BP Oil Spill: Against Gov. Jindal's Wishes, Crude-Sucking Barges Stopped by Coast Guard by AURaptor

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

BP Oil Spill: Against Gov. Jindal's Wishes, Crude-Sucking Barges Stopped by Coast Guard

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Friday, June 18, 2010 16:17
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Thursday, June 17, 2010 5:51 PM

America loves a winner!

Day 57...

Quote:
Eight days ago, Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal ordered barges to begin vacuuming crude oil out of his state's oil-soaked waters. Today, against the governor's wishes, those barges sat idle, even as more oil flowed toward the Louisiana shore.

"It's the most frustrating thing," the Republican governor said today in Buras, La. "Literally, yesterday morning we found out that they were halting all of these barges."

Watch "World News" for David Muir's report from Louisiana tonight.

Sixteen barges sat stationary today, although they were sucking up thousands of gallons of BP's oil as recently as Tuesday. Workers in hazmat suits and gas masks pumped the oil out of the Louisiana waters and into steel tanks. It was a homegrown idea that seemed to be effective at collecting the thick gunk.

"These barges work. You've seen them work. You've seen them suck oil out of the water," said Jindal.

But the Coast Guard ordered the stoppage because of reasons that Jindal found frustrating. The Coast Guard needed to confirm that there were fire extinguishers and life vests on board, and then it had trouble contacting the people who built the barges.

http://abcnews.go.com/WN/bp-oil-spill-gov-bobby-jindals-wishes-crude/s
tory?id=10946379

“We will not rest until this well is shut, the environment is repaired and the cleanup is complete.”

- Barack Hussein Obama

( mmm mmmm mmmm! )

No inconvenience, what so ever. As I said, I got no use for..... private messaging some.

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Friday, June 18, 2010 2:01 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Yeah, I saw this news story, and I have a problem with this. It comes across like those idiot bitter lake cops every holiday weekend who just go around hassling people because they're pissed that they have to work and others want to go have a good time.

YES, they should have extinguishers and life vests. And in this instance, the Coast Guard should by god be going around and DISTRIBUTING extinguishers and life vests so these boats can hurry up and get back out there, not holding them up from doing their job while they try to call the owners.

What's fucked is that there are government employees at every level who are simply unable or unwilling to look at the SPIRIT of things, and go only by the LETTER of their rules. "Nope, says here that if you don't have an extinguisher and a vest, you can't go out and rescue that drowning man. I can't let you go out."

I'm fairly sure Obama wasn't the one who called the Coast Guard and told them to hold those boats, though.

Mike

On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you. --Auraptor

This vile and revolting malice - this is their true colors, always has been, you're just seeing it without the mask of justifications and excuses they hide it behind, is all. Make sure to remember it once they put the mask back on. --Fremdfirma

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Friday, June 18, 2010 3:16 AM

JONGSSTRAW

The Governors there want to build sand barriers and support structures to protect the coasts, but they are not being allowed because others say environmental impact studies need to be conducted first. Environmental impact studies? Now?? In the face of this?? In the face of the grim reality that they are facing complete destruction of their land and water?? Are they fucking kidding? There are a million bureaucrats and red-tape agency idiots running around down there like Keystone Kops on 'ludes with clipboards and checklists. We're going to see, and already are seeing the individual States themselves rebeling, taking charge and doing what they have to do to save themselves, telling the Feds to get the hell out of the way, sue us if you like.

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Friday, June 18, 2010 3:20 AM

FIVVER

I used to have respect for the Coast Guard but it's ebbing fast. Here's a link to an article in the Miami-Herald about some communities in the panhandle where the commissioners are risking jail to protect an ecosystem that's absolutely unique to North America.

Seagrove Beach is the place the fivver fammily has chosen for it's annual beach vacation for over 20 years. The dune lakes talked about in the article are fresh to brackish water lakes held back from the gulf by the beach sand dunes. Little creeks cut through, across the beach and allow an interchange of water between the two. You can walk from the ocean to the lake and never set foot on dry land. I've done it.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/15/1682792/for-small-florida-towns-
oil-stress.html

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Friday, June 18, 2010 11:10 AM

DREAMTROVE

Sounds like someone is deliberately stoking the red tape here. Jindal has a point, they're fucking with him.

Here's something that ive noticed which i find disturbing. Pele seem to sabotage accomplishments of the other party just to prevent them from looking good, not just because they disagree with the agenda. It happens in both directions.

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Friday, June 18, 2010 12:02 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Hookay...first off, the "sand berms" are a waste of time and effort and may make matters WORSE, according to all scientists and even the Army Corps of Engineers. They will only be six feet above water, and most likely washed away as fast as they're put in, or later by the first storm that hits.

