people dying of the heat - but hey, rappy's backyard is just fine! by 1kiki

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
I think you need to get over yourself. -SIGNY

That make you feel better?
Yanno, everyone here has thought that about everyone else at some point. Don't make you a genius for sayin' it.
This is just a discussion board, you can believe what someone says or not.
The fact that what I believe about reality makes people angry means that I'm probably closer than you care to admit. You and kiki are optimists and I'm sure that makes you more fun to be around than me, but it also makes you less likely to be realistic.
I'll take realism over sugar-coated optimism any day.

What a load of tripe.

You've unloaded in many threads and posts how mortally "stupid" people are, with their ignorance and their beliefs, and you're not a whit different. Your "beliefs" ... about people, about healthcare, about economies, about societies ... And all of your "beliefs": How're they working for ya? Have they gotten you ahead? Materially improved anything for you or your family or ... anyone? Your belief in capitalism: how's that working out for your healthcare?

Yeah, we know: You've got a grip on sanitation. Good for you.

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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Wednesday, July 22, 2015 1:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:

What a load of tripe.
How're they working for ya? Have they gotten you ahead? Your belief in capitalism: how's that working out for your healthcare?

Yeah, we know: You've got a grip on sanitation. Good for you.

Why is getting ahead so important? Can't take it with you. Never expected to get rich, but even in the state I'm in... we get by. You CAN do that if you work at it. Our state told y'all to go shove it, so hopefully hubbs should have a coal job for long enough to pay the house off, and that's all I care about. Me and the other 8 billion people- that's about all we care about. GETTING BY. And I just made my point again!

As for healthcare, when my snot turned green and my face started to explode yesterday, I went to the doc and got some anti-biotics, so I'm good for today. Thanks for askin'!

Now I'm gonna go pee, and I'm gonna relish the flushin' just a bit more. Might remind my kid how lucky she isn't gonna haveta rustle through our neighbors trash for dinner. And to always have STANDARDS- like not wiping your ass with your HAND.

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Wednesday, July 22, 2015 6:47 PM

Y'all might want to know I stopped using round-up (mostly because it's expensive to do a 150 ft driveway several times a year, so I just mow it) and now all the neighbors are mad. There's your environmental concern from my state.

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Thursday, July 23, 2015 2:44 AM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

You and kiki are optimists and I'm sure that makes you more fun to be around than me, but it also makes you less likely to be realistic.

I'm not optimistic. I don't have the energy for it. However, I have concern for the people who'll still be here after I'm gone. The US will no longer have superior economic power - and unrivaled access to resources. Nope, economically, it'll be in the scrum. And speaking of resources, thanks to global warming, overpopulation, and the capitalist economic dependence on profligate purchasing, and strip-mining the air, land and water of every bit of value it has, resources will be far more limited and have a greater demands put on them.

So, you think it's possible to get by now. What do you think the future holds for your daughter if we keep on doing what we're doing now? What will her world be like? What will 'getting by' look like?

Anyway, I won't be around to see it, lucky me. But you will, and your daughter will. So I think it would behoove you to do some realistic thinking about the future, and see if you can spare the small amount of effort it takes to send off an email petition as part of a petition drive (all you really have to do is click a link), or vote for a good candidate (especially if the outcome is a given), or send $5 a year to, say, The Nature Conservancy. All of these are well within your scope.

SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.

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Thursday, July 23, 2015 10:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:

Anyway, I won't be around to see it, lucky me. But you will, and your daughter will. So I think it would behoove you to do some realistic thinking about the future, and see if you can spare the small amount of effort it takes to send off an email petition as part of a petition drive (all you really have to do is click a link), or vote for a good candidate (especially if the outcome is a given), or send $5 a year to, say, The Nature Conservancy. All of these are well within your scope.

DO you even remotely realize how manipulative that post was???

I mean, you sound like a Baptist Preacher.

WHOA to you and yours for ye shall surely burn in the hell and wasteland of the eternal money grubbers and planet rapists, but ye can repent if you but send $5 paltry dollars to people who really can't do anything to stop the onslaught of greedy butchers in that far-away land...

