So what's shut down for you? by Geezer

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Let's see...who was it here who was adamant that the Republicans WOULDN'T shut down the government...??

This is so disgusting, I don't know when the American people are going to have had enough of this childishness...so many innocent people affected and they don't give a flying SHIT!

And for absolutely NOTHING...Obamacare started today, just like they knew it would...but so much else DIDN'T. Totally insane.

My stepson lives out Jackson Hole way, does a lot of hiking in Yellowstone. His vacation starts today, he can't even go hiking 'cuz Yellowstone is closed. People have to reserve visits to Yosemite over a YEAR in advance, but of course Yosemite's closed. Over five THOUSAND tourists a day go out to The Rock, but Alcatraz is closed and since most people buy their tickets on line, they're not sure how to get their money back...and those are just the UNIMPORTANT, recreational aspects...

Makes me sick. They'll have to throw in the towel, even they know it, it's just a matter of how long they want to fuck us all over before they do, so they can make their "statement". Absolutely unconscionable. "Representatives" my fucking ASS!

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Tuesday, October 1, 2013 12:24 PM

Quote:
Geezer: So what's shut down for you?

I choose to interpret this as what does shut down mean to me. In answer:

I think... All of us should have a barbeque.

You can put corn still in the husk on a grill. Give it five minutes, turning over occasionally, and then you have some tasty corn that has the subtle smokey flavour of the outdoors and charcoal.

All the meat eaters can just go to TOWN. Have some fun, get sauce everywhere, delicious carmelized sauce on once living protein. And then hamburger buns.

Drinkers can get the hootch up ins. Apple cider will be provided for the non-drinkers.

And then, as we eat and make merry, we can envision that we are munching on, slicing and serving up, the party system and laws we don't like.

That's what I think.

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Tuesday, October 1, 2013 1:00 PM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

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Tuesday, October 1, 2013 6:04 PM

WHOZIT

It's the shut down no one cares about, unless your a lazy government worker or were planing on taking a dump in the park.

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Tuesday, October 1, 2013 6:19 PM

America loves a winner!

I like how the crowd of WW2 Veterans said 'screw you, Obama ! ' and crossed the roped off 'closed' areas of the WW2 Memorial anyways.

You can shut down the WH, Barry, but you can't keep Americans from THEIR monuments!

Good job, Vets!!!

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Wednesday, October 2, 2013 1:47 PM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

You'll have to cite where they SAID "Screw you, Obama" to be taken seriously, because I doubt that's what happened. Obama didn't shut down the government; the Republicans' refusal to pass a budget did. Nobody else is refusing to pass the budget, and the LAW required the government to shut down if they didn't pass one. Obama hasn't got a damned thing to do with it, it's Congress and the Senate, you poor addled fool.

Here, given you get your "information" from FauxNews and we know people who do are more ignorant than others, try to understand the following. The budget process is as follows:

1.The President of the United States submits a budget proposal to Congress.

2.Both houses review the proposal, and develop budget resolutions of their own.

3.The resolutions are “marked up” in the appropriations subcommittees.

4.The House and Senate vote on the final versions of their respective bills, and go to conference committee to hammer out their differences, at which point the reconciled versions go to the floor of each house for a final vote.

5.The president signs the reconciled versions, and the budget becomes law.

The first three and half steps of the process happened as they should have. The second half of step three, which is the conference committee, didn’t take place. Here is where GOP, or rather, Tea Party stubbornness, came into play. When the time came to go to conference, Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) and Sen. Patty Murray (D-WA), the chairs of their respective budget committees, sat down to discuss a framework for such a conference.

Sen. Pat Toomey (R-PA), speaking on behalf of Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL), objected to forming such a committee because neither of them saw a successful outcome of such a committee.

A conference committee is usually approved unanimously by the Senate, is made up of people from both houses, and is used to reconcile differences in legislation that both houses have passed. Such committees are temporary, and once reconciliation is achieved, are disbanded.

Between April 23 and July 1, Senate Democrats asked for consent to go to conference on the budget resolutions 15 times, and were shot down by Senate Republicans 15 times, for the following reasons:

-- They wanted a framework for how the conference would work.

-- They wanted a guarantee that the budget would not be used to raise the debt ceiling.

-- They wanted a guarantee of protection from tax hikes on corporations and the wealthiest Americans.

-- Some of them wanted to debate the resolution again.

-- They wanted an agreement on a 30-year budget outlook.

Notice that not one of these reasons has to do with the ACA. What’s truly odd is that Sen. Sessions and Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY), two of the Republicans that blocked various conference requests, asked for a conference prior to passing the resolution. They knew the process, and then backed away from it early on, and dug their heels in with subsequent requests. Other Tea Party senators, including Ted Cruz and Mike Lee (R-UT), also blocked requests.

On Sept. 29, Sen. Paul asked why they weren’t going to a conference on this on CBS’s “Face the Nation,” and the above was then explained by Sen. Durbin (D-IL). Paul is also among the senators who blocked conference requests earlier this year.

