REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Board Dispute - Please Help

POSTED BY: BYTEMITE
UPDATED: Tuesday, October 16, 2012 16:02
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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 3:48 AM

BYTEMITE


Hey everyone. This isn't a RWED but I could use your opinions and advice. Oonjerah has authorized me to post these messages because I would like to understand what is happening.

Because of how fireflyfans works, I don't have all the transcripts of my responses. But I have tried to reconstruct them from memory to the best of my ability, and I think I've included everything that might have escalated this chain. I will update with any corrections offered.

Some of these messages reference this argument. http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=53061&p=2

Quote:
-Tue 10/02/12 6:41 PM-

Oonjerah has sent you a message from FIREFLYFANS.NET.



The message is as follows:


Maybe it's my misunderstanding, but -- last two times we locked horns,
you left the board for a while. ... I don't want that.

You brought your feelings into the French Cartoon thread.
I suggest that we could have a thread about your feelings, and
You would agree to it, and courageously hang in and discuss them.

OR ... when you call people dumb or put words in their mouths,
we could talk about that.

You obviously have a lot of friends on this board. They don't want
you to go away. They want you to accept the hand of friendship that
they offer.

You remind me a lot of a couple of friends I used to have.

Oonjerah


(((RECONSTRUCTION)))
Quote:

-Tue 10/02/12 around 7 PM-

I guess I can't blame you for giving me a taste of my own medicine and conflating insults when I do that myself.

But let's not pretend your suggestion that I quarantine my feelings to a single thread was a meant as constructive and positive advice.

And besides, it doesn't work. I've tried before to stop gushing negativity everywhere. By LEAVING.


Quote:
-Tue 10/09/12 3:32 PM-

Oonjerah has sent you a message from FIREFLYFANS.NET.



The message is as follows:


Byte,

I'm not ignoring you. I just found your message (eMail had sent it to Junk) as I was crashing early this morning, then I went to bed. ... Now, still sleepy, I'm trying to be fair & not critical. Give me credit there, please.

"But let's not pretend your suggestion that I quarantine my feelings to a single thread was a meant as constructive and positive advice."

Well ... maybe not constructive for you, but a relief to others. The thread was about a cartoon that got a violent mob reaction from some radical Muslims. I wanted to stay on topic there instead of discussing your feelings. On Topic. Everyone insults and disrespects Bytemite was not the topic. But since it comes up in so many threads, probably it needs its own thread.

Everyone insults and disrespects Bytemite. When you toss that out on the board, does it feel honest to you? Because it always Strikes me as dishonest and inappropriate.

I've tried before to stop gushing negativity everywhere. By LEAVING.
How I hear what you said: "I want stop gushing negativity everywhere, but I can't. I have no control over it." OK ... you mean, it's OCD? I didn't know. I thought it was just a wrong switch that makes you turn left when you ought to stay on track.

Because what you do bugs me, I've been trying to find something in me that is like it ... a way to relate and see what my anger is really about. I think I found it. => Most people don't like me and they ignore me. So I feel rejected, a social outcast.

But you resemble more my long lost friend Eva who fought the way you do. When she got mad, honest, fair & objective all became irrelevant to her. So she fought dirty. But she never could see it that way, even in retrospect.

To simplfy, When we are talking about an event from the news: We have different opinions about it, different principles and priorities attached to it. We talk civilly for a while. Then suddenly I say, "How dare you disagree with me. Your opinion invalidates my opinion and you insult me!!" Wouldn't you recoil from my off the wall accusation?

However, in the offensive cartoon thread, you did mostly complain about being misunderstood ... that you clearly said one thing, but people were replying as if you'd said another. I can relate to that as well. Being misunderstood is very frustrating, and sometimes, often times, people do it on purpose, which is a way of making fun of others. But I never got that sense of HKC's responses to you.

Anyways ... this is the best I can do for the moment.

Oonj


Quote:
-Shortly afterwards-

Wow. I make an effort to stop spouting off negatively on the boards, and this is the message I get.

