REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Casey Anthony is innocent...really?

POSTED BY: OPPYH
UPDATED: Monday, July 11, 2011 18:31
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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 3:15 PM

OPPYH


Well, she beat the system.
If this were a 25 year old male with the same predicament, do you think he would have walked?
I'm no Nancy Grace, but I am a bit upset with the outcome.

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70's TV FOREVER


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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 3:35 PM

THEHAPPYTRADER


Casey Anthony certainly seems like a pretty terrible person, and there is a lot of suspicious/shady behavior that has no doubt been played up by the media, but from what I understand there was little to no evidence that wasn't entirely circumstantial. I'm uncomfortable with the thought of a conviction based off of how much we don't like the suspect.

She may very well be guilty, but I'd rather see 10 guilty go free than see one innocent punished. I believe if she is guilty, she'll get what's owed her one way or the other.

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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 3:45 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by OPPYH:
Well, she beat the system.
If this were a 25 year old male with the same predicament, do you think he would have walked?



OJ walked. Not 25, but still.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 3:59 PM

BYTEMITE


A jury of her peers found that there was not sufficient evidence to convict her, and from what I've heard all the evidence provided was circumstantial. Both lawyers made a mockery of justice and truth, as was their idiom, and I don't blame a jury for throwing up their hands and saying "all of you are full of it, get out of our faces, we missed our fourth of July BBQs for this."

Perhaps it's because I don't have children, and never will, but I also found the amount of assumed guilt in this case disturbing. Many people hearing about this girl seemed to be out for blood. She's only 25. If they did kill her or lock her away, what a pointless waste of resources, and if they didn't, a pointless waste of tax dollars.

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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 4:15 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Not Guilty of 1st degree murder was obvious from Day 1 for anyone who looked at the evidence and law, as the jury was held hostage to do for several months.

If the psycho prosecutor had done his real job, he might have charged involuntary manslaughter for accidental death by chloroform, and she might have pled to probation. The prosecutor immediately resigned from the DA's office after the verdict.

This case was a mind control psyop by Nancy Disgrace and Co, to divert apathy from the Genocidal Wars killing children, Weather Wars and Ethnic Clensing by fire/flood/nukes killing kids in USA, Bilderburg Group child sacrifice cult, Bohemian Grove child sacrifice cult, and Dictator Hussein Obama's lack of birth certificate (according to the governor of Hawaii and US Supreme Court). How many babies has Obama killed?

This case made the multinational media mafiya look like the boobs they are, and elevated the alternative media another notch up in public opinion.

Quote:

"Most of the people will have died and the rest of us will be cannibals. We're too many people; that's why we have global warming. Everybody in the world's got to pledge to themselves to one or two children. Communist China just wants to sell us shoes. They're not building landing craft to attack the United States, and Russia wants to be our friends, too. It's been a long time since anybody caught me saying something stupid. A total population of 250-300 million people, a 95% decline from present levels, would be ideal."
-Ted Turner, bi-polar founder of CNN News who was paid $3-billion salary tax-free in one day and owns 1,910,000 acres (more land in USA than any other US citizen), father of 5 kids, Bilderberg Secret Society)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1070329053600562261

"The most stunning statistic, however, is that the total number of deaths caused by conventional medicine is an astounding 783,936 per year. It is now evident that the American medical system is the leading cause of death and injury in the US. Using Leape's 1997 medical and drug error rate would add another 216,000 deaths, for a total of 999,936 deaths annually. Our estimated 10-year total of 7.8 million iatrogenic* deaths is more than all the casualties from all the wars fought by the US throughout its entire history. Our considerably higher figure is equivalent to six jumbo jets are falling out of the sky each day."
—Gary Null, PhD; Carolyn Dean MD, ND; Martin Feldman, MD; Debora Rasio, MD; Dorothy Smith, PhD, "Death by Medicine", March 2004 (plus 1-Million annual aborticides in USA)
http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2004/mar2004_awsi_death_01.htm

"'People are too trusting, people don't ask the right questions.' Sometimes, being too trusting was equated with being too dumb. But sometimes when he would say that and say, 'People don't ask the right questions,' it was almost with a sense of regret, as if he were uneasy with what he was part of, and wished that people would challenge it and maybe not be so trusting."
-Dr. Lawrence Dunegan MD, quoting Dr. Richard Day MD who was director of a corporation paid $1-billion by the U.S. Govt to successfully genocide 100-million U.S. citizens, New Order of the Barbarians
http://100777.com/nwo/barbarians

“The birth-rate of the Non-Jews has to be suppressed massively.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, Zohar II, 4b

