Looking for an Angus Trim by AnthonyT

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Looking for an Angus Trim

POSTED BY: ANTHONYT
UPDATED: Monday, August 29, 2011 12:55
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Thursday, August 25, 2011 9:53 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

~ A decade ago, Angus Trim was known on (the now largely inactive) swordforum.com as one of the premier U.S. artisans studying the science of sword manufacture. He was so respected in the sword community that the notable Christian Fletcher partnered with him to mate his workmanlike blades to lavish hilts, pommels, scabbards, and belts. More recently, Angus Trim partnered with a foreign producer to manufacture swords based on his (re)discoveries of proper blade geometry, weight, and heat treatment.

Now there appear to be a few sword distributers who offer these Angus Trim 'designs' at ~ 200 dollars a pop.

However, I have been unable to discover any evidence of Angus Trim's original sword research/manufacturing operation. Did he completely close down his U.S. shop when he partnered with the foreign manufacturer? Does anyone know?

I had hoped to get an original Angus Trim for Christmas, but I can't find any evidence of his original wares being sold.

Thanks,

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 12:58 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Sorry, no real help here. I remembered some swordmaker being a sponsor of Dan Carlin's Hardcore History podcast, so went searching in hopes that maybe it was the one you were looking for, but no such luck. That was Albion Swords. ( http://www.albion-swords.com/ )

Good luck in your search, though, and here's a complementary bump! :)

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 1:14 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

Thank you, Mike. Albion swords has an excellent reputation in the sword community, and I can recommend them. They tend to have a somewhat formidable price-tag, if I recall, but they really are functional works of art made in the oldest and finest traditions of the craft. (Or as much as you're likely to get nowadays.) If I recall my lore, their techniques bear much more resemblance to traditional swordmaking than Angus Trim's.

One of the special features of an Atrim (Angus Trim) sword is the unique dismountable blade arrangement. See, he was something of a sword scientist, and so he looked to bring modern swordmaking techniques to classic sword design. One of the practical innovations he developed was using a hex-nut to secure the pommel to the robust blade tang. This allowed the sword and hilt to be disassembled for cleaning, or to be tightened when rigorous swordplay created any kind of looseness in the hilt.

I think this is an innovation that classic warriors would have appreciated had it been available to them. Re-peening a sword to tighten its hilt is a labor intensive prospect, and the ability to easily clean gore from the nooks and crannies is just invaluable. Nowadays, we worry less about the gore, but being able to tighten a hilt in seconds is still worthwhile.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 2:05 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

These photos may more easily demonstrate what I was trying to explain. This style of hilt assembly was pioneered by Angus Trim. It is not historically correct, but it is practically useful.

I should also note that while the methods of manufacture that Angus Trim used were not classical, the actual dimensions, weight, and heat treatment of his swords are accurate to historical norms. In essence, a modern version of a classic weapon that would have been welcomed in the hands of any ancient warrior.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 3:00 PM

KWICKO

Very cool, and very, very functional. I figured that's what you were talking about when you described it (you described it very well, so it was easy to envision it thusly), but it is very nice to see it in pics.

I'm a big fan of modernizing classic designs. I nearly had death threats from some car folks because I once suggested that I might like to get my hands on a '68 Mustang fastback and renovate it using a more modern powerplant, transmission, and suspension, which would keep the wonderful lines of the car while making it all actually WORK much better than the original.

This is better, though - he's not taking an actual classic sword and changing it; he's just basing a modern technical design on the looks of the classic. No old swords were harmed in the manufacture of the new one! :) And yes, if the ancients had access to this kind of sword, they would be quite happy indeed.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 3:29 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

I know nothing about swords, sword design, manufacture or use, except whatever I learned from "The Shadow of the Torturer" by Gene Wolfe. Severian had a sword named Terminus Est.

As for the blocks used for execution, they were "Wide as a stool, dense as a fool, and dished, as a rule."

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 3:49 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I am unfamiliar with the book, but it sounds like a grim treatise of the executioner's trade, as described by Doctor Seuss. ;-)

I used to know much more about swords than I do now. But then I got additional knowledge, and now I understand that I am ignorant. :-)

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 4:14 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Well, I don't know how your taste in sci-fi goes, but it's about an earth far in the future where there are people of different subspecies, where the sun has a poison inserted in it by vast alien cultures to cool it down (and slow the humans down on their trip to the stars), where there are fabled to be invasive alien plants and animals that are truly alien, and where everything is referential to a glorious, and presumably unreachable, past in a vibrant but decaying present.