My kid lives in the Midwest, and since everything takes like another twenty or thirty years to get here, SHE WILL GET BY JUST FINE. She is an only child, so she gets it all. And we're past that annoying ice cap melt line, so YAY.

Like I've said many times- voting doesn't do anything but line someone else's pocket till it's fluffy, and donating money just insures you line someone else's pocket until it's fluffy, and signing an e-mail petition??? I haven't ever even done that for Firefly. I've voted lots because we actually have won those, but I've never signed my name to a thing.

They are all temporary, ineffective, and insufficient. You wanna "keep up the good fight" you do that. I think I'll wait for that sixth extinction event to happen and fix it all. And it WILL happen.

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Friday, July 24, 2015 2:53 AM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

I didn't realize pointing out facts was manipulative. My bad. I'll skip the facts next time and go straight to my assumptions, like you do. That way, I'll be able to ignore drought, the loss of ocean-based habitat, species and food, the fall of the petrodollar and the impoverishment of the US population, and all the other emerging threats, and say everyone will be ... just fine. And at my decree - voilà - every problem, instantly solved.

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Friday, July 24, 2015 11:48 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
Why is getting ahead so important?

Isn't that the capitalist mantra? Isn't that what you believe in?

"Greed is good"?
"The person who dies with the most toys wins"?

You claim to prefer capitalism, but then you don't engage in it. I think you're confused about capitalism is.

Quote:
Our state told y'all to go shove it, so hopefully hubbs should have a coal job for long enough to pay the house off, and that's all I care about. Me and the other 8 billion people- that's about all we care about. GETTING BY. And I just made my point again!

What point is that? That you prefer to be at the bottom of the heap? (Oh, I forgot: You have indoor plumbing! So you're not QUITE at the bottom.) That you feel defensive about enabling a system that's ultimately self-destructive? That you're OK with having no authority over how society runs, and that you like leaving all the big decisions to the 500 richest people who own 50% of the world's assets?

Quote:
Anyway, I won't be around to see it, lucky me. But you will, and your daughter will. So I think it would behoove you to do some realistic thinking about the future, and see if you can spare the small amount of effort it takes to send off an email petition as part of a petition drive (all you really have to do is click a link), or vote for a good candidate (especially if the outcome is a given), or send $5 a year to, say, The Nature Conservancy. All of these are well within your scope.- KIKI

DO you even remotely realize how manipulative that post was???

How is that manipulative? Your daughter will experience more of the future than you will. Unless she dies before you, of course. That's a fact.

Quote:
I mean, you sound like a Baptist Preacher.
WHOA to you ....

It's "WOE to you" [sadness,misery, affliction] not "WHOA to you" [opposite of "giddyup"]. I hate to be a spelling Nazi, but occasionally it's fun. Unless you really meant "HALT", in which case- my bad

Where were we? Oh yes ..

Quote:
WOE to and yours for ye shall surely burn in the hell and wasteland of the eternal money grubbers and planet rapists, but ye can repent if you but send $5 paltry dollars to people who really can't do anything to stop the onslaught of greedy butchers in that far-away land...

You claim to be a realist, and yet you refuse to engage in realistic thinking. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to do some simple back-of-the envelope math and project what things will be like 20 years from now: more people, killer weather, less water, and fewer species/resources.

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My kid lives in the Midwest, and since everything takes like another twenty or thirty years to get here, SHE WILL GET BY JUST FINE. She is an only child, so she gets it all. And we're past that annoying ice cap melt line, so YAY.

Is this what you TRULY believe?

Wow, then you're telling yourself a whopper! Do you really think that being "in the midwest" in going to isolate her from killer heat, killer drought, killer storms, and general societal breakdown? Do you really think that when economies and societies are under severe stress, that money or inheritance (a house) will mean anything? Heck, why do you think so many people are drinking and drugging their lives away now? Society is ALREADY breaking down. And it's all around you. And if the stats about meth and oxycontin in the midwest can be believed there's no protection by being "in the midwest".