"And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Again, thou shalt say to the children of Israel, Whosoever he be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn in Israel, that giveth any of his seed unto Molech; he shall surely be put to death: the people of the land shall stone him with stones. And I will set my face against that man, and will cut him off from among his people; because he hath given of his seed unto Molech, to defile my sanctuary, and to profane my holy name. And if the people of the land do any ways hide their eyes from the man, when he giveth of his seed unto Molech, and kill him not: Then I will set my face against that man, and against his family, and will cut him off, and all that go a whoring after him, to commit whoredom with Molech, from among their people."
-Leviticus 20:1-5, Christian Bible KJV and Jewish Torah

"And Solomon did evil in the sight of the LORD, and went not fully after the LORD, as did David his father. Then did Solomon build an high place for Chemosh, the abomination of Moab, in the hill that is before Jerusalem, and for Molech, the abomination of the children of Ammon."
-1 Kings 11:6-7, Christian Bible KJV and Jewish Torah (Luciferian Star of Soloman is the jewish symbol and Israeli flag)




Your politicians, judges and media tycoons celebrating snuff kiddie porn to Jewish Molech

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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 4:15 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Seriously, as Jayne said... .I saw it comin'.


As miserable a POS as this slut is, the state never had any hard evidence on her.

No confession, no eye witness, no direct, solid physical evidence. Just a bunch of lying, white trash Florida dirt bags.

I don't know if her dad or brother sexually molested her, but I know the defense didn't mention any of that in the closing arguments.


And if she writes a tell all book, and confesses, there's not a damn thing anyone can do about it. Not legally, at least.

Sad thing is, she'll make a lot of $ from idiots who'll buy her book, watch the made for t.v. movie, etc...

And what justice for Caylee ?

None. That's what.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 4:36 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!



Not Guilty on the 4th of July

Is she crazy?

Yes, with PTSD from the death of her child that she loved, and after spending 3 years in jail without a conviction due to unconstitutionally excessive bail.



Is she a famous hottie soon to be rich with millions of admirers?

Yes. Amazing after 3 years in a Police State death camp gulag and 3 months torture in court.

Is Nancy Grace a scary dyke bitch in a wig?



I rest my case.

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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 4:55 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


The jury didn't find her "innocent", did they? I thought they found her "not guilty".

Subtle difference, but it matters.

She may not be guilty in a court of law, but she's far from innocent.

She says she wants to settle down and have another baby. That should go well.

She's pure Whiskey Tango, as are her parents. They deserve each other.

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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 5:29 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Casey Anthony's Attorney Gives Media The Middle Finger
http://realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/07/06/casey_anthonys_defense_l
awyer_gives_media_the_middle_finger.html


Plenty of that to go around:


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Wednesday, July 6, 2011 8:33 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by TheHappyTrader:
Casey Anthony certainly seems like a pretty terrible person, and there is a lot of suspicious/shady behavior that has no doubt been played up by the media, but from what I understand there was little to no evidence that wasn't entirely circumstantial. I'm uncomfortable with the thought of a conviction based off of how much we don't like the suspect.

She may very well be guilty, but I'd rather see 10 guilty go free than see one innocent punished. I believe if she is guilty, she'll get what's owed her one way or the other.


And *I* have nothing further to say on the matter, since someone else did it damn near verbatim, leaving me naught to do but confirm that I share that opinion.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Thursday, July 7, 2011 5:48 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Ironically, I agree with PN, on one point anyway:
Quote:

If the psycho prosecutor had done his real job, he might have charged involuntary manslaughter
Beyond that, what I've been hearing is that the jury HATED acquitting her, but accepted that there wasn't enough evidence to convict. Several have spoken up and said so, and have described how hard it was for them to do so, including that some people cried about their predicament.

I didn't follow the trial, as I don't follow a lot of the drama the MSM decides we should be watching every minute, so I don't know. But it sounds to me like the jury spent a lot of time on the issues and that they recognized that, despite their own feelings, if there wasn't enough evidence they legally COULDN'T convict. That both saddens and makes me feel good. It saddens me that maybe she got off when she's actually guilty, but it makes me feel good that the legal system worked in this case and that the people on the jury didn't go with their feelings, but accepted they had to abide by the law. The latter is the stronger feeling, for me, because (although I recognize it doesn't work that way that often) it means that were I to stand trial for something, maybe the jury would look to the evidence and there's less chance of a wrong verdict.