Here's a random passage:

The chiming of the carillon in the Bell Tower was in my ears. It was time to rise, time to run to the kitchen pulling on my clothes, time to stir a pot for Brother Cook and steal a sausage - a sausage bursting, savory, and nearly burned - from the grill. Time to wash, time to serve the journeymen, time to chant lessons to myself before Master Palaemon's examination.
I woke in the apprentices' dormitory, but everything was in the wrong place: a blank wall where the round port should have been, a square window that should have been a bulkhead. The row of hard, narrow cots was gone, and the ceiling too low.
Then I was awake. Country smells - much like the pleasant odors of flower and tree that used to float across the ruined curtain wall from the necropolis, but mixed now with the hot reek of a stable - drifted through the window. The bells began again, ringing in some campanile not far away, calling the few who retained their faith to beseech the coming of the New Sun, though it was very early still, the old sun had hardly dropped Urth's veil from his face, and save for the bells the village lay silent.

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Thursday, August 25, 2011 6:24 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello Kwik,

Your dream of refurbishing a classic car with modern technology while retaining its appearance reminds me of this:

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Friday, August 26, 2011 8:46 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Far as I know, Anthony, due to health issues and to some degree age, Gus started becoming difficult to contact around 2004ish, and ever since each successive attempt to re-enter the field has kind of petered out.

Not his fault, really, I mean he can teach apprentices to do the work, sure - but what my problem is, these days they're supposedly offering Angus Trim "designs", but you've really no way to ensure this is the case till it's in your fist, and good luck getting your money back then, especially if what you're holding is some cheapass screwtang wallhanger clobbered together out of potmetal with a phony AT stamp on it, right ?

My knowledge of that field and what companies may or may not be reliable is sorely out of date as well, so there's little help I can offer...

My own blade preferences are a little different, I've never quite liked blades where the tang is less than 80% of blade width, nor those where the grip is screwed on, hexnut or not - in fact I hate hexnuts, pet peeve of mine(1), I think the last blade I actually bought from anyone is one I've not even the physical ability to really use any more, it's this something between sword and machete called a Panga/Kukri depending on who one asks about it, it's got a motherhuge sloped blade and all the weight is on the swinging end.. I bought that monster a long time ago cause I thought it might be useful for breaching interior doors in a very intimidating fashion, but never actually got around to using it in that fashion, it's pretty damn good at brushclearing though.

For preference I prefer a smallsword, and not the ornamental "fencing" type, old spanish design, double edged, pointy, about 24-28" with finger ring for control and S-type crossgaurd, but good luck finding one of those, meh.

(1) This is because a lot of small engines use them, made out of REALLY CHEAP METAL, and in bizarre sizes that neither metric OR standard hex keys seem to fit, and even if you do buy one and file it to shape, you'll just strip it anyway and wind up having to drill it out cause the metal is so soft it just disintigrates when you apply force to it - prolly cause they don't want you in there and prefer you taking it to their shop, which mighta made sense back when you could get Tomos serviced here, but these days you either trust some hack at a motorcycle shop who knows nothing about em, go to Flint and pay that cack-handed dunsel a hundred bucks an hour (and he'll take his damn time with it, of course) or you track me down and catch me on a good day.
Ergo, this has colored my viewpoint of them damn hexnuts/hexhead screws, to where my FIRST reaction to the damn things is to get the power drill and grinder out.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, August 26, 2011 8:52 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Anthony, I don't know anything about the subject, I just wanted to pop in mention one of the reasons I'm glad to see you back. You put up posts! Aside from Raptor/Wulf's exclusively "Snark Obama! Snark Dems! Snark Libs!" bullshit and PN's insanity, I've been the most prolific post-putter-upper. It's great to see another SANE person doing so...and means I don't have to try to look for things in which people might have an interest every day. Thank'ee, sir!

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, August 26, 2011 9:06 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello Frem,

Well, I can see why you hate hexnuts, though I can attest that the actual Atrims not only had robust and proper nuts, but the tang itself has never been reported to break even in use that I consider criminal for a sword. (Let's see what happens when we start hacking at a big metal signpost!)

