Amer-ica Amer-ica God shed his Grace on theee... by Wishimay

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Amer-ica Amer-ica God shed his Grace on theee...

POSTED BY: WISHIMAY
UPDATED: Tuesday, July 17, 2012 07:37
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 2619
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Wednesday, July 11, 2012 8:44 PM

Dear God(s),
If you ARE there-
I pray you send a plague.
Intelligence
is overrated...
Especially
when you see how little it is used as intended,
and how thoroughly we inflict it's lack
on those who have no defence.
Grace. In all its' definitions.
Amen.

P.S. Once people are removed from the equation, I would really like to be re-incarnated as a Manatee. Thank you.

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/half-newborns-tennessee-hospital-prescrip
tion-drug-withdrawal-treatment/story?id=16755130

This is just a tip of the iceberg

Forget sterilizing people or making them take Parental Equivilency Tests.

LETHAL F'ING INJECTION!! YOU WANNA SHOOT SOMETHING UP??? I'LL GIVE YOU SOMETHING TO F'ING SHOOT UP.
BASTERDS!

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Thursday, July 12, 2012 12:29 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

That's bad. Really bad. But I doubt it's the epidemic as is being claimed. Not that it makes any difference to those little ones.

" We're all just folk. " - Mal

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, July 12, 2012 6:00 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Not really all that surprising; it is, after all, Tennessee...It does have one of the highest infant mortality rates in the country (interactive map at http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparemaptable.jsp?ind=47&cat=2 ). Actually, all of the Southeast does, compared to the rest of the states...these being, of course, many of the states whose politicians are determined to repeal the ACA and deny the Medicare expansion...naturally. The Southeast also has the higest rate of uninsured...Tennessee among them, so of course repealing the ACA is a good idea...

Nonetheless, truly horrific and despicable, what you posted.

Me, I would like to come back as a dolphin. The oceans MAY be the last to go, and meanwhile that's a pretty damned good life. Other choice would be river otter; also a pretty soft life, but I think most species will go extinct before we do, and water will become a bit problem.

Would have chosen wolf, but they'll DEFINITELY go extinct among the first, especially given Wasilla-Baby's love of hunting them from the air. Did you know the Nome Run started in Wasilla?? I didn't, until I was reading a book about huskies, and how close they are to their wolf ancestors. Ironic, given her love of killing wolves.

Nonetheless, truly horrific and despicable, what you posted.

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Thursday, July 12, 2012 7:31 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Tennessee, where the hick family (PN?) wanted to get an abortion when the woman got pregnant with her tenth child, because they'd heard that one in ten babies born is Muslim, and they weren't takin' no chances!

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I've not watched the video either, or am incapable of intellectually dealing with the substance of this thread, so I'll instead act like a juvenile and claim victory..." - Rappy

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Thursday, July 12, 2012 11:23 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Yes, and it's soooo horrible now that in less than ten years the same providers trying to save them now will be shoving psychotropics down their throat as fast as they can, and then wondering why the children OF these children are born in withdrawl, riiiiight.
Not to mention a lot of these prolly ARE that third generation.

-F

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Thursday, July 12, 2012 1:38 PM

OONJERAH

I'm not even gonna read that.

Opening of a TV show: child in trouble, ill. That was a warning: Don't watch
this show; you will not like it! But I was hooked & watched it. Child died soon,
causes: abuse, neglect. Based on a true story, tho Law & Order always denies
this. Then if I wasn't hurting bad enough from the TV version, my OCD, morbid
curiosity forced me to look up the real case. Which made me really hurt!
The perp is alive, out of prison.

I'm not even gonna read that story in TN, 'cause I could not cope with knowing
somewheres, more than half the kids are born into pain & hopelessness!

I strongly believe that well over half of adult human beings are not qualified
to be parents and oughta get themselves sterilized. @*{snarl, gnash}#!