BUT, moving the sand out there, and dredging it from somewhere else, is likely to change the tides and currents, which might well make everything worse, and will definitely affect the ocean life...like fish and oysters and stuff, y'know?

Second: THE BERMS HAVE BEEN APPROVED, and they're going ahead with them. All the bitching and moaning has been by people who are panicked and want to do something NOW without thinking it through. If they build these berms, watch what the scientists fear come true. They hadn't been built until now because of these environmental concerns and the waste of time and money for something that won't work, not red tape.

Third, the Coast Guard is working with BP, so the instructions are coming from THEM, not the White House (which we need to change post haste). They've also been assisting BP in keeping the media out, among other things that are just plain wrong.

Fourth, BP has been making it difficult for people to get gear of all kinds...they're stalling and stonewalling, as they've been doing all along. Nothing new there. I'm covering this in another thread.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
signing off

To our President: “Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar. Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.... oh, go fuck yourself, Mr. President” ...Raptor

To Anthony, unquestionably the most civil person on this forum: “Go fuck yourself. On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you. ...Raptor

To Frem: “You miserable piece of shit.” ...Raptor

To Niki: “My guess is it won't just be your ugly face you dislike.....Well, it's true......if you had a soul.” ...Raptor

To Kwicko:" You're the putrid slime which oozes between troll's toes, you're so low.” ...Raptor

...Remember, remember, the ugliest member...

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Friday, June 18, 2010 12:19 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Here's something that ive noticed which i find disturbing. People(sic) seem to sabotage accomplishments of the other party just to prevent them from looking good, not just because they disagree with the agenda. It happens in both directions.

I suppose it does - but the GOP in Michigan has taken it to such an extreme they have effectively destroyed the states economy and infrastructure, which has begun to fracture the society itself.

Combine that with authoritarian types exploiting those fractures and the all but imminent upheaval and destruction gonna come from that, and you might begin to see where my passionate bitterness at the fuckers comes from - not only did they not do their job, they spent every moment of it fucking everything up for everyone like petulant little children who break toys rather than share.

-Frem

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Friday, June 18, 2010 2:39 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

You can't make matters " worse " by building sand berms if the oil gets in ( as it already has ) and kills all life, save for the bacteria that actually eats the oil .

Sure, building berms under any other circumstances would be nuts, but now.... ? I'd have preferred to give the marshes a fighting chance, instead of giving it up to the suffocating oil. That's really a no brainer.

Yes, the berms HAVE been approved, or some have, long after their effectiveness is all but shot to hell. I believe the idiom " fixing the barn door after the horses have left " applies here.

The chain of command here is beyond pathetic. No one knows who's in charge. The Keystone Cops were a precision tactical team compared to this quagmire ( about the 1st time this word has even been used properly, thank you )

No inconvenience, what so ever. As I said, I got no use for..... private messaging some.

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Friday, June 18, 2010 2:53 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

As usual, you didn't read. Yes, you CAN make it worse. The main objection by scientists is that they will wash away as fast as they're built, if not with the first bad weather to come along. So I hear complaints about doing things "for show"--that's PRECISELY what this is. Actually, it's doing things out of fear--grabbing at whatever straws they can, given how helpless they feel, which I can understand.

But if they won't work (and they won't--think about dumping a bunch of sand, enough sand to raise six feet above water, then watching it all disappear!--AND the dredging and berming changes the currents and wildlife (fish), so much more harm than ANY good could be done... Get it??

One of the things they said was that the berm, while it will fall apart rapidly, will change the ocean insofar as making a lump where one wasn't before, but not protecting anything from the oil, which is on the TOP and will roll right over. So you think that's smart???

Think it through before you go off on a tangent about "something is better than nothing". If that "something" doesn't improve the problem but makes it WORSE, what kind of sense does that make??

Try to conceive it: Build a berm, it gets washed away and sinks. No protection from oil, which will wash right over. BUT, the floor of the ocean has now been changed, dredged UP and laid DOWN. Nobody knows how that will affect future hurricanes, how the oil moves around, how fish patterns might change...can you possibly grasp that? It's not just about "right now"; it won't WORK for "right now" yet will have long-term consequences.

They okayed it because of pressure, not because it's a good idea. This administration bows to pressure on virtually everything. THERE is your "for show" effort, not the burning off of pools of oil on the surface.

Duh.

I recognize how this has affected you and it's much the same as it's affected those in the Gulf, without the personal consequences. I see it in your every post. I'm just as affected, but it's important to use one's BRAINS in dealing with this horror, not just one's heart.

The idiom you should be looking at is First do no harm

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Friday, June 18, 2010 3:21 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Oh, I read, but, as is so often the case, don't agree with what you posted.

Berms aren't suppose to be a permanent barrier to keep the oil out. Just delay it, and give the wetlands a chance to weather this storm....ooops.

