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REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
"For all you kids watching at home, Santa just IS white"
Sunday, December 15, 2013 1:48 PM
NIKI2
Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...
Sunday, December 15, 2013 1:56 PM
6IXSTRINGJACK
Sunday, December 15, 2013 2:03 PM
AURAPTOR
America loves a winner!
Sunday, December 15, 2013 2:07 PM
JONGSSTRAW
Sunday, December 15, 2013 2:14 PM
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Can we at least all agree that there are no sub Saharan AFRICAN reindeer pulling Santa's sleigh? Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts. " AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall
Sunday, December 15, 2013 2:16 PM
Sunday, December 15, 2013 3:03 PM
Sunday, December 15, 2013 4:31 PM
KPO
Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.
Sunday, December 15, 2013 4:58 PM
Sunday, December 15, 2013 4:59 PM
Quote:Originally posted by kpo: At the end of the day Santa/Father Christmas/St. Nicholas is from European tradition; I've no problem people saying he should be white. If there was a character from African tradition that the Western world had taken to heart, I think (some) black people would get pretty upset if people started making him white. It's not personal. It's just war.
Sunday, December 15, 2013 5:46 PM
Quote:Saint Nicholas (Greek: ????? ?????a??, Hagios Nikólaos, Latin: Sanctus Nicolaus); (15 March 270 – 6 December 343),[3][4] also called Nikolaos of Myra, was a historic 4th-century Christian saint and Greek[5] Bishop of Myra (Demre, part of modern-day Turkey) in Lycia. Wikipeia
Quote:Santa is loosely based on Saint Nicholas, a fourth-century Greek bishop known for secret gift-giving. But while the names “St. Nicholas” and “Santa Claus” are often used interchangeably, modern-day Santa hardly resembles his supposed inspiration, who was depicted as tall and thin and, you know, Greek. Santa as we know him today is the result of wild imaginations and creative input from many people across centuries, including Washington Irving and Clement Clark Moore. He’s utterly divorced from his religious and historical roots. As part of the long process of formalizing a celebration of the birth of Christ–-which includes shifting the purported date of Jesus’ arrival in the world to midwinter to coopt pagan observances and then suppressing said observances–-Saint Nicholas gets mashed up with other figures. These include Sinterklass, who may be a variation of the Norse god Odin, and who’s part of holiday observances in places as varied as the Netherlands and Greece. Father Christmas, the British character, has analogues in South America, most European countries, and the Caucuses. And this isn’t even including characters like Zwarte Piet*, who’s part of Christmas folklore in Netherlands, Luxembourg and Belgium, who is, wait for it, of African origin. In the United States, many people and organizations have contributed to our modern conception of Santa Claus’ physical appearance, including the the political cartoonist and muckracker Thomas Nast, the White Rock Beverage company which used him to sell mineral water, and Haddon Sundblom, who drew Santa Claus for Coca-Cola’s famous 1930s advertising campaign. Relying on the historical argument to prove or disprove whether Santa is white is essentially insane. Because, and I’m going to go out on a limb here, but I will argue that once you give the guy a workshop of magical elves, eight tiny flying reindeer, and the ability to distend his corpulent body down a billion chimneys in a night, historical verisimilitude no longer obtains. Santa–avert your eyes, kids–is a fictional character, and as such, can plausibly be represented and colored any damn way you want him. To say that he “is just white” because that’s the way fictional pictures of him have mostly appeared nowadays is to say that your pictures and traditions are solely legitimate, authentic, the cultural default. Santa Claus is frequently depicted as a white guy today precisely because of what Kelly said we absolutely must not do: “revise it in the middle of the legacy of the story.” http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2013/12/13/dreaming-of-a-white-santa/]
Monday, December 16, 2013 5:02 AM
AGENTROUKA
Monday, December 16, 2013 6:09 AM
Monday, December 16, 2013 7:57 AM
MAL4PREZ
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: I think the Russian Santa looks pretty bad ass.
Monday, December 16, 2013 8:48 AM
Quote: As for Megyn Kelly... I can't see this as anything but an incredibly lame publicity stunt, because if you're joking? You don't lean into the tv and tell other people's children "the truth" about Santa or Jesus. NOT funny. The "you all just can't take a joke" excuse is pretty sad.
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:11 AM
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Quote: As for Megyn Kelly... I can't see this as anything but an incredibly lame publicity stunt, because if you're joking? You don't lean into the tv and tell other people's children "the truth" about Santa or Jesus. NOT funny. The "you all just can't take a joke" excuse is pretty sad. Per Jesus , the creepiest version of him is where he's all buff & cut, like he's all 'roided up. Homosayswhat? As if the son of God looks like Thor, and pumps iron out @ muscle beach, shirtless and glistening in the sun.