I now know never to open up to you again, because you just use it as hurtful ammunition. I wonder how I could have possibly thought you were actually trying to befriend me. I feel dumb now. Take your satisfaction, then, and leave me alone. I will endeavor to do the same.


Quote:
-Tue 10/09/12 7:01 PM-

hurtful ammunition?

Wow, yourself!
You & I clearly have the opposite idea of what's hurtful and what's helpful.

Often on forum, you mention how sick you are with your "black little heart."
I accept & address that claim, and you take it as an attack. That is your pattern.

So you will talk to me again, 'cause you love this game.
But seriously, Don't pretend to be honest. That's the last thing you are.

For the record, I am not trying to befriend you OR hurt you.


(((RECONSTRUCTION)))
Quote:
-Shortly afterward-

Look, you messaged me. And you keep messaging me. But fine, you want fair and impartial?

Why don't we ask the board what they think? If they think I'm off base, I'll apologize to you, and I'll even post that thread you were talking about. And if they think you could have worded this better, then you don't talk to me again. Deal?


Quote:
-Wed 10/10/12 12:09 PM-

I am not much in favor of making our little squabble public, but will not shirk from
it either. But if you want it on the forum, you'll have to be the one to post it.

Oonj


That's all I have. Thank you for reading. Thoughts?

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 4:38 AM

CANTTAKESKY


Wow.

OK, Byte? I like your brain. I don't always agree with you (who does with anyone else?), but I like the way you think. Of all the people on this board, you are probably the least likely to be hurtful or dishonest. In my view, you are as objective and fair and logical as they come. You are aware of fallacies, and as far as I can tell, you are one of the few who stoops to fallacious reasoning the least, if at all. Logic and intellectual integrity is exceptionally important to me, so I notice these things.

So, for what it's worth, I have no fucking idea what Oonj is talking about. Like she's talking about a different person than the Byte I have always talked to.

If she doesn't get you and who you are and how you think, she won't be the first--esp not on this board. Move on.

PS. I am NOT Byte's sockpuppet. ;)

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 6:33 AM

FREMDFIRMA



Effectively not my business, but you should know who you were really talking to, Byte.
I wonder if they have the guts to admit it.
We will see, I guess.

-Frem


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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 7:07 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Sigh...

I'm not comfortable with this. Bringing a PM conversation onto the board, well, it just doesn't seem right. And this one's gonna get me in tons of trouble, but okay, you asked:

I see some of the same things Oonj does; not all, but some. You know I've had difficulty with you before, and called it "passive aggressive". Whatever terminology you want to use, I have frequently observed you take things personally and go what is to me over the top in your responses.

To start, your reconstruction must be missing something, because Oonj's response started "I'm not ignoring you".

The thing about leaving keeps on coming up. Nobody wants you to leave, you've been told that, and to me doing so over and over again, along with your self-hateful rhetoric, seems to indicate something--I don't know what--that is uncomfortable for me. It seems to be indicating that I or one of us is doing something bad or wrong or picking on you or something, which I don't think anyone is. As Oonj said, there seems to be something dishonest--tho' I wouldn't say inappropriate--about things you write like this.

It seems to me that you get hyper-sensitive frequently...hell, we all do from time to time, but the way you go about dealing with it isn't comfortable for me, tho' I've tried to work things out with you in private before, I've sometimes been left with the feeling that somehow I should feel like I'm a bad person about it or something.

I'm putting this really badly, so I think I'll shut up. Suffice it to say I didn't enjoy the thread in question going off tangent into personal feelings either and wish it hadn't gone on so long.


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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:03 AM

STORYMARK


I see Oojn making an effort at understanding, and Byte bbeing Byte in return.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:15 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Y'know, Byte, there are those in this world with whom you may never get along. (And I mean "you" in the general sense, because I've sure as hell got some of those folk in my own life, both virtually and in real life, and some of them are family!)


You can't spend too much time on it. Lots of stuff, you'll never agree on, but a few things, you will.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:38 AM

MAL4PREZ


Byte, I honestly don't see where there ought to be a problem. Perhaps your reconstruction is incomplete, but your responses seem to have little to do with what Oonj was saying. Truly, I don't see any insult or putdown from him/her, not even an unintentional one. There's just nothing there.

