REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Re: The "OccupyParty"

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Wednesday, October 12, 2011 13:05
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 2298
PAGE 1 of 1

Thursday, October 6, 2011 8:40 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


REVISED POST AFTER FURTHER INFORMATION

Okay...I thought this "OccupyParty" was for real and had something to do with the Wall Street protests. Turns out:
Quote:

As the Occupy Wall Street movement inspires protests in more U.S. cities, a website has popped up that seems to be trading on the group's somewhat nebulous status and lack of formal organization.

The site, called OccupyParty.org, has been disavowed on the actual Occupy Wall Street site, where the author also noted, "We are not a political institution."

OccupyParty has a landing page that features what you might expect from a young political movement: images of a diverse crowd of smiling people, waving flags; an image of the U.S. Constitution; and a video purporting to show dastardly Wall Street bankers.

The only snag: other than an embedded YouTube video (from another group), the page is devoid of any working links to information about Occupy Wall Street — or even more about "The Occupy Party."

A look at the page's source code finds that even the link under "Latest Events" is a mere hashtag placeholder — which returns anyone who clicks on it to the top of the page they're already on.

Other than the video, there are only three working outbound links. And they're all Google Ad slots — a circumstance that would be highly unusual for a grass-roots group seeking to round up more support.

A bit of research turns up more information about the site. It was registered on Oct. 2, 2011, using a post office box in Australia — the Fortitude Valley section of Brisbane, to be exact.

If the site is in fact a jaded attempt to cash in on burgeoning interest in the Occupy Wall Street movement, its administrators are being sneaky in another way, as well. Because as we know here at NPR.org, using the ".org" suffix traditionally means that you're a non-commercial enterprise.

Oh well, sounded good; my apologies.

The video on that "OccupyParty" website makes me downright SICK!



Sure tells us which side Herman Cain is on:



They're just that arrogant, and it's time we took them down a peg or two! (That isn't a threat or a wish to harm anyone, just that they don't have the "right" to make outrageous profits on the back of the American people, and that we should vote people into office who will take away their loopholes and gimmes, and make them "share the pain" by raising their taxes.)

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 8:49 AM

BYTEMITE


...Damn, well, I don't know if it started as astroturf, but a website and a video suggests someone's backing it so it's astroturf now.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 8:59 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Well, someone backing it doesn't mean it's astroturf, as we just learned (the hard way) from the Koch Brothers and others backing the originally-grassroots Tea Party. Personally, I hope it IS grass roots...I heard on the news that they're refusing donations at the protests, asking people to contact their reps instead and put the money toward candidates for office who'll work FOR us (if they can find any, that is!).


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 9:20 AM

HERO


I'm all for this Occupy Wall Street protest. Free speech is fine. Just keep them out of the way of all the nice people going to work and living their everyday lives who don't deserve to be hassled by someone else regardless of the cause.

Plus groups like this are key to giving Republicans control of the Presidency and Congress next year. I mean look at them, they are hardly able to give a coherant message and what's the message "urrr, Hulk hate capitalism".

One look at these guys or five minutes of listening to their goals and demands and the independents and moderate Democrats will be banging on the door of the big tent of whoever the Republicans put up next year. Keep it up and Obama will be wishing he had Jimmy Carter's numbers in 1980 or Mondale in '84.

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.
"I agree with Hero." Niki2, 2011.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 9:24 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

Plus groups like this are key to giving Republicans control of the Presidency and Congress next year.
Quote:

the big tent of whoever the Republicans put up next year
I call dichotomy! There's been no "big tent" in the GOP for ages, and isn't going to happen with ANY of the now-permanent candidates!

More like


or


and


They've got a "big tent" this year alright, as in big CIRCUS tent!



Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 9:46 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

Astroturfing is a form of advocacy in support of a political, organizational, or corporate agenda, designed to give the appearance of a "grassroots" movement. The goal of such campaigns is to disguise the efforts of a political and/or commercial entity as an independent public reaction to some political entity—a politician, political group, product, service or event. The term is a derivation of AstroTurf, a brand of synthetic carpeting designed to look like natural grass.

