REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

There are no words...

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Monday, February 6, 2012 12:35
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Sunday, January 29, 2012 1:18 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

The chairman of the Republican National Committee unveiled his latest attack on President Barack Obama on Sunday, comparing him to the captain of the wrecked Costa Concordia cruise ship.

"In a few months, this is all going to be ancient history and we're going to talk about our own little Captain Schettino, which is President Obama who's abandoning the ship here in the United States and is more interested in campaigning than doing his job as president," Priebus said on CBS' "Face the Nation."

Priebus added the president is "fleeing the American people," just like Schettino allegedly fled his cruise liner.

Following the jab, CBS host Bob Schieffer seemed caught off guard by Priebus' comment, asking with a laugh: "What did you just say? What did you call President Obama?"
Priebus was defiant in his response.

"I called him Captain Schettino, you know the captain that fled the ship in Italy," Priebus said. "That's our own president who's fleeing the American people and not doing his job."

The saddest thing of all is that the pathetic excuse for intelligent right-wingers here and on so many other websites will jump up and down and clap Priebus on the back. Any semblance of decency has long been abandoned by them, along with any semblance of intelligence or honesty.

Play among yourselves; today you guys are just too sick to even be entertaining. It's not worth being around the other, actually sane, people here to put up with you.




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Sunday, January 29, 2012 1:47 PM

WHOZIT


Yep, if he was the captain of a sinking ship he'd be the first in the life boat, he'd tear up and say, "my golf clubs are still on board!"

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 4:21 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
The chairman of the Republican National Committee unveiled his latest attack on President Barack Obama on Sunday, comparing him to the captain of the wrecked Costa Concordia cruise ship.

"In a few months, this is all going to be ancient history and we're going to talk about our own little Captain Schettino, which is President Obama who's abandoning the ship here in the United States and is more interested in campaigning than doing his job as president," Priebus said on CBS' "Face the Nation."



Niki.

You've said stuff about Republican politcians, and posted quotes from others, that are just as objectionable, and you apparently have no problem with it. Seems like a case of "She can dish it out, but she can't take it." on your part.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 4:22 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Newt abandoned Congress and wives on their deathbed.

Whats her name in Alaska abandoned the governors mansion.

Santorum abandoned Obama's embassy in China.

Romney abandoned Massachusettes.

Obama abandoned his Kenyan birth certificate in Indonesia.

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 4:52 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Obama has run the ship on the ground, so the analogy is apt.

The silly , nonsensical definition of 'fascism' is hysterically false.

Obama is installing fascism as we speak. Govt control of private enterprise.




" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 5:49 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Obama is installing fascism as we speak
Yep.
Quote:

Private enterprise in control of govt
Fixed it for you, you had it bass akwards.

But don't worry- Obama is on the same page as Bush, and Romney and Gingrich are on the same page as Obama.

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Sunday, January 29, 2012 6:28 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by SignyM:

Fixed it for you, you had it bass akwards.

But don't worry- Obama is on the same page as Bush, and Romney and Gingrich are on the same page as Obama.



No, you didn't 'FIX' anything. All you've done is transpose words to fit your fantasy view of the world.

Govt take over of GMC, the student loans industry, the banks,... it's YOU who has it " bass akwards ".


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, January 30, 2012 11:52 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Since when has government "taken over" banks, the auto industry, or even health insurance? Last I saw, the government hemorrhaged trillions of taxpayer dollars into financial institutions. So, the government owns AIG now? Goldman Sachs does Obama's bidding? We get a cut of Chase Morgan into the Federal budget? The government rakes in a tidy profit from health insurances? Makes a profit from each GM car sold? We have federal employees making up the boards of these entities?

Wow.

From where I see it, the taxpayer collectively got reamed and got precious little for it. I'd call that government doing the bidding of (so-called) private enterprise, not the other way around.

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Monday, January 30, 2012 12:01 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Obama has run the ship on the ground, so the analogy is apt.




Sure, sure, if you ignore the state the country was in when he took office, which of course, you do.

Life in the GOP bubble. Rappy wouldn't live anywhere else. Facts be damned.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, January 30, 2012 12:01 PM

HERO


Quote:

Originally posted by piratenews:
Newt abandoned Congress and wives on their deathbed.

Whats her name in Alaska abandoned the governors mansion.

Santorum abandoned Obama's embassy in China.

Romney abandoned Massachusettes.

Obama abandoned his Kenyan birth certificate in Indonesia.


I note for the record that Santorum never served in China or as any part of the Obama administration. You are thinking of Huntsman. He did abandon his campaign this week to spend time with his young daughter in the hospital.