I do recall something like this happening between you and I, which settled quickly and peacefully when I refused to engage. Remember? It worked out fine. I really wasn't upset with you at all.

The theme seems to be that the only one seeing the *dislike* is you. Believe me, I understand how hard it is to live with that state of mind, but I hope you know enough not to buy into it. You know you have a tendency toward paranoia about this, so fight it. Don't trust these negative feelings when they come. But I'm glad you didn't run away either. I agree with Niki that airing PMs is weird, but I think it's healthier for you to talk about it, though it must have been a scary risk for you to take.

I tell you - no one dislikes you. I guarantee it. No one is out to hurt you. Please just consider that people have their own inner lives and their own reasons for saying stuff that has absolutely nothing to do with whether they like you or not. I say this not because I want to start something with you - believe me I don't! - but because I do actually like you, and I enjoy your input here. I think it'd be even better to converse with you if I didn't worry about having to prove my good feelings.

Hmm. Maybe you can think of it as a courtesy. Do folks the courtesy of believing in their sincerity. If they don't like you, let them prove it, rather than always looking to prove it for them. That may seem weird, but as an anti-social person myself, I find an approach like that oddly empowering. I let the negativity live in other people, rather than focusing on it myself.

Hope something in my ramble is helpful.

(((((hugs)))))

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:44 AM

OONJERAH


10/2, Byte to Oonj:
"Well, I conflate insults all the time, so I can't fault you for giving me a taste
of my own medicine.

But let's not pretend your suggestion that I quarantine my feelings to a single thread
was a meant as constructive and positive advice.

And besides: it hasn't worked. As you noted, I've tried before to stop gushing negativity everywhere. By LEAVING."


Essentially the same as her reconstruction above. I found it in the junk folder a week
after it was sent.


10/9, Byte to Oonj (3rd PM):

Look, you messaged me first. And you keep messaging me. But fine, you want impartiality
and fairness?

Then why don't you post what you sent me to the board, and ask them what they think. If
they think I'm off base, then I'll apologize, and I'll even make that thread you mentioned.
If they think that you could have worded things better, then you don't talk to me again.
Agreed?

........

I thought this one over quite a while. When I sent my response, I got an error message from
the board & I assume the message was not sent. Since Byte hasn't seen it, I won't put it here.

I thought about it some more, then sent the one she posted: "I am not much in favor of ..."

Byte: "And you keep messaging me."
Actually, our PMs were one to one.

I'm not going to elaborate on the issue just now. And if y'all are not interested, I'll be happy to drop it.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:49 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
To start, your reconstruction must be missing something, because Oonj's response started "I'm not ignoring you".


It's a time stamp issue. I responded to her when she first messaged me, but the message was directed into her junk folder, and she didn't get back to me for a few days. She said that as a courtesy.

My messages from here also get directed into my junk folder. I have to check it regularly, like a second inbox.

Well, I'm hearing all of you. I'd like you to know that when I get bothered by something, it's because I'm genuinely upset, it's not because I'm putting on an act to score points in an argument. That would be a cheap move - I'd rather be wrong and have to apologize than engage in deceitful behaviour to win a hollow victory. My points should be able to stand on their own, apart from whatever emotional reaction I might also be having. That's why whenever I object to an argument on an emotional level, as in the cartoonist thread, I try to bring a reasoned response in later.

However... Just as I can't change how I feel (such as being hypersensitive sometimes), I can't change how you feel, and I concede what you have told me as valid.


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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:54 AM

BYTEMITE


Oonj, it appears I owe you an apology.

In retrospect, I have been a bit of a shit. I thought that there were all these comments in threads that you had directed at me, on top of what I saw as insults here. But, it sounds as though they weren't insults, rather you were actually asking me to clarify, but I reacted negatively to the language instead of the intent.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 8:56 AM

HERO


Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
I have frequently observed you take things personally and go what is to me over the top in your responses.