I agree, too; I'd rather have one guilty person go free than see innocent people wrongly convicted. Her karma will get her in the end, if not in this life, in the next; she may well come back as a bug or something and then we could squash her.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Thursday, July 7, 2011 11:04 AM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I think Happy did a good concise job.

I see this as being like the OJ case. We're all pretty sure she did it, but there isn't enough solid evidence to convict her, so we can't convict her, even if we want to. If we can't prove that she did it then we can't convict her. I agree though that she's luh suh and I think she probably did do it, or had someone else do it for her.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Thursday, July 7, 2011 1:30 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)



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Friday, July 8, 2011 5:09 AM

HKCAVALIER


Hey Mike,

I really don't think connecting the Casey Anthony trial to the O.J. trial is valid. O.J. was a huge and beloved celebrity going in. And he had a hell of a lot of support in the African American community, for instance, that complicated the whole thing. And the cops on the case were racist.

Casey Anthony, from what I've been able to glean in the past couple days (didn't follow the trial) had next to no support outside of her lawyer. I'm only catching up on the trial now, but so far I've been utterly astonished at the raw hatred Ms. Anthony has inspired in every commentator I've seen. There is never any doubt in the media's mind that she is guilty and everyone else in her family is some kind of martyr. Every story, every report is slanted in an all too predictable direction. What the eff happened to journalistic neutrality??? Across the board their treatment of her is smarmy and hysterical.

Here's one example of the specious lengths folk will go to vilify the woman:



If Casey Anthony is a psychopath based on those letters, then every third angry abused teenage girl in American is a psychopath. And what is up with everyone demanding she be killed? Death penalty, death penalty, rah rah rah! It's disturbing as hell to me.

O.J. had an infamously clever attorney in Johnnie Cochran who manipulated the jury masterfully. Whereas, Anthony's lawyer was vastly inexperienced and not terribly clever or competent as far as I've seen (best argument that the verdict was legitimate there--when your lawyer is a bumbling rookie and you WIN anyway, well...hmmmmmmm).

The prosecution could not establish motive or produce a murder weapon. They couldn't even establish the cause of the poor child's death. And based on so utterly flimsy a case they were pushing for the death penalty??? What the HELL did they think they were doing trying this case under such conditions?

I'm also disturbed that no one, besides her lawyer, seems to have taken the sexual abuse stuff seriously for a second. No one even questions Casey's father, far as I've seen. That's weird. His grandstanding bravado about his grand daughter has seemed off to me. And if he is a pedophile, his attempted suicide in the midst of the trial is extraordinarily typical. In that light, his saying that he tried to kill himself because "it was time to be with Caylee" is plain creepy. So, anyway, my personal jury is out on the father so far--the whole family seems pretty untrustworthy.

When are folks going to understand that the kind of violence and abuse we see in this case is multi-generational. If her father molested her, it doesn't mean she didn't kill her child at all. It just means that the case is a lot more complicated than "that slut needs to die!"

And so far, I've not been able to find out what the exact wording on her tattoo is. If it is "La vita è bella" (Life is beautiful) as some sources say, then it's not just some random "Let's party!" phrase but the title of a holocaust movie about a parent who sacrifices himself to the Fascists to save his child. Doesn't proclaim her innocence, but it sure does imply to me that her family life is a gorram nightmare.

Anyway, just my thoughts on the case so far.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, July 8, 2011 7:32 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Cav, I agree with the pre-judging that's gone on, tho' what I've seen of it has been from the PUBLIC, not as much the media. I didn't follow the case much myself, just bounced across mention of it from time to time, but there's no question in my mind that the public has condemned her, and I'm pretty impressed that the jury went against their beliefs and held to the letter of the law instead. Didn't think that happened anymore.

Saw on the news last night that some establishment or other had a big sign out front to the effect that jurors in the Anthony case would not be served there, and I've seen the signs and placards out there; it sickens me too.
Quote:

What the eff happened to journalistic neutrality?
Oh, darlin', you thought it had only died recently? (/snark) It's been "infotainment" for ages now, I don't think anyone even EXPECTS neutrality or even integrity from the MSM anymore.

Interestingly, tho', when I've bumped across it on the news--various stations, including CNN--what I've heard is discussions about the trial itself, and little if any commentary or judgment of Casey herself. A bit has been there, but nothing like what you mentioned; can you give me examples of some of where you've heard this stuff? I'd be most interested in hearing.

And, of course, in the final analysis she was never found "innocent", there's a big difference between that and not being able to convict because the case hadn't been proven, not that there's much comfort in that!