Astroturfers attempt to manipulate public opinion by both overt ("outreach", "awareness", etc.) and covert (disinformation) means. Astroturfing may be undertaken by an individual promoting a personal agenda, or highly organized professional groups with money from large corporations, unions, non-profits, or activist organizations. Very often, the efforts are conducted by political consultants who also specialize in opposition research. Beneficiaries are not "grass root" campaigners but distant organizations that orchestrate such campaigns.



Quote:

asking people to contact their reps instead and put the money toward candidates for office who'll work FOR us (if they can find any, that is!).


*wince* Niki, I'm pretty sure it's astroturf. If it's got backing by definition it is. Grassroots refers to a local level of organization, it's from the ground up, the grassroots, not the top down.

These protests have been cropping up everywhere and now they're got a list of requests and a video and a website out. It's leaning more towards this all is orchestrated.

It'd be nice for once to find a genuine grassroots effort that some ulterior interest hadn't been already hijacked.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 10:00 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Wow. I posted a response, but it's not here...duh?

Response was: "Duh, mea culpa. I meant "grassroots" not "astroturf". The minute I saw "grassroots" in your reply, I got it. Been playing here too long today, time to get out and do something contructive or just enjoy the rain. Yes, RAIN! Four days of it...heaven, I'm in heaven...

And that's the reason I've been here so long. Got up before dawn intending to sulky the dogs; turned on computer, saw rain was forecast, so sat down to wait and see. Been here ever since, which is absurd, so I'm outta here!

Sorry about that!

To be clear, maybe this protest will BECOME astroturf (I sure hope not!) but no, they don't have a website, at least I don't think so. The website with the "demands" was put up by one person; the website of "OccupyParty" is APPLAUDING the protests, but didn't start them and isn't financing them. We'll just have to wait and see. If they're astroturf, why would they reject donations, for one.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 10:15 AM

DREAMTROVE


This is so awesome.

That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 10:45 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 10:58 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Thanx Nick...I'm editing my post. Damn. Sounded good, which probably should have made me suspicious right off!


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 11:18 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Thanx Nick...I'm editing my post. Damn. Sounded good, which probably should have made me suspicious right off!


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off





Not a problem!

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 11:32 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Bytemite:
...Damn, well, I don't know if it started as astroturf, but a website and a video suggests someone's backing it so it's astroturf now.



In an age where most people carry video cameras in their pocket, and can set up a website in minutes.... you think that's proof of big backers? Okay...

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 11:39 AM

BYTEMITE


The appearance of coordinated protests in major cities calling themselves "Occupy Wall Street" and not being in New York, AND a website, AND a quality produced video.

I might be paranoid, I might be crazy, but I am NOT dumb. I could be wrong about this, but if I'm questioning it, I have reason to.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 11:53 AM

CUDA77

Like woman, I am a mystery.


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:




And that video right there proves to me with one defining image how utterly useless this whole Occupy Wall Street thing is. Honestly, I appreciate these people for speaking out and trying to do something but what they're doing is not going to change one single solitary thing. What they're doing is providing no threat or inconvenience or anything bad for the people in Wall Street. They're still there trading and making/losing lots of money despite what's going on outside. And they will continue to do so no matter how many people show up there or in other places around the country. Nothing is at stake for the bankers and traders so they have no reason to change or to "give in" to any of the demands.

Socialist and unashamed about it.


NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 12:51 PM

FREMDFIRMA



Oh there's plenty of folk hooking strings into it, some good, some bad, some crazy and clueless.

Thing is, who will end up with the hook set firmly is still something of a toss-up, even now.

