REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

What's going on in the Pacific?

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Saturday, June 7, 2014 08:42
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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 9:34 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


On ENENews I found an article about the near total-failure of brown pelicans to breed this year. http://enenews.com/ap-drastic-plunge-in-baby-california-pelicans-zero-
young-born-in-multiple-areas-that-were-studied-expert-went-from-thousands-to-10-or-less-the-bottom-dropped-out. This is normal in an El Nino year, but the loss is normally in the realm of 50-70%, not 99-100%.

In the past six months I’ve seen reports of a sardine collapse. This has also happened historically – a population crash in the mid ‘50s led to the failure of “cannery row”- but that was a localized phenomenon and this crash seems to be up and down the west coast.

Reports of abnormal orca, dolphin, and gray whale behavior- dolphins gathering in a “superpod” of 100,000 individuals

and all species coming very close to shore. Tour operators say that although it’s great for business, they haven’t seen this behavior before. http://www.weather.com/news/science/nature/california-whale-sightings-
gray-whales-blue-whales-killer-whales-spotted-20140102.

And then there is the creepy sea star wasting disease, causing starfish and other sea stars to (literally) dissolve apart, leaving disconnected limbs to writhe on the sea floor as they slowly shred and drift away. This isn‘t just a local phenomenon either, but as been observed up and down the west coast, which is unfortunate, because sea stars are a “keystone” species.

The mussel population collapse.

The description of a yachtsman’s latest voyage between Australia and Japan, previously filled with birds, cetaceans and fish but now just filled with trash and emptiness.

“In 2003, I caught a fish every day,” he told Guardian Australia. “Ten years later to the day, sailing almost exactly the same course, I caught nothing. It started to strike me the closer we got to Japan that the ocean was dead.

“Normally when you are sailing a yacht, there are one or two pods of dolphins playing by the boat, or sharks, or turtles or whales. There are usually birds feeding by the boat. But there was none of that. I’ve been sailing for 35 years and it’s only when these things aren’t there that you notice them” … For the majority of the voyage to Japan, MacFadyen had to ensure that his yacht wasn’t holed by clumps of rubbish he said were “as large as a house …. There were fenders from ships, balls of net and telegraph poles with barnacles on them that were never going to sink,” he said. “There was nothing like that 10 years ago. I couldn’t believe it…. We wouldn’t motor the boat at night due to the fear of something wrapping around the propeller. We’d only do that during the day with someone on lookout for garbage. When you stood on the deck and looked down you’d see the rubbish shimmering in the depths below, up to 20 metres under the water.”

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/oct/21/yachtsman-describes
-horror-at-dead-rubbish-strewn-pacific-ocean

And the search for the missing Malaysian plane, which didn't find any plane but DID find lots of oil slicks and floating debris.

I get a sinking feeling (no pun intended) when it seems that so many things are going so drastically wrong all at the same time. Did we do something catastrophic and irreversible? Is this due to very high temperatures in the mid-level ocean? Trash from the 2011 tsunami? Radionuclides? Something else? I wish I could point to a cause, but all I can do is point to a series of troubling events that may or may not be related.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 9:52 AM

CHRISISALL


Millions of tons of sewage, garbage, petroleum, and even nuclear waste hit the ocean every day from all over the planet. No surprises here.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:19 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


I think my concern is - Have we finally really killed the Pacific? Is all of this coming back to bite us in the ass now?

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:30 AM

JONGSSTRAW


Dateline: Northern California,

100,000 dolphins gathered together for three days of peace, love, and music at Blowholestock. Headlining the event was Country Joe and the Fish, along with Hot Tuna and Jefferson Starfish.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:30 AM

JONGSSTRAW


When so many showed up without tickets and crashed the nets, the promoters declared "It's a free concert now!"



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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:35 AM

MIKER

Once I found Serenity




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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:48 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I think my concern is - Have we finally really killed the Pacific?
No, but we have it on the ropes.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:52 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Dateline: Northern California,

100,000 dolphins gathered together for three days of peace, love, and music at Blowholestock. Headlining the event was Country Joe and the Fish, along with Hot Tuna and Jefferson Starfish.


The oceanic equivalent of "It was cold here today, so Climate Change is a myth."



“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”? Isaac Asimov

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:53 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Millions of tons of sewage, garbage, petroleum, and even nuclear waste hit the ocean every day from all over the planet. No surprises here.


And kaiju! Can't forget about them.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 11:21 AM

MIKER

Once I found Serenity



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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 11:40 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Kaiju actually means " men in giant rubber suits ".