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Friday, July 8, 2011 8:28 AM

HARDWARE


Both the Simpson and Anthony trials had something in common. Prosecutions that failed to establish in the mind of the jury, guilt beyond reasonable doubt.

The jury sees less evidence than what is presented on the infotainment stations. If you'd have trusted them to come back with a guilty verdict you have to trust them when they come back with a not guilty verdict.

It is a truism that almost any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so, and will follow it by suppressing opposition, subverting all education to seize early the minds of the young, and by killing, locking up, or driving underground all heretics - RAH

...and he that has no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. Luke 22:36

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Friday, July 8, 2011 10:51 AM

OPPYH


Quote:

Originally posted by HKCavalier:


The prosecution could not establish motive or produce a murder weapon. They couldn't even establish the cause of the poor child's death. And based on so utterly flimsy a case they were pushing for the death penalty??? What the HELL did they think they were doing trying this case under such conditions?




Yes, but the suspicious behavior she displayed was enough to prove her guilty. If not in a court of law then in the general public minds.
1.Her child is missing, she doesn't report it for 30 days=guilty
2.When she is under suspicion, she tells a tale that is completely wild, and far-fetched about a baby sitter(ZANIDA) that took the child. The baby sitter as it turns out does not exist=guilty.

If she is innocent.....WHY DIDN"T SHE TELL THE POLICE WHAT THEY WANTED TO KNOW?
Not sure where your from, but when someone lies compulsively, and is evasive and slippery about common sense facts, they are usually hiding something.

And as far as covering for her father....give me a break. She would have thrown him under the bus the minute she stepped in jail(as proven by her claims) to get out of there.


She was covering up for no one. She killed her daughter either intentionally, or unintentionally.

She is guilty, but the lack of evidence against her set her free.





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70's TV FOREVER

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Friday, July 8, 2011 11:19 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Just playing devil's advocate here: "she tells a tale that is completely wild, and far-fetched"--mental illness could attribute for confusion, paranoia, attempts to avoid blame, and any number of other things. I've learned more today, and it sure sounds like that is one fucked-up family, which often produced fucked-up kids...

Which is not to say I think she's innocent.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Friday, July 8, 2011 11:51 AM

HKCAVALIER


Quote:

Originally posted by OPPYH:
Quote:

Originally posted by HKCavalier:


The prosecution could not establish motive or produce a murder weapon. They couldn't even establish the cause of the poor child's death. And based on so utterly flimsy a case they were pushing for the death penalty??? What the HELL did they think they were doing trying this case under such conditions?




Yes, but the suspicious behavior she displayed was enough to prove her guilty. If not in a court of law then in the general public minds.
1.Her child is missing, she doesn't report it for 30 days=guilty
2.When she is under suspicion, she tells a tale that is completely wild, and far-fetched about a baby sitter(ZANIDA) that took the child. The baby sitter as it turns out does not exist=guilty.

If she is innocent.....WHY DIDN"T SHE TELL THE POLICE WHAT THEY WANTED TO KNOW?
Not sure where your from, but when someone lies compulsively, and is evasive and slippery about common sense facts, they are usually hiding something.

And as far as covering for her father....give me a break. She would have thrown him under the bus the minute she stepped in jail(as proven by her claims) to get out of there.


She was covering up for no one. She killed her daughter either intentionally, or unintentionally.

She is guilty, but the lack of evidence against her set her free.

I'm gonna try to answer your questions. I hope you can hear me over the sound of your own outrage.

Okay, the single important premise I'm starting with is that Casey Anthony is an incest survivor. Yes, OPPYH, if she is not an incest survivor, her behavior is nothing but bizarre and incriminating. But incest has some pretty extreme, and specific consequences for the victim.

1.) Victims of incest have had their most primal relationship with authority utterly, forcefully, and nigh on permanently destroyed, reduced to scorched earth. Imagine your own mother or father performing acts of sexual torture on you or a sibling--it would drive anyone mad. No survivor of incest walks away without some serious psychological disturbances.

Short of getting some form of therapy, survivors end up with one of two modes of coping: one, utterly and unreasoningly fuse with their authority figures and become the best little Nazi drone you've ever seen--even making up elaborate and absurd lies to hide the unspeakable truth; or two, become utter anarchists (in the pejorative sense), drug seekers, suicidal, etc. blaming all and sundry for their suffering. Often enough, both polarities manifest in the same person at different times. Casey Anthony demonstrates all of these traits quite extensively.