Just remember, you start takin their money, you wind up takin their orders, so be damn sure you know what hand is holding out the largess before ya snatch it - too many movements get co-opted or crushed cause of that, not the least of which was the so-called libertarian party.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 12:55 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by Cuda77:
What they're doing is providing no threat or inconvenience or anything bad for the people in Wall Street. They're still there trading and making/losing lots of money despite what's going on outside. And they will continue to do so no matter how many people show up there or in other places around the country. Nothing is at stake for the bankers and traders so they have no reason to change or to "give in" to any of the demands.


Which is exactly what MY issue with the whole modern school of "protest" *IS*, in point of fact.
I was in fact amused in a very dark sort of way, but what some protestors overseas did in response to being ignored and mocked by their own powers that be.
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4107640,00.html
Of course, you did that HERE, you'd have ten freakin SWAT teams, DepHomeSec and the freakin Nasty Guard all over you...

Land of the free, huh - yeah, keep on believing that.

-Frem


I do not serve the Blind God.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Thursday, October 6, 2011 4:08 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
The video on that "OccupyParty" website makes me downright SICK!



If the video is accurate, those people were on the balcony at 55 Wall Street, which isn't a bank or brokerage. It's an apartment building.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, October 7, 2011 3:22 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...


Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:

If the video is accurate, those people were on the balcony at 55 Wall Street, which isn't a bank or brokerage. It's an apartment building.



While that is funny and telling of how we tend to see what we want to see... that would mean that is one damn big apartment they all share. Looks more like an event of some kind - maybe the second floor is a banquet/meeting space with a bar?

Hey, sure enough:

http://www.cipriani.com/locations/new-york/events/cipriani-wall-street
.php


"Cipriani Wall Street® stands as a triumph of Greek revival architecture, as well as a grand and luxurious venue for events. This New York landmark served as the home of the New York Merchants Exchange, the New York Stock Exchange, the United States Customs House, and the headquarters of the National City Bank. Framed by monolithic columns, Cipriani Wall Street® features a 70-foot ceiling with a Wedgewood dome. Impeccable attention to detail, the finest cuisine and classic service sets the stage for the most sought after social experiences."

EVENTS
Cipriani offers the world's most sought after social experiences. Two unique venues with distinct styles provide the perfect options for an effortless affair. These locations offer the finest skyline views, landmarked locations, Art Deco glamour and Italian Renaissance inspired architecture. Cipriani provides you with endless options and the freedom to design the most unique events. Celebrating the good life, Cipriani guests experience the finest of cuisine, impeccable attention to detail and classic service. Celebrate the Good Life — Cipriani Style."

I'm thinking with it's history and big dollar smell, this is where the 1% party.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, October 7, 2011 7:56 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Bytemite:
The appearance of coordinated protests in major cities calling themselves "Occupy Wall Street" and not being in New York, AND a website, AND a quality produced video.



You have heard of the internet, right?

Jesus.

Facebook, Godaddy, and a camcorder. All of these things you think indicate high-level backing are available with a credit card.

A "quality" video? Seriously? That's your measure? Have you not seen YouTube? I have High School students put together high quality videos in a couple days time.

Quote:

I might be paranoid, I might be crazy, but I am NOT dumb.




Im highly dubious.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, October 7, 2011 8:24 AM

BYTEMITE


Thank you. Your insults and general patronizing attitude that you contribute to every discussion are always appreciated.

Quote:

That's your measure?


NO, it wasn't, I believe I called out the level of organization seen in multiple cities first in the list of concerns I have, indicating that I am giving that concern a priority. The video and the website, and the fact that the website is not even originating in the US only serve to contribute to my suspicions.

But, by all means, continue to cherry pick and mischaracterize.