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Thursday, July 12, 2012 2:33 PM

OONJERAH

. . . As for the infants at East Tennessee Children's Hospital in Knoxville, if
their mothers were not addicted to prescription drugs, chances are very good
they'd be on street drugs instead. Thus these mothers bear the primary res-
ponsibility for the suffering of their babies, probably in many cases includes
birth defects.

This is not a rant against all American doctors. I know we still have some good ones.

The current system nurtures the other kind: Those who are indifferent to
their patients and play ball with Big Pharm & anything that makes a dime
for their masters.

I fired my heart Dr. last year. Pretty sure I can live longer, better without
his help. My GP is better in a way: Doesn't do anything for me, but doesn't
try to do anything TO me, either. I only see the FNP there anyway.

So I thought better of firing my GP. Sooner or later, I'll be in the hospital
if I don't die in my sleep. The GP has my medical records close at hand.

My take on Drs today for the elderly: Most of them are perfectly indifferent
to us; but many are actually harmful to us.

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Thursday, July 12, 2012 4:48 PM

WISHIMAY

I gave up taking anything. If I can't cure a thing or treat a thing for more than an hour or two, at least I'm not being a slave to the system anymore.

See there? I feel better already.

About the stats, half does sound very high, but somehow "only a third" doesn't sound any better.... And somehow, the number of women I see who get arrested around Meth makes me think IT AIN'T ALL PAIN MEDS, either. I think THAT was the real sugar coating. We don't stop to think how world wide Meth has become either, at least I didn't until last year, anyway...

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Friday, July 13, 2012 2:25 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Quote:
Originally posted by Wishimay:
I gave up taking anything. If I can't cure a thing or treat a thing for more than an hour or two, at least I'm not being a slave to the system anymore.

See there? I feel better already.

About the stats, half does sound very high, but somehow "only a third" doesn't sound any better.... And somehow, the number of women I see who get arrested around Meth makes me think IT AIN'T ALL PAIN MEDS, either. I think THAT was the real sugar coating. We don't stop to think how world wide Meth has become either, at least I didn't until last year, anyway...

Wow....

That's the first time I've seen negative spin like this strictly leveled to prescription pain medication. It makes you wonder how bad babies of completely healthy, non-drug using parents are if they don't eat only garden-grown vegetables, consume milk. meat and eggs from their own raised chicken and cows, and drink nothing but bottled water too. I think we've all heard about how many prescription drugs we all take these days just drinking from the tap.

Maybe this is what my grandmother was talking about when she speaks of "De-evolution". Of course when she says it, she means that we've all be devolving since the day of Adam and Eve, but from a non-religious standpoint, the idea holds water today. Seems that half of the children in America today have ADD or some derivative. The amount of cases of autism and aspergers in children is staggering. Now babies of mothers who don't take any illicit drugs, even including something as benign as pot, have babies being born so addicted to substances that they need morphine drips?????

I can't imagine what kind of a life they will have when they've already started out with vices. The longer you live co-dependent on "something" the harder it is to give it up without simply transferring that co-dependency upon some other form of release/relief.

My heart goes out to these babies, and also their parents. Who am I to judge them? Sure, they shouldn't have had kids in the first place, but it's to late for that. No point in berating them after the fact. I hope they somehow manage.

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Sunday, July 15, 2012 5:39 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

Half Oonj? I won't be electing you to any important position anytime soon.

I have Kathy Bates on speed dial, mwa ha ha ha (in exaggeratedly evil voice)

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya.

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Sunday, July 15, 2012 6:58 PM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
...even including something as benign as pot,

My heart goes out to these babies, and also their parents. Who am I to judge them? Sure, they shouldn't have had kids in the first place, but it's to late for that. No point in berating them after the fact. I hope they somehow manage.

Pot is a drug, and as such- has side effects, even if modern science hasn't figured it out yet. I wouldn't even label aspirin as "benign".

And there IS a point in berating them, as you would berate any other criminal. It's to deter future behavior. Every single woman that gives birth to a drug addicted baby that didn't have a dire need to be on them should be locked up. Then repeatedly drugged without their consent and made to feel the pain of withdrawl...It is assault and criminal negligence. You do nothing to these woman and you prove to them it's okay to hurt a child and that society doesn't care.