I have lost thousands of dollars on swords, so I understand the dangers of buying from uncertain sources. Glenn Paril (sp?) a once-revered Canadian Smith was paid for a sword he never delivered. He fell off the face of the Earth right after I ordered it. I don't know what happened to him but I am still bitter about it. There's also a Czech outfit called Armart that owes me two swords that I'll never see. They weren't cheap, either. If you know about their deal with swordforum, you know about that bitter brew. I'm still mad about that, too.

I think I will have to take a leap of faith with one of the 'authorized reproductions' of an Angus Trim sword because the only alternative I know is to spend three to ten times as much. That would put me in a whole new class, but also a deep credit hole.

I own a Kukri and have used them for years. Excellent 'knife.' Used for everything that needs cutting, hacking, and even digging in Nepal, including the ritual beheadings of water buffalo. (And the non-ritual beheadings of people.)

I can get Kukris fairly inexpensively, and find them to be remarkable (if rather heavy) weapons. But I'm in the mood for something with a western flavor.

I'll keep an eye out for the smallsword.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Friday, August 26, 2011 9:10 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello Niki,

You are too kind. This particular post is entirely self-serving. I'm coming to an 'excrete or get off the seat' moment and I wanted to reach out to my fellow forumites.

(While hoping that they wouldn't answer with "A swha?" ;-)

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Friday, August 26, 2011 1:28 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Well, I used to do biz with AngelSword, so I can commisserate about the pricetags, ouch!

Thing is, while a smallsword is more suited to my best, and still remaining asset, speed and reflexes, back when I was still able to engage in berserkerang without risk of causing a stroke I would use brute force as well, which is kinda rough on a sword even when used properly, and after HydraGladius outright shattered when I inadvertantly clipped a fencepost during a challenge brawl(1) with someone also capable of zerking I finally threw down the dosh for a sword that *wouldn't* break in use, in fact one reason I dealt with AS is that if the damn thing did fail me they would guarantee replacement.

Damn shame I never got to use that Kukri beast to take out doors though, I bet the look on the faces of the Hellcamp stooges woulda been priceless, FWHACK, STOMP, and there goes the door - although that woulda been just for show anyhows cause "Test Number One" for my prosthetic units is the ability to kick a standard household FRONT door in, one shot, and remain wearable/walkable without pain or splitting the socket.
(Which is why the Borgmatic has a carbon fibre/ballistic material socket)

(1)FYI, these are done with live steel, but no actual edges on the blade, kind of a flat block instead of an edge, which isn't as safe as padded sticks, sure - but I never favored that cause it means some clueless jerk swiping away with what'd likely be the flat of the blade counts, and most of em have all kinds of silly rules which make it laughable... seriously, no shield bashing, no body contact, what the hell is that ? dancing ?
If you ain't got bruises, you ain't been in a fight!

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, August 26, 2011 1:44 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I recall that angel sword had a reputation for tough blades. Used frequently in edge-to-edge sparring applications, if I remember right.

Also known for inelegant handling, if it is not too unkind to say so. But if durability is the primary criterion, I doubt you could do much better. (Based on reviews from people I respect. I have never owned one.)

I do remember that the sword (snob) community was less than impressed with the design, geometry, and weight of the pieces coming out of that manufacturer in the early 2000's.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Friday, August 26, 2011 2:39 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Elegance wasn't the issue, and for $1800.00 USD, the damn thing was guaranteed indestructible by normal means, for THAT price it'd damn well better be - heaven knows where it is now, prolly hanging on somebodys wall somewhere, as I had to abandon it cause it was stuck in something and my ass needed to get out of dodge like twenty minutes ago.

It might not have been elegant, it may have handled like a crowbar, but it was damn sure tougher than any blade I've handled since - besides which, given my preference for ye olde L-type tire iron as a melee weapon, not like that handling didn't appeal to me, just a little.

Speakin of which, that one can find and use that very weapon (Tire Iron) in Fallout 3 amuses the hell out of me, to the point where I offed the big bad by smashing his pretty high tech laser pistol with it and then working him over, heeeee.

-Frem
I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, August 26, 2011 3:09 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

It seems the blade passed the only test any blade needs to pass.

You were pleased with it.

I hope to find the same luck.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Friday, August 26, 2011 3:21 PM

FREMDFIRMA

FYI, just looked over that mess at swordforum, honestly you people are TOO nice, and I think that's half the problem.