Or, if you just want a thread where you can celebrate your happy shiny movement, just say so, and I'll leave you to it. You don't have to bite my head off or chase me out.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, October 7, 2011 9:13 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Okay Byte, let's check this out,
Quote:

The appearance of coordinated protests in major cities calling themselves "Occupy Wall Street" and not being in New York, AND a website, AND a quality produced video.
First of all, as far as I know anyway, the demonstrations haven't been "coordinated"; they started in New York and others have started since then, something totally normal for many demonstrations That it all began in July and is only now spreading (as it gets media coverage) doesn't seem astroturfed to me; wouldn't they have organized all around the same time if that were so? Second the video is nothing, as mentioned anyone could have taken it, one of the marchers or anyone else, given everyone has a video camera these days. Third, the "demands" were made by ONE PERSON, and those demonstrating made very clear it doesn't represent them. The "proposed list" was submitted as a COMMENT by ONE PERSON, and it says quite clearly on the website:
Quote:

Admin note: This is not an official list of demands. This is a forum post submitted by a single user and hyped by irresponsible news/commentary agencies like Fox News and Mises.org. This content was not published by the OccupyWallSt.org collective, nor was it ever proposed or agreed to on a consensus basis with the NYC General Assembly. There is NO official list of demands.
The website states they disavowed any affiliation with the "OccupyParty.org" site, which appears to be a bogus site put up for nothing but to attract people to its advertisements:
Quote:

This Site Has Nothing To Do With Us

Posted Oct. 6, 2011, 11:48 a.m. EST by OccupyWallSt

occupyparty.org

We are not a political institution.

Lastly, if you go to the actual Occupy Wall Street website, you'll find one page under "about", which states:
Quote:

OccupyWallSt.org is the unofficial de facto online resource for the ongoing protests happening on Wall Street. We are an affinity group committed to doing technical support work for resistance movements. We are not affiliated with Adbusters, anonymous or any other organization.

The leaders of this movement are the everyday people participating in the occupation. We use a tool called the "General Assembly" to facilitate open, participatory and horizontal organizing between members of the public. We welcome people from all colors, genders and beliefs to participate in our daily assemblies. Visit the NYC General Assembly website to learn how you can become involved, read updates/minutes, or find out how you can adopt NYCGA processes to organize your own community.

Other than that, the page contains only press releases, one of which tells how they began:
Quote:

July Press Release

On 13 Jul 2011, the group Adbusters released this call: Occupy Wall Street!

In Solidarity, and as a response to this call, a planning group was formed [occupywallst.org], and an info sharing site established. The participation of every person, and every organization, that has an interest in returning the US back into the hands of it's individual citizens is required.

The original web page by Adbusters appears here: http://www.adbusters.org/blogs/adbusters-blog/occupywallstreet.html .

The rest of their site is made up of various pages, those being "News", "Live Stream", "Forum", "Chat", "User Map", "NYCGA" (NYC General Assembly), "about" and "donate". None of those include any of the kind of astroturfing messages on Tea Party websites (if you've seen any of them, you know what I mean). At the bottom of the "About" page it says
Quote:

this site was brought to you by various radicals
hosting for this site generously donated by alternet <3
email: general@occupywallst.org | help line: +1 (877) 881-3020

The Donations page is as follows:
Quote:

DONATE

Donate Money to #occupywallstreet

Top of Form
__________ Enter amount you would like to donate

__________ Submit donation to nicanet.org

You will taken to nicanet.org and asked to confirm. All donations through here are tax deductible.

Don’t be alarmed when you end up on nicanet.org this is the method that our sponsor Alliance for Global Justice provided to the NYCGA.

Bottom of Form

Mail your check or money order to the Alliance for Global Justice.
Please indicate “Occupy wall street” in the memo line.

Alliance for Global Justice
1247 “E” Street, SE
Washington, DC 20003

Or CALL at 202-544-9355 to make a telephone donation.

The following donations are managed by some of our working groups:

Live Streaming team
bitcoin.org - 1Q7DQVTubbUqr5by2YoZJRKCEzj9D3LQ9w

Donate yourself

Come to Liberty Plaza, formally Zuccotti Park. How to get there.
Liberty st and Broadway, Financial District, Manhattan, NY (map)

Donate Laundry and Shower

Comfort has created a form where you can sign up to host laundry and showers for the brave people holding the Plaza each night. Laundry and Shower Sign Up Form

Order Us Food

Order Panini Panini & Co 115 Broadway: Please try to focus on vegan and vegetarian options with some meat options.

