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Originally posted by WHOZIT:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iraq/10910868/Ira
q-crisis-Obama-may-launch-air-strikes-without-Congress-amid-calls-for-Maliki-to-go-live.html

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Links to a headline, a claim, but not much else.

I'm sure ISIS / ISIL , who ever, would like everyone to believe they have more support and fire power than they have, but unless there's any way of verifying this, ... meh.

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Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Is this the one where he says there is no military solution, so he is sending military troops over as advisers?

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Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Is this the one where he says there is no military solution, so he is sending military troops over as advisers?

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
That's our Barry !

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

If there are any military grade production or ordinances there, why wasn't this -

A ) Fully exposed by the Media ?

B ) Dismantled and destroyed by the US military ?

Channeling my inner Wash here, WHATS A CHEMICAL WEAPONS COMPLEX DOING IN IRAQ ??

Seems I remember something about a war, and then a 10 year 'occupation' or some such ???

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

Not sure i get the point of the video...

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

How the hell is the news that Iraq's chemical weapons complex falling into the hands of ISIS Bush's fault ??



Sarcasm not coming in too clear, if that's the intent.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

How the hell is the news that Iraq's chemical weapons complex falling into the hands of ISIS Bush's fault ??

Sarcasm not coming in too clear, if that's the intent.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Reaver - try following the gorram thread before you start spouting off mindless Left wing lies as talking points.

And 2nd... Lol @ " reset button "!!

Good one.

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In an interview published by the German magazine Der Spiegel in June 2008, al-Maliki said that a schedule for a withdrawal of U.S. troops from the country of "about 16 months... would be the right time-frame for a withdrawal, with the possibility of slight changes". In the interview, he said the U.S. government has been reluctant to agree to a timetable "because they feel it would appear tantamount to an admission of defeat. But that isn't the case at all... it is not evidence of a defeat, but of a victory, of a severe blow we have inflicted on Al Qaeda and the militias." He said U.S. negotiators were coming around to his point of view. Hillary Clinton and Carl Levin were two of several U.S. politicians who called for him to be removed from office in 2007. Senator Clinton urged Iraq's parliament to select a "less divisive and more unifying figure" and implied she felt al-Maliki was too concerned about Iraq's Shiite majority and not enough with national reconciliation. "During his trip to Iraq last week, Senator Levin ... confirmed that the Iraqi government is nonfunctional and cannot produce a political settlement because it is too beholden to religious and sectarian leaders", she said. Maliki hit back and said the Democratic senators were acting as if Iraq were "their property" and that they should "come to their senses" and "respect democracy" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nouri_al-Maliki#Relationship_with_U.S.

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Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
"Chemical Weapons Facilities" has such a sinister connotation. Just call them "Scientific Climate Research Stations" and the problem will go away.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
OMG!!!

"Chlorine plants" on the map! Because, you could NEVER use bleach for anything other than making WMD! Yanno, like disinfecting water! That would be unthinkable!

And "phenol plants"! Double OMG! Because you would NEVER use phenol for making plastics and detergents!

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Sheesh.

These are common... common... industrial chemicals. No modern economy is without them.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
OMG!!!

"Chlorine plants" on the map! Because, you could NEVER use bleach for anything other than making WMD! Yanno, like disinfecting water! That would be unthinkable!

And "phenol plants"! Double OMG! Because you would NEVER use phenol for making plastics and detergents!

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Sheesh.

These are common... common... industrial chemicals. No modern economy is without them.

Why bring up old news now??

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Originally posted by second:
Dick and Liz Cheney Troll Us With Scathing Iraq Op-ed. Dick Cheney Not Completely Sure If Obama Is a Traitor. http://online.wsj.com/articles/dick-cheney-and-liz-cheney-the-collapsi
ng-obama-doctrine-1403046522

The Cheney video on YouTube has disabled comments. Some things never change.

The Cheneys’ op ed is silent on what they would do differently in Iraq today. The op-ed contains nothing even approaching a specific suggestion for what, other than to say that defeating terrorists “will require a strategy — not a fantasy. It will require sustained difficult military, intelligence and diplomatic efforts — not empty misleading rhetoric. It will require rebuilding America’s military capacity — reversing the Obama policies that have weakened our armed forces and reduced our ability to influence events around the world.”

So to recap: we need a strategy, the Cheneys won’t tell us what that strategy might be.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
" Baby milk factory "

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Man I hope to god he sends troops.

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Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Is this the one where he says there is no military solution, so he is sending military troops over as advisers?

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I'm not sure there was a military solution to the Taliban/Al Qaeda in Afghanistan either. Does that mean we sit on our hands as terrorists and their sympathisers take over countries and set up terror camps? I think as with Afghanistan, as with Syria, there is no 'winning' option here - and that includes sitting on our hands.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I think that if we're going to follow a foreign policy for which there is no blowback for the vast majority of Americans, we should start by following the beginning of the Hippocratic Oath...