The ACA appears central to the reasons for a shutdown now, but is actually a red herring being used for the purpose of assigning blame. This whole thing started 5 months ago when the GOP began refusing to even attempt reconciliation of the budgets. To determine who is responsible for this, one needs to look at the last five months, and ignore the childish “they started it” arguments with respect to the ACA. The Tea Party wing of the GOP is, in fact, responsible for our current crisis. They are the ones who refused to negotiate.

That's it, in a nutshell, and I could offer links to each part of it, except I know you wouldn't read them.

By the way, a GOP aide told Yahoo! News that the House was calling for a conference tonight, after the Senate rejected their third continuing resolution ( http://news.yahoo.com/government-shutdown-imminent-barring-an-unlikely
-last-minute-deal-165129660.html), so maybe... Or not.

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 6:38 PM

The Shut Down is totally selfish on the part of Congress, or rather, on the part of those 30-40 knuckleheads appeasing their base. Plus Boehner, what a wimp!

It is the two H's - Hubris and Hypocrisy.

They must know that this latest salvo wouldn't affect Obamacare. It is pure and utter political posturing in prep for the mid-term elections and beyond.
These guys need to show their base that they're in it to disrupt and destroy POTUS' reputation.

What I would like to know is why they haven't attempted to impeach Obama. They have it within their power to do so. Think about that for a moment. If the president is illegitimate, as they and their base say, then they have grounds for impeachment. Don't they?

This is about Obamacare (or so they say) and they have tried to repeal it over 40 times without any success. So they decide to hold a gun to our collective heads. They close down the government in hopes of forcing the president to repeal or change the law he based his campaign on. A law that was implemented in Massachusetts by Romney (but for some reason he claimed was not good for the rest of us in this country), a law that passed both houses (as part of the democratic process) and deemed Constitutional (which Tea Party people claim is their guiding light). Face it folks, we are being held up by our own government. This is a shakedown; the Mob must be grinning from ear to ear.

What's wrong with this picture?

Is this America? What happened to the democratic process that I once read about in my history class? Is Teddy all upset that he couldn't win and he's taking his ball home? What ever happened to fair play?

I wasn't happy when Bush won the general election, but I didn't see the Dems pack up their ball and glove and go home. I didn't them see throw a tantrum and hold their breath, or hold the country hostage to force our troops to come home from Iraq.

What does Shut Down mean to me: It means strategic bullshit and stupidity.

Long Live the United States of America/Real Americans don't try to destroy Democracy

SGG

Freedom is just another word for nothing left to Lose

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 6:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
'screw you, Obama ! '

LOL, since when is refusing to negotiate with terrorists a fault?
Your bullshit is so predictable, so tired & Nazi-like.
Heil Fox!
(raise your hand, Rappy)

To answer the actual question, Curiosity was turned off!!! How much does THAT suck???

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 6:52 PM

You have that ass backwards.

It's Congress who hold the purse strings there buddy. It was their idea to shut down government and, in my mind, it seems they kind of forgot about the impact their decision would have on the vets (well, that goes across the board).

From what I understand the vets broke through the barricades and exercised their right as vets to visit the memorial, and only after did the idiots show up to hypocritically take advantage of photo-ops. What gall! What hubris! What a bunch of maroons!

What nerve. They shut it down, then have the nerve to point fingers in the direction of the president who repeatedly advise them to do their constitutionally appointed job.

But since blaming Obama for everything but the Lindberg baby kidnapping is the norm of the day..........what else is new!

SGG

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
I like how the crowd of WW2 Veterans said 'screw you, Obama ! ' and crossed the roped off 'closed' areas of the WW2 Memorial anyways.

You can shut down the WH, Barry, but you can't keep Americans from THEIR monuments!

Good job, Vets!!!

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 6:56 PM

That's right! Give 'em Hell Niki!

SGG

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
Let's see...who was it here who was adamant that the Republicans WOULDN'T shut down the government...??

This is so disgusting, I don't know when the American people are going to have had enough of this childishness...so many innocent people affected and they don't give a flying SHIT!

And for absolutely NOTHING...Obamacare started today, just like they knew it would...but so much else DIDN'T. Totally insane.

My stepson lives out Jackson Hole way, does a lot of hiking in Yellowstone. His vacation starts today, he can't even go hiking 'cuz Yellowstone is closed. People have to reserve visits to Yosemite over a YEAR in advance, but of course Yosemite's closed. Over five THOUSAND tourists a day go out to The Rock, but Alcatraz is closed and since most people buy their tickets on line, they're not sure how to get their money back...and those are just the UNIMPORTANT, recreational aspects...

Makes me sick. They'll have to throw in the towel, even they know it, it's just a matter of how long they want to fuck us all over before they do, so they can make their "statement". Absolutely unconscionable. "Representatives" my fucking ASS!

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 7:00 PM

Since we're thinking along those lines, here's a thought.......