Oonj- you got MY vote!
Maybe sterilizing half the population might save the planet, too. Maybe.

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Sunday, July 15, 2012 7:43 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Wishimay, maybe cut back the judgement and think about some workable solutions. Your post is ugly.

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Sunday, July 15, 2012 9:12 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Hey Wish,

Pot IS a drug. So is beer and cigarettes and even aspirin or ibuprofen.....

All over the counter, and all totally legal. Only half of them I use to get around what I'd rather be doing in this land of conformity we exist in....

I was FAR from a criminal in the blue "glory days" of FFF, back when I smoked pot daily.

I could buy that shit TOMORROW without blinking an eye.

The only reason I don't is because I'm still hopeful, 18 months later, that I can have a union job in HVAC by next spring if I'm "good".

The same job that coke heads did 30 years ago while their wives tended to the house and kept the kids out of trouble, right?

Here's 6, on Union pay after apprenenticehip....

Retirement at 55....

400k of "real" money...

Showing others how to "really" spend that money in this environment....

I don't give two shits "how good" the DOW is doing today... It will take a crap again.

If you have REAL money of your money... there's MUCH better ways of making money on it without leaving it to the wolves.....

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." ~Shepherd Book

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Wishimay, maybe cut back the judgement and think about some workable solutions. Your post is ugly.

God MD.....

I won't thank you for "standing up for me", because you were making a point much above anything I was saying, and that's what I'm trying to do here....

I say a lot of things that piss a lot of people off. I can only, at this point, say that I'm honored that somebody agrees with something I said.

Maybe you didn't.... and I misread this too...

It's really cool otherwise. Wish could "remove a mirror and show Freddie Kruger" and I'm down with her.

Wish is only one of 3 people here that would ever get me to re-consider a thought if they had the "balls" to ask me to.

The first choice I had for that title here decided to make me a bitch publically in a thread rather than consult me firsthand and I thought we've been fiends for over 7 years. Fuck him.....

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Monday, July 16, 2012 1:46 AM

KWICKO

Waaaaaahhhhh...

Go cry in your beer, Jack - the only reason you got made "a bitch" here is that you were posting shit and trying to make someone else a "cunt" (your word, not mine).

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I've not watched the video either, or am incapable of intellectually dealing with the substance of this thread, so I'll instead act like a juvenile and claim victory..." - Rappy

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Monday, July 16, 2012 3:06 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Quote:
should be locked up. Then repeatedly drugged without their consent and made to feel the pain of withdrawl.

Hello,

I do not condone torture, nor generally anything designed to cause pain for its own sake.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term fits.)
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -Thomas Szasz

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Monday, July 16, 2012 4:53 AM

WISHIMAY

They "tortured" their own babies. THEY felt it kick and then took ANOTHER pill....I have really come to understand that most people just can't understand how another person feels unless they go through the same thing. My goal would be to teach ultimate empathy. It's not always a pretty thing, learning. I don't see how anyone could be blaze about not getting justice for these babies, they can't fight for themselves...That's kinda why we have a justice system, right? Or do they matter less because they are babies, hmm?

I'm not religious, but Do Unto Others- I understand.

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Monday, July 16, 2012 11:45 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

You don't teach empathy by inflicting pain and suffering on another, even if you, in your apparent god like status of handing out justice, think they deserve it.

You teach empathy by showing empathy. Having empathy for good people is easy, it aint so easy to show it for those who have made poor choices and stuffed up their lives and the lives of others. But perhaps they are the ones who need it most.

Addiction is a terrible thing, difficult. Behaviour change is hard for all of us, but addiction makes it 100 fold so harder. And kicking drug habits is often not advised during pregnancy, where the withdrawal shock can cause death for an unborn infant.

Infants need their mothers to be in the best possible shape, so the punishments you would hand out would make their lives worse, not better.