Order Lemongrass Grill Lemongrass Grill: Please try to focus on vegan and vegetarian options with some meat options.

Order Tolache Tolache Taqueria: Please try to focus on vegan and vegetarian options with some meat options.

Liberatos pizza – order online – order the “Occu-pie”
Please order vegan or non-meat pizzas [smiley face graphic]

Other local business that deliver

Our physical address

118A Fulton st #205
New York, NY, 10038

Non perishable, no checks (money orders okay) , any size package okay

Given all of that, I believe they're grassroots. You'll have to make up your own mind.

And finally, sweetie, your post is about as patronizing as it gets; don't you find that a bit hypocritical when complaining about someone being patronizing? I understand your feelings, just sayin'.
Quote:

they're doing is not going to change one single solitary thing.
Cuda, what would you suggest, aside from revolution? Given the government is bought and paid for and has no desire to listen to the people of America who it supposedly represents, and those in the government who DO are stymied again and again by the right insisting on no taxes for the rich and trying to do away with what little regulation we HAVE on Wall Street, what is your valid suggestion people DO aside from march in the streets to have their voices heard?


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, October 7, 2011 9:18 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

And finally, sweetie, your post is about as patronizing as it gets; don't you find that a bit hypocritical when complaining about someone being patronizing? I understand your feelings, just sayin'.


It WOULD be... If I had SAID that. But I didn't. Cuda did.

I have taken enough glancing hits from people attacking other people, and being misunderstood and conflated with other people for now.

EDIT: I see that may have been an accident of paragraph order on the initial post, but I'm still mad. I might think that this movement is suspicious, hence the snark against it, but my offer to leave you alone was genuine. I'm not a hypocrite for trying to DEFEND myself. I wasn't being patronizing, I was being INSULTED.

Story, good work. You win. Niki, believe as you want.


NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, October 7, 2011 11:05 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Yes, it was an accident of paragraph order, which I changed immediately. As for myself, I've made no glancing blows or any other kind against you; I researched all the pertinent information I could find and posted it for you, to show how I had come to my conclusion that it is a grass roots movement, not astroturf. That is absolutely all...check my post, see if you can find any kind of snark directed at you. Certainly none was intended, none whatsoever. I had my own question as to what this movement is, and what I found is what helped me make up my mind. It's a shame you chose not to edit your own post, rather than leave it as it was.

I'm very confused; your offer to leave me alone? I don't recall seeing any such thing, did I miss something? Sometimes when I come back to a thread, I miss what went on in between. Or was that directed at Story? Given it seems to be responding to my noting that your reply to Story was pretty condescending, they seem to be tied together.

As for defending versus condescending, they are not mutually exclusive. I kinda saw what Story wrote and what you wrote as being two sides of the same coin, and pointed it out. One can defend oneself without stooping to the other person's level. Please read my first paragraph here. It's defending myself, but is it condescending, insulting, or anything other than explaining the facts? The "it's a shame" was not intended as condescending, I honestly wish you had; accusing me of something, then taking it back, yet saying at the same time that you're still mad, seems kinda unfair to me. If you're mad at Story, by all means, be mad at Story, but to me what you wrote seems like a "glancing blow" at me which was actually aimed at Story.

Thanx for the perspective, Pizmo, it's much appreciated.

Ooops, and here I was trying to bump the thread about the ACTUAL protest in hopes this one would fade down the list. Mea culpa; I was responding to Byte's post directed at me; I'm gonna take off now, hopefully this will fade on its own.


Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off



NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, October 8, 2011 10:00 AM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by Bytemite:
The appearance of coordinated protests in major cities calling themselves "Occupy Wall Street" and not being in New York, AND a website, AND a quality produced video.



