REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Did White House arm al-Qaida operatives who killed Amb Stevens ?

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Thursday, October 4, 2012 05:35
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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 2:30 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


JERUSALEM – While echoes of the “Fast and Furious” scandal still resound in the White House, another administration decision at the heart of Obama’s Mideast policy may prove even more explosive.

Almost entirely missing from the debate surrounding the anti-U.S. attacks in Libya is the administration’s policy of arming jihadists to overthrow Mideast governments. But in the case of Libya, the arming of jihadists may have directly resulted in the Sept. 11, 2012, attacks against the U.S. consulate in Benghazi and the subsequent murder of Ambassador J. Christopher Stevens, Foreign Service Information Management Officer Sean Smith, private security employees and former U.S. Navy SEALs Glen Doherty and Tyrone Woods.

After changing its story multiple times, the White House finally conceded the deadly assault on the U.S. consulate was a planned attack linked to al-Qaida, as per information released by national intelligence agencies.
The admission prompted Rep. Peter King, R-N.Y., to call for the resignation of U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Susan Rice for pushing the narrative that the attacks were part of a spontaneous uprising.

King may instead want to focus his investigative energies on the larger story: How the Obama administration armed Libyan rebels who were known to include al-Qaida and other anti-Western jihadists, and how the White House is currently continuing that same policy in Syria.

During the revolution against Muammar Gadhafi’s regime, the U.S. admitted to directly arming the rebel groups.
At the time, rebel leader Abdel-Hakim al-Hasidi boasted in an interview that a significant number of the Libyan rebels were al-Qaida gunmen, many of whom had fought U.S. troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Hasidi insisted his fighters “are patriots and good Muslims, not terrorists,” but he added that the “members of al-Qaida are also good Muslims and are fighting against the invader.”
Even Adm. James Stavridis, NATO supreme commander for Europe, admitted during the Libyan revolution that Libya’s rebel force may include al-Qaida: “We have seen flickers in the intelligence of potential al-Qaida, Hezbollah.”

At the time, former CIA officer Bruce Riedel went even further, telling the Hindustan Times: “There is no question that al-Qaida’s Libyan franchise, Libyan Islamic Fighting Group, is a part of the opposition. It has always been Gadhafi’s biggest enemy and its stronghold is Benghazi. What is unclear is how much of the opposition is al-Qaida/Libyan Islamic Fighting Group – 2 percent or 80 percent.”

The arming of the Libyan rebels may have aided in the attacks on our consulate in Libya. One witness to those attacks said some of the gunmen attacking the U.S. installation had identified themselves as members of Ansar al-Shariah, which represents al-Qaida in Yemen and Libya.

The al-Qaida offshoot released a statement denying its members were behind the deadly attack, but a man identified as a leader of the Ansar brigade told Al Jazeera the group indeed took part in the Benghazi attack.

Ambassador Stevens was directly involved in arming the rebels, reported Egyptian security officials speaking to WND. Those officials claimed Stevens played a central role in recruiting jihadists to fight Bashar al-Assad’s regime in Syria.

The officials further claimed Stevens served as a key contact with the Saudis to coordinate the recruitment by Saudi Arabia of Islamic fighters from North Africa and Libya. The jihadists were sent to Syria via Turkey to attack Assad’s forces, said the security officials.

The Egyptian security officials said Stevens also worked with the Saudis to send names of potential jihadi recruits to U.S. security organizations for review. Names found to be directly involved in previous attacks against the U.S., including in Iraq and Afghanistan, were ultimately not recruited by the Saudis to fight in Syria, said the officials.

Regardless of Stevens’ alleged role, the Obama administration now continues to support the Syrian rebels, including the Free Syrian Army, despite widespread reports that al-Qaida is prominent among their ranks.

In addition to a reported $450 million in emergency cash for the Muslim Brotherhood-led Egyptian government, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on Friday announced $45 million in additional aid for Syrian the opposition after nearly $100 million was provided to the Syrian rebels this year.