Pot to Kettle...your black.

H

Hero...must be right on all of this. ALL of the rest of us are wrong. Chrisisall, 2012

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 9:59 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
I have frequently observed you take things personally and go what is to me over the top in your responses.

Pot to Kettle...your black.






Man, you're dumb.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 10:02 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Sounds like you guys are working it out, which is great. NOT speaking for anyone else, but if it were me, I wouldn't feel an apology was necessary. Similar to situations I've been in, it sounds like a miscommunication which has been solved; ergo, no harm no foul on either side.
Quote:
I tell you - no one dislikes you. I guarantee it. No one is out to hurt you.
I wouldn't say that's unilaterally true, given there are some here who seem to "dislike" or "hate" pretty easily (NOT you, Byte, or Oonj; you know those of whom I'm speaking). But even those don't seem to dislike you, so I agree with Magons, maybe just take it on faith that we all have differing opinions and unless someone out-and-out snarks at/about you, there are no bad intentions. From what I've seen here, most people are pretty damned transparent when they don't like someone! ;o)


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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 10:10 AM

HKCAVALIER


Quote:
Originally posted by FREMDFIRMA:

Effectively not my business, but you should know who you were really talking to, Byte.
I wonder if they have the guts to admit it.
We will see, I guess.

Frem? Seemed to me the thread ended up a dialogue between Byte and me. Should I be afraid to admit that? I can't imagine who you would be talking about otherwise and I don't scare that easy, so color me confused.

I think I'll stay out of this conversation for now, let other folks chime in, seeing as Byte and I were having at least as much trouble communicating as she and Oonjerah. But if you think I have something important to contribute, I'm all ears.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 10:39 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Other people's conflicts don't make much sense. They are generally about feeling hurt and unheard or misunderstood and some other nebulus stuff instead. I'm not sure how you intend to make sense of it, Byte, except to try and understand your own responses to all this. And I'm not sure anyone here can help you with that.

Frem, I'm not sure what you comment refers to. I don't believe Oonjerah is a sock puppet, as I remember her from another board.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:39 AM

PEACEKEEPER

Keeping order in every verse


I never thiught I would see a thread about Internet mediation???? My advice to the both of you, is to leave the house just a tad more than you both do and worry about REAL fleshy people in the wide wide world. maybe a visit to your respective therapists for a discussion on PERSPECTIVE would be in order. A thicker skin and a wave of the hand in apathy wouldn't hurt guys!!!

With the grace of age, commander, we learn to accept.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 2:00 PM

OONJERAH


Bytemite: "Oonj, it appears I owe you an apology."


It's OK. Like Niki said, no harm, no foul.

"Because what you do bugged me, I've been trying to find something in me that is like it
... a way to relate and see what my anger is really about."

This is the crux of it for me now: my anger, my inappropriate reaction. A little bell rings
& it means, "Time to get up and work on myself."

PeaceKeeper advises acceptance. Good idea!


I want to thank you for something. Last June, you recommended Lord of the Rings Online
to me. So I went there and did that. It's more complex than EverQuest. And in spite of
the huge learning curve, I much enjoy it.


Last. The term "Sockpuppet" is new to me since I came on this board. So, for my information,
is it a greater insult than Troll?

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 2:13 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


A sockpuppet (or what I call a sickpuppy) is someone having more than one account and posting under more than one name. In other words, pretending to be more "people" than themselves. There's lots of guesses from time to time as to who is who's sockpuppet, etc., but I never figured out why anyone would want to do it, and probably never will. Is there some kind of game where you pretend to be someone besides yourself? Is there a "score" to be kept? And can you ever "win" if the other people don't know Person A and Person B are both you? It's pretty silly, IMHO. I guess if there are two people, and each knows who the other person's sockpuppet is, they can snark that "Hey, we really pulled the wool over HIS eyes!" and chortle together, but either that OR someone getting off on fooling someone else seems rather uninteresting to me.