2.) Compulsive, and every other kind of lying is already a way of life for pretty much any survivor who actually, y'know, survives. Also, those victims who do "tattle" or inform on their abusers are very frequently disbelieved and/or blamed for the abuse. Survivors learn at an early age that authority figures are exquisitely dangerous, particularly when you come to them in need. Of course, when authority forces its will upon a survivor of incest, the survivor may say anything she thinks might help her to survive.

So, not going to the cops, not telling anyone about what really happened is entirely consistent with the actions of an incest survivor in Ms. Anthony's position.

As to your statement: "...when someone lies compulsively, and is evasive and slippery about common sense facts, they are usually hiding something." Yes. Emphatically, yes. But what specifically she's hiding is not in evidence from the mere fact of the lying. Yes, she's hiding the death of her child, but we cannot discern why she is doing so from the simple fact of the lie. Any survivor of incest knows there are fates far, far worse than death and to protect herself from those, the survivor will go to almost any length. She needs to protect the image she holds of the perfect family. She needs to hide anything and everything that does not reflect a happy home-life. One very telling remark of hers was in one of the letters when she said now that her daughter was dead, her daughter was "safe." Isn't that an odd thing to say about your own daughter? Well, it is, unless you're an incest survivor and the perpetrator of that incest is still in your life. She lied about a great many things, not simply things that would suggest her innocence of murder, as a lying murderer would. Her lying goes a bit beyond mere sociopathic CYA, wouldn't you agree?

The lie about the nanny is particularly irrational and ultimately self-destructive. Why didn't Ms. Anthony simply lay all the blame at her father's feet if all she was lying for was to escape prison and execution? No, instead, she deflected all blame for the death of her daughter AWAY from the family. Classic incest survivor move.

If indeed her father raped her repeatedly as a child and for years, her relationship with him is far too complex to submit to any casual notion of throwing the man under the bus. As far as I know, Ms. Anthony has never gotten any kind of therapy to help her to heal from her family nightmare, so her behavior is not likely to be remotely rational or consistent when it comes to her father/rapist. She will defend him one minute and revile him the next. She will try to protect the family secrets and then blurt them all out in a rush.

I hope you don't imagine that I think the woman is sane. I'm only suggesting that surviving incest creates some extraordinary challenges for anyone, not least of which a woman at the center of an investigation of her own daughter's death.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, July 8, 2011 12:23 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Most excellent, Cav; thank you. Because I've been unable to understand her behavior, too, except to think in terms of "some" mental disorder. I've friends who are incest survivors and knew a few in therapy, and you nailed it nicely! Choey is actually a survivor (my friend of over ten years who lives with us); she got therapy and "got over" it for the most part, but she's still stuck with a lot of baggage: PTSD, anxiety and more. She is, on the other hand, the most honest person I've ever known next to Jim (and his form of "lying" is "omission"), and worked HARD for years to overcome the abuse. I actually believe she's so damned honest in reaction to how she grew up and what she survived. She is also, by the way, a recovering alcoholic, and screwed up her earlier years before recovering.

Reading your description, Cav, reminded me that childhood sexual abuse is one of the main causes of Borderline Personality Disorder and DID (Dissociative Identity Disorder, which used to be called Multiple-Personality Disorder--you know, Sybyl), from what I've read and experienced, and Jo was a textbook example of Borderline; she literally couldn't tell the truth if she WANTED TO! She told whatever came to mind to appease the asker and keep herself out of trouble...even teeeny trouble. For example, her therapist and I were trying to get her to get out and meet people (half for her half to get her off my back, which she was on 24/7!). Suddenly she tells me she met a woman at a park she'd bicycled to and they really hit it off. Next thing, the woman had a crush on her. Next, the woman had snuk in the house to have sex with her. There was no woman, of course, and she had no reason to make all that up except to stop her therapist and I from encouraging her to meet others. She hadn't even done anything wrong!

The lies she came up with when she WAS suspected of having done something wrong (she stole from us in numerous ways, and got my doctor and dentist to renew strong pain meds "for me" until I found out...and lots more), the lies that came out of her were so exorbidant and ridiculous NOBODY would have believed them. And Jo had an incredibly high IQ, I saw the tests. So why would a person with a really high IQ come up with lies that were patently stupid? Cav got it:
Quote:

Any survivor of incest knows there are fates far, far worse than death and to protect herself from those, the survivor will go to almost any length. She needs to protect the image she holds of the perfect family. She needs to hide anything and everything that does not reflect a happy home-life. One very telling remark of hers was in one of the letters when she said now that her daughter was dead, her daughter was "safe." Isn't that an odd thing to say about your own daughter? Well, it is, unless you're an incest survivor and the perpetrator of that incest is still in your life. She lied about a great many things, not simply things that would suggest her innocence of murder, as a lying murderer would. Her lying goes a bit beyond mere sociopathic CYA, wouldn't you agree?
Bang on, Cav...not to say we'll ever know if it's true or not, but it fits what I know, too.