Women are more than just baby incubators, they are HUMANS who have failings and can make shitty choices. Many women do things that harm their unborn child. I can put my hand up and say I drank alcohol before I realised I was pregnant. I ate shitty food, because I felt so sick. I got stressed and unhappy. All these things affect fetal development, and I feel guilty about it all still. I'm sure a lot of those other addicted mothers do as well. They need support to help them be better mothers to their children, not some banshee screaming for their heads.

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Monday, July 16, 2012 5:02 PM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:

You teach empathy by showing empathy. Having empathy for good people is easy, it aint so easy to show it for those who have made poor choices and stuffed up their lives and the lives of others. But perhaps they are the ones who need it most.

You wanna go screw up your own life, I got no problem with it. You screw over someone else's life with intent- I'm damn sure not gonna stand there and hold your hand and kiss your ass about it. I'm not talking about one or two lousy choices, here. No one is a perfect parent. These mutts went out and bought the drugs over and over and had the sex knowing what would happen. Shouldn't be given back the keys to their own life, much less a fully dependant being.
Punishing people isn't easy, but there's a reason we do it. I save my empathy for people who truly have no control their circumstances, not the people who have a barrelful of excuses of why they are crap-tastic humans. My empathy goes to the babies, for they are the ones that need and deserve it.

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Tuesday, July 17, 2012 1:32 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Pot surely is a drug....

One I miss very much.....

Let me reply with a calm and cool head, if I can Wish. Consider this my "second chance" that I know you're classy enough to give me.

The silly thing about it, is that I'm chock full of 13 5.6 percent beers as I write it, but I'm in a very zen moment, and I'd not ever want to talk with or to you in any other state of mind....

Nobody will EVER figure out the effects and after-effects of pot scientifically, because of the happy little Democratic fact that "we're all snowflakes".

A suit would surly blame my desire to always be a 'lone wolf" without any of the pack, even my brother and his mate, to be a symptom of pot use. It does't matter that I was that way before pot and I haven't smoked it for going on two years.

The same people would have no probelm with the fact that I drink anywhere from 8 to 15 beers a night to overcompensate for that loss.

Add it up Waish.....

Considering an absolute minimum base of 8 5.6% beers a night since April of last year until tonight... let's just call it 8 bucks an hour, 30 hours a week...

That's 240 beers a week.....

Back when I smoked weed, I went 5 years without a single beer, even at parties.....

Don't know about any of you, but my liver sure as hell loved me for it....

My GOVERNMENT ENFORCED DRINKING will kill me 20 years before any smoking of cigs and weed would have ever. I was also much more happier 5 years ago when I didn't drink and I smoked while posting....

I was going to follow that up with a great clip from Idocracy that seems to be deleted....

I'm cool with it being there or not, since nothing in my nature actually precludes me from giving two shits about anything but a "twister" coming down my path....

Even if that happend, it's just me alone, I can take care of myself, an as much as I love the work I've done on my house, my overpriced insurance would pay 240k for a new house if a tornado ripped it up, wich is like 7 times what I bought it for (that's why I'm paying so fucking much, and I couldn't get it reduced)

It's a good idea with all the potental woman vultures out there who find out you have no mortgage. There are only 3 people in my own circle who know it, but I get hit on every once in a while at the grociery store now.

The first week was cool. 2 weeks later, not so much when it was virtually the same intro on her part.

Holy shit... that's what my life has come to?

Doing right and trying to help Americans and set a good example made most Americans hate me, even though I now make less than 10k a year.

More that twice this year, I've been stopped at a local grocery store by a recently transplanted Russian Goddess looking for money and a green card.

I'm glad you're here, my little Babushka.... but You're barking up the wrong tree. Talk to my married friends with union jobs....

I'm doing good, but I'm no PIMP and this is a table setting for one.

Quote:
Originally posted by Wishimay:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
...even including something as benign as pot,

My heart goes out to these babies, and also their parents. Who am I to judge them? Sure, they shouldn't have had kids in the first place, but it's to late for that. No point in berating them after the fact. I hope they somehow manage.

Pot is a drug, and as such- has side effects, even if modern science hasn't figured it out yet. I wouldn't even label aspirin as "benign".