If you have access to TheHighRoad, dig up the infamous "Bearcoat" thread and you'll see that kinda thing happens in the gun-bunny world too, only they're NOT very nice about it, even WildAlaska finally got his comeuppance despite not having any involvement in it beyond his big mouth and bad attitude, which is not exactly good customer service in any form.
I myself am not welcome on THR thanks to calling the idea of exterminating ALL muslim/arabs "Genocide" - and yet the person blatantly calling for that to happen was cheered and adulated.
That's part of what lead to the schism war they had about it, especially since the guy keeping the forum up was in fact of that belief and ancestry, although he was also an outright crook, but one didn't have nothin to do with the other - and honestly, he had his reasons.

Anyhows, I'd ask if you wanted some justice on Pavel for this, but knowing the answer I won't bother...

Myself, I've been known to hunt people down and TAKE my merchandise from them, or what I feel is an appropriate equivalent amount of violence upon them - because (say it with me now), YOU DO NOT BREAK CONTRACT WITH ME - a tenet I follow with a rabid fanaticism usually reserved for religion.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, August 26, 2011 3:38 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

This reminds me of something.

I hereby promise to pay you a dollar. Do not forget. I owe you money.

As for Pavel, the only justice I want from him is the sword I paid for, and I think I will never get it. Revenge holds no sweetness for me, and as you say, you already know it. I don't even want him out of business, because he clearly employs talented artisans who might otherwise waste their skills on more mundane jobs.

Same with Glen Parril (sp?) and my Sword of Eire designed by Antonio Cejunior. That would have been a magnificent piece.

I put so much effort into saving the money for these projects, and so much emotion anticipating these made-to-order projects. They were meant to be family heirlooms passed to untold future generations of the Toledo line. Not having them still depresses me years later. And so, having been bilked out of thousands of dollars, I now settle on the idea of 200 dollar replacements. At least, hopefully, they will be swords, and not SLO's.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Friday, August 26, 2011 7:31 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
I hereby promise to pay you a dollar. Do not forget. I owe you money.

Interesting bit about that whole breaking contract issue, given that I make it, and take it, kinda personal, as finance Sgt Macgruder learned shortly before he had the damn indecency to drop dead on us...

I hate banks, for a fact, prolly lost as much money there as you have in this sword biz, so I can commisserate, first one was old court savings and loan, one of the linchpin failures that caused the savings and loan crisis of the early 80's and the collapse of the FSLIC - one reason I do NOT trust the fekkin FDIC, cause if anything really goes wrong they don't have the assets to even cover 1% of it and they'll save the corpies first, which means you're screwed.

Mind you, that was my original savings account from when I was like, ten, you know, the money you save up to buy a car, leave the nest, the necessary funding for security deposits and the like - all gone, poof, never got it back, not even pennies on the dollar, they slammed the door on us and that was that, while THEY hauled ass to the caymans, livin large, yeah...

The other one was Signet/Sovran, in which I placed my assets during military service, who closed and emptied the account as "abandoned" when I didn't make a transaction within 90 days despite no requirement to do so, fuckers.

And so, being constantly harrassed by the girl who is now my ex about carrying cash, since it does kinda limit transactions, and the need for a method of handling online payments, I decided to take a chance on this puny little podunk local credit union, and I was in a foul humor since we'd tried one other credit union just before that which took *issue* with us not being a certain RELIGION... I was pissed off, SHE was pissed off because that made her look like an idiot after sayin I was paranoid and they wouldn't do that, and she was also mad at ME cause of it, for reasons only ever coherent to the female mind.

Thus, when we got there I took the customer service rep aside and had a bit of discussion, while probably not exact since it's been a while and memory fades, the essential sentiment is the same.

Quote:
Ok, look, every financial institution I have ever dealt with has shafted me, bar none - I am not exactly sanguine about dealing with you, and I want you to understand this one thing right up front and clearly.

IF I should take a shafting from this place, I will come HERE, I will find YOU - my ire will not fall on the company, it will fall on YOU, personally, including whatever legal or other measures I deem appropriate to the situation, now, if you have faith in the company, if you really believe in their honesty enough to be comfortable with that, then we can sit down and hammer out a deal, but if not, if you're only telling me how trustworthy they are cause it's your job, if you are not willing to put your OWN neck on the line here...

Then I am walking out that door, so what's it gonna be ?"

The lady in question stood behind her company, and they've been my financial institution ever since, no bullshit, no hidden fees, no dollar-here, dollar-there disappearances of my money, none of that - 98% of the time their balance sheet matches mine exactly, and the remaining 2% has always in every case been my poor math skills when I double-checked it, always.