There is no rhyme or reason to some sex-abuse survivors' brains; exactly as you said, Cav, their brains get wired differently from other people's. Just as those of us with mood disorders already have weird wiring; difference is we can overcome it with meds. Borderline can actually be CURED, but not with meds, with therapy, which is ironic because they are the population who have the strongest tendency to drop out of therapy. It's too threatening, and their therapists can't trust a thing that comes out of their mouths unless they're willing to do the work.

Remember that Personality Disorders, unlike Mood Disorders, are thought to be LEARNED behaviors (as opposed to us, who are elieved to carry a physical gene)...a child in that situation learns to function within the family for years and years by playing by mixed-up rules. The faily is certainly fucked up, and a family dynamic as screwed up as theirs, if sex abuse were part of the picture, could definitely cause Borderline. I don't know whether Casey was abused sexually or not, but reading what you wrote, I would bet money she's a victim of Borderline Personality Disorder. So much fits the profile; her appearance, her actions, her lies...and if so, she could well be so as a result of childhood sexual abuse. If she were Borderline, that would explain absolutely everything about her.

As you indicated, when all this started she could well have been paranoid about being blamed, because may Borderlines walk around EXPECTING to be blamed, to receive punishment, from any and all authority figures. So, like Jo, she'd make up anything she could think of reflexively. Same, as you said, for admitting her daughter was dead The POSSIBILITY of her suffering from BPD would explain absolutely everything about Casey Anthony. Dunno why I didn't make the connection before, but what you wrote "clicked". I'd bet dollars to donuts she WAS sexually abused as a child and suffers from BPD.

Two clarifiers: As with any condition, no flat, absolute statement can be made of any sex-abuse survivor OR any mental condition, each of us is different. Second, none of that makes her innocent if she did kill her daughter, but it would go a long ways toward explaining her otherwise-inexp0licable behavior, whether innocent OR gulty.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Friday, July 8, 2011 1:16 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


I don't think she's innocent; I think the jury wasn't able to find her guilty. I don't blame the jury for that, I blame the prosecution for blowing what looked like a pretty easy case.

I agree that a hundred guilty should go free rather than one innocent be locked away or executed, but when you see it in actual practice, it's hard not to be outraged.

I don't support the death penalty, even in Casey's case. Of course, that was never really an issue for her. We don't often execute pretty white girls in this country.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Friday, July 8, 2011 2:11 PM

BYTEMITE


Two people liked HKCavalier's post.

I don't know anything about all this incest or psychologizing, but I do know that it seemed like almost everyone had it out for this girl, and I found that very inappropriate.

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Friday, July 8, 2011 2:16 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I just wish there was a way to really know what happened.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Friday, July 8, 2011 2:25 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Bytemite:
Two people liked HKCavalier's post.

I don't know anything about all this incest or psychologizing, but I do know that it seemed like almost everyone had it out for this girl, and I found that very inappropriate.




Oh, I liked HK's post as well. I don't agree with all of it, but I liked it. And like I said, she wasn't found "innocent", she was found "not guilty" - but she was still found "NOT guilty", by a jury of her peers. Like it or not, the jury's verdict stands. Sometimes our system seems like the worst one in the world, except for all the others...


Speaking of "Like" and such, it would be kinda nice to have a "Like" button (or even an "Unlike" or "Dislike" button) on posts, the way facebook does.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Friday, July 8, 2011 2:28 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Cav, don;t really know much about the case, but I do know how the media love to vilify mothers who don't fit the motherly mould. A famous case here in the 80's was the Azaria Chamberlain case (made into a film Evil Angels), where the mother was basically tried by the press and found guilty. Luckily we don't have capital punishment here, because the braying public would have had her strung up and killed slowly in public. Turned out she was innocent after all and released about 5 years after she was convicted.

Not sure why people go after mothers in that way. Something quite primitive about it, psychologically speaking.

Edited - film released as A Cry in the Dark in the US.

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Friday, July 8, 2011 2:28 PM

BYTEMITE


I've heard discussions about just such a feature, though I don't know if Haken will implement it.

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Friday, July 8, 2011 5:50 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Meanwhile, what is to become of Casey Anthony?


