REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Syria

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Friday, September 6, 2013 10:27
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Wednesday, September 4, 2013 12:55 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


There's so much in every direction on the issue right now, it's hard to find much else. And given we MAY be close to doing something, that's not surprising.

But I haven't followed it HERE, so I don't know, and I'm asking. Where do people stand? I can't say I personally can TAKE a stand; I don't want us involved, I'm not sure we'd do any good (but pretty sure we'd do a lot of harm), but at the same time people are suffering, the situation is horrible, and I WISH we could do something to stop it. So I guess I'm pretty much neutral, leaning away from America getting involved.

How about everyone else? "Should we, shouldn't we, will we, won't we, will we join the dance?"

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Wednesday, September 4, 2013 7:14 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!




Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Wednesday, September 4, 2013 7:38 PM

WHOZIT


I'd like to know where Obama stands, does he want to bomb a small country to get a boner or not?

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Wednesday, September 4, 2013 8:10 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by whozit:
I'd like to know where Obama stands, does he want to bomb a small country to get a boner or not?



Only if Aunt Esther gives him permission.



Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, September 5, 2013 6:04 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Thank you, G. I guess yours is the only intelligent response this thread may get. It's pretty telling that, in my opinion and many others, the Syria question is a pretty serious one facing our country, yet the only others to bother to respond do so to play nasty little games.

I've done a lot of reading and thinking the past week about Syria, and it kind of "congealed" if you will in the last day or two. I think I've come down on the side of not wanting us involved. I hate doing nothing, but I don't see anything USEFUL we really can do, and I don't trust governments to do the "right" thing, whatever that even might BE.

I'd sure like to have heard intelligent comments from others here; there are many whose opinions I respect, and I was hoping they'd speak up. Oh, well...


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Thursday, September 5, 2013 6:45 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Quote:

I'd sure like to have heard intelligent comments from others here; there are many whose opinions I respect, and I was hoping they'd speak up. Oh, well...




Yeah. My 2 comments here prolly don't qualify, huh?

I'll give ya that.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Thursday, September 5, 2013 7:15 PM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Thank you, G. I guess yours is the only intelligent response this thread may get. It's pretty telling that, in my opinion and many others, the Syria question is a pretty serious one facing our country, yet the only others to bother to respond do so to play nasty little games.

I've done a lot of reading and thinking the past week about Syria, and it kind of "congealed" if you will in the last day or two. I think I've come down on the side of not wanting us involved. I hate doing nothing, but I don't see anything USEFUL we really can do, and I don't trust governments to do the "right" thing, whatever that even might BE.

I'd sure like to have heard intelligent comments from others here; there are many whose opinions I respect, and I was hoping they'd speak up. Oh, well...



I've been meaning to reply, but my response is too long and complex to just sit down and write and post- it would require a detailed essay.

Short answer-- Historically, doesn't the Civilized world have to do something? But since the UN won't, because of Russia and China; since the Brits WON'T, in spite of the gas attacks in World War I, and since everybody who is arguing for action wants the US to do it, instead of doing it themselves, it's pretty lonely arguing that we're doing it for civilization. Those who used the weapons should be found and punished. But because of the manufactured uncertainty about who did it, there will be no clarity, just arguments about conspiracies. And given that joining either side puts us in bed with creeps and anti-Americans, it's a loser no matter what we do.

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Thursday, September 5, 2013 7:22 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Well, NewOld, you nailed the one thing that I keep screaming inside: "doesn't the Civilized world have to do something?"

...but then the rest of what you wrote, and so much more. So, like you, I say "it's a loser no matter what we do".


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Thursday, September 5, 2013 9:05 PM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Well, NewOld, you nailed the one thing that I keep screaming inside: "doesn't the Civilized world have to do something?"

...but then the rest of what you wrote, and so much more. So, like you, I say "it's a loser no matter what we do".




Yeah. The long version of what I was going to post was about the horrors of the gas attacks of WWI, and the 1929 Geneva Protocol on the use of poison gas.

The ENTIRE WORLD agreed that that was a very bad thing. Of course, there are loopholes and technicalities: that was about a nation using poison gas in a war against another nation's army, not against its own civilian population. Which doesn't make this case less horrible, rather more, and the law morally more applicable.

But there's no way to win in this scenario: victory would be Assad removed, taken to the International Criminal Court and convicted of Crimes Against Humanity. And nobody in D C is suggesting an effort that would lead to that.

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Thursday, September 5, 2013 10:37 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by G:
Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Well, NewOld, you nailed the one thing that I keep screaming inside: "doesn't the Civilized world have to do something?"



Um, what "Civilized world" would that be? Us?
Reminds me of one of my favorites:

"What do you think about Western Civilization?"
"I think it's a good idea."

By the way - us dropping bombs is likely to produce more images of dead innocent Syrians, this time that the US has killed (or not, truth doesn't matter), images which will no doubt circulate around the ME further endearing us to the people there.

And bombing will create more refugees - 200 million now, what's another 100,000 without a home.

What do we GAIN again? Is it just to make some of us here, thousands of miles away and safe in our homes, feel better?



Got it in one.

There's really no military action that the U.S can take that will make things better in the Syrian civil war. There's probably not any non-military stuff we could do at this point that could accomplish much either.




"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Friday, September 6, 2013 10:27 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Wow, we might actually have found something we're all in agreement on! Is there anyone here who thinks we SHOULD get involved?


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