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.
"I agree with Hero." Niki2, 2011.

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Monday, January 30, 2012 12:30 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Oops, missed this one:
Quote:

You've said stuff about Republican politcians, and posted quotes from others, that are just as objectionable
Uh, I don't believe either I or anyone I have quoted is the CHAIRMAN OF any political party? I can take it, I've shown it quite clearly by the amount of truly obscene things hurled at me, especially by...what's his name? Was it "Kane"? I forget. And OBAMA can take it, trust me; it's too stupid for him to do otherwise. I pointed out, and I decry, the absurdity of making such a comparison and how it shows the Republican Party for just what it is. A group so intent on getting rid of Obama that they don't care what they or THEIR CHAIRMAN say, however absurd and asinine, nor do they care about the condition of America or the American people, or anyone ELSE for that matter, except the rich who pay for their campaigns. His statement is nothing but a blowhard utilizing anything he can pull out of the air to tar Obama; they do it every day and will go right on doing it...and it has nothing to do with "dishing" it out...Priebus offered it on a platter hisownself.

Ach, Story, you already KNOW Rap, et al., will positively ignore anything prior to 2008 (unless it's negative about Obama, liberals, Democrats, etc., etc.). The world began when Obama took office, and nobody else did anything bad before he stepped INTO that office--for them at least--you know that! The fact that the ship had already run aground, and was chugging along pushing itself into the ground, has nothing to do with their thinking, EVER, they stop listening when they've swallowed enough pablum, then regurgitate it cheerfully to whoever will pay attention.



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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 4:33 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Uh, I don't believe either I or anyone I have quoted is the CHAIRMAN OF any political party?



Did I say you were? Objectionable is objectionable, be it from a party chairman, a blogger, or an individual. Just because you're not a higher-up doesn't mean you aren't responsible for your language and conduct.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 5:08 AM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by SignyM:
Since when has government "taken over" banks, the auto industry, or even health insurance? Last I saw, the government hemorrhaged trillions of taxpayer dollars into financial institutions. So, the government owns AIG now? Goldman Sachs does Obama's bidding? We get a cut of Chase Morgan into the Federal budget? The government rakes in a tidy profit from health insurances? Makes a profit from each GM car sold? We have federal employees making up the boards of these entities?

Wow.

From where I see it, the taxpayer collectively got reamed and got precious little for it. I'd call that government doing the bidding of (so-called) private enterprise, not the other way around.



US Government owns a 26% stake of GM and Obama forced out its CEO, Rick Wagoner. US. Government owned a 78% stake in AIG. US Government owned a 36% stake in Citibank.

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/business/companies/general_motors_c
orporation/index.html

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2011/11/21/142600494/former-aig-ex
ec-sues-federal-government-for-25-billion-over-takeover

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/citi-finalizes-us-exchange-sets-right
s-offer


The problem being with Big Government owning a stake in these companies and also being responsible for oversight and regulation, there's a HUGE conflict of interest. See the latest controversy over the Chevy Volt. And since the Obama administration basically appointed the new CEO of GM, that sounds like government dictating to business.

But I will agree with you wholeheartedly on the point that the taxpayer is getting the raw end of this deal.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 6:33 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Uh, I don't believe either I or anyone I have quoted is the CHAIRMAN OF any political party?



Did I say you were? Objectionable is objectionable, be it from a party chairman, a blogger, or an individual. Just because you're not a higher-up doesn't mean you aren't responsible for your language and conduct.

"Keep the Shiny side up"



Way to deliberately miss the point!

Of course you don't see a difference between a random person saying these things, and a prominent leader of the party - because you'd have to be honest to do so.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 6:40 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


That's the most amazing thing...I can't quite grasp it. You have NO recognition of anyone's need to be civil to the President of the United States? In other words, you make no differentiation between say a bunch of teenage boys hanging together who rag on one of their teachers, and any one of those boys saying those same things to the teacher's face in front of the class? Or any million other scenarios wherein a "regular person" says something negative about someone in private but knows full well that it's wrong to say those things in public to their face. Amazing. It means nothing to you that the Chairman of a party is supposed to represent that party, that elected officials are expected to behave with SOME modicum of decency, etc., etc.

In which case, what can I say? "There are no words..."



