can all just stop for a moment before we post and ask ourselves "Am I just posting because I disagree?" If I am, then I'm probably trolling, or well on the road.

If it's a debate, then you have two people interested in discussing the solution to a problem, or its details and underlying fact. Rap-Mike debates often remind me of the Faulty Towers skit with the German customer, or perhaps some Marx brothers routines. The whole did too, did not, sort of thing.

I try to stop and ask myself whether my posting is doing anything other than wasting my own time. If I'm not sure, it's probably best that I don't post.

That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 2:17 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Yeah, but Rappy still hasn't answered me, and I posted what I thought was a very reasonable response.

Answered what , exactly? Busy these days, not in the mood to scan back through various threads and such to find what ever it is you're on about now...

Repeat, please, if you'd like me to answer something specific.

Or not... no skin off my nose.

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 2:37 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

I think DT is right that everyone will have things to say that we agree with and disagree with. True I skip over any Pirate News post with Jew in the title, but I do give his other stuff a chance at least. I think even Signe, Raptor and Quicko could find something in this world that they all have in common, hey, they all like Firefly, good start! So much as some might like to say it there is no one that you have absolutely nothing in common with. SImilarly there is no one who you will have everything in common with. Byte and I are good friends and we have some things in common, but we also have variant opinions on a lot of things too. That's just how life goes.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 3:40 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Pffth, way I see it, if ya posted it in RWED, you're inviting comment to it, and since this isn't some heavy handed place where conflicting opinions get silenced, if folks disagree, they're gonna disagree - and if you wanna back the point you have to have all your ducks in a row and be able to coherently and consistently argue it, or else you're gonna look like a damn fool, since there's no jackboot moderator to come running to your rescue with the ban hammer when you happen to be having your ass handed to you.

And yanno what ?

I LIKE IT THAT WAY.

Fair enough ?

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 4:17 PM

BYTEMITE

Moderators are really terrible. Every board I've ever been at that had moderators crashed and burned because a moderator got power crazy. Some were immediate. Some took longer than others, but there were underlying fights and grudges on the board that would simmer for years, and the ultimate unravel would always trace directly back to an initial power mad incident.

Haken's hands off approach really is the best method for any internet based forum for communication. There are some minor features or apps that could make the thread display smoother, my understanding is Haken is already aware of them and working on the coding.

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | TOP | HOME

Friday, April 22, 2011 5:38 PM