The problem? Last month, WND quoted a senior Syrian source claiming at lease 500 hardcore mujahedeen from Afghanistan, many of whom were spearheading efforts to fight the U.S. there, were killed in clashes with Syrian forces last month.
Also last month, WND reported Jihadiya Salafia in the Gaza Strip, a group that represents al-Qaida in the coastal territory, had declared three days of mourning for its own jihadists who died in Syria in recent weeks.

WND reported in May there was growing collaboration between the Syrian opposition and al-Qaida, as well as evidence the opposition is sending weapons to jihadists in Iraq, according to an Egyptian security official.

The military official said that Egypt has reports of collaboration between the Syrian opposition and three al-Qaida arms, including one the operates in Libya:
Jund al-Sham, which is made up of al-Qaida militants who are Syrian, Palestinian and Lebanese;
Jund al-Islam, which in recent years merged with Ansar al-Islam, an extremist group of Sunni Iraqis operating under the al-Qaida banner and operating in Yemen and Libya;
Jund Ansar al-Allah, an al-Qaida group based in Gaza linked to Palestinian camps in Lebanon and Syria.

U.S. officials have stated the White House is providing nonlethal aid to the Syrian rebels, while widespread reports have claimed the U.S. has been working with Arab countries to ensure the opposition in Syria is well armed.

http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/this-scandal-could-dwarf-fast-and-furious/

* No idea why this was posted multiple times. Sure as heck wasn't trying to. I just wanted to make 1 or 2 edits. Never had this happen before.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 2:45 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


If there's a way to keep this thread, and delete the copies, I'd appreciate that.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 3:15 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


LOL!

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 3:19 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:
Originally posted by kpo:
LOL!

It's not personal. It's just war.


You're laughing at the possibility that this white house may have supplied the guns that killed ambassador stevens ?

Really?

wow.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 3:31 AM

BYTEMITE


He's laughing at the 2x 2x 2x 2x post. Me, this is pretty much what I suspected all along. Because our government is full of morons who think they're these great plotters and schemers but they're as transparent as grease paper. Apparently crappy government that never gets any better is a human condition, because it's been like this for probably 10,000 years.

But it is almost INSULTING how obvious this false flag operation was, and this is why I was hesitant to say I wasn't sure Israel was behind making and highlighting the movie, because I thought U.S. government had it's fingerprints all over it instead. Like I said before, I think we attacked ourselves.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 3:57 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


The multi post thing is goofy, and I have no idea what caused it. Never happened to me before.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 4:00 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:
Me, this is pretty much what I suspected all along. Because our government is full of morons who think they're these great plotters and schemers but they're as transparent as grease paper. Apparently crappy government that never gets any better is a human condition, because it's been like this for probably 10,000 years.
Yup, you nailed it, Byte. The more things change, the more they stay the same!


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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 4:19 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)





Consider the source for this "news": World Nut Daily.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 4:46 AM

CAVETROLL


Attacking the messenger with absolutely no counter-comment on the substance. Disregard Kwindbago. He's becoming more irrelevant every day.


Kwindbago, hot air and angry electrons

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 4:49 AM

BYTEMITE


Wait, Kwicko. I think AuRaptor may have a valid point here. In the past our government HAS given weapons to Al Qaeda, and in fact the entire group first started from the remnants of CIA training and the Pakistan ISI forces during proxy cold war meddling in the Afghanistan-Russian conflict.

I don't JUST blame Obama for this, but the idea that the weapons used by Al Qaeda groups in this attack could have come from us is actually something really important to consider. If we can verify the story here is in fact incorrect, it would also be important information, but I'd like to try to evaluate this on that basis more than any other (i.e. source).

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 5:13 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


Quote:
Originally posted by CaveTroll:
Attacking the messenger with absolutely no counter-comment on the substance. Disregard Kwindbago. He's becoming more irrelevant every day.