We can buy guns online and in the gun shows, go to our local gun manufacturers and start blasting..........whaddaya say! Who's game!

Isn't it ironical!!!!!

;-)

SGG

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:
Geezer: So what's shut down for you?

I choose to interpret this as what does shut down mean to me. In answer:

I think... All of us should have a barbeque.

You can put corn still in the husk on a grill. Give it five minutes, turning over occasionally, and then you have some tasty corn that has the subtle smokey flavour of the outdoors and charcoal.

All the meat eaters can just go to TOWN. Have some fun, get sauce everywhere, delicious carmelized sauce on once living protein. And then hamburger buns.

Drinkers can get the hootch up ins. Apple cider will be provided for the non-drinkers.

And then, as we eat and make merry, we can envision that we are munching on, slicing and serving up, the party system and laws we don't like.

That's what I think.

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 7:08 PM

You do realize of course that the government shutdown didn't affect NSA surveillance. And that anything we post here is preserved by various means/waybackmachines and etc.

Thanks for painting me with that brush when all I'm saying is that if Occupy Wall Street wants to do something peacefully, maybe they should try Occupy Freaking Congress. This is a golden opportunity to affect change you know.

I seem to remember people being impressed with the crowd support when some lady in Texas did a fillibuster not too long ago. The public as a whole CAN make a difference, and not only on voting day.

But no, I guess I'm just another dangerous idiot with an itchy finger and a lead thrower fetish just because I'm not having panic attacks about what's happening.

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 7:13 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
You'll have to cite where they SAID "Screw you, Obama" to be taken seriously, because I doubt that's what happened. Obama didn't shut down the government; the Republicans' refusal to pass a budget did. Nobody else is refusing to pass the budget, and the LAW required the government to shut down if they didn't pass one. Obama hasn't got a damned thing to do with it, it's Congress and the Senate, you poor addled fool.

While the Republicans sending up a budget the Democrats will not agree with may defund the government, it's the Executive branch that decides what government functions are essential, and what will be cut. As usual, these cuts are the ones that will get the most publicity. Don't think that the Republicans are the only ones playing politics here.

"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 7:15 PM

Wouldn't it be just a hoot if Ted Cruz's house gets bombed and the FBI aren't available to investigate......

Or the WWII vets beat the shit out of Michele Bachmann with their canes, now that would be funny.

SGG

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
'screw you, Obama ! '
LOL, since when is refusing to negotiate with terrorists a fault?
Your bullshit is so predictable, so tired & Nazi-like.
Heil Fox!
(raise your hand, Rappy)

To answer the actual question, Curiosity was turned off!!! How much does THAT suck???

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Thursday, October 3, 2013 7:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Don't think that the Republicans are the only ones playing politics here.

Thanks for the phoney objective view, Geez.
I dislike Democrats too, but they didn't engineer this hostile takeover attempt.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:10 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Don't think that the Republicans are the only ones playing politics here.
Thanks for the phoney objective view, Geez.
I dislike Democrats too, but they didn't engineer this hostile takeover attempt.

Didn't say they did.

However, they're playing it for all its worth - shutting down the parts of government that will have the most visible impact and garner the most news reports.

C'mon, Chris. You know that the Democrats wanted this shutdown as much as the Tea Partiers.

"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:32 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:
You have that ass backwards.

Actually, I don't. Y'all do.

The order to barricade the WW 2 Memorial came down to the US Parks Service from the Office of Management and Budget. They get their orders directly from where ?

Congress ? Nope

The White House.

This is entirely Obama's doing.

( Same goes for shutting down the WH, and giving the sequestration as an excuse )

At no other time in the 17 Govt shut downs ( or slim downs, as Andrea Taranto calls 'em ) have any open air memorials been blocked or closed off.

There ARE no working staff at these facilities, and they are to remain open 24/7.

it's actually costing the govt MORE money to rent barricades and staff guards on these locations, which ordinarily run on next to no staff, save for maintenance.

Deal w/ the facts

Quote:
Wouldn't it be just a hoot if Ted Cruz's house gets bombed and the FBI aren't available to investigate......

Why would that be a " hoot ", if a US Senator's home got bombed ? Would you laugh as much if Obama's, or Harry Reid's house were bombed ? Oh, not so much a " hoot " then, is it ?

Either way, the appropriate law enforcement resources would still be on the case. Your lack of understanding on such matters is embarrassing.

Quote:

Or the WWII vets beat the shit out of Michele Bachmann with their canes, now that would be funny.

SGG

Michelle Bachmann is one of the Senators fighting for their right to VISIT the W W 2 Memorial in the first place. Were it not for her, and others, they'd have traveled across the country only to be turned away at THEIR Memorial. Turned away by Barrack Hussein Obama, and no one else.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 9:35 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

None of which has anything to do with the issue at hand, which is passing the budget, which is what caused anything to be shut down. That's been engineered for months by the Republicans, despite Rap's complete unwillingness to read.