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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 8:29 AM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Uh, I don't believe either I or anyone I have quoted is the CHAIRMAN OF any political party? I can take it, I've shown it quite clearly by the amount of truly obscene things hurled at me, especially by...what's his name? Was it "Kane"? I forget. And OBAMA can take it, trust me; it's too stupid for him to do otherwise. I pointed out, and I decry, the absurdity of making such a comparison and how it shows the Republican Party for just what it is. A group so intent on getting rid of Obama that they don't care what they or THEIR CHAIRMAN say, however absurd and asinine, nor do they care about the condition of America or the American people, or anyone ELSE for that matter, except the rich who pay for their campaigns. His statement is nothing but a blowhard utilizing anything he can pull out of the air to tar Obama; they do it every day and will go right on doing it...and it has nothing to do with "dishing" it out...Priebus offered it on a platter hisownself.


Pot to Kettle, Pot to Kettle, you are black, over.

http://www.newenglandcouncil.com/media-article/national-dnc-chair-wast
es-little-time-to-attack-romney
/

Quote:


BEDFORD – Less than 12 hours after Republican Mitt Romney’s primary win Tuesday, a top Democratic leader was already attacking the GOP front-runner on jobs and taxes.

With the presidential primary over, New Hampshire has again become a two-party battleground. And Democratic National Committee Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz called Romney a “wounded candidate” at Wednesday’s Politics and Eggs breakfast hosted by the New Hampshire Institute of Politics.

Wasserman Schultz wasted little time in her talk before going on the attack against Romney, who has built a head of steam toward the Republican presidential nomination.

She criticized his corporate past and his party’s tax policies, contrasting them with President Barack Obama’s first-term achievements.

There was little doubt Wasserman Schultz had taken off her party’s gloves. For emphasis she told the non-partisan crowd, “On to victory.”...



It is a campaign season. The rhetoric will be flying hot and heavy. Priebus' comments are fine of themselves, although I take exception to the comparison to the Costa Concoria shipwreck. But only for the fact that people lost their lives. That should impart a period of respectful silence regarding the disaster, but not regarding criticisms of Obama's job performance.

There are better ways to highlight criticism of Obama's job performance than taking topical events and massaging them to fit your message. A mere perusal of 2008 campaign promises would provide more than enough fodder to damn Obama.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 8:43 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

That's the most amazing thing...I can't quite grasp it. You have NO recognition of anyone's need to be civil to the President of the United States? In other words, you make no differentiation between say a bunch of teenage boys hanging together who rag on one of their teachers, and any one of those boys saying those same things to the teacher's face in front of the class? Or any million other scenarios wherein a "regular person" says something negative about someone in private but knows full well that it's wrong to say those things in public to their face. Amazing. It means nothing to you that the Chairman of a party is supposed to represent that party, that elected officials are expected to behave with SOME modicum of decency, etc., etc.

In which case, what can I say? "There are no words..."



I don't either.

If I were in Roman times, should I respect Nero? Caligula? People only buy into titles having entitlements if they also buy into the concept of TITLES too. I believe what the person actually does to be a far more important qualifier than what they're supposed to be doing or what they're supposed to represent.

I pretty much say what I think about people.

On the other hand, there is a such thing as not profiting from a tragedy that I have pretty strong feelings about.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 9:31 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Government had a stake in... but didn't have a voting role, and gave up its interests as soon as a turnaround began. So the question as to who was doing whose bidding, maybe it was 80-20, but still pretty much in favor of corporations. But thanks for the info; I will read it when I have more time.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 9:59 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by CaveTroll:
Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Uh, I don't believe either I or anyone I have quoted is the CHAIRMAN OF any political party? I can take it, I've shown it quite clearly by the amount of truly obscene things hurled at me, especially by...what's his name? Was it "Kane"? I forget. And OBAMA can take it, trust me; it's too stupid for him to do otherwise. I pointed out, and I decry, the absurdity of making such a comparison and how it shows the Republican Party for just what it is. A group so intent on getting rid of Obama that they don't care what they or THEIR CHAIRMAN say, however absurd and asinine, nor do they care about the condition of America or the American people, or anyone ELSE for that matter, except the rich who pay for their campaigns. His statement is nothing but a blowhard utilizing anything he can pull out of the air to tar Obama; they do it every day and will go right on doing it...and it has nothing to do with "dishing" it out...Priebus offered it on a platter hisownself.


Pot to Kettle, Pot to Kettle, you are black, over.

http://www.newenglandcouncil.com/media-article/national-dnc-chair-wast
es-little-time-to-attack-romney
/

Quote:


BEDFORD – Less than 12 hours after Republican Mitt Romney’s primary win Tuesday, a top Democratic leader was already attacking the GOP front-runner on jobs and taxes.

With the presidential primary over, New Hampshire has again become a two-party battleground. And Democratic National Committee Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz called Romney a “wounded candidate” at Wednesday’s Politics and Eggs breakfast hosted by the New Hampshire Institute of Politics.

