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Originally posted by Oonjerah:
I don't get that the 70's-80's were more violent in America than now.
Are all the bad people locked up?

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For more than two years, Adrian Schoolcraft secretly recorded every roll call at the 81st Precinct in Brooklyn and captured his superiors urging police officers to do two things in order to manipulate the "stats" that the department is under pressure to produce: Officers were told to arrest people who were doing little more than standing on the street, but they were also encouraged to disregard actual victims of serious crimes who wanted to file reports.

Arresting bystanders made it look like the department was efficient, while artificially reducing the amount of serious crime made the commander look good.

[...]

The [2010 NYPD] investigation found that crime complaints were changed to reflect misdemeanor rather than felony crimes, which prevented those incidents from being counted in the all-important crime statistics. In addition, the investigation concluded that "an unwillingness to prepare reports for index crimes exists or existed in the command."

Moreover, a significant number of serious index crimes were not entered into the computer tracking system known as OmniForm. "This was more than administrative error," the probe concluded.

There was an "atmosphere in the command where index crimes were scrutinized to the point where it became easier to either not take the report at all or to take a report for a lesser, non-index crime," investigators concluded.

[...]

The implications of the report are obvious: If the 81st Precinct was a typical station house, then crime manipulation is more widespread than city officials have admitted.

John Eterno, a criminologist at Molloy College and a former NYPD captain, says that what was happening in the 81st Precinct is no isolated case. "The pressures on commanders are enormous, to make sure the crime numbers look good," Eterno says. "This is a culture. This is happening in every precinct, every transit district, and every police housing service area. This culture has got to change."

source: http://www.villagevoice.com/2012-03-07/news/the-nypd-tapes-confirmed

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Originally posted by Kwicko:


Image no worky.

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Originally posted by FREMDFIRMA:

Ain't about guns, it's about sanity.

We are not a sane society, and THAT, more than anything else, is the problem.
Reducing the tools by why that violence is often carried out is just pruning the branches, not striking the root.

-F

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Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
I think I agree with Kwicko. If people keep saying that something else is going on, that some sort of societal group breakdown is happening, then how can you be so cavalier aboutgun ownership. A sick society is one thing, a sick armed society is another.

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

Bingo. Several people over the last few days have brought up that it's our "insane" society that is driving these things, not the guns. So the question I'm asking is, if you believe that the entire country, or a significant portion of it, is completely insane, psychotic, sociopathic, then are you comfortable with such people having ready access to massive arsenals at a moment's notice?

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Originally posted by Kwicko:
Meanwhile, if it's all about a case of national insanity, then do you firmly believe that the most insane among us should have ready access to firearms with high-capacity drum mags?

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Originally posted by kpo:
I would go further and suggest that guns act as a catalyst for social breakdown, making it happen faster, and to a worse extent.

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Therefore you get the stupid arguments about guns being no worse than cars, or knives, or bats.

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Ever think the things I wanna break, they might NEED breaking?

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Originally posted by kpo:

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Therefore you get the stupid arguments about guns being no worse than cars, or knives, or bats.

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You also get the claim that gun rampages are no more devestating than car, or knife rampages would theoretically be. The thing is (in the rest of the world at least) you get car rampages, and you get knife rampages. And you even get vehicle AND knife rampages: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akihabara_massacre

The reason why you don't hear about these attacks as much is because they are far less deadly than gun rampages.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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Originally posted by kpo:

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Therefore you get the stupid arguments about guns being no worse than cars, or knives, or bats.

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You also get the claim that gun rampages are no more devestating than car, or knife rampages would theoretically be. The thing is (in the rest of the world at least) you get car rampages, and you get knife rampages. And you even get vehicle AND knife rampages: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akihabara_massacre

The reason why you don't hear about these attacks as much is because they are far less deadly than gun rampages.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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And, I'd wager, far less common.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero


"The groin cup and throat protector have about as much ballistic protection as the kneepads I wear when I'm doing a job that requires me to be on my knees." - Troll

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Originally posted by Niki2:
Magons: You mentioned in another thread that you must not make an impact 'cuz someone didn't remember you're from Down Under. You KNOW full well I do, 'cuz I mention it a lot, and believe me, I pay attention to both you and PK, becasue as I've said before, my friends outside the US teach me a lot from both their outside perspectives AND because they get news we don't. I thought KPO was British, too...and we used to have Citizen (I may not have liked him, but I paid attention) and Gino was a Canook (which he took as a pejorative, but which I saw as a familiar nickname, like Yankee or Brit or Ozzie).

When someone mentions where they live, whether they're male or female, what age they are, etc., I keep track, along with maybe a note of specific likes, dislikes, etc. It makes it easier for me to know who I'm talking to and what their perspective might be. It goes beyond that with you and PK, 'cuz first off, I came to like you both and second, I've got a terrible weakness for Ozzies and Brits. Aside from that, I had two very special friends from Australia, and ended up with real good feelings about you guys. As for Brits, they've always been my weakness and I adore the country. Nonetheless, I don't think I'm the only one who remembers where you two come from; I just wish we had more of you, and others from other countries, too. We need perspectives from outside our country to help us understand things better.

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