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 12:42 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Kaiju actually means " men in giant rubber suits ".
You entertain yourself well. Bravo.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 1:18 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
Radionuclides?


Natural radionuclides in the ocean kinda out-quantify anything we've introduced, so probably not.

The sea star wasting makes me think of ocean acidification though. The calcite crystals in their ossicles dissolving is I assume what's going on. Which can do with temperatures or pollution or ocean floor methane releases.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 1:21 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
Originally posted by MIKER:
Are Earth’s oceans sentient? Will the oceans try and remove humanity from existence? Have the Oceans ever done so before and can they do it again?



No.

There have been die offs before that we could trace to various causes - the P-T boundary is an excellent example of this. None of those die-offs have ever been because of a sentient earth deciding to abruptly kill off lots of species.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 1:22 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
The sea star wasting makes me think of ocean acidification though. Which can do with temperatures or pollution.
And millions upon millions of tons of batteries...

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 1:50 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
And millions upon millions of tons of batteries...


That sort of thing would actually be more like a drop in the bucket compared to other stuff that's likely happening here.

Hoo. Okay, so calcium is one of the major minerals found in the continental crust. You might put millions of metric tons of calcium in the ocean EVERY DAY just from river run-off.

Calcium and Carbon Dioxide forms a material called Calcium Carbonate, or limestone in shallow water. Carbon Dioxide can be dissolved in the ocean at cooler temperatures, which produces more limestone. At warmer temperatures, CO2 bubbles out of the system, and Calcium Carbonate interacts with water (a very weak acid, H20) to produce Hydrogen ions, Calcium ions, and carbonate ions.

Acidity is a measure of how many hydrogen ions are in a solution, as H+ ions are very reactive (this is why acids dissolve stuff). So the more H+ ions in the ocean, the more acidic it is. The warmer the temperatures, the more acidic the ocean becomes.

Calcium is also used by a lot of organic processes. A number of animals make their shells or exoskeleton from Calcium Carbonate. (Humans use calcium in their bones and for neural signaling)

So animals that live in the water can survive a certain amount of acidification and temperature increases, but too much and their shells and bodies basically dissolve as you watch.

Another issue that could be a factor here is that there is a LOT of dead organic material and organic waste that builds up on the ocean floor over time. That stuff gets broken down into methane hydrates by various microbes that turn into ocean floor deposits. Temperature changes can convert those hydrates into methane gas, which puts even more hydrogen ions into the solution (probably at an even greater rate than carbonates).

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 3:09 PM

MIKER

Once I found Serenity



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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 5:13 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Close enough.

Pacific Rim .

Seen it?


" Kaiju (?? kaiju?) is a Japanese word that literally translates to "strange creature." The word has been translated and defined in English as "monster" and is used to refer to a genre of tokusatsu entertainment. Kaiju films usually showcase monsters of any form, usually attacking a major Japanese city or engaging another (or multiple) monster(s) in battle.
"

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 6:16 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Pacific Rim .

Seen it?


Yeah. It was a lot of fun.

Er, unless YOU liked it. If YOU liked it, it sucks.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 6:31 PM

WHOZIT


Did you also notice that all this happened after "Almost Human" was canceled...hmmm.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 6:51 PM

OONJERAH


Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
No.

There have been die offs before that we could trace to various causes - the P-T boundary is an excellent example of this. None of those die-offs have ever been because of a sentient earth deciding to abruptly kill off lots of species.


How about we have sentient & foolish race of monkeys. They did not
sit down and say, "Hey, let's destroy life on this planet by creating
widespread toxic pollution and never bothering to clean up our mess!"
and then vote yes on it.

No, we didn't decide to do it. It just comes naturally to us to do it.

We did bad habits with lazy neglect. Everything else was always more
important to most of us. And when the destruction we've caused became
undeniable, we denied it and ignored it some more.

Like the UN says, we all gotta get busy depolluting.

Question: What's the best way to demand changes?


... oooOO}{OOooo ...

Part of being smart is knowing what you're dumb at.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 7:05 PM

MIKER

Once I found Serenity



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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 7:13 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:
Radionuclides?


Natural radionuclides in the ocean kinda out-quantify anything we've introduced, so probably not.

The sea star wasting makes me think of ocean acidification though. The calcite crystals in their ossicles dissolving is I assume what's going on. Which can do with temperatures or ocean floor methane releases.