Wasserman Schultz wasted little time in her talk before going on the attack against Romney, who has built a head of steam toward the Republican presidential nomination.

She criticized his corporate past and his party’s tax policies, contrasting them with President Barack Obama’s first-term achievements.

There was little doubt Wasserman Schultz had taken off her party’s gloves. For emphasis she told the non-partisan crowd, “On to victory.”...



It is a campaign season. The rhetoric will be flying hot and heavy. Priebus' comments are fine of themselves, although I take exception to the comparison to the Costa Concoria shipwreck. But only for the fact that people lost their lives. That should impart a period of respectful silence regarding the disaster, but not regarding criticisms of Obama's job performance.

There are better ways to highlight criticism of Obama's job performance than taking topical events and massaging them to fit your message. A mere perusal of 2008 campaign promises would provide more than enough fodder to damn Obama.



Ah, the standard right wing defense - if the Left says ANYTHING bad about ANYONE, then it justifies any degree of angry rhetoric.

Like this. Pointing to a poor economic record is EXACTLY the same as comparing the President to a murderous criminal.

You really live up to your name, dontcha? I bet FoxNews is the only channel you get in your cave.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 11:21 AM

CAVETROLL


I'm sorry, I thought I heard something. Like maybe the far-off screaming of a small, insignificant... thing. I'm sure it won't leave a mark on the world.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 11:31 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

I take exception to the comparison to the Costa Concoria shipwreck. But only for the fact that people lost their lives. That should impart a period of respectful silence regarding the disaster, but not regarding criticisms of Obama's job performance.

There are better ways to highlight criticism of Obama's job performance than taking topical events and massaging them to fit your message.



Quote:

Like this. Pointing to a poor economic record is EXACTLY the same as comparing the President to a murderous criminal.


Don't believe Cavetroll did. Specifically, that reads like a condemnation of doing so, with a side order of pointing out that both sides say reprehensible things about each other.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 11:32 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

Pointing to a poor economic record is EXACTLY the same as comparing the President to a murderous criminal.
Astonishing, isn't it? It certainly explains why they have no boundaries whatsoever; if everything equals everything, nobody's responsible for anything. That helps me understand why Obama has been so incredibly disrespected by people in office and supposedly responsible adults. I'm not talking about the fringe; I expect no better from the fringe on either side. But it's been amazing to hear what's been coming out of the mouths of those who supposedly REPRESENT us, those who supposedly WORK WITH the President, etc. But now I get it. There are no rules; there is no responsibility. Wow.

p.s. I would have said "cowardly" criminal, not murderous, myself; he didn't actually murder anyone, people just died because of his cowardly actions...but that's neither here nor there. So I guess we're just supposed to become like those other countries where the legislative bodies periodically break out into massive fist-fights...won't we be proud of ourselves THEN!?

Byte, if everyone said what they thought about everyone else, we'd be perpetually at war. That's the reason for "civility", and the lack of it is exactly what you see playing out before you, with the obvious result: Nobody's doing anything, nobody's working on any solutions, they're just going after each other with full venom. That's what we expect in a campaign season (which doesn't make it right), but there should be a limit--SOME limit or other, which this time around apparently there is not.

Do you really believe people should say what they think to/about one another all the time?? As far as I'm concerned, my opinions on people might not be completely fair and/or I might not know all the facts, so while griping privately is one thing, I think it wrong to bad-mouth someone in public and I've never shoved my finger in someone's face. And yes, I believe in behaving at least somewhat respectfully to people in office in public; to do otherwise invites anarchy. If I don't like someone or what they did, I'll work to get them out of office, not make an ass out of myself in public. Because that's exactly what it is--be it left or right, and tho' I accept some degree of lack of civility, making a public statement that Obama is the same as an irresponsible ship captain who cost the lives of numerous people is disrespectful to both Obama and the families of those who died.

Apparently we have very different standards.



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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 1:20 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

we'd be perpetually at war


That's silly. I'm not at war with any of you.

Quote:

That's the reason for "civility", and the lack of it is exactly what you see playing out before you, with the obvious result: Nobody's doing anything, nobody's working on any solutions


But, the solutions they come up with are awful. Why do we want them to be successful?

Quote:

And yes, I believe in behaving at least somewhat respectfully to people in office in public; to do otherwise invites anarchy.


0_o

*points at self*

Really, this shouldn't be so surprising.

Quote:

making a public statement that Obama is the same as an irresponsible ship captain who cost the lives of numerous people is disrespectful to both Obama and the families of those who died.


I don't care at all about someone being disrespectful to Obama. He's a public figure. This is part of the territory. I felt the same way about Sarah Palin's whining - though I also thought her whining was just to make herself more popular.

