Serenity layout by TallGuy

Hey, Browncoats!

Ever since a variant of this thread appeared on the FOX (grr. arrgh.) Official Site, I've been scrutinizing the eps I watch (and re-re-re-watch) for agreement between the interior and exterior. My conclusion is that there IS a match. You know these rendering types; they'll sweat for hours on the hidden musculature of a fictional (or extinct) creature, just so THEY know they got it right. Yes, I know, the muscles have a direct bearing on the movement and exterior appearance of the beastie, which would not be the case through the hard carapace of a spacecraft. Still, if I understand the culture correctly, they're not the sorts who would let this go.

Speculations on the psychology of CG artists aside, though, I have looked very carefully at the limited number of screencaps, and at the eps themselves, and have a few notes to share:

The mess hall needn't cover the whole hold, and indeed can't (though it is quite a roomy space, the cozy way it's shot notwithstanding). It lies slightly up the sloping dome sides of the central ("thorax") pod, its floor beginning slightly above the shuttles' berths, and as such would have a smaller footprint than the cargo hold beneath it. As for the roof/hull discrepancy (i.e., the mess hall's roof does not appear to be dome-shaped), Serenity's designers were marvelously aware of the need for hardware (life support, etc