Frem seems to be saying you're actually someone else here who created a sockpuppet called Oonj. Maybe you are, I could care less. Frem has suspected some others in the past that I thought he was wrong about, but I can't know and I don't care...it would take WAY too much time and energy to figure out who's who's who...I just take people as they present themselves, it's no skin off my nose if they're faking it, and actually more harmful to THEM, in my opinion.


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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 2:15 PM

MAL4PREZ


Bytemite,

I've been looking into the other thread, which I haven't read a bit of before now. I can see the source of your frustration. I'm glad I wasn't in on that thread when it went down, because I could see the point on both sides yet also disagreed with some of what both were saying. I might have stepped in and likely pissed off everyone LOL!

I only got halfway through, but it seemed like I expected. Some basic disagreement, then the flawed communication medium and people not really understanding each other, and then it went nuts. I'm glad to see that it's come back around to hand-shaking.

Last night I read that blog you linked to about the potter troll war - very creepy! We've had our sockpuppet weirdos (and possibly still do - who knows!) but at least we can back off and be friendly when the smoke clears. Wow. I can't imagine people being as nuts about fandom as those folks were!

So I'm really glad you all talked this out.

ETA: Niki: yeah, when I said no one was out to get her, etc... I was kind of making an assumption. No one who's a reasonable human and not a half-troll. But I don't see the trollish ones go after Bytemite much, and I think she knows to blow them off anyway.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 6:28 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
Frem? Seemed to me the thread ended up a dialogue between Byte and me. Should I be afraid to admit that? I can't imagine who you would be talking about otherwise and I don't scare that easy, so color me confused.

Oh, no that has nothing to do with it, nor is that directed at you.

Someone needs to come clean is all

-Frem


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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 7:16 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


FREM, you sometimes see sockpuppets when there are none.

BYTE: You often assume ill-intent when none is intended, and cast others as villains when they aren't. I can be a prick, but I see you taking offense at many others who truly don't deserve it. I'm not sure what sets you off, since there doesn't seem to be much in common among your various targets. But when you go off on people like Niki and HK and Ooonj as well as me... well, that's a "you" problem, not a "them" problem. IMHO.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 7:30 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


FWIW Byte

I read the posts between you and HK - what I saw was HK being as unarmed and non-aggressive as possible, doing the equivalent of standing with arms out and palms forward. And you picking up your sword and going on the attack. The more non-confrontational he became, the more hostile and aggressive you became. I have to say it had me extremely puzzled. I looked closely and couldn't find what it was that was triggering that response from you. Just my opinion. Maybe you could explain b/c it baffled me. Perhaps if you could pick out a word, phrase, sentence or paragraph that you feel deserved that response it would help me understand you.

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Wednesday, October 10, 2012 7:50 PM

HKCAVALIER


I dunno, Frem.

Oonjerah is an entirely new voice on the board as far as I can tell. She honestly comes closer than anyone around here ever has to sharing my understanding of, well, a lot of things. Stuff I've been at odds with pretty much everyone over but that one guy a billion years ago whom I can't remember (what was his name, Mavon, Ravon, Travon, or some such?) and, of course, Chrisisall's wife. Is that who it is? I'm hoping you don't think she's Rue. Rue ain't sockpuppetting around this place, I assure you. Unless she's the ghost of SoupCatcher or something, you're not gonna convince me she's anybody other than who she says she is.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Thursday, October 11, 2012 6:09 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I dunno about this sickpuppy thing; I, too, think sometimes you see them when they're not there, Frem. Someone guessed you might think Oonj was MY sockpuppet, which made me laugh. Given you and everyone else know how I feel about them, I can't imagine that.

Mostly, I'm just glad they worked it out, and hope Byte doesn't take offense at anyone's responses. Let there be peace! ;o)


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Thursday, October 11, 2012 11:00 AM

OONJERAH



Frem: "Effectively not my business, but you should know who you were really talking
to, Byte. I wonder if they have the guts to admit it."

1. Byte was talking to Oonjerah, therefore "who" must refer to Me. (WTF?)

2. Magonsdaughter: "Frem, I'm not sure what you comment refers to. I don't believe
Oonjerah is a sock puppet, as I remember her from another board."