I do think it's tasteless to profit from the deaths of the people aboard the cruise ship, and I also think it's bad form to bring someone's family into a debate. If someone has a point, they should be able to stay on topic, or at least on target. At the same time, even though ad hominem attacks are a fallacy, it's not exactly like we could ever outlaw them.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 2:34 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Several Presidents have been assassinated, one within my lifetime. There were many assassination attempts, one within my lifetime resulting in injury to a sitting President. Some were hung and burned in effigy. It's hard to get more disrespectful than that. So to say that this is the worst ever is something of an exaggeration.

What bothers me about the criticism of Obama is that it's ludicrous. He's a Kenyan? A Muslim? A socialist? Soft on illegal immigration? Really??? Aren't there enough legitimate criticisms of Obama without resorting to lunacy?

As far as comparisons to Captain Francesco Schettino, there is absolutely NO comparison. Captain Schettino was responsible for about 20 deaths. Obama is responsible for a lot more.

AFA Presidents "deserving" respect... one of the things that I always find insanely humorous (when I watch "24" and other military-action shows) is that these combat-and-torture-tested characters nearly wet their pants when the President show up. "OMG it's the President!". *snicker* That gets another REALLY? from me. I was extremely disrespectful of Bush, and he deserved it, and not too crazy about Reagan either.

For all you older folks, take a trip down memory lane with me: Do you remember when Reagan had polyps removed from his colon, when he was President? His poor memory was notable even then. So the joke went around: Say, how is Reagan like a bad typewriter? Because he has no memory and no colon!

Like I said- not the first time anyone was ever disrespectful to a President. Just the first time (that I can recall) that people consistently reached for such weird fantasies as the basis for their criticism.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 2:49 PM

BYTEMITE


^That.

In my view, questioning the president and disrespecting/opposing the president are a cause and effect relationship. Really, to consider that someone has intentionally done something wrong is technically disrespect, because how can you respect someone who has intentionally done something you think is wrong?

So I think there is little point in questioning the president's actions if one can't later disrespect him for it. You have to be able to follow through. There has to be consequences for someone who has so much responsibility, lest the power be abused, and one of those consequences is the possibility their approval rate can drop.

Perhaps you can oppose someone without disrespecting them, but I feel it's important to keep all options open.

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 2:59 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I think that in public, while addressing the public there are certain things one ought not say. I think that the comparison here is rude and insensative, since its such a recent event. I tend to believe in dissing on people within limits. Of course at home I have a reputation, not a good one, of talking trash about people. Its not something I'm proud of and I know it can get out of hand sometimes, but I try not to do it in public at least.

I think criticism of the president, whomever he may be, for things he's done and not done is fine, but sometimes people step over the line a bit. I'm not as bothered about it as Niki, but I can see why some people are. It was lacking in taste.

On Byte's point though its true that people do have the right to say these things if they choose to and I'm not into taking that right away or censoring that right. I think people create their own consequences often in life.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Tuesday, January 31, 2012 2:59 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


In public, one must never threaten the President. THAT will get you a visit by the Secret Service or the FBI or both.

Comparing Obama to Schettino is ludicrous. Schettino only caused a few dozen deaths, Obama has caused thousands. That's an apple to apples comparison. Let's be fair.

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 4:05 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
That's the most amazing thing...I can't quite grasp it. You have NO recognition of anyone's need to be civil to the President of the United States?



I would prefer that everyone be civil. That includes the Chairman of the Republican party talking about Pres. Obama, or you talking about the Republican candidates. What's amazing to me is that you complain about other folk's incivility, yet ignore your own. The fact that you're not in a postion of authority, or that your audience is smaller, does not make what you say any less objectionable.

That being said, both you and the Republican chairman have a right to be pretty much as uncivil as you choose, and others have a right to criticize both of you for such uncivility.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 4:37 AM

BLUEHANDEDMENACE


Actually, the fact that Niki has not been entrusted by the people to represent their interests, and her comments are posted on a message board instead of made public in the media, means *EXACTLY* that anything she says isnt as objectionable as what a Chairman of a political party says about a sitting President, any chairman or other elected official, about any President.

And before you start pointing fingers and playing left-right....the exact same thing is true of u, Rappy, and everyone else on this board.

No matter how obnoxious, offensive, or just plain rude anyone on this board may be, it will never be as unacceptable, and cosidered as uncivil, as something like screaming "You Lie!" in the middle of a congressional address.

Context matters, yes?

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 7:33 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:
That includes the Chairman of the Republican party talking about Pres. Obama, or you talking about the Republican candidates.



There's that false equivalence ya'll like so much.