Can we blame California cows farting for the ocean floor methane releases? We can claim that methane gas sinks in the ocean after rising in the atmo.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 7:33 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Even sharks are being affected. They're feeding as if they're in a frenzied state, they're stalking and killing other fish, and they're not getting any sleep. Al Gore's new movie "An Inconvenient Tooth" will be out for the Summer, just in time to scientifically explain what's happening. Hopefully it will prevent mass beachings of libtards who cannot cope any longer.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 9:39 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Pacific Rim .

Seen it?


Yeah. It was a lot of fun.

Er, unless YOU liked it. If YOU liked it, it sucks.


Same rules apply for Firefly, huh? Cause I loved that show.

And yeah, Pacific Rim was lots o' fun. Despite the array of flaws through out the movie, I enjoyed it.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 9:53 PM

CHRISISALL


Dumass morons can like quality entertainment. That's been proven again & again here.

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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:18 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Dumass morons can like quality entertainment. That's been proven again & again here.


Case in point...

" Yeah, it was a lot of fun "



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Wednesday, June 4, 2014 10:28 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Case in point...

" Yeah, it was a lot of fun "
You're tryin' to make a political point of some kind here....!?

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Thursday, June 5, 2014 12:27 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
Can we blame California cows farting for the ocean floor methane releases? We can claim that methane gas sinks in the ocean after rising in the atmo.


I think the methane released from the ocean floor is more a matter of decomposing organic material that's already there. But, cow farts can actually contribute to pollution problems. the Wasatch front here in Utah actually has the worst air in the nation on inversion days, and a lot of that is because of cows. Both cows and cars produce nitrates which contribute to smog conditions, and we have a lot of both.

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Thursday, June 5, 2014 7:10 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:
Can we blame California cows farting for the ocean floor methane releases? We can claim that methane gas sinks in the ocean after rising in the atmo.


I think the methane released from the ocean floor is more a matter of decomposing organic material that's already there. But, cow farts can actually contribute to pollution problems. the Wasatch front here in Utah actually has the worst air in the nation on inversion days, and a lot of that is because of cows. Both cows and cars produce nitrates which contribute to smog conditions, and we have a lot of both.

Why has Utah not banned cow farts? Or else cows altogether?

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Thursday, June 5, 2014 7:19 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:
Why has Utah not banned cow farts? Or else cows altogether?


We're cattle country, a lot like Wyoming and the other "Western" western states.

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Thursday, June 5, 2014 9:03 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Case in point...

" Yeah, it was a lot of fun "
You're tryin' to make a political point of some kind here....!?


Nope.

Just collating data. As they say.

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Thursday, June 5, 2014 11:53 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.




OONJERAH - We are too dumb to live and smart enough to wipe ourselves out.
"You, who live in any kind of comfort or convenience, do not know how these people can survive these things, do you? They will endure because there is no immediate escape from endurance. Some will die, the rest must live."

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Friday, June 6, 2014 7:45 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Pacific Rim .

Seen it?


Yeah. It was a lot of fun.

Er, unless YOU liked it. If YOU liked it, it sucks.


Same rules apply for Firefly, huh? Cause I loved that show.

And yeah, Pacific Rim was lots o' fun. Despite the array of flaws through out the movie, I enjoyed it.


So naturally, I had to re-watch the movie. I liked it even more. The cast is darn good, and the music ! Wow... perfect for the movie. More and more, I've come to believe it takes a great soundtrack to make a good movie a GREAT movie. The original Star Wars, Indiana Jones ( well, the first one ), Jurassic Park, hell, even Thor, have music that I've DL'd , simply to listen to the scores.

Might not do so for Pacific Rim, but man... it's got darn good music.

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Friday, June 6, 2014 10:44 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Pacific Rim, but man... it's got darn good music.
A MUSLIM from IRAN gets praise from U?!?!?!?!?!!?!!??!?!?!?!


*cough* * choke*

someone temp Hell....

ETA: I simply adored his work on that AND Iron Man.

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Friday, June 6, 2014 11:59 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:A MUSLIM from IRAN gets praise from U?!?!?!?!?!!?!!??!?!?!?!


*cough* * choke*

someone temp Hell....

ETA: I simply adored his work on that AND Iron Man.


Whew! Ya almost had me there.

Funny.

He was born in Germany, and moved to LA. Dunno if he ever lived in Iran, and he certainly wasn't FROM Iran.

No idea of whether he's Muslim or not. Music doesn't sound Muslim.

And I do hear a similarity to Iron Man soundtrack. Which I also like. ( Even though it's not AC/DC )

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Saturday, June 7, 2014 8:42 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:
Originally posted by G:

nearly impossible to have a great movie with bad music)
See: Ladyhawk.

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