Your daughter, no matter how smart and capable, will never be able to survive on her own if society collapses. I had this discussion with BYTE many years ago. Yeah, she might be able to scratch up enough food on her own to support herself for a few years, but over the long haul she'll need to be able to make things like nails, axes, hoes, glass, and cloth. Only a fairly large group - 100 people or so - of like-minded and hard-working crafts-people would be able to survive at the middle-ages level indefinitely. And then, only if they had sufficient raw resources nearby.

So, those [good midwestern] neighbors that you seem to despise so heartily? You might want to get to know them better, and on better terms.

Quote:
Like I've said many times- voting doesn't do anything but line someone else's pocket till it's fluffy, and donating money just insures you line someone else's pocket until it's fluffy, and signing an e-mail petition??? I haven't ever even done that for Firefly. I've voted lots because we actually have won those, but I've never signed my name to a thing.

This is something to be proud of? That you have some sort of internal block that compels you to say "I refuse to take ANY sort of agency about our collective future! I reject ANY opportunity to express a preferred goal! I LIKE leaving all of the decisions in the hands of the wealthy few!"

Quote:
You wanna "keep up the good fight" you do that. I think I'll wait for that sixth extinction event to happen and fix it all. And it WILL happen.

First of all, you don't have to wait - it's already happening. Animals are going extinct (thanks, Homo Sapiens!) at a rate 1000X faster than the geologic norm.

Second, for someone who thinks it really "WILL" happen ... you manage at the same time to believe it will pass your (medically challenged) daughter by, because you're going to leave her "everything" including indoor plumbing and air conditioning. That's not very realistic of you.

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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Friday, July 24, 2015 11:22 PM

You must spend hours [.cuddling up next to the bracket button.]

I get that it does make you feel better to try and nick pick every little point. You probably need to understand that every time I see that all I can think is O...C...D.

I dare you, find ONE major point that is the most important of all those things to you and argue it in paragraph form.

'Cause half of those are just nonsense babble, or unimportant details, or desperate attempts to cross-connect things I've said so you can prove me wrong in your own head. I don't even know where to start... It's like you've perfected the whole "baffle them with bullshit" routine.

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Friday, July 24, 2015 11:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
I didn't realize pointing out facts was manipulative. My bad. I'll skip the facts next time and go straight to my assumptions, like you do.

That way, I'll be able to ignore drought, the loss of ocean-based habitat, species and food, the fall of the petrodollar and the impoverishment of the US population, and all the other emerging threats, and say everyone will be ... just fine.

AT least you would have an assumption to start from instead of standing on HOPE. Hope is just delusion wrapped in a pretty dress.

Lots of problems on this planet. When you come up with a plan to FIX any one of them, instead of just applying yet another dirty bandage...You let me know.

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Friday, July 24, 2015 11:44 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
'Cause half of those are just nonsense babble, or unimportant details

Hey, I'm just responding to the nonsense babble and unimportant details that YOU brought up! In a thread about global warming, you managed to bring up sanitation, your horrible neighbors, and your daughter's (imaginary) prospects for surviving an apocalypse, because your live "in the midwest" which is on (another imaginary) timeline from everyone else.

HAHAHAAHAHA!

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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Saturday, July 25, 2015 12:22 AM

OK, since you can't do it I will pick one you have repeated.

My kid and the apocalypse.

I believe something is going to happen, on a global scale within -let's say- 200 years.

I do not know what, and I do not know when, and neither does anyone else.

))))))My point was that in the event of a economic downturn, people in the Midwest are far more able to cope than people in cities, just due to availability of resources. WE ARE SURROUNDED BY FOOD, GENIUS!!!!! If that is the determining factor, and we only have the one mouth to sustain, sustain she will. If our health be the determining factor, then we die. Oh well...

You are trying to make global warming a personalized thing by attempting to play with my emotions- thus the manipulation part.

