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Originally posted by AURaptor:

omg... the end of the world as we know it!!!

ROFLMAO !!!

]

That should be dedicated to Whozit. Tears you can laugh at.

At least the libs are taking the loss in a calm, mature and adult manner:

http://twitchy.com/2012/06/06/kill-scott-walker-angry-libs-flood-twitt
er-with-death-threats-after-wisconsin-recall-defeat/

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A Madison City Clerk has told a Wisconsin radio host that turnout for the area is expected at over 100%, up to 119%...

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Originally posted by Storymark:
Not surprising. Money talks, and Walker spent 8 times what his opponent did.

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Walker collected $30.5 million to Barrett's $4 million. Roughly two-thirds of Walker's contributions came from out of state, the Center for Public Integrity reported, while only a quarter of Barrett's funds originated from outside Wisconsin.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
http://twitchy.com/2012/06/06/kill-scott-walker-angry-libs-flood-twitt
er-with-death-threats-after-wisconsin-recall-defeat/


While the media phonied up outrage over Sarah Palin's innocent, harmless facebook page, showing location icons on STATES, and voting districts, this is what we see from the Left...



Stay classy, Libs. Stay classy.

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Originally posted by Storymark:
Always nice to hear from the Wulftard, once again proving his understanding of even basic politics to be somewhere sub-kindergarten level.

National Socialists... LOL. Do you use a stopwatch to guage how quickly you Godwin yourself? Can you even work a stopwatch?

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
lol

The Dems bussed in Progs to vote... and they could STILL ONLY get 40%.

The 50+ odd years of hell are starting to finally be beaten back.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
http://twitchy.com/2012/06/06/kill-scott-walker-angry-libs-flood-twitt
er-with-death-threats-after-wisconsin-recall-defeat/


While the media phonied up outrage over Sarah Palin's innocent, harmless facebook page, showing location icons on STATES, and voting districts, this is what we see from the Left...



Stay classy, Libs. Stay classy.

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How is this markedly different from Palin's stunt, which you defended (and still do)?



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero


"I've not watched the video either, or am incapable of intellectually dealing with the substance of this thread, so I'll instead act like a juvenile and claim victory..." - Rappy

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Originally posted by WULFENSTAR:
Your bitter, bitter, tears... they taste like...

VICTORY.

"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

How is this markedly different from Palin's stunt, which you defended (and still do)?

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Originally posted by m52nickerson:
If Obama wins re-election I am so bringing this thread back......

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Originally posted by Niki2:
Righties have a right to crow, albeit for reasons I believe they would find uncomfortable if they weren't happy with the fact that elections (and primaries) will be bought from this day forth.

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Originally posted by Niki2:

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The voters spoke. Seems as if a majority of voters in Wisconsin have the image of lazy public sector workers in their heads. Of course that is an incorrect image, but money helps people believe it.

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Pretty much. That's what they've been brainwashed into believing, among other things. Worked, too.

Six, you obviously haven't been keeping up.

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Both teachers and especially Government officials (whether elected or appointed) should not have guaranteed pensions funded by taxpayer dollars either.

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I posted quite clearly that the pension are NOT funded by "taxpayer dollars", but by the workers themselves. Seems you've bought into the propaganda as much as the people of Wisconsin have.

Yes, elections have virtually always been about money for a long time now. But with Citizens United, you can truly say things haven't changed dramatically in favor of a few rich and powerful people/corporations able to spend TONS more than ever before on elections? If you can say that, there's nothing to discuss, because it's obvious that is true.

If you think any teachers can afford "half-million-dollar houses", you'll have to show proof. I've never known one, nor heard of any. If you really believe teachers go into that profession to get rich, you're off your rocker.

It's probably a stupid thing to suggestion, but it might help if you were to look into the FACTS about Wisconsin and teachers and public-sector workers in general. I've known a lot of teachers, and there's no way it's an easy or lucrative profession. Teachers mostly rank in the "middle class"--upper or lower--and Walkers WRITTEN INTENT is to lower their salaries. What he's already done has in effect cut their salaries, by as much as $2,000 a year, which is no small amount to most of us, tho' maybe not to you. And more is coming, if Walker gets his way.

Someone said "The voters have spoken, get over it". My response is "Money talks. Elections will be decided by money, get used to it." That will be proven over time.

As will the job losses which will ensue in Wisconsin, currently with the worst job-growth record in America.

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Originally posted by CaveTroll:
But it is perfectly okay for unions to forcibly deduct dues from their members, use that money to hire workers, pay them a salary but call them campaign "volunteers". So that money never shows up as a campaign contribution.

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Originally posted by Niki2:
You're welcome to crow, but I wish you'd at least get your facts straight. They have to pay MORE for their pensions; they have to pay MORE for health care.

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Originally posted by Geezer:

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Originally posted by Niki2:
You're welcome to crow, but I wish you'd at least get your facts straight. They have to pay MORE for their pensions; they have to pay MORE for health care.

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True. Prior to Act 10, the state employees paid little or nothing to their pension fund. Now they have to pay 5.8% of their income with a matching 5/8% from their employer. Their average cost for health insurance will be 12.6% of the cost of the premiums (although the state is required by Act 10 to reduce premiums), with the state not paying more than 88%. Previously, they paid around 6% of total premiums.