Kwindbago, hot air and angry electrons

It's a right-wing source - that's relevant information to some people.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 5:14 AM

BYTEMITE


Looking into this further, I can't find anything that can confirm or deny this. If American weapons were used, they could have come from a number of sources; various militia groups, caches, and even just regional proliferation of weapons. At the same time, I can't rule out that weapons were supplied to the group.

Need more information.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 5:19 AM

STORYMARK


Ill care when this is coming from something other than far-right blog.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 5:46 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


Agreed. This topic wasn't worth eleven threads.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 6:02 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:
Originally posted by kpo:
Agreed. This topic wasn't worth eleven threads.

It's not personal. It's just war.


Was it even worth one?


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 6:08 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Wait, Kwicko. I think AuRaptor may have a valid point here. In the past our government HAS given weapons to Al Qaeda, and in fact the entire group first started from the remnants of CIA training and the Pakistan ISI forces during proxy cold war meddling in the Afghanistan-Russian conflict.







"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 6:33 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Ill care when this is coming from something other than far-right blog.



Fair enough.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 7:13 AM

FREMDFIRMA



I don't think it's even worth a question - we DID arm the Qaidas, the Mujas, we armed Bin Laden, Saddam, we're currently selling weapons to MEK, we've sold heaven knows what to an appalling number of propped up dictators, dumped surplus on a bunch of genocidal irgun terrorists, and our so-called-protectors in the CIA armed the hell out of the goddamn drug cartels - add to that not knowing if they resold or traded any of that stuff, and it's no longer even a question, is it ?

Speakin of the cartels, it's damn ironic they used a set piece ambush on some of those CIA creeps just recently over a turf and market dispute, but watch THAT get spun as an act of terrorism to whip up the booga booga when it was in fact more or less a gunfight between rival druglords, one of which just happens to work for us, supposedly.

You can't blame this on any one administration though, it goes way the hell back to the freakin banana wars if not even before that.

-Frem

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 7:54 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

You can't blame this on any one administration though, it goes way the hell back to the freakin banana wars if not even before that.


Yeah. Although whether there was any extra involvement in this action is an interesting question - though that kind of thing happens no matter who's in office.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 8:17 AM

JONGSSTRAW



I really don't care where the weapons came from. What matters is that the ambassaador requested additional security prior to 9-11 for the embassy after numerous previous attacks on international diplomats in Libya. Either Clinton or Obama said no, and now we have a dead ambassador and navy seals killed, along with the Al Qaeda flag flying over the charred building.

Then Obama and his cronies tried to downplay the whole thing by blaming a spontaneous riot due to a movie trailer as the cause, all while they knew the truth. It was a well organized terrorist attack with serious weaponry. As far as I'm concerned those are impeachable offenses for both Obama and Clinton. The WH Press Corps and major media outlets are culpable due to their sickening in-the-tank non-questioning of the Admin. This is a most serious breach of public trust. Without an honest press there is no democracy. Obama and his leg-thrilled media lemmings have succeeded in turning America into a state-run oligarchy, a new USSR and Pravda.












Hmmm, better than Reuben's.
..One more.
Ben!
..My last one.
Okay.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 8:20 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:



Then Obama and his cronies tried to downplay the whole thing by blaming a spontaneous riot due to a movie trailer as the cause, all while they knew the truth.


Blaming a movie... by saying that it wasn't the movie?


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 8:26 AM

JONGSSTRAW


I guess some missed UN bitch Susan Rice's little Sunday morning show whirlwind tour of lies and deception by saying it was the movie that sparked spontaneous violence in Libya. Clinton and Obama still refused to call it what it was for over a week. First they tried to cover it up. It's disgusting that so many don't know or care.