I realize I can only do what I can do, and no action I take is going to stop a comet from wiping out all life on Earth, from melting polar ice caps, from succumbing to a plague that wipes out all life. If it comes, it comes. I will not waste my life in worry about things I cannot change. .

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Saturday, July 25, 2015 12:39 AM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

AT least you would have an assumption to start from instead of standing on HOPE. Hope is just delusion wrapped in a pretty dress.

And an assumption isn't equally a delusion - especially when it refuses to yield to facts?

You're trapped in your stalled out car on the train tracks. Your seat belt is jammed and the train is traveling toward you. You still have some time. Do you
1) dial 911, honk your horn and turn on your brights, keep trying to release the belt and keep trying to wiggle your way out of it, because there is some chance you'll be able to stay alive
2) say there is no train and refuse to look out the window
3) admit there is a train but conclude you'll be OK

Lots of problems on this planet.

And yet, the one to focus on would probably be the fatal one.

When you come up with a plan to FIX any one of them, instead of just applying yet another dirty bandage...You let me know.

I already did.

YOU start with the idea nothing will work. Direct action, even by millions of people - won't work. Political pressure - won't work. Democracy - won't work.

How do you know?

Let's look at democracy. For the most part, people have been voting for the same kinds of people with the same kinds of results. Has the alternative even been tested? When was the last time a DEMONSTRABLY populist party - that stands for the common person instead of corporate profit and power - been in government? Decades? A hundred years? Never? So, by what magic divination do you know ahead of time nothing will get better if such a party was to gain the vote?

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Saturday, July 25, 2015 7:54 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

Quote:
Originally posted by Wishimay:

I will not waste my life in worry about things I cannot change.

One person's vote won't change the USA, but one percent of all voters can because the weak link or maybe the hinge or the pivot point for governance is at the primary election where only a small percent of registered voters (10%, 15%) pick the candidates for all political offices.

This weakness in US democracy has been exploited since the days of Thomas Jefferson by the Top One Percent, the people with the most money in the USA. Very clever of them.

Not so clever, the Bottom 90 Percent can't understand why the Top One Percent control the USA. It is because the Bottom does not have the commonsense to vote in the primary elections.

Here come the excuses. There are always naysayers in the Bottom saying “My one vote does not count” and “I've got no time for politics”. The Top One Percent love you for saying that and don't even need to thank naysayers for their unpaid services. Just not voting in primaries serves well the Top 1%.

The good news is that we may not be doomed to spend the rest of our lives thinking of disgusting things to which to compare the American political process. This week for the first time, 12 major U.S. public interest organizations jointly released a campaign finance reform agenda. Simply creating a list of common demands is the baby step part of politics, there’s a reason parents get excited when their children first stand up and walk. https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/07/24/campaign-finance-reform-
world-gets-page-fight-big-money-empower-people/

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Saturday, July 25, 2015 9:52 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:

OK, since you can't do it I will pick one you have repeated.
My kid and the apocalypse.
I believe something is going to happen, on a global scale within -let's say- 200 years.

Well, first of all, you were convinced not three posts ago that a 20-30 year delay would be meaningful. Now you say it's 200 years. I think you believe whatever it is that gets you thru the day.

And, about those "beliefs"!
I started out my comments with the observation:

Quote:
WISH, you have a lot of "beliefs" ... about humanity, about capitalism, about socialism, about India, about history. But to you, your beliefs aren't beliefs, they're "the truth".

So thank you for demonstrating that I was correct, because you don't have knowledge, you have "beliefs". And very naive ones at that! Ones that give you "hope"!

Quote:
I do not know what, and I do not know when, and neither does anyone else.

Do I "know" that the sun will come up tomorrow? Well, not with 100.000000% certainty. A huge meteor may smack into the earth and knock it off its orbit, or the sun may go supernova. Both unlikely, but not impossible.

But I did invite you to do some back-of-the-envelope calculations, so what do those those calculations tell you about this?

WORLD POPULATION

HUMAN POPULATION AND SPECIES EXTINCTIONS

GLOBAL WARMING

What do these tell you about life in 20-30 years, and 200 years from now?