Too late.

Had the berms been constructed, had booms been placed with more urgency, and with any semblance of thought and care, much of the oil would have been held at bay. The berms don't have to be permanent, just built and maintained long enough to get a hold on the situation.

Add the barges that can suck up the oil (when not being kept in port for life vest checks ) or if Kevin Costner's centrifuges been put to use in the first few weeks, maybe much would have been saved. Might not have, but hell, I'd rather go down swinging than just sit there and wait for the bureaucrats and suits at BP determine the fate of the entire gulf region.

I trust the locals who live down there to know what the hell they're talking about , rather than some dispassionate scientist, or some Army Corps of Engineers spokesmonkey. After all this is the same Corps that brought us the flawed levee designs and which dredged up canals across the wetlands, that have lead to their disappearance for the last 100 years.

You fret over the " possible" harm if berms are put in place ? Who cares. You can't harm that which no longer is living. The wetlands were slowly dying anyways, and the oil will only hasten their demise. Berms at least give Louisianians a fighting chance. Or would have....

The harm's been done. Severely. Sometimes you have to lose a limb to save the body. Sadly, looks like the body is a goner by the time the word was given to lose the tip of the finger.

No inconvenience, what so ever. As I said, I got no use for..... private messaging some.

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Friday, June 18, 2010 3:47 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

I see I can't get through to you. This is NOT permanent, I explained in my post in another thread. Nature can come back...it will take a long time, how long depending on many things, but not everything is dead, by a long shot.

You didn't get what I was saying...the strongest possibility is that the berms will dissolve as soon as they're built, or with the firt storm. They're having a storm just today, how many more do you think they'll have in the coming weeks while they're building these berms?

The time, effort and money to build them is just a total waste and could be used elsewhere; they won't stop the oil, and they won't even slow it down, they'll just change the ocean floor and possibly so much more.

I know you empathize with those in the Gulf, but they're reacting out of panic mode, as are you, and people don't think straight in panic mode. They want to do something...NOW, which is only natural. But this is not a good idea.

Booms aren't perfect, but you're right. If they'd been put up earlier, and MAINTAINED, they'd have been much better at keeping the oil out--even if they were maintained NOW it would be a good thing.

By the way, you're also half right about the Jones Act. It wasn't about the skimmers, but it IS, from what I can find, about the tankers, and that's despicable.

Our government needs to take over: NOW! BP is playing games, has been from the start, and they need someone in there who can do the job, not lie and cheat to avoid penalties. And yes, they definitely need to waive the Jones Act NOW. They WERE accepting help from international skimmers and equipment from overseas, but we need to those tankers!

Maybe it would be a good idea if you took a break from the news, Raptor. I know it's hard to, I'm finding it hard too, but it's gonna continue to be bad news for some time to come, and you need to take care of YOU, you can't help them by staying so head up all the time. I don't mean that snidely--having been off for two days and then readinga bunch of your posts, it's come through even clearer how strongly you are caught up in this, and how it's affecting you (shut up, Mike, I'm talking to Raptor).

It would probably be good if we ALL took a break from the news, or at least only watched it once a day or something. I'm not sure how, I can't, but I recognize how it's got me all tied up in knotts, and now I can see how it's doing the same to you.

I continue to remind myself that the real culprit in this is BP, and I can't wait for MMS to get on the hot seat. I concede Obama hasn't done enough or done it fast enough, and am angry that they aren't taking over, give how BP is acting. But it's BP responsible for this in the end, and it's our lack of willingness to give up oil, so it's a shared disaster, in many ways. Attacking one another for party affiliations doesn't help the Gulf or anyone else. Just my opinion.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
signing off

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Friday, June 18, 2010 3:53 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

I'd rather react out of panic mode than to sit there, do nothing, which is exactly what D.C. and BP have been doing for nearly 60 days.

The thing is , there isn't ONE plan that needs to be implemented here. Depending on the currents ,the terrain, and what can be used and when... the best way to attack this crisis is at the local level , with help from the outside being directed to where it's needed the most.

The Federal Gov't, however, is doing it damn near backwards, with them telling the locals nothing, and giving them nothing to do it with.

No inconvenience, what so ever. As I said, I got no use for..... private messaging some.

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Friday, June 18, 2010 4:17 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

I understand how you feel. I'm frustrated too, believe me. And if you recall, I never said doing nothing was better. I just don't believe in giving in to panic and doing something harmful out of that panic.

We need those goddamned tankers. Now!

By the way, I AM as pissed about the barge thing as you are. It seemed like a good idea, as opposed to the berms. Bear in mind, the Coast Guard is working for BP these days, not us. I'm with Fivver: "I used to have respect for the Coast Guard but it's ebbing fast."

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
signing off

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