You have heard of the internet, right?

Jesus.

Facebook, Godaddy, and a camcorder. All of these things you think indicate high-level backing are available with a credit card.

A "quality" video? Seriously? That's your measure? Have you not seen YouTube? I have High School students put together high quality videos in a couple days time.



Thanks for saying it, Story. My thoughts exactly.



-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, October 8, 2011 2:25 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


I believe the point Byte is trying to make is that there is at the very least an ATTEMPT to "astroturf" this movement. You have a bunch who have video, website, and some backing, and they are definitely trying to co-opt the message of the Occupy movement. That's pretty much the definition of astroturfing, which is taking something that IS "grassroots" and organic, and trying to make it artificial and pre-fab.



"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, October 8, 2011 3:11 PM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
I believe the point Byte is trying to make is that there is at the very least an ATTEMPT to "astroturf" this movement. You have a bunch who have video, website, and some backing, and they are definitely trying to co-opt the message of the Occupy movement. That's pretty much the definition of astroturfing, which is taking something that IS "grassroots" and organic, and trying to make it artificial and pre-fab.



Not so much, Mike.

Byte said that the way the movement's spreading can't possibly be organic. I beg to differ. There's lots of pissed off 99%-ers out there who've been waiting for this to get started. It's spreading quickly because it's a long overdue good idea, not because there's some Koch behind it.

Although, I somehow didn't process the part of Story's post with the whole Byte-might-be-dumb thing. Byte may have as many blind spots as the rest of us, but she sure as hell ain't dumb.


-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, October 8, 2011 3:30 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by mal4prez:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
I believe the point Byte is trying to make is that there is at the very least an ATTEMPT to "astroturf" this movement. You have a bunch who have video, website, and some backing, and they are definitely trying to co-opt the message of the Occupy movement. That's pretty much the definition of astroturfing, which is taking something that IS "grassroots" and organic, and trying to make it artificial and pre-fab.



Not so much, Mike.

Byte said that the way the movement's spreading can't possibly be organic. I beg to differ. There's lots of pissed off 99%-ers out there who've been waiting for this to get started. It's spreading quickly because it's a long overdue good idea, not because there's some Koch behind it.

Although, I somehow didn't process the part of Story's post with the whole Byte-might-be-dumb thing. Byte may have as many blind spots as the rest of us, but she sure as hell ain't dumb.


-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left




No, she's not dumb. Not by a long stretch.

I think at the moment is *IS* organic - some of you may remember a while back, I posted that this country was about one Rodney King beating away from its own Arab Spring. This seems to be that moment. It's spreading, not through some great plan or some George Soros-funded movement, but through Twitter, Facebook, and YouTube, as people around the country (and around the world!) see that there actually ARE others who are just as frustrated and pissed off as they are.

But Byte has a very valid point in saying that there's definitely some attempts going on to astroturf it. As with pretty much any human endeavor, you get something that gets enough attention, and you'll get scammers trying to hijack it to make money or to rip people off, or simply to try to steer the message to their own agenda.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, October 8, 2011 3:33 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Also, I've seen a few people posting on facebook and elsewhere that the tea-baggers are trying to insinuate themselves into the OWS movement now, and be a part of it. They say this with much anger and dismay. I say let 'em in. After all, polls show that majorities of Americans, majorities of Republicans, and even majorities of the Tea Party people support raising taxes on millionaires and billionaires.

If they're down with the movement, they're welcome to join. After all, it *IS* a movement made up of the other 99% of us!

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, October 8, 2011 8:56 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Quote:

Originally posted by Cuda77:
Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:




And that video right there proves to me with one defining image how utterly useless this whole Occupy Wall Street thing is. Honestly, I appreciate these people for speaking out and trying to do something but what they're doing is not going to change one single solitary thing. What they're doing is providing no threat or inconvenience or anything bad for the people in Wall Street. They're still there trading and making/losing lots of money despite what's going on outside. And they will continue to do so no matter how many people show up there or in other places around the country. Nothing is at stake for the bankers and traders so they have no reason to change or to "give in" to any of the demands.