Yep, some person on a message board is JUST LIKE the chairman of the party....

Once again, there is no word more appropo for you than:

Douche.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 8:06 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Thank you, Blue, for expressing what I was trying to say far more eloquently and conciely than I could. That's exactly my point. I have absolutely nothing against anyone dissing anyone, public figure or private. I'm not making myself clear. My only problem is with people in office or who represent an entire group of people going over the line is something I find offensive. The "you lie" thing, shouted out the House of Congress. This comparison by the supposed head of the Republican Party. A governor shaking her finger in the President's face. Those things I find offensive.

ANYTHING said here is unimportant, in my view; we all have freedom of speech and, especially on the internet, people express themselves in ways they might not IRL. Candidates in elections...sigh...we can expect no better of. Before you jump on me about freedom of speech, I'm talking about civility and respect to the highest office in the land, whoever happens to inhabit it.

I guess today we CAN expect no better, we have enough evidence of that. But I can still decry it and be disgusted by it when it is exhibited by public officials we have elected to represent us and who we SHOULD expect not to make asses out of themselves (except they do, Bachman and Palin being prime examples). When they do, it disgusts me, and I have the freedom of speech to say so.

As far as I'm concerned, yes, a modicum of civility is important and it's not always acceptable to say what you think of someone in public or to their faces. If you give yourself leave to say anything to anyone, we truly would NOT survive as a society, in my opinion. I can't believe you really want us to degenerate into some of those places you see legislators screaming in each others' faces and coming to blows. I certainly do not.

Byte, would you really go up to your teacher or your boss and say "You're a complete asshole, I think you're a lousey boss/teacher/whatever"? If so...oh hell. I should shut up; I don't think I'm making myself clear even now. "What Blue said" and I'll let it go at that.



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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 8:25 AM

BYTEMITE


I didn't really have a problem with any teachers after my first grade teacher. But she and I hated each other, and we knew both let each other know it. Eventually, I got her fired.

There was also the moderator at another board I posted on who I clashed with constantly. And the guy from an even earlier message board who crossed the line with a very nasty email when I was thirteen.

Oh yes. I don't hold back punches. It takes something pretty drastic to piss me off that much though.

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 9:06 AM

CAVETROLL


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
...A governor shaking her finger in the President's face...


From the folks I know in Arizona, they're pretty happy with their governor on this issue. They've been on their own with illegal aliens for going on 12 years. This administration is giving them pushback, the previous administration gave them pushback and weak responses.

Brewer herself described the president's attitude in their meeting as "condescending and patronizing". After he failed to respond to 5 letters from her regarding the border problems with Mexico. The background for their meeting on the tarmac is the insulting way Obama's administration is treating Arizona by suing that state for trying to enforce laws against illegal aliens, withdrawing National Guardsmen from the Mexican border, initiating a civil rights investigation of Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio and the scandal of the "Fast and Furious" gun-sale operation.

And you are getting your knickers in a twist over a waved finger? (Not even the really insulting one.)

Jan Brewer is the highest elected official in Arizona. It is her job to deal with Washington and any other states. She was showing Obama an appropriate level of respect given the prior treatment Brewer, and Arizona, have received from Obama.

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 10:33 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Cave, you have to understand how the liberal mind works.

See, to them, it's FUNNY when someone throws a shoe at the head of the President ( and misses ), provided that President is a Republican.


However, when a President , who is much younger and taller than the female Gov of AZ, grabs her by the elbow and sternly lectures her as he wags his finger in HER face, she's not allowed to wave her finger back in HIS face, even though he started it.

You see, to the Left, SHE is being disrespectful.

Got it ?

Good.



" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 10:42 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


A) Those throwing shoes were neither Americans nor American officials. I laughed when Kennedy said "I'm a bagel" too and the Germans sneered at him...

B)
Quote:

when a President , who is much younger and taller than the female Gov of AZ, grabs her by the elbow and sternly lectures her as he wags his finger in HER face, she's not allowed to wave her finger back in HIS face, even though he started it.
Care to provide proof of that? I haven't heard it in any news story nor read it from any verifiable source anywhere.



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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 10:49 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

See, to them, it's FUNNY when someone throws a shoe at the head of the President ( and misses ), provided that President is a Republican.


That was awesome. Why hasn't anyone thrown a shoe at Obama? Instead we get finger-wagging. Americans are lame.

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 10:54 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Regarding Brewer, I think you're a bit out of date. As of two months ago:
Quote:

A new poll suggests that Gov. Jan Brewer’s job approval ratings have plummeted.

