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Originally posted by HKCavalier:
It all boils down to the fantasy of control. Control is the saddest lie of the human mind. We have no control over this kind of thing. Y'know, murder is the ultimate expression of the fantasy of control. Murder is the only "control" any human being is going to have over the thoughts and actions of another person. We can limit and limit and limit a person's movement but we won't have total control. But we can have "control" if we end them entirely. So, yes, of course, folks fantasize about assassinating a 19 year old child for the pre-crime of killing 20 others. They fantasize about standing in front of the School like Doc Holiday and gunnin' the sum'bitch down like the dog he is.

It's also an expression of the a fallacy of us and them. Violence on my part = good, violence on his part = bad. All we gotta do, the think goes, is make sure that the violence always flows in the correct direction: from the virtuous to the villainous. But that's not in the nature of violence, is it? What violence loves most of all is a cycle. No, violence never goes in just one direction, the direction we want and fantasize about. But that brings us back to the fantasy of control, don'it?

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Reminds me of the thought experiment I'd heard of, years and years ago, where it is posited, that, IF you could go back in time, to a point where Adolph Hitler is still just a child, would you murder him, knowing that, if you didn't, he'd later grow up , and take the world to war ?

In effect, you'd be killing a young boy, who had yet done nothing, but would grow up to be the author of millions of dead and the destruction of much of Europe.

Could you carry out such an act ?

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
I guess that's why they called it a thought experiment, or Gedankenexperiment. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thought_experiment )

It's not meant to be a REAL situation.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

Ha ! I got a YoSaffBridge gif! Woo hoo!

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Originally posted by Arlo:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

Ha ! I got a YoSaffBridge gif! Woo hoo!

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Will this mean you'll be missing from forum conversation for five minutes or so?

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Originally posted by HKCavalier:
All these dumbass time travel thought experiments have one stupid premise in common: the presumption of absolute predestination that would have to be in place to justify the slaughter of a child named Adolf Hitler (which of course is totally undermined by the stated goal of changing history).

If I were in charge of a top secret government time travel program involving Adolph Hitler, I'd have my operatives go back in time and befriend Hitler's mother and father and become close family friends when their child Adolph was born. My operatives would nurture and aid the young Adolph as much as they could, even patronizing his artistic career. Wouldn't that be great? Why not turn Hilter into a great artistic celebrity long before he turned in frustration to politics? I mean, I could myself go back and teach him cubism and fauvism way ahead of the curve! Only then, the great dictator would come out of Spain, a failed artist whom everyone accused of copying Hitler's genius. His supporters would march down the street chanting, "Heil Picasso!"



HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Originally posted by HKCavalier:
If I were in charge of a top secret government time travel program involving Adolph Hitler, I'd have my operatives go back in time and befriend Hitler's mother and father and become close family friends when their child Adolph was born. My operatives would nurture and aid the young Adolph as much as they could, even patronizing his artistic career. Wouldn't that be great? Why not turn Hilter into a great artistic celebrity long before he turned in frustration to politics? I mean, I could myself go back and teach him cubism and fauvism way ahead of the curve! Only then, the great dictator would come out of Spain, a failed artist whom everyone accused of copying Hitler's genius. His supporters would march down the street chanting, "Heil Picasso!"

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"I do not wish to kill him for what he has done to my name, I wish to RAISE him... so that he can HONOR it."

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Originally posted by AgentRouka:
And that leads further to who else may need help at this moment in time who could potentially walk down a dark road in the future. Taking that sort of gamble needs a lot more courage than violence and punishment.

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