First, do no harm.

Economies and societies need stability and justice. You can't produce reliably if you're constantly looking over your shoulder for the gunman, and you can't produce reliably if the fruit of your labor is constantly being stolen from you. Production in the basis of wealth, and fairness is the basis of cooperation.

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I'm not sure there was a military solution to the Taliban/Al Qaeda in Afghanistan either. Does that mean we sit on our hands as terrorists and their sympathisers take over countries and set up terror camps? I think as with Afghanistan, as with Syria, there is no 'winning' option here - and that includes sitting on our hands.

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There are a lot of non-military options to choose from. One of the things to remember is that the various corrupt leaders around the world ... including Obama... get their funding from somewhere. You can't have a government in a financial vacuum. So the first thing to do is cut off access to the formal banking system. A little hard to do, since money laundering is so profitable! (Just as HSBC) But if you can get a hold of 90% of the transactions, you'll seriously impede a government's ability to arm itself.

The other point is that leaders who stay in power at the point of a gun have access to weapons.

The third point is that within even the most corrupt societies are people and movements who are seeking to make progress- wells for clean water, schools for children, food for the people, equal rights before the law... we should be supporting those movements.

What the USA does is stomp across the world in giant hobnailed boots, scattering governments and people here and there. The latest name of the game seems to BE "destabilization"... not to replace it with something better, but simply to leave wide smoking ruins where societies used to be.

That generates blowback.

And it occurred to me... the wealthy, they don't care about blowback because they're not going to be the victims! WHO were the victims of 9-11? WHO were the soldiers who were killed and maimed invading Afghanistan and Iraq? Jamie Diamon? Dick Cheney? King Abdullah? Anyone in their families?

Nah... it's us lowly shmucks. Blowback to them isn't a reaction to be feared, it's a foreign policy tool and an opportunity for investment.

Boy, are we screwed, or what?

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It must be nice to be so righteous at the expense of our military and the shield they provide you

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

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It must be nice to be so righteous at the expense of our military and the shield they provide you

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First of all, I pay a crap-ton of taxes. It's not as if they're doing this for free, out of the goodness of their hearts. So spare me the military sob-story- they're getting paid by my taxes.

Second, when has the military shielded ME (or most people) from anything? Did they protect the USA from 9-11? I noticed that I, and most Americans, happen to be HERE and the military happens to be THERE, doing god-knows-what. They're not defending me, they're defending the banks and the oil companies.

Until we're actually invaded, you can't point to any examples where the military has "defended" anyone.

Sheesh.

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Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Me, I never asked anyone to die for me. So anyone expecting me to jump up and salute while whistling Yankee Doodle for their sacrifices is in for a long wait.

They've got my sympathy. They don't have my allegiance. There isn't anything or anyone in this world who I think can do no wrong and nothing and no-one I wouldn't question. You start worshiping the military or the state, you no longer have the freedom people supposedly fought and died for.

Vets looking around all sad wondering what it is their buddies died for, and the truth is empty and bleak as the promises of our government. People fought and died, because our leadership is a greedy bunch of cowards in service to politics.

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Originally posted by THGRRI:

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Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Me, I never asked anyone to die for me. So anyone expecting me to jump up and salute while whistling Yankee Doodle for their sacrifices is in for a long wait.

They've got my sympathy. They don't have my allegiance. There isn't anything or anyone in this world who I think can do no wrong and nothing and no-one I wouldn't question. You start worshiping the military or the state, you no longer have the freedom people supposedly fought and died for.

Vets looking around all sad wondering what it is their buddies died for, and the truth is empty and bleak as the promises of our government. People fought and died, because our leadership is a greedy bunch of cowards in service to politics.

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You would ask if you lived in many of the troubled countries in the world. Of that I have no doubt. lucky for you, you live in a country where you can take it for granted and not have to ask.

si shen

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Originally posted by BYTEMITE:

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Originally posted by THGRRI:

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Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Me, I never asked anyone to die for me. So anyone expecting me to jump up and salute while whistling Yankee Doodle for their sacrifices is in for a long wait.

They've got my sympathy. They don't have my allegiance. There isn't anything or anyone in this world who I think can do no wrong and nothing and no-one I wouldn't question. You start worshiping the military or the state, you no longer have the freedom people supposedly fought and died for.

Vets looking around all sad wondering what it is their buddies died for, and the truth is empty and bleak as the promises of our government. People fought and died, because our leadership is a greedy bunch of cowards in service to politics.

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You would ask if you lived in many of the troubled countries in the world. Of that I have no doubt. lucky for you, you live in a country where you can take it for granted and not have to ask.

si shen

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Yeah? So who should I ask to die for me first, eh? Because this nation is going to shit, lemme tell you.

I'll die for myself, thanks much. Keep that military white knighting well away from me. Got enough blood on my hands.

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Not a white knight for the military. Just like to point out how easy it is to dismiss that the military is why we are not speaking German today or other languages of other invaders.

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