Socialist and unashamed about it.




I dunno. They are receiving press throughout the world. I for one are sick of the idea of 'austerity meaures' hacking into services throughout the world, like social security got the world the GFC. It was the greed and dodgy practices of the financial sector, backed up by corrupt governments that have caused the current global client, not some old geezers pension. And its good to see it actually being 'outed'.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Tuesday, October 11, 2011 10:39 AM

CUDA77

Like woman, I am a mystery.


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Cuda, what would you suggest, aside from revolution? Given the government is bought and paid for and has no desire to listen to the people of America who it supposedly represents, and those in the government who DO are stymied again and again by the right insisting on no taxes for the rich and trying to do away with what little regulation we HAVE on Wall Street, what is your valid suggestion people DO aside from march in the streets to have their voices heard?



Apologies for being late in responding to this. Busy weekend.

My suggestion would be to do one of the few things left we have in this country that gives us power and VOTE. Everyone who agrees with this movement should find some local candidate intending on running for Congress who they think will be their champion for this issue and throw all their support behind them. Campaign for them. Attend rallies. Be apart of phone banks or groups that send out literature. And then next November, vote for them. That's really all we can do to try and change things. Simply standing around and yelling "You're mean! We don't like you!" simply isn't going to do it no matter how much press or support this thing gets. At least with voting, there is a slim chance that things might get accomplished. Granted, it's slim but it's better than nothing.

Socialist and unashamed about it.


NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Tuesday, October 11, 2011 3:59 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


My ultra liberal friend was super excited the other night, calling this "our Arab Spring" etc. It made me think, the term Arab Spring to describe what happened in Egypt and Libya this year is super cheesy. At the time I was neutral about the term, whatever, you know? But now it seems super cheeseball when I hear it coming out of Lise's mouth. Oh well.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Wednesday, October 12, 2011 12:49 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Riona, just smile and point out to her that that would make this the "American Fall".

Just sayin'.

"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservatives." - John Stuart Mill

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Wednesday, October 12, 2011 12:58 PM

BYTEMITE


o.o

Clever. I may have to steal it.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Wednesday, October 12, 2011 1:05 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Bytemite:
o.o

Clever. I may have to steal it.




You cannot steal what is freely given. :)

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

YOUR OPTIONS

NEW POSTS TODAY

USERPOST DATE

OTHER TOPICS

DISCUSSIONS
Trump, convicted of 34 felonies
Thu, November 28, 2024 03:56 - 44 posts
Thread of Trump Appointments / Other Changes of Scenery...
Thu, November 28, 2024 03:51 - 48 posts
Where Will The American Exodus Go?
Thu, November 28, 2024 03:25 - 1 posts
In the garden, and RAIN!!! (2)
Wed, November 27, 2024 23:34 - 4775 posts
Russia Invades Ukraine. Again
Wed, November 27, 2024 17:47 - 7510 posts
What's wrong with conspiracy theories
Wed, November 27, 2024 17:06 - 21 posts
Ellen Page is a Dude Now
Wed, November 27, 2024 17:05 - 238 posts
Bald F*ck MAGICALLY "Fixes" Del Rio Migrant Invasion... By Releasing All Of Them Into The U.S.
Wed, November 27, 2024 17:03 - 41 posts
Why does THUGR shit up the board by bumping his pointless threads?
Wed, November 27, 2024 16:43 - 32 posts
Joe Rogan: Bro, do I have to sue CNN?
Wed, November 27, 2024 16:41 - 7 posts
Elections; 2024
Wed, November 27, 2024 16:36 - 4845 posts
Biden will be replaced
Wed, November 27, 2024 15:06 - 13 posts

FFF.NET SOCIAL