I consider Magons' integrity above reproach. I'm hoping for another witness also.

Frem thinks I'm a sockpuppet? Frem thinks I'm a sockpuppet!!
It's mind boggling that anyone could think that.

My voice is my own, and it's unique. That much is obvious.

Please have the guts to back off, Frem.


=========================
I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it. ~Charles R Swindoll

If I let others tell me I'm a clone, I've vacated self-definition.

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Thursday, October 11, 2012 11:05 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
FREM, you sometimes see sockpuppets when there are none.


Agreed.

If ANYONE around here has a unique writing style, it's Oonj.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum


"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Thursday, October 11, 2012 11:12 AM

OONJERAH



Thank you, Story.

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Friday, October 12, 2012 6:08 PM

SOCKPUPPET


Once again Fremdfirma is going off about an assumption he has made, which his afraid he might be wrong about, so he's not willing to accuse someone precisely, that way he thinks he can be right, but he's still trying to sneak the negativity into an attack that others will take as he intends it, pushing off this viscera on another user.

In this case, he is wrong, and just being a little dickishly arrogant because being wrong is not a possibility that he really entertains. But for the record, he is wrong.

ETA: Thanks, Sig.

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Friday, October 12, 2012 6:19 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


OMG!!! A REAL sockpuppet!!! I've heard about you so much... pleased ta meetcha!

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Friday, October 12, 2012 6:42 PM

OONJERAH



You mean ... you're the Real SockPuppet?
But aren't SockPuppets supposed to be sneaky and evil?

Then why are you telling the Truth?

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Friday, October 12, 2012 6:50 PM

HKCAVALIER


Hey Oonjerah,

Just to be clear: I'm basically ribbing our mutural Frem in my above post. None of the folks I mention could possibly be you in reality. Frem is usually pretty discerning, so I'm intensely curious what about you could possibly have led him to believe you were someone's sockpuppet.

The point of a sockpuppet is to grant one's own opinion greater weight by having "others" agree with it. If he thinks you're a sockpuppet, I gotta wonder who's opinion you're supposedly bolstering, 'cause far as I can see, your opinions are...well, your own.

Unless, of course, you are MY sockpuppet! lol Ack! What have I done! I've given us...er, I mean, myself away! Some sorry excuse for a forum troll I am! Loser! (Now, you come back with "Oh, I don't think you're a loser, HK, I think you're the most brilliant--wait a doggone minute! If you're my sockpuppet, I don't have to give you instructions! I can just log into my Oonjerah account and post what I please--no one the wiser! Yeah! Hey, I'm really getting the hang of this sockpuppetry dealie, aren't I? Don't answer that! Damn it!)

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Friday, October 12, 2012 7:21 PM

OONJERAH


I'm intensely curious what about you could possibly have [done that?] led him
to believe you were someone's sockpuppet.

What was Frem's need/use for a sockpuppet in this case?

1. He hasn't outed anyone lately and feels it's overdue?

2. He loves being the mysterious know-it-all?

3. He is drawing fire from Byte to himself?

4. He saw a picture of me with the wool drawn over my eyes?

Boss, I'm thinkin' only Frem can answer your question. But it blew me away, too.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 3:00 AM

SOCKPUPPET


Quote:
Originally posted by Oonjerah:

You mean ... you're the Real SockPuppet?
But aren't SockPuppets supposed to be sneaky and evil?

Then why are you telling the Truth?


Who says I am?

Oh, I do, of course. And you, because you're my sockpuppet. Thanks for the backup, sockpuppet.

Only bad sockpuppets are evil. Most of us are just unseely fae drifting through the ether. We don't always support our humans, sometimes we shoot them down and become real. Like therightstuff and shadowfly. Its how we get our wings

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 6:24 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

3. He is drawing fire from Byte to himself?


The question of what exactly is guilt by association came up in a thread recently.

I have been accepting of the criticism here, and spending less time on the boards reevaluating my perspective. I don't attack people through other people. I do that well enough on my own.