She had a lucrative offer to do hardcore porn, but after a profoundly negative response from porn enthusiasts, that offer has been withdrawn.

http://www.tmz.com/2011/07/06/casey-anthony-steve-hirsch-porn-offer-vi
vid-entertainment-terminate-withdraws-offer-take-back-no-more-murder-suspect-adult-film-xxx-naked-nude
/

Wow. When you're too sleazy for the porn industry, you're REALLY not having a good year!


I guess she can go live with Mom & Dad. I'm sure they'll be glad to have her. :P

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Friday, July 8, 2011 9:16 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
I guess she can go live with Mom & Dad. I'm sure they'll be glad to have her. :P


Oh that was low, even for you, Mikey...
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0171.html

HKCav explained it far better than I woulda, but if I had actually cared to I woulda said much the same thing - in fact I firmly believe she was technically NGI (Not Guilty by virtue of being bat-shit-crazy).

The lady needs serious help, and ain't likely to get it because of her own issues, and the subsequent vilification which is gonna happen in that the jury of the media and public has all but lynched her in absentia - this is common with abuse victims far less screwed up than she is, and never does fail to provoke my ire, ESPECIALLY since it confirms that hostile relationship with authority of any kind, which bleeds over into their hatred of conventional pysch personnel, which are, factually, often "in with them" and looking for something to hang you on rather than to actually help you - in situations like this...

And that condemns them forevermore to a short, miserable, unhappy life which not only is full of suffering for them, but spreads the misery to others, a self-inflicted wound our society inflicts, which festers into a chain of misery as those who were victimized BECOME victimizers either out of bizarre notions of self-defense, pre-emptive or otherwise, or just plain HATE for a world and society which has treated them so.
And it does shame me to admit this, but while my head is telling me it's wrong - when they DO retaliate against a society which HAS mistreated them, my heart cheers them on.
Because from a certain point of view, they have just cause.

Of course, my "revenge" has been trying like hell to make it so fewer, preferably none, ever face that kind of misery - a much broader horizon than most of the badly screwed up can comprehend, given how most of em struggle to get through one day at a time.

As for "Authority Issues" and a Scorched Earth Policy - lemme tell you this...
You got two choices with that, either you call it demented and try to force them not to think that way with abuse and medication...
Or you fucking admit that it's true - often most Authories ARE the enemy, ARE abusive, and maybe you should DEAL with that reality instead of flaming people who refuse to blind themselves to it.

-Frem
I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, July 8, 2011 10:15 PM

FREMDFIRMA



No, Guess I ain't finished...
(had to cut it short, above, doin rounds tonite)


Thing is, when a state shrink goes digging in someones head under the guise of "trying to help you" but in fact looking for things to use against them - or participates directly in an interrogation, or even torture, as happens to be the case with both rendition and official sites...
Any of which I consider an ethics violation so massive mere words cannot contain it, mind you.
What do you think it does to folks perception of the profession, ESPECIALLY folks with pre-existing authority issues cause of abusive familial relationships or mistreatment at the hands of those authorities ?
This *IS* the root cause of Iatrogenic Psychology.

Y'all wonder why folks like spree-shooters, moms who kill their kids, and other causes of what SHOULD have been avoidable tragedies, did not seek help from psych personnel ?
BECAUSE THEY CAN NOT TRUST THEM
This is a valid, and correct assessment - denying it will not change the fact that it is, much to my displeasure.
And if we wanna change it at all, the very first thing we must do is ensure that that confidentiality of ANY information passed between patient and professional in this matter remains IN-VIO-LATE, period, end of story.
As in NO, as in go-fuck-your-self, as in no warrant, subpeano, or other administrative tattle-tale permission applies - with revokation of license and criminal penalty in the offering should they breach it.

Till we do so, the notion of someone in that much distress, who may well have a great deal to hide, seeking professional help is ludicrous, laughable, even - making tragedy all that much more inevitable.


Also, the conduct towards the Jury Members.
Now, we already bring tremendous pressure to convict down on potentive jurors, by way of lying to them, omission and otherwise, legal threats, and deliberate misinformation, not to mention the astonishing number of procedural and discovery violations committed wholesale by prosecutors, and that doesn't even cover testilying and intentional perjury on behalf of the states witnesses...
I mean, it's downright pathetic when a juror who refuses to convict risks contempt citation if not criminal charges, despite that it is the behavior of our so-called justice system which is in fact contemptible.
We, as the public, do NOT need to be encouraging and abetting the states abuse of the system with our own conduct, and I think those who act in this fashion should be held liable in a social sense, if not subjected TO that same system in what would be a damn fine irony.