The poll, conducted by North Carolina-based Public Policy Polling, indicates that 42 percent of respondents approve of Brewer’s job performance, while 49 percent disapprove. Nine percent said they were “not sure” whether they approved or disapproved.
.....
Thirty-two percent of respondents said they would support a recall of Brewer. http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PoliticalInsider/149298 not everyone feels as your friends do. From PHOENIX news:
Quote:

Last week, we asked our readers to come up with their own captions for the above photo of Governor Jan Brewer humiliating Arizona (yet again) for this week's New Times You Write the Caption contest.

Brewer, as you know, stuck her finger in the face of President Barack Obama as the two argued on the tarmac at Phoenix-Mesa Gateway Airport in Mesa on Wednesday.

Get all the details here.

We had 120 responses in the comment section of the post, which you can see by clicking here.

We've narrowed it down to five finalists, but only one can win the grand prize: a pay-your-own-way trip to the historic New Times building, a firm handshake, and a lukewarm glass of Phoenix's municipal tap water.

The finalists are as follows:

Yogurt4Lunch with "Don't you dare tell me I've had too much to drink. My daddy died fighting the Nazi's at Huntington Beach."

OnlyinArizona with "Listen up brown boy - you aint takin ONE MORE STEP into my State til I see dem der birth papers of yours. Me 'n' uncle joe run this place, and we say what goes down here....."

Newwest with "Scorpions for Breakfast? Actually, I had four martinis for lunch."

david saint with "(Ding ding ding) LETS GET READY TO RUBMBLE!! In that corner, we have a Harvard graduate, a former US Senator, and current president, MR Obama! (cheers). Notable wins include Killing Osama, several other Terrorists, and is the man who brought back the auto industry.

"Our challenger: shes a fiesty one with scorpions all around her (Chuck Coughlin), has no college education, got away with a DUI in the state with the harshest DUI laws, slurs her words all the time, and cant complete a coherent sentence..ladies and gentleman, Jan 'We Have Did' Brewer! (crickets)." http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/2012/01/best_reader_capti
on_for_photo_16.php
]



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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 10:58 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


As to deportations, again, as of three months ago:
Quote:

President Obama Holds the Highest Deportation Record New Statistics Revealed

In a shocking revelation that sent chills down the spine of all illegal aliens in the United States, it was revealed on October 26, 2011 by the Department of Homeland Security that the Obama administration succeeded in deporting 396,906 immigrants from the United States.

This is acclaimed to be the largest record ever attained by any past U.S. President in deportation.

Statistics show that in 2000, 188,465 people were deported. In 2001, 189,026 were affected. In 2002, it was 165,168. The figure rose to 211,096 in 2003. It went higher again in 2004 to 240,665. The rising trend was maintained in 2005 as it hit 246,431deportations and another 280,974 in 2006. In 2007, this pattern peaked at 319,382. In 2008, it stopped when the number hit 359,795. In 2009, the first year of President Obama, the figured reached 395,165. In 2010, which was his second year, 387,242 people were returned to their home countries while in 2011, the record breaking massive deportation of 396,906 was accomplished. http://www.usimmigrationnewspaper.com/index.php?option=com_content&
;view=article&id=418:president-obama-holds-the-highest-deportation-record-new-statistics-revealed-&catid=67:cover-story
]



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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 11:00 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
However, when a President , who is much younger and taller than the female Gov of AZ, grabs her by the elbow and sternly lectures her as he wags his finger in HER face, she's not allowed to wave her finger back in HIS face, even though he started it.



Trying your hand at fiction writing, I see. And no better at it than at anything else.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 11:00 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Byte, I'm losing faith in you. It appears that you are losing what I used to see as your fairness and neutrality and becoming as partisan as some of our worst posters. You really think it would be "awesome" if some American threw a shoe at Obama? I think that's sad, especially coming from you.



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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 11:02 AM

BYTEMITE


When I think it was also awesome that someone threw a shoe at George W. Bush? Obama's killed less people in the Middle East, but "less" doesn't mean "none at all." Considering the cultural norms, where that gesture is an insult and a protest, not a form of violence, then yes, I'd like to see everyone in office have a shoe thrown at them.

I hate them both, and I hate both parties. I've made that pretty clear. I've never been fair and I'm not neutral in the sense you think. I just direct my attacks at the people who deserve them.

Let's keep this argument on topic, instead of feeling sad for my nascent partisanism. A number of people here appear to think that it is just fine to disrespect a president - I'm one of the ones that doesn't particularly care which president we're talking about.

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 11:28 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
However, when a President , who is much younger and taller than the female Gov of AZ, grabs her by the elbow and sternly lectures her as he wags his finger in HER face, she's not allowed to wave her finger back in HIS face, even though he started it.