WHAT is shut down isn't the issue; that anything HAD to be shut down is. And it was Rap would was adamant just a little while ago that the Republicans WOULD NOT shut it down. Wanna get back to that one?

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Friday, October 4, 2013 9:42 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:

None of which has nothing to do with the issue at hand, which is passing the budget, which is what caused anything to be shut down. That's been engineered for months by the Republicans, despite Rap's complete unwillingness to read.

God dammit Niki, it has EVERY thing to do w/ the issue at hand. You're ignoring my post, what i said, and the FACT that Obama himself is doing all this, just to make the shut down as painful as possible.

HE DOES NOT CARE ABOUT THE VETERANS ! It was Michelle and others who are keeping the WW2 Memorial OPEN for the Vets, and trying to remove the barricades OBAMA HIS OWN DAMN SELF PUT THERE!

WAKE THE FUCK UP!

And its Obama who is doing this. Entirely. The GOP has passed a budget. That's what Congress does. Obama refuses to even meet with them to discuss the issue. He's a thug and a punk and a rank amateur.

Quote:

WHAT is shut down isn't the issue; that anything HAD to be shut down is. And it was Rap would was adamant just a little while ago that the Republicans WOULD NOT shut it down. Wanna get back to that one?

>

Learn to read, Niki.

Thread title : " So what's shut down for you ? "

The GOP has NOT shut down anything. Nothing to get back to. But thanks for playing.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 12:12 PM

STORYMARK

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Don't think that the Republicans are the only ones playing politics here.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Good one, gramps!

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, October 4, 2013 12:14 PM

STORYMARK

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:

None of which has nothing to do with the issue at hand, which is passing the budget, which is what caused anything to be shut down. That's been engineered for months by the Republicans, despite Rap's complete unwillingness to read.

God dammit Niki, it has EVERY thing to do w/ the issue at hand. You're ignoring my post, what i said, and the FACT that Obama himself is doing all this, just to make the shut down as painful as possible.

HE DOES NOT CARE ABOUT THE VETERANS ! It was Michelle and others who are keeping the WW2 Memorial OPEN for the Vets, and trying to remove the barricades OBAMA HIS OWN DAMN SELF PUT THERE!

WAKE THE FUCK UP!

And its Obama who is doing this. Entirely. The GOP has passed a budget. That's what Congress does. Obama refuses to even meet with them to discuss the issue. He's a thug and a punk and a rank amateur.

Quote:

WHAT is shut down isn't the issue; that anything HAD to be shut down is. And it was Rap would was adamant just a little while ago that the Republicans WOULD NOT shut it down. Wanna get back to that one?

>

Learn to read, Niki.

Thread title : " So what's shut down for you ? "

The GOP has NOT shut down anything. Nothing to get back to. But thanks for playing.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

The poster child for the American Taliban, ladies and gents!

Give him a round of applauds! It takes talent to be that utterly fucking stupid!

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, October 4, 2013 12:37 PM

JONGSSTRAW

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

And its Obama who is doing this. Entirely. The GOP has passed a budget. That's what Congress does. Obama refuses to even meet with them to discuss the issue. He's a thug and a punk and a rank amateur.

The GOP has NOT shut down anything.

Emperor Ba'raq Hussein Obama, Dark Lord of the Sith, Master of the Sullied, Mother of Dragons ...

... demands no conditions to CR bill
... demands no conditions to raising debt ceiling
... demands Republicans obey his will unconditionally

Well, FUCK HIM and the Affirmative Action Kenyan zebra he rode in on.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 12:55 PM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Yeah, pretty much Mark. Sad, tho', 'cuz there are just enough like him in just enough gerrymandered districts to put these assholes in office and keep them there.

OF COURSE both sides are playing politics, that's what politicians are about and they're assholes. Of course Obama's shutting down stuff that's visible--of course, also, the idea that maybe shutting down tourist attractions is better than shutting down, say, the FBI, doesn't occur to our righties.

But again, that does not address the basic fact of the shutdown itself, which was caused by the Republicans REFUSING TO ADOPT THE BUDGET. Any debate here on the issue would have to encompass the chronology I laid out, with links, because that is what happened, in detail, not what parts are shut down and what aren't. The simple fact is that a MINORITY of the House of Representatives worked for months to bring this to pass, it was well known, it was covered extensively by the media, it was discussed, intelligent Republicans were quite vocal against it, and Rap kept saying 'it won't happen'. The fact that Rap and others choose to buy the spin the GOP puts on it NOW is irrelevant; the fact that Obama (or whoever makes those decisions, somehow I don't think he pulls them out of thin air) chooses to shut down some things over other things is irrelevant. We don't know what the choices were, I have no doubt politics comes into it, but it doesn't change the ISSUE itself--or, by the way, the fact that, again, Rap was ADAMANT that the Republicans weren't going to shut down the government. Still waiting for him to deal with that one, but not holding my breath.