Hmmm, better than Reuben's.
..One more.
Ben!
..My last one.
Okay.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 8:37 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Now that's telling:
Quote:
What matters is that the ambassaador requested additional security prior to 9-11 for the embassy after numerous previous attacks on international diplomats in Libya. Either Clinton or Obama said no.
Wasn't there another President in between those two? One who was right there "prior to" and AT 9/11?? I guess it must just have been Clinton and Obama, one following right after the other, who said not to additional security the ambassador requested, yes?

Wow.

Also:
Quote:
I really don't care where the weapons came from.
What a self-righteously American mentality! Doesn't matter that we've been arming "freedom fighters" (aka, insurgents) for decades, and had those weapons turned against us and others immediately afterward. Nope, America arming others is of no importance whatsoever, you betcha!


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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 8:48 AM

JONGSSTRAW


Hillary Clinton is Sec of State, not Bill. Besides, old cum stain already got his sorry rapist ass impeached long ago. Obama impeached and Hillary sent to a Guantanamo cell will be justice.










Hmmm, better than Reuben's.
..One more.
Ben!
..My last one.
Okay.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 9:29 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Clinton and Obama still refused to call it what it was for over a week. First they tried to cover it up. It's disgusting that so many don't know or care.



And with that, this dipshit proves himself to be every bit as blind, deaf, and dumb as Rappy.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 9:40 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
I guess some missed UN bitch Susan Rice's little Sunday morning show whirlwind tour of lies and deception by saying it was the movie that sparked spontaneous violence in Libya. Clinton and Obama still refused to call it what it was for over a week. First they tried to cover it up. It's disgusting that so many don't know or care.








Hmmm, better than Reuben's.
..One more.
Ben!
..My last one.
Okay.


And I guess you missed the several quotes from the White House the DAY AFTER the attack, saying it wasn't because of the video.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 11:09 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Guess Kwickie never heard of Charlie Wilson ?

He should. He was a Democrat from Texas.

He sorta was in favor of helping out folks who were fighting the Soviets.

But go ahead and mock Reagan.


" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 1:20 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:
U.S. officials have stated the White House is providing nonlethal aid to the Syrian rebels, while widespread reports have claimed the U.S. has been working with Arab countries to ensure the opposition in Syria is well armed.



FYI, this isn't a contradictory statement, for a couple of reasons.

1) The U.S. *can* provide nonlethal aid to Syrian rebels *AND* at the same time work with Arab countries to ensure the opposition is well-armed. That's easy - don't sell them guns, but put them in contact with those who will.

2) "Guns don't kill people; people kill people." According to the NRA, giving Syrians guns *IS* providing them nonlethal aid, since guns are considered nonlethal by the gun freaks.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 1:23 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Guess Kwickie never heard of Charlie Wilson ?

He should. He was a Democrat from Texas.

He sorta was in favor of helping out folks who were fighting the Soviets.



How'd that work out?


Quote:

But go ahead and mock Reagan.



It's the only thing he was ever good for.





"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, October 3, 2012 1:26 PM

STORYMARK


I love it. His bullshit not bought by anyone, he pouts and weeps for Reagan. Awesome.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Thursday, October 4, 2012 4:53 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:



Then Obama and his cronies tried to downplay the whole thing by blaming a spontaneous riot due to a movie trailer as the cause, all while they knew the truth.


Blaming a movie... by saying that it wasn't the movie?



Even Jon Stewart had to admit that the Administration was playing up the movie angle quite a bit.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-october-1-2012/american-terror-s
tory

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Thursday, October 4, 2012 5:35 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:



Then Obama and his cronies tried to downplay the whole thing by blaming a spontaneous riot due to a movie trailer as the cause, all while they knew the truth.


Blaming a movie... by saying that it wasn't the movie?



Even Jon Stewart had to admit that the Administration was playing up the movie angle quite a bit.

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-october-1-2012/american-terror-s
tory


Ive even posted quotes that support this. So, duh.

What I don't see is any evidence of them saying it was only that, as Rappy claims over and over.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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