Trying your hand at fiction writing, I see. And no better at it than at anything else.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"




This is interesting. First, I checked out the clip from MSNBC...

http://www.myvidster.com/video/4152438/Video_Brewers_motivation_to_con
front_Obama


Curious, the only clear shot they have of the meeting is the still, of her waving her finger. ( You can also see his right arm appears to bent, as he grabs onto her elbow.

And then there's THIS video..( sorry, check the beta site. No idea why vids aren't posting up here for me now )

Which has a better shot of his right arm...

Sorry if you think what I said was fiction, but it's what I heard her say about the incident, in a radio interview. It's clear that HE was the one who initiated the confrontation, by bringing up the comments she had made in her book. There seems little doubt on that point.

So, you were saying ?


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 12:01 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I have no doubt that when she gave him the letter asking for a meeting, he responded that she had characterized their last meeting as "cordial", etc., in public then wrote what she did in her book. Beyond that, I've heard several different versions from Brewer herself, including that she felt "intimidated" (?), so I'll withhold belief of any one of them.

I will also freely grant that Obama should have stayed in "politician" role and not brought up the lie, perhaps smiled, taken the letter and have left it at that. At the least he should have extricated himself sooner, bland smile, nod of the head and turning away would have been the "diplomatic" thing to do.

On the other hand, she clearly did stick her finger in his face, and in my opinion used it as an opportunity to ride it into the ground to get as much attention as possible out of it.

So there is sufficient blame on both sides, but I will retain my opinion that it's wrong to behave in such a fashion when one is the Governor of a state speaking to the President of the country.

Having watched the MSNBC clip, I agree with the statement that they INVITE you to greet the President, you don't have to go, but if you DO go, you should behave civilly. That's just my opinion.


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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 1:49 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Sorry if you think what I said was fiction, but it's what I heard her say about the incident,



This is the woman who completely changed her story about the first meeting.

And you call others "sheep".

Adorable.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, February 1, 2012 2:03 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Sorry if you think what I said was fiction, but it's what I heard her say about the incident,



This is the woman who completely changed her story about the first meeting.

And you call others "sheep".

Adorable.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"



She was being diplomatic, in a moment right after she was leaving the White House.

I got no problem with her coming out and telling the truth in a book. Clearly, you -and Obama- do.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, February 2, 2012 4:54 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by BlueHandedMenace:
Actually, the fact that Niki has not been entrusted by the people to represent their interests, and her comments are posted on a message board instead of made public in the media, means *EXACTLY* that anything she says isnt as objectionable as what a Chairman of a political party says about a sitting President, any chairman or other elected official, about any President.



I consider it just as objectionable. The Republican chairman gets more air play, but the insult is just as real.

It's sort'a like you killing a homeless person and then saying "Well, he wasn't really that important, so I shouldn't be punished".

Quote:

And before you start pointing fingers and playing left-right....the exact same thing is true of u, Rappy, and everyone else on this board.


Cite one instance where I have insulted the President, or pretty much any politician.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Thursday, February 2, 2012 5:25 AM

BLUEHANDEDMENACE


Do you really read that sentence and comprehend from it that I said u attacked the President???

Seriously???

Your analogy is completely insane also btw. U are comparing speech (suppossedly free) to murder? Really?

Again I am having a hard time believing that these are serious statements that you are making.

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Thursday, February 2, 2012 6:47 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
She was being diplomatic, in a moment right after she was leaving the White House.

I got no problem with her coming out and telling the truth in a book. Clearly, you -and Obama- do.



Suuuure. Her unprepared, off-the-cuff response right after the fact was the lie...

But her anti-Obama version, written much later, in a book aimed at an Obama hating audience.... that's the unvarnished truth.

HAHAHA. Riiiiight. I doubt you are even that stupid - and that's saying a LOT.

You may as well have just typed "Baaaah" over and over, it would have been more honest.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Thursday, February 2, 2012 8:11 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

DNC chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz (Fla.) said the expected endorsement of Republican frontrunner Mitt Romney by reality show host Donald Trump was "a non-news event" and mocked both for making millions "firing people" during an interview Thursday morning.

"It really wouldn't be surprising if Donald Trump supports Mitt Romney, because they both like firing people and they've both made millions doing it," Wasserman Schultz said on MSNBC. "Donald Trump is such a cartoon character, an endorsement no matter who he chooses is like Bugs Bunny making an endorsement."



So. Any words for this?

http://thehill.com/video/campaign/208263-wasserman-schultz-trumps-supp
ort-is-like-bugs-bunny-making-an-endorsement


"Keep the Shiny side up"

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