That one's kinda personal since I earnestly and firmly believe the system as constructed isn't even capable of offering a fair trial, thus failing the constitutional requirement and not only making me ineligable as a juror, but if forced to be at gunpoint conscription gives me only ONE option for a verdict, regardless of guilt or innocence.
This is gonna come to a head in early august, as according to the court I *have* to actually show up for this duty notice, since it's been a year (and multiple notices) since I did last - which tends to go badly when a Judge asks me *UNDER OATH*, questions I'd rather not bloody answer, and then gets all pissed off when I do answer them honestly... grrrr.

I've even had to rewrite work schedules in case he tosses me in the brig overnight.
So *that* for flaming a jury for doing their constitutional duty instead of being a rubber stamp!

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Saturday, July 9, 2011 12:29 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Speaking of "Like" and such, it would be kinda nice to have a "Like" button (or even an "Unlike" or "Dislike" button) on posts, the way facebook does.


Do you really wanna give the right wing trolls here the means to use their sockpuppet bury brigades to trash any opinion that doesn't lick their boots ?

Cause I don't.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Saturday, July 9, 2011 1:32 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:

Oh that was low, even for you, Mikey...
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0171.html




"Your approval fills me with shame." :biggrin


Quote:


Also, the conduct towards the Jury Members.
Now, we already bring tremendous pressure to convict down on potentive jurors, by way of lying to them, omission and otherwise, legal threats, and deliberate misinformation, not to mention the astonishing number of procedural and discovery violations committed wholesale by prosecutors, and that doesn't even cover testilying and intentional perjury on behalf of the states witnesses...
I mean, it's downright pathetic when a juror who refuses to convict risks contempt citation if not criminal charges, despite that it is the behavior of our so-called justice system which is in fact contemptible.
We, as the public, do NOT need to be encouraging and abetting the states abuse of the system with our own conduct, and I think those who act in this fashion should be held liable in a social sense, if not subjected TO that same system in what would be a damn fine irony.




Agreed. Given the choices, I can't really put it on the jury for not convicting. Bad prosecution, overzealous, overreaching, and it bit 'em in the ass.



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Saturday, July 9, 2011 1:33 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Speaking of "Like" and such, it would be kinda nice to have a "Like" button (or even an "Unlike" or "Dislike" button) on posts, the way facebook does.


Do you really wanna give the right wing trolls here the means to use their sockpuppet bury brigades to trash any opinion that doesn't lick their boots ?

Cause I don't.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.




Good point.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Saturday, July 9, 2011 9:02 AM

BYTEMITE


Yeah, I'd just go with +like. Posts that aren't anything but steaming piles can just sit there, grotesque and proclaiming that "zero people liked this post."

Also: it surprises me how many webcomics I read that I later find out other people around here are into. My geekicity is not exclusive.

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Saturday, July 9, 2011 9:16 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Speaking of "Like" and such, it would be kinda nice to have a "Like" button (or even an "Unlike" or "Dislike" button) on posts, the way facebook does.


Do you really wanna give the right wing trolls here the means to use their sockpuppet bury brigades to trash any opinion that doesn't lick their boots ?

Cause I don't.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.




Good point.




Yeah, because the sockpuppet bury brigades and boot licking duties belong exclusively to the LEFT wing trolls !

And don't none of yous guys forget it !



" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Saturday, July 9, 2011 9:48 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


O J Simpson
Lindsay Lohan
Britney Spears

And now another person I have absolutely no interest in, no matter how hard they get pushed on me on the TV, radio, internet and tabloids.

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Saturday, July 9, 2011 8:43 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


^Like

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Sunday, July 10, 2011 5:51 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


^
like

At this point, my only thoughts on the matter are, as Riona said, "I just wish there was a way to really know what happened."

As to "like", etc., I'm not on facebook and I admit to a certain disdain for seeing that on articles, etc. And don't kid yourself, even if there were no "dislike", the "like"s would be there...from themselves or others piling on! Or can't you "like" your own post?

Along that vein: "And now another person I have absolutely no interest in, no matter how hard they get pushed on me on the TV, radio, internet and tabloids. "


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



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Monday, July 11, 2011 6:31 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I don't like the idea of having a like button because it will make everyone lazier. A "like" button is like text speak, its a way to not actually have to think eliquently enough to write out a full sentence about how you agree with someone. Quicko, that comment was indeed disgusting and I expect better from you, though with conduct like that I'm not sure why, "having" people and all.

There probably isn't a way for us to know what's going on, whether the abuse happened or didn't happen, either could be the case, maybe there are other things the matter with her that cause her to think those things happened to her. Maybe they really did happen. We can't know.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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