We ran across our first effects this morning...sulkied the dogs out on a favorite trail, got back to the car and discovered a sticker on the window that we were "parked illegally" (not a citation, just a notice)...it's where we've always parked, there are no "no parking" signs, etc. Turns out half of the trail is on GGNRA--Golden Gate National Recreation Area. We get there before sunrise so didn't see a couple of little wooden barricades at the entrance that had been pushed aside by someone. No problem, we can park just outside, but it made us realize that it means ALL of Pt. Reyes, Crissy Field, Rodeo Beach, Tennessee Valley, Fort Funston and more are closed. That's going to be a real mess over the weekend.

Fucking idiots. Willing to hold the whole country hostage to throw a hissy fit--PURE POLITICS, not anything to do with the good of the country or representing the American people./

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Friday, October 4, 2013 1:18 PM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

And if ANYONE doesn't realize Gohmert and Palin and their buddies are using the Vets for political reasons...well, everyone does, it's just useful spin for the right to now scream about some veterans not being able to visit a monument. Obama hates vets, eh? Then why have Republicans voted against so many veterans' benefits bills, things which would have REAL IMPACT on veterans' lives?

"GOP Senators Block Veterans Jobs Bill", http://www.military.com/daily-news/2012/09/20/gop-senators-block-veter
ans-jobs-bill.html

"GOP blocks COLA on benefits for disabled veterans and survivors", http://www.examiner.com/article/gop-blocks-cola-on-benefits-for-disabl
ed-veterans-and-survivors

"GOP Voted Against 7 Bills to Help Veterans", http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/05/16/1091597/-GOP-Voted-Against-7-
Bills-to-Help-Veterans

"GOP demands benefits for the military be on chopping block", http://www.veteransnewsnow.com/2011/09/19/gop-demands-benefits-for-the
-military-be-on-chopping-block/

"Republican Party ignores vets’ needs":

Quote:

Since I was discharged from the Army in 1968, I have yet to see the GOP helping veterans, e.g., when in power the GOP fights increases in funding for the VA hospital system. The GOP has no problem sending our young men and women to war, but once they are beyond military service the GOP no longer has any use for ‘em and would prefer the veteran died so as not be a drain on the “system”.

The GOP likes to say they support the troops and veterans but their actions speak louder than words. When it comes to the veteran, the GOP is all talk and no action, unless that action is cutting veteran’s benefits.

The only time I see an increase in veteran benefits is when the Democrats are in power, so any veteran who votes GOP is simply shooting himself in the foot. http://www.bonnercountydailybee.com/opinion/letters_to_editor/article_
9c95c34a-2584-11e2-80f1-001a4bcf887a.html]

"REPUBLICANS WANT TO PRIVATIZE VA HOSPITALS":

Quote:
The Republicans unveiled their Pledge to America today but they kept secret a plan that is in the works to privatize Veteran Hospitals and make ALL veterans take out an insurance policy to go to a VA hospital. http://www.zimbio.com/US+Vets/articles/T_PAUH7Lw0O/REPUBLICANS+WANT+PR
IVATIZE+VA+HOSPITALS]

I detailed that plan to privatize the VA, with quotes from Republicans, back in 2010 at http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=45462, if anyone wants to see the details.

And on and on. Veterans are only useful to the GOP when it's time to wave the flag or utilize them for political purposes, period.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 2:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
God dammit Niki, it has EVERY thing to do w/ the issue at hand. You're ignoring my post, what i said, and the FACT that Obama himself is doing all this, just to make the shut down as painful as possible.

HE DOES NOT CARE ABOUT THE VETERANS ! It was Michelle and others who are keeping the WW2 Memorial OPEN for the Vets, and trying to remove the barricades OBAMA HIS OWN DAMN SELF PUT THERE!

WAKE THE FUCK UP!

Uhhh...

While I'm not sold on the Democrats saying that it's ALL the Republicans fault - it does take two to tango, after all - you don't really think Obama is flying out in Airforce One to personally put up barriers to the national parks himself, cackling all the while.

I mean there are still SOME federal employees on the payroll, so menial labour jobs can be delegated. The President - and the other democrats - are too busy playing electric-fence-pissing-match chicken with the Republicans to personally shut down ALL the parks.

And none of them care about vets, or poor people, or jobs or the economy, only political capital and psychological warfare.

I'm just... Going to attribute that outburst to feeling provoked by the proximity of registered democrats. Don't let it get to you man.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 2:25 PM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Rep. Randy Neugebauer (R-TX), at the WWII Memorial for photo-ops, decided that he would use a National Park Ranger as a whipping post. The NPS has been allowing WWII Veterans to visit the memorial, even though it is technically closed. The Nation Park Rangers are doing this on a volunteer basis.

Neugebauer took exception to that fact, though he was directly responsible for it. He decided to vent his spleen on a female Park Service Ranger. Neugebauer said that the Park Service should “be ashamed.”