Quote:
My point was that in the event of a economic downturn, people in the Midwest are far more able to cope than people in cities, just due to availability of resources. WE ARE SURROUNDED BY FOOD, GENIUS!!!!! If that is the determining factor

First: Big if. Maybe the determining factor is weather. Maybe you suffer from such a serious drought that nobody can grow anything ...
Second: Neither your nor your family are farmers. As far as I cant ell, you don't even garden. You may be surrounded by food (that's an "if") but it's not yours. And the farmers: they're going to give you food just because of your winning personality?
Third: How do you know that you won't be in the path of an exodus from the cities?

Quote:
we only have the one mouth to sustain, sustain she will.

Your mixed pronouns indicate that you (plural) will starve to sustain one. Correct?

Quote:
You are trying to make global warming a personalized thing by attempting to play with my emotions- thus the manipulation part.

Look, if I told someone here is the LA area that they better get some earthquake supplies together so their family will survive "the big one", is that being manipulative, or just passing on some common sense?

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I realize I can only do what I can do ...

Yes, you can do only what you can do. So do what you can. Both KIKI and SECOND had good points to make on this.

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... and no action I take is going to stop a comet from wiping out all life on Earth, from melting polar ice caps, from succumbing to a plague that wipes out all life.

Oh, you mean no action BY YOURSELF? You're right - you're not superwoman. Nobody expects you to solve the world's problem by yourself. Nobody expects your hubby to give up his coal job. Because of my blood sugar, I don't expect that I'll give up eating meat.

Quote:
If it comes, it comes. I will not waste my life in worry about things I cannot change.

And neither do I. Am I prepared for a comet strike? No. Am I prepared for an earthquake? Yes. Do I do something about global warming? Yes. And the first thing that I do is-

I don't engage in magical thinking.

I don't imagine all kinds of naive and hopeful scenarios that things will continue as they have in the past, with which I comfort myself.

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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.

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Saturday, July 25, 2015 2:02 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN

Quote:
Originally posted by Wishimay:
You must spend hours [.cuddling up next to the bracket button.]

I get that it does make you feel better to try and nick pick every little point. You probably need to understand that every time I see that all I can think is O...C...D.

I dare you, find ONE major point that is the most important of all those things to you and argue it in paragraph form.

'Cause half of those are just nonsense babble, or unimportant details, or desperate attempts to cross-connect things I've said so you can prove me wrong in your own head. I don't even know where to start... It's like you've perfected the whole "baffle them with bullshit" routine.

Somebody on the internet is wrong. About something. Or so she thinks.

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Saturday, July 25, 2015 2:06 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Quote:
Originally posted by Wishimay:

I will not waste my life in worry about things I cannot change.
One person's vote won't change the USA, but one percent of all voters can because the weak link or maybe the hinge or the pivot point for governance is at the primary election where only a small percent of registered voters (10%, 15%) pick the candidates for all political offices.

This weakness in US democracy has been exploited since the days of Thomas Jefferson by the Top One Percent, the people with the most money in the USA. Very clever of them.

Not so clever, the Bottom 90 Percent can't understand why the Top One Percent control the USA. It is because the Bottom does not have the commonsense to vote in the primary elections.

Here come the excuses. There are always naysayers in the Bottom saying “My one vote does not count” and “I've got no time for politics”. The Top One Percent love you for saying that and don't even need to thank naysayers for their unpaid services. Just not voting in primaries serves well the Top 1%.

My excuse is more better.
My state does not allow voters to select the best candidate in any partisan Primary. Only in General Elections, when the Libtards stuff the ballot boxes.

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Saturday, July 25, 2015 10:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:

Somebody on the internet is wrong. About something. Or so she thinks.

And somebody else likes to jump on bandwagons at the last second of a conversation because it's easier then having a conversation.

P.s. I've been gone all day, it's 9:30 and I'm to tired to deal with a group of mindless parrots. Another day maybe...

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Sunday, July 26, 2015 6:08 AM