We never know about anyone here. There are similarities between you and other people, but there are also differences. I am unsure and often paranoid, and I don't recall seeing that you've ever posted anywhere outside the RWED, but I also don't think you are the person he thinks you are.

Some part of me, the logical part says that you are probably your own person. Another part of me is always screaming to never trust anyone. Eventually, as I check off who you aren't, there may come a time when there is only Oonj. This is the only way I can fight the paranoia.

I suspect everyone might be sockpuppets, but I try to address everyone at face value. Ultimately, my view is that whether someone is or isn't a sockpuppet doesn't really matter in the long run - if their ideas and arguments are insightful then they will stand up to scrutiny on their own, regardless of which head or source those ideas come from.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 1:38 PM

OONJERAH




Quote Oonjerah: "3. He is drawing fire from Byte to himself?"

the remark means: I believe Frem feels protective toward you.

If he feels antagonistic toward me, that's puzzling.
Did I offend him with some blunder?


=========================
I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it. ~Charles R Swindoll

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 2:06 PM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:
Originally posted by Oonjerah:
If he feels antagonistic toward me, that's puzzling.
Did I offend him with some blunder?
I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it. ~Charles R Swindoll
Maybe because you quote Charles Swindoll.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 2:22 PM

OONJERAH



I like the line about "how I react." It goes to response-ability.
I've no idea who Charles R Swindoll is (wiki: evangelical Christian pastor,
author, educator) but have to give credit to the quote.

There is someone I know better who he is that I'd like to quote. We'll see
if I have the strength to start a new thread for it.


=========================
I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it. ~Charles R Swindoll

If I have to react to others all the time, then they own my mind more than I do.
If I let others tell me how to feel, I lose my ability to choose happiness.
If I let others tell me who I am, I've vacated self-definition.
Finally, I realized how foolish I was to give others such power over me.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 3:28 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
OMG!!! A REAL sockpuppet!!! I've heard about you so much... pleased ta meetcha!



Trust me, you've met before. Odd that SockPuppet hasn't been here in a year and a half, and just magically pops up in this thread, huh?






"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 3:32 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
Hey Oonjerah,

Just to be clear: I'm basically ribbing our mutural Frem in my above post. None of the folks I mention could possibly be you in reality. Frem is usually pretty discerning, so I'm intensely curious what about you could possibly have led him to believe you were someone's sockpuppet.

The point of a sockpuppet is to grant one's own opinion greater weight by having "others" agree with it. If he thinks you're a sockpuppet, I gotta wonder who's opinion you're supposedly bolstering, 'cause far as I can see, your opinions are...well, your own.

Unless, of course, you are MY sockpuppet! lol Ack! What have I done! I've given us...er, I mean, myself away! Some sorry excuse for a forum troll I am! Loser! (Now, you come back with "Oh, I don't think you're a loser, HK, I think you're the most brilliant--wait a doggone minute! If you're my sockpuppet, I don't have to give you instructions! I can just log into my Oonjerah account and post what I please--no one the wiser! Yeah! Hey, I'm really getting the hang of this sockpuppetry dealie, aren't I? Don't answer that! Damn it!)

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.



Occasionally, a sockpuppet is a way for one user to try and "seamlessly" transition their account from one name to another, in an effort to transform themselves or remake their image in a better light.





"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 4:09 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
Originally posted by Oonjerah:

Quote Oonjerah: "3. He is drawing fire from Byte to himself?"

the remark means: I believe Frem feels protective toward you.

If he feels antagonistic toward me, that's puzzling.
Did I offend him with some blunder?


Ah.

No, it's probably not anything you did. Whenever a new person joins an internet board there's always a period of scrutiny where people consider whether the person might be a sockpuppet. Or other shenanigans, there was one time I was on a board that was closing down and we all jumped to a new board, I was the last to join at the new board and two people switched account names just to mess with me. Took me forever to figure out why everyone was laughing.