Even their reduced benefits appear to be better than pretty much any private business offers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Wisconsin_Act_10

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Originally posted by Geezer:
Even their reduced benefits appear to be better than pretty much any private business offers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Wisconsin_Act_10

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Originally posted by Geezer:
Prior to Act 10, the state employees paid little or nothing to their pension fund. Now they have to pay 5.8% of their income with a matching 5.8% from their employer. Their average cost for health insurance will be 12.6% of the cost of the premiums (although the state is required by Act 10 to reduce premiums), with the state not paying more than 88%. Previously, they paid around 6% of total premiums.

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Pensions ARE funded one way or another by taxpayer dollars. Just like 401k retirement plans take big hits during bad times, so do pension plans. Just like the Social Security system was bound to fail since it started and it relies more and more on young people funding it to keep retirees payments coming in for more and more years because of the advances in medicine, so do the pension programs.

What happens when these failing pension programs can't continue to pay out? Why, just rob from peter to pay paul.

Sure, as far as government sector jobs are concerned in Wisconsin, there probably will be a lot of jobs cut. That's not a bad thing. The financial hole Wisconsin and Milwaukee have dug for themselves is just a fraction of what Illinois and Chicago have done. Chicago, Crook County and Illinois make California look downright fiscally responsible.

There may be no direct correllation between the high pay, healthcare benefits, and retirement packages of government workers directly to taxes people pay, but in a state like Illinois, particularly Crook County, property taxes have become so high you're fooling yourself if you believe you're not just renting your property from the government. Business taxes are becoming so high that they're fleeing to other states just like people who can afford to move can. Sales tax is the highest in the country at 10.25%, with very little relief on even food purchases. Income tax was just raised 66% last year to 5%.



As for teachers, I never said they were rich. A half-million dollar house 5 years ago was a dime a dozen.

What I am saying is is that these people are "professionals". Do lawyers get unions and pensions and tenure? Do doctors? No... If they can't win a case or they cut the wrong leg off, they become ambulance chasers or get fired for incompetence.

A teacher shouldn't make more than 40k a year at today's salary, and that's being generous, especially since they often only work 9 months out of the year. My art teacher was a great guy, for sure, in high school, but since you can look up any teachers salary online since it's paid for by taxpayers, I was appalled to see he was making over 120k a year before he retired. I'm sure him and his wife have the best medical care taxpayer dollars can buy today and until he dies.

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Originally posted by Niki2:

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The voters spoke. Seems as if a majority of voters in Wisconsin have the image of lazy public sector workers in their heads. Of course that is an incorrect image, but money helps people believe it.

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Pretty much. That's what they've been brainwashed into believing, among other things. Worked, too.

Six, you obviously haven't been keeping up.

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Both teachers and especially Government officials (whether elected or appointed) should not have guaranteed pensions funded by taxpayer dollars either.

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I posted quite clearly that the pension are NOT funded by "taxpayer dollars", but by the workers themselves. Seems you've bought into the propaganda as much as the people of Wisconsin have.

Yes, elections have virtually always been about money for a long time now. But with Citizens United, you can truly say things haven't changed dramatically in favor of a few rich and powerful people/corporations able to spend TONS more than ever before on elections? If you can say that, there's nothing to discuss, because it's obvious that is true.

If you think any teachers can afford "half-million-dollar houses", you'll have to show proof. I've never known one, nor heard of any. If you really believe teachers go into that profession to get rich, you're off your rocker.

It's probably a stupid thing to suggestion, but it might help if you were to look into the FACTS about Wisconsin and teachers and public-sector workers in general. I've known a lot of teachers, and there's no way it's an easy or lucrative profession. Teachers mostly rank in the "middle class"--upper or lower--and Walkers WRITTEN INTENT is to lower their salaries. What he's already done has in effect cut their salaries, by as much as $2,000 a year, which is no small amount to most of us, tho' maybe not to you. And more is coming, if Walker gets his way.

Someone said "The voters have spoken, get over it". My response is "Money talks. Elections will be decided by money, get used to it." That will be proven over time.

As will the job losses which will ensue in Wisconsin, currently with the worst job-growth record in America.

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Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:

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Originally posted by Geezer:
Prior to Act 10, the state employees paid little or nothing to their pension fund. Now they have to pay 5.8% of their income with a matching 5.8% from their employer. Their average cost for health insurance will be 12.6% of the cost of the premiums (although the state is required by Act 10 to reduce premiums), with the state not paying more than 88%. Previously, they paid around 6% of total premiums.

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5.8 % + 5.8 % = 11.6 %, not 12.6%.

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100 % - 88 % = 12.0 %, also not 12.6%.

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Big winner in this scenario seems to be the insurance companies, neither the workers nor the state. I wonder about stuff like kickbacks, bribes, slush funds, and campaign contributions.

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Pensions ARE funded one way or another by taxpayer dollars.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

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Pensions ARE funded one way or another by taxpayer dollars.

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Pensions are funded by investments and employee/ employer contributions. Taxes are a backstop for SOME public pensions, but not all. I am a public employee, but my pension is not at all funded by taxes.

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