This is *WHY* I am willing to continue dealing with a place that's sixty plus miles away, and I've only had to drive up there once thanks to Experian selling my rental application and credit card info to some scammer in mainland china - I KNOW it was them cause of my habit of using slightly different contact info so I know who's selling me out, and as soon as I spotted the transposed-digit phone number (which also means I don't get a lotta telemarketers..) I damn well knew it was Experian - and between me and the lady we had that shit settled and ALL my money back in four hours flat, PLUS via a little social engineering I managed to weasel the bastards actual address out of one of the merchants, who was so much of a crook himself it was easy enough to wheedle him.
(I wrote a letter detailing the situation and had it translated by a friend, then sent it and the banks documentation to his local law enforcement, I doubt it went well for him)

Now, in this case I think the biz itself is pretty honest, and their customer service is gold star, but in many other cases, makin it personal, takin it personal, has prevented an otherwise dodgy company from trying to stick it to me cause the person who's head I'd be coming for made sure that didn't happen - especially a certain muffler company being that I overheard a bit of conversation not intended for my ears, and said would-be-target was BY NO MEANS willing to stick ME with an inferior product to what I paid for when it'd be HIS ass on the line if I found out....
I made a show of checking and doublechecking those brake parts too, just to drive the point home, them bastards should be happy enough that I do biz there given the way THAT damn car eats brakes.

Anyhow, I doubt you could truly intimidate someone, but it's worth a thought to try and make biz transactions a little more personal cause when someone feels their own ass is on the line they're far less likely to stick it to you.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Sunday, August 28, 2011 8:32 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

Wow, swords, I love swords! And "Sword of Eire"? Hold on let me get a cup to catch all my druelling so it doesn't get on the keyboard.
:))))

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Monday, August 29, 2011 4:00 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Quote:
Originally posted by RionaEire:
Wow, swords, I love swords! And "Sword of Eire"? Hold on let me get a cup to catch all my druelling so it doesn't get on the keyboard.
:))))

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

Hello,

This is the Sword of Eire designed by Antonio Cejunior that I paid to have made, but never received. The Canadian smith vanished.

No fault of Antonio, who was earning nothing on the transaction, and merely consented to let me use his design when requesting a sword from the smith.

He was as disappointed as I was. To my knowledge, the sword was never crafted into reality by anyone, anywhere. It remains his unrealized dream.

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Monday, August 29, 2011 8:57 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

http://www.arscives.com/bladesign/swordrunes.review.design.htm

Hello,

Here is another sword that was actually completed by Glen Parrell (finally found the right spelling) for Antonio Cejunior before that Canadian smith fell off the Earth.

It was on the strength of such well-made custom work, and a previous collaboration with the designer, that I chose Glen as the smith for the Sword of Eire. Antonio Cejunior was most embarrassed at how everything turned out.

As you read the page, keep in mind that Antonio is an artist, hence somewhat eccentric, and a very spiritual person. None of this detracts from his art skills. Quite the reverse.

I haven't heard from Antonio in some years. I wonder how he is doing.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Monday, August 29, 2011 12:42 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

If there's one thing that irritates me its unreliability. Did you get your money back since you never got your Sword of Eire?
It seems that a lot of swordsmiths disappear, must be a coincidence, but one wonders why you special-sword-ordering guys are often plagued with such an inconvenience.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Monday, August 29, 2011 12:55 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I never got my money back. I think I never will. I have learned some lessons, too late, from these incidents. The foremost being that I should never pay full price for custom work up front, before the piece is even begun. The second is that I should never pay for such work with a check.

In both cases where I lost money for swords ordered but never produced, the sword-maker was outside of the United States. I think this is something I will try to avoid as well.

There are very, very few custom smiths of quality. It's not exactly a boom industry, so you have maybe a dozen notable makers in the whole western world. They usually run one-man shops, and may close down due to changes in the economy or health or any number of reasons. Because of their scarcity, they may be far from you. So you end up taking a chance on an individual you've never met who is half a continent away or more, based on some pictures and reviews of completed pieces on a forum for sword lovers.

It's probably a much better experience when you can go a few miles up the street and see and speak to the man who will make you a product, look his other wares, etc.

If I ever order another custom sword (I doubt I'll ever have that much disposable cash again any time soon) I'll probably try hard to find an American smith and pay with a credit card in stages.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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