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:15 AM
SECOND
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:30 AM
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:39 AM
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:46 AM
REAVERFAN
Monday, December 16, 2013 10:05 AM
Quote: Now sure how that applies to my quote but...
Monday, December 16, 2013 11:55 AM
Quote:I’d say two things. The original segment was clearly not as light-hearted and humorous as Kelly now insists it was. She did not originally refer to the Slate piece as “tongue-in-cheek” and responded to its provocation by being offended, not amused. Since both tapes are out there, make your own mind up. But rather than cop to an obvious error – made off the cuff – she made the decision to hunker down and accuse others of persecuting Fox News because it isn’t liberal. So the classic and silly notion that white Republicans are somehow an oppressed class – and minorities should just stop whining – became her “correction.” But that’s not a correction. It’s a distraction. More to the point, the much more disturbing assertion that “Jesus was white” – something Kelly injected into the conversation all by herself – is left hanging. She claims in one aside in her response that the question “is not settled.” But it is. Jesus was a first century Jew. He’s not a northern European. He was Semitic, not Caucasian. Now maybe Kelly will unpack why she may believe that Jews are somehow “white” in her racial categorization of humanity, while, say, Hispanics are not. But it seems likely she won’t. That would open a very large box of premises Roger Ailes prefers to keep vacuum-wrapped. So she screwed up – which we all do. But on the core measure of whether she could fairly cop to her screw-up, correct and apologize for it, she failed. I tend to think that how journalists respond to error is more instructive than how they report and analyze in factually impeccable fashion. On that count, Kelly emerged this week as a flak and a hack.
Monday, December 16, 2013 12:28 PM
BYTEMITE
Quote:Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK: Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Can we at least all agree that there are no sub Saharan AFRICAN reindeer pulling Santa's sleigh? Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen I'm just a red pill guy in a room full of blue pill addicts. " AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall All this dumb rube can say for sure is that Santa wasn't using any red-nosed alligators or crocodiles. That shit's too cold for their awesomeness!
Monday, December 16, 2013 12:38 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 12:45 PM
Quote:Originally posted by AgentRouka: Is that painting verified to be by Hitler? Not saying it can't be but I thought he was almost infamous for not really painting people.
Monday, December 16, 2013 12:49 PM
Quote:Originally posted by BYTEMITE: Huh. After about 30 seconds of research, it appears that really was by Hitler. http://sobadsogood.com/2013/07/22/25-rarely-seen-artworks-painted-by-adolf-hitler/
Monday, December 16, 2013 1:01 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 1:09 PM
Quote:Six White Boomers Early on one Christmas Day, a Joey Kanga-roo, Was far from home and lost in a great big zoo. Mummy, where's my mummy? They've taken her a-way. We'll help you find your mummy, son. Hop up on the sleigh. Up beside the bag of toys little Joey hopped, But they hadn't gone far when Santa stopped. Unharnessed all the reindeer and Joey wondered why, Then he heard a far off booming in the sky. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, Racing Santa Claus through the blazing sun. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, On his Australian run. Pretty soon old Santa began to feel the heat, Took his fur-lined boots off to cool his feet, Into one popped Joey, feeling quite okay, While those old man kangaroos kept pulling on the sleigh. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, Racing Santa Claus through the blazing sun. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, On his Australian run. Joey said to Santa, Santa, what about the toys? Aren't you giving some to these girls and boys? They've got all their presents, son, we were here last night, This trip is an extra trip, Joey's special flight. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, Racing Santa Claus through the blazing sun. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, On his Australian run. Soon the sleigh was flashing past, right over Marble Bar, Slow down there, cried Santa, it can't be far, Come up on my lap here, son, and have a look around. There she is, that's Mummy, bounding up and down. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, Racing Santa Claus through the blazing sun. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, On his Australian run. Well that's the bestest Christmas treat that Joey ever had, Curled up in mother's pouch feeling snug and glad. The last they saw was Santa heading northwards from the sun, The only year the boomers worked a double run. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, Racing Santa Claus through the blazing sun. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, On his Australian run. https://alldownunder.com/australian-music-songs/six-white-boomers.htm
Monday, December 16, 2013 1:24 PM
Quote:Six white boomers, snow white boomers, Racing Santa Claus through the blazing sun. Six white boomers, snow white boomers, On his Australian run.
Monday, December 16, 2013 1:45 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Niki2: *Netherlands Zwarte Piet:
Monday, December 16, 2013 1:53 PM
Quote:Originally posted by BYTEMITE: He'd go off on a Hitler rant on youtube. And we'd all laugh.