There was a crowd of people surrounding the brief exchange and most were definitely on the National Park Ranger’s side of the issue. One told Neugebauer to question the people who “aren’t passing the budget” about the closure. Then a man in a bicycle helmet addressed the Congressman:

“This woman is doing her job, just like me. I’m a 30-year federal veteran — I’m out of work.”

With no shame or irony (assuming he even knows what those are), Neugebauer tells the man that the reason he was out of work was because “Mr. Reid decided to shut down the government.” But the bicycle man wasn’t having any of that, saying that the shutdown was due to the government “not doing its job.”

It’s bad enough that the Republicans are holding us all hostage for.. well, they don’t really know why anymore. They just are. It’s bad enough that there are over 800,000 federal workers who are sitting at home and hoping the GOP will act like grown-ups. It’s bad enough that these National Park Rangers are basically volunteers right now. But for them to be blamed, by Congressmen or TV pundits, for the shitstorm the Republicans have stirred up is beyond galling.

Nah, they're not playing politics, no sirree bob! Talk about your cheap shots...she's VOLUNTEERING her time!

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Friday, October 4, 2013 3:21 PM

HERO

The local National Parks are closed. On the way to work this morning I passed a deer sitting on the side of the road with a sign saying 'will frolic for food.' Very sad.

H

Hero...must be right on all of this. ALL of the rest of us are wrong. Chrisisall, 2012

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Friday, October 4, 2013 5:02 PM

STORYMARK

Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

And its Obama who is doing this. Entirely. The GOP has passed a budget. That's what Congress does. Obama refuses to even meet with them to discuss the issue. He's a thug and a punk and a rank amateur.

The GOP has NOT shut down anything.

Emperor Ba'raq Hussein Obama, Dark Lord of the Sith, Master of the Sullied, Mother of Dragons ...

... demands no conditions to CR bill
... demands no conditions to raising debt ceiling
... demands Republicans obey his will unconditionally

Well, FUCK HIM and the Affirmative Action Kenyan zebra he rode in on.

Well, Ill give you this - if you're trying to usurp the "biggest moron" title from rappy - you're doing a damn fine job. Maybe you can be co-captains!

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Friday, October 4, 2013 6:14 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:

The poster child for the American Taliban, ladies and gents!

Give him a round of applauds! It takes talent to be that utterly fucking stupid!

Can't dispute anything I said, so you resort to juvenile name calling and scared mockery.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 6:24 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Uhhh...

While I'm not sold on the Democrats saying that it's ALL the Republicans fault - it does take two to tango, after all - you don't really think Obama is flying out in Airforce One to personally put up barriers to the national parks himself, cackling all the while.

Why should he ? The memorial is right in the neighborhood. And while Barry won't flinch to hop on AF-1 to take Michelle out on date night, I doubt he'd NEED to actually do any work himself on this matter, other than sending out a memo or making a phone called. ( Dialed by his secretary , of course )

Quote:

I mean there are still SOME federal employees on the payroll, so menial labour jobs can be delegated. The President - and the other democrats - are too busy playing electric-fence-pissing-match chicken with the Republicans to personally shut down ALL the parks.

Not only tried to shut down Federal parks, but private ones as well.

Quote:

And none of them care about vets, or poor people, or jobs or the economy, only political capital and psychological warfare.

I'm just... Going to attribute that outburst to feeling provoked by the proximity of registered democrats. Don't let it get to you man.

I'm tired of the games and b.s. the Left uses to try to tell everyone that these aren't the droids we're looking for.

These are EXACTLY the droids we're looking for. There ARE four lights, not the three they keep telling us we see.

There are differences of opinion, where one can be for TASTE GREAT, while others prefer LESS FILLING. This isn't one of those times.

Obama did this. THIS meaning closing off the WW2 Memorial ( as well as other selective acts ) purely for punishment and PR purposes.

There is Z E R O room for debate on the matter.

Yet the usual suspects refuse to take off their Obama colored glasses long enough to even admit the most BASIC of truths. It's beyond childish , and I'm frelling sick of it.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 7:31 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
There is Z E R O room for debate on the matter.

The Raptiod hath spoken.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:07 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
There is Z E R O room for debate on the matter.

The Raptiod hath spoken.

Make me a liar then.

OMB is under what branch of govt ?

Executive.

Parks Services get their orders to close down monuments from OMB.

Where is what I'm saying false ?

Do tell.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Make me a liar then.

You stupid asshole, that's clearly impossible. Facts are like flies for you to swat. Do you seriously think I'd spend any spade time at all to 'enlighten' your brainwashed little hate-filled ass?
Just read what Niki posts.
But you don't.
Cased closed (for you).

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:17 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

The EPA and NIST are shut down.

We're working on a method which may eventually be applied nationally. It's a major advance over another method which has been used for 40 years. We're discussing it with industry and "other stakeholders" and we need to get approval from the EPA before we make some pretty major revsions.

Also, the NIST has our Protocol 1 Certification Cylinders, which we need to check our own calibration standards.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:28 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Make me a liar then.
You stupid asshole, that's clearly impossible.

O.K. ya got me there. I don't lie.

But facts are facts. That you are incapable of proving me wrong only proves that you can't prove me wrong.

Go sniff some more glue, pal. You're too uptight for a Friday night.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
That you are incapable of proving me wrong only proves that you can't prove me wrong.

The fact that you can type that shows how utterly devoid of logic and clear thinking you are.
And here I am, lured into yet another commentary on your pathetic lack of awareness...

My bad.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:41 PM

America loves a winner!

Maybe I was wrong.

Maybe you've sniffed too MUCH model glue tonight.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 8:54 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Rappy is that that little kid with his fingers stuck in his ears saying "Nyah nyah nyah. I can't hear you" ... ESPECIALLY when when you're bringing up something he doesn't want to hear.

Is it possible for someone to be THAT brainwashed? Well, have you tried arguing with a young creationist or a flat-earther or a jihadist lately? The answer is... of course it's possible for someone's brain to be shrunken into a hard little turd. Difficult to fathom, but just think of rappy as a jihadist or a young creationist and let it go at that.

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Friday, October 4, 2013 9:12 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Rappy is that that little kid with his fingers stuck in his ears saying "Nyah nyah nyah. I can't hear you" ... ESPECIALLY when when you're bringing up something he doesn't want to hear.

Is it possible for someone to be THAT brainwashed? Well, have you tried arguing with a young creationist or a flat-earther or a jihadist lately? The answer is... of course it's possible for someone's brain to be shrunken into a hard little turd. Difficult to fathom, but just think of rappy as a jihadist or a young creationist and let it go at that.

More empty insults, no substantive replies to comments made.

You are what you accuse others of being, Sig.

All you can do is prattle on about how dumb, stupid, brainwashed and mentally limited anyone is who opposes how you see the world.

You won't even dare discuss facts. Pertinent details relative to the issue at hand. Nope. Brain shrunken nut job is how you see anyone NOT in your camp. Kinda like Obama.

Incidentally, I DID use to 'argue' with YEC, years and years ago. I found them every bit as set in their belief system as AGW folks of today. Stubborn and immune to evidence. REAL evidence, not computer models, which seemingly have to be revised over and over...

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Friday, October 4, 2013 9:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
just think of rappy as a jihadist or a young creationist and let it go at that.

Yep. Thanks for the reality check, Signy.

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 9:48 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Yup, Chris, he gotcha. I'm not going back to count, what, three or four times you got sucked into responding? My sympathies. I agree with Chris, Sig; you nailed it.

My sympathies also on what the shutdown has caused you and your company; a prime example of how it's harming our country. The blow to the economy will be another, which of course will tickle them pink because they'll spin it to blame THAT on Obama, and if they keep it up and do their job, that's how history will remember it. Works for them, you betcha!

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 11:22 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Obama did this. THIS meaning closing off the WW2 Memorial ( as well as other selective acts ) purely for punishment and PR purposes.

There is Z E R O room for debate on the matter.

They were closed because the workers at the parks were basically told to go home because there's no pay. You can't keep a business open under those circumstances.

This is cause and effect. Some of the rangers at various parks have shown up as volunteers, as have the secret service, and the WW2 memorial was opened because some vets and wives of vets showed up and whoever was there that day closing the memorial felt sorry for them. Then it got attention and the rest of the workers showed up also as volunteers to try to keep it open.

If you want to say that the reason there's no pay is Obama's fault, or that it's his responsibility because he's the president and the vice president seems to be useless as an influence in congress, okay, you're entitled to that, but saying that closing the parks was like a personal choice on the part of the president is not an argument that makes sense.

It happened as a direct result of there being no budget. When a budget agreement couldn't be reached, no one had any choice but to close the parks because we have no means to pay to maintain them or the workers at the parks.

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 12:53 PM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Succinctly and accurately put, Byte. I don't know who decides what stays open and what closes when there's a government shutdown, but aside from politics, it seems logical that tourist attractions wouldn't be high on the "necessary" list. Unfortunately a LOT of people are getting caught in the middle, which is sad.

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 2:41 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Obama did this. THIS meaning closing off the WW2 Memorial ( as well as other selective acts ) purely for punishment and PR purposes.

There is Z E R O room for debate on the matter.

They were closed because the workers at the parks were basically told to go home because there's no pay. You can't keep a business open under those circumstances.

Told to go home, by the White House. Right.

It's a free standing, open air monument. It's not a " business". We're not talking about a museum, or even a park, which has a turnstile or doors to lock up at night. It's open, 24/7.

And barricading these monuments... never happened before, in all the 16 other times the govt has shut down.

Also, it costs the govt MORE $ to hire guards and rent blockades. But this admin wants as many visible signs of the govt 'closing down', as possible, and to inflict as much pain on the public. Screw the Vets. They're dying anyways, what does Obama care ?

He doesn't.

Quote:

This is cause and effect. Some of the rangers at various parks have shown up as volunteers, as have the secret service, and the WW2 memorial was opened because some vets and wives of vets showed up and whoever was there that day closing the memorial felt sorry for them. Then it got attention and the rest of the workers showed up also as volunteers to try to keep it open.

Only they tried to double down and make the barriers harder to get into, by wiring the barricades together the next day. It was thanks to the likes of Senator Bachmann and Jay Sekulow who are raising awareness about this travesty of keeping 90+ year old Vets out of THEIR memorial.

Quote:

If you want to say that the reason there's no pay is Obama's fault, or that it's his responsibility because he's the president and the vice president seems to be useless as an influence in congress, okay, you're entitled to that, but saying that closing the parks was like a personal choice on the part of the president is not an argument that makes sense.

Actually, it's not an argument at all. It's the truth. Even if you lay the blame at the feet of BOTH parties, which I have to admit most Americans seem to be doing, the specific choices of closing open air monuments like the WW2 Memorial is entirely Obama's.

Quote:

It happened as a direct result of there being no budget. When a budget agreement couldn't be reached, no one had any choice but to close the parks because we have no means to pay to maintain them or the workers at the parks.

In some cases, sure. But not this one. Not most, in fact.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 4:02 PM

Quote:
It's a free standing, open air monument. It's not a " business". We're not talking about a museum, or even a park, which has a turnstile or doors to lock up at night. It's open, 24/7.

Open air monuments charge admission fees and are therefore a business, and open air businesses are still subject to the same risks and limitations as all other businesses.

Unless instead of closing the monument, you would have preferred it to remain open and get graffiti within 24 hours because no one is on the payroll to patrol it. I hear the punks on the national mall like green.

You have to make sure other people don't wreck the joint. If you can't pay anyone to make sure of that, you close the business to protect the stuff.

They're just lucky they got volunteers who stepped up to protect the monument so it could stay open.

Frankly, I don't care one way or another. All these marble pats on the back in the capital at the expense of tax payers kinda stick in my craw. But I figured maybe YOU did seeing as you're raising a fuss about it.

Previous shutdowns for example like 1995 were technically only partial shutdowns, as some of the departments had received funding prior to very similar disagreements about funding of medicare and education between Republican congress wanting to slow spending and a Democratic president with social welfare programs. There was almost NO funding approved this year before October 1st, therefore the shutdown was more extensive.

Lastly, the determination of which employees are "nonessential" is done by the Office of Management and Budget, which is run by Sylvia Mathews Burwell, who is on Obama's cabinet, but I really doubt that Obama looked twice at whatever she recommended before signing it. List of designated nonessential employees from every county and regional diversion of government offices in every state, sounds like thrilling reading material.

You can't paint Obama as being inept but then also have him be some kind of manipulative mastermind giggling over park closures for political spin.

I agree Obama's inept, I disagree that he closed the parks for political points. Since when has he ever been that savvy?

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 5:14 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:
It's a free standing, open air monument. It's not a " business". We're not talking about a museum, or even a park, which has a turnstile or doors to lock up at night. It's open, 24/7.

Open air monuments charge admission fees and are therefore a business, and open air businesses are still subject to the same risks and limitations as all other businesses.

No, they don't.

Quote:

Unless instead of closing the monument, you would have preferred it to remain open and get graffiti within 24 hours because no one is on the payroll to patrol it. I hear the punks on the national mall like green.

Already happened to the Lincoln Memorial, not too long ago. The "workers " were on the job then, too. So much for that.

Quote:

You have to make sure other people don't wreck the joint. If you can't pay anyone to make sure of that, you close the business to protect the stuff.

They're just lucky they got volunteers who stepped up to protect the monument so it could stay open.

There were no " volunteers " . No idea what you're even talking about. The PAID rent-a-cops were put there, by Obama, to keep people OUT.

Quote:

You can't paint Obama as being inept but then also have him be some kind of manipulative mastermind giggling over park closures for political spin.

I agree Obama's inept, I disagree that he closed the parks for political points. Since when has he ever been that savvy?

Can and do, for the reasons already stated. Same reason he closed the WH tours, for " sequestration ", as he's doing this too. To inflict pain on the public, closing the most visible , high profile things possible, to try to win the PR game. He's losing badly on the WW 2 Memorial , and folks are starting to wake up.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 5:48 PM

I don't get it. Why is ANYTHING still working at all? There should be riots N' looting already! Mass hysteria! Cats and dogs living together!
This is NOT a proper government shutdown IMO!

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 6:46 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
I don't get it. Why is ANYTHING still working at all? There should be riots N' looting already! Mass hysteria! Cats and dogs living together!
This is NOT a proper government shutdown IMO!

Remember the hysteria that Obama would have us believe faced us, due to sequestration ? The horror tales and drag on the economy ? And then more of the same w/ the shut down ?

Seems folks aren't missing the Gov'ment as much as Barry would want. So he pulls stunts like closing open air monuments, and such.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Saturday, October 5, 2013 7:28 PM