And there IS a point in berating them, as you would berate any other criminal. It's to deter future behavior. Every single woman that gives birth to a drug addicted baby that didn't have a dire need to be on them should be locked up. Then repeatedly drugged without their consent and made to feel the pain of withdrawl...It is assault and criminal negligence. You do nothing to these woman and you prove to them it's okay to hurt a child and that society doesn't care.

Oonj- you got MY vote!
Maybe sterilizing half the population might save the planet, too. Maybe.

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." ~Shepherd Book

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Tuesday, July 17, 2012 1:46 AM

KWICKO

You say they "had the sex knowing what would happen"; do you have any factual basis for that allegation? What makes you think they have any idea how reproduction happens? It's not like they're taught anything about it in school!

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I've not watched the video either, or am incapable of intellectually dealing with the substance of this thread, so I'll instead act like a juvenile and claim victory..." - Rappy

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Tuesday, July 17, 2012 2:55 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Quote:
Originally posted by Wishimay:

You wanna go screw up your own life, I got no problem with it. You screw over someone else's life with intent- I'm damn sure not gonna stand there and hold your hand and kiss your ass about it. I'm not talking about one or two lousy choices, here. No one is a perfect parent. These mutts went out and bought the drugs over and over and had the sex knowing what would happen. Shouldn't be given back the keys to their own life, much less a fully dependant being.
Punishing people isn't easy, but there's a reason we do it. I save my empathy for people who truly have no control their circumstances, not the people who have a barrelful of excuses of why they are crap-tastic humans. My empathy goes to the babies, for they are the ones that need and deserve it.

We all screw up each others lives all the time. If you don't take care of yourself, and make stupid choices, someone else always suffers...maybe its your kids, your partner, or your parents. When people wreck their lives they cause trails of destruction around them.

You said you thought that by experiencing pain, they could empathise with their babies. Some of them have already experienced withdrawal and know what they have put their babies through and suffer guilt. You would like to torture them a bit more..not sure what you are hoping to achieve. Yes, what they have done is terrible. Maybe it should be a crime, but I'm not sure what would be better in your world. Addicts are already punished, and it does little to stop the cycle.

Sometimes choices are pretty shitty. If you fall pregnant while using, you can't withdraw unless you want to damage the fetus. The article outlines it.."As she was trying to recover, the young mother said she was taking methadone when she was pregnant with Grayson. But doctors advise expecting mothers not to stop using the drug because the baby might suffer from potentially lethal withdrawal in the womb and the mother could have a miscarriage. "

You may live somewhere where abortions are hard to obtain, sounds like there is a lot of that in the states.

And as for screwing around irresponsible, that is what drug addled people do.

So sometimes people do bad stuff. The best chance for those babies is to get them properly withdrawn from the drug and treat their mothers to kick the stuff and be decent parents. And as the article says, if mum doesn't get treatment, then they look to relatives. Foster care, quite rightly, should be last resort.

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Tuesday, July 17, 2012 4:28 AM

FREMDFIRMA

You've prettymuch stolen my thunder here, and quite welcome to it, Magons, but lemme add this...

Perhaps if the US would finally get its head of its ass and quit trying to climb up there and dig their way back to the 18th century, perhaps they could choose the course of common fucking sense and treat addiction as a MEDICAL, rather than CRIMINAL, problem, ehe ?

That might help matters just a little, ya think ?

-F

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Tuesday, July 17, 2012 7:37 AM

KWICKO

^^ What Magons and Frem said.

Do I think this is terrible? Undoubtedly. Do I think these people should have kids? Nope. Would I take away their right to CHOOSE to have kids? Nuh-uh. Would I take away their kids and make them wards of the state? Dunno - that doesn't seem any more cruel than putting the parents in prison and making THEM wards of the state, really.

Maybe abortion SHOULD be encouraged, in some cases.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I've not watched the video either, or am incapable of intellectually dealing with the substance of this thread, so I'll instead act like a juvenile and claim victory..." - Rappy

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