Monday, December 16, 2013 2:00 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 2:24 PM
Quote:The role of Zwarte Pieten has become part of a recurring debate in the Netherlands. Zwarte Piet continues to draw negative attention from international commentators and news organizations.[19][20] but he continues to be popular in the Netherlands. Among others, American essayist David Sedaris has written about the tradition.[21] Since the 1990s, there have been several attempts to introduce an updated version of Zwarte Piet to the Dutch public, among them replacing traditional black makeup with various other shades of colours.[22] In 2006, the NPS (en: Dutch Programme Foundation) replaced the black Pieten with rainbow-colored Pieten, which had accidentally shifted colour according to the storyline of the televised Sinterklaas arrival serial of that year.[23] Within the Netherlands and abroad there is an ongoing debate over how best to update the tradition and remove Zwarte Piet's stereotypical characteristics. The largest Sinterklaas celebration in Western Canada, slated for 3 December 2011, in New Westminster, British Columbia, was cancelled for the first time since its inception in 1985 following a debate over the inclusion of the character. Rather than remove Zwarte Piet, the organizers cancelled the festivities entirely because, as spokesperson Tako Slump of the organization said:[24] "We got a lot of replies back from our customers in the Dutch community. It became pretty clear to us that we love Sinterklaas and we can't have it without Black Peter. Those two go together." In 2011, legislators in the former Dutch colony of Suriname stated that government-sanctioned celebrations involving Zwarte Piet were considered an insult to the "black part of Suriname's community."[25] Efforts later began in Suriname to prevent future governmental promotions of the character. Elsewhere, four people wearing t-shirts with the words "Zwarte Piet is Racisme" were arrested during the second weekend of November 2011 at a Sinterklaas festival in Dordrecht.[26] Also in 2013, the mayor of Amsterdam suggested that the stereotypical frizzy hair and thick, red lips could be easily changed.[31] As a result of the ongoing controversy, the 600 actors who played Zwarte Piet in the city's annual Sinterklaas celebration on November 17 did not wear the character's traditional golden earrings.[32] The organizing committee suggested the character's depiction could be altered further in 2014.[33] On the weekend of Amsterdam's Sinterklaas celebration in November 2013, several hundred people protested against the character at demonstrations throughout the city.[34] In the weeks that followed, several smaller public[35] and private[36] celebrations opted to feature alternative "colored", "rainbow" or "soot swiped" Pieten, already a common sight in Sinterklaas celebrations in North America. But the Dutch public broadcaster Nederlandse Omroep Stichting concluded the trend had not gained mainstream adoption.[37] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zwarte_Piet]
Monday, December 16, 2013 2:29 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 3:10 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 7:37 PM
BIGDAMNNOBODY
Quote:Originally posted by reaverfan: What guy would argue? Whatever you say, Megyn.
Monday, December 16, 2013 7:41 PM
Quote:Originally posted by BIGDAMNNOBODY: Quote:Originally posted by reaverfan: What guy would argue? Whatever you say, Megyn. While some would say Megyn is an attractive lady, I believe your pic is of model Brooklyn Decker.
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:06 PM
ELVISCHRIST
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:17 PM
FREMDFIRMA
Monday, December 16, 2013 9:55 PM
Quote:That means he's utterly perfect for being shaped to fit the culture he is used in. No harm in people wanting him to be a range of colors (or penguin shapes...) if that actually makes him more representative of the culture he's in, more inclusive of the children he is aimed at and more universal like the spirit of generosity he is supposed to embody.
Monday, December 16, 2013 10:00 PM
Quote:Originally posted by kpo: For one thing won't it confuse kids, if they alternately see white, black, and Asian Santas?
Monday, December 16, 2013 10:25 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 10:39 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 11:02 PM
Monday, December 16, 2013 11:24 PM
Quote: I guarantee - the kids have no problem with a more inclusive fantasy.
Quote:if all these fantasy characters look like their race, that race must be singled out. Superior in some way. It makes them close-minded. It leans them toward that idea that they are more important than others who look different.
Monday, December 16, 2013 11:58 PM
Quote:Originally posted by kpo: The fantasy breaks down though, when it's not consistent on something as basic as skin colour.
Quote:Maybe that's from what you're saying about fantasy characters Mal4.
Tuesday, December 17, 2013 2:33 AM
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Quote: Now sure how that applies to my quote but... Really? You see no connection there at all ? Between how some view Jesus & the more likely , accurate image ? Huh.
Tuesday, December 17, 2013 2:42 AM
Tuesday, December 17, 2013 3:02 AM
Quote:Originally posted by kpo: Quote: I guarantee - the kids have no problem with a more inclusive fantasy. The fantasy breaks down though, when it's not consistent on something as basic as skin colour.
Tuesday, December 17, 2013 8:50 AM
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