Frem thought some of your typing habits were like the habits of another member who doesn't come around as much anymore. Who appears to now have picked up on the accusation.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 4:16 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Maybe I'm a sockpuppet and don't know it.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 4:31 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Well, in a sense, aren't we all sockpuppets?

I mean, are any of you posting under your real, given name here? I'm not; I can assure you that my parents did not name me "Kwicko" upon birth.

Who we are on this site is not who we really are in real life. We are here as an imago, an icon of our actual selves. What you see here is not the totality of any one person, but the image they share with you by choice.


Some apparently have chosen to share more than one image of themselves. Some may have even shifted the image they project.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 6:28 PM

OONJERAH



Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Maybe I'm a sockpuppet and don't know it.



Very likely, MD. But if you are, you have the
same puppetmaster as you did on the other board.

I don't recall that we had sockpuppets there, so
maybe that's why you never knew. Til now.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 7:08 PM

FREMDFIRMA



One might note that I did not assume malice, simply obfuscation of identity.

And yes, I had suspicions, when a user using tablet style formatting and green text goes away and another user comes along using green text and tablet formatting shows up in the same time frame, with certain similarities of style - who would not be ?

I was emphatically not the only one who noticed this at the time, but simply felt there was no reason to pursue it whatever given apparent lack of malicious intent.

I'd deny a certain protective instinct but I rather doubt anyone here would buy that, so whatever.

Oh, and speakin of similarities of style, Nickpuppet, you ain't very convincing, stick to your own name, ehe ?

-F

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 7:34 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


"Nickpuppet"?? Is that a reference to me?? Now you're making ME paranoid!

And by the way, initially was going to respond to Mike by saying that, while not the totality of the person, I use my own name and I THINK "speak" to you guys the same as I do to Choey, or Jim, or anyone else. I'm sure subconsciously there are differences, but not consciously. I've never been on a forum board under anything but my own name, and never deliberately portrayed myself as other than I am.

So what's with this "Nickpuppet" thing, Frem?

(Just popped in to turn the computer off, so I'll check in tomorrow...you've got me wondering what's going on...)


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Saturday, October 13, 2012 7:37 PM

OONJERAH



'#fff4d0' This is the color I used when I first came here. Not
green; the predominant color is red. I'd call it a dark manilla.
One rule is the color has to be light enough for clear contrast
against the black background. Dreamtrove, for example, always
used the standard bright green; I wouldn't.

I am inconsistent, changing the color on whim or to show off.

You can go places like this to get the hexadecimal color codes,
http://html-color-codes.com/ .. but I don't because I like to mess
with the code myself until the color looks good to me.

This page shows html colors with both names and hex codes.
http://www.w3schools.com/html/html_colornames.asp

Lots of people love color, love a bit of artistry in their
expression. Real People even.


Haven't used tan yet. Maybe I'll do this color for awhile.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 7:51 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
So what's with this "Nickpuppet" thing, Frem?

Lmao, sorry, didn't mean to push your buttons doll - just that "SOCKPUPPET" is so obviously M52Nickerson that I thought everyone else would get the joke...

-F

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 8:34 PM

BYTEMITE


>_>

I thought SOCKPUPPET was DT.

This thread. It blew up. But it was always going to blow up.

I am the wasteland. It's me. Walking across your fields and leaving them fallow. Eris threw the golden apples and now Troy is besieged.

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Saturday, October 13, 2012 8:57 PM

CANTTAKESKY


Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
I thought SOCKPUPPET was DT.
I don't think it is even a secret. Sockpuppet uses run on, stream of consciousness sentences. It's a very unique style. Sounds just like DT.

And Oonjerah doesn't. She talks like a woman, with subtle emotional nuances. She also uses short sentences separated by line breaks, with a lot of enumeration. Very different voice. Definitely not DT.


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Saturday, October 13, 2012 9:38 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
>_>

I thought SOCKPUPPET was DT.

This thread. It blew up. But it was always going to blow up.

I am the wasteland. It's me. Walking across your fields and leaving them fallow. Eris threw the golden apples and now Troy is besieged.


Haha. You egocentric little muppet. It's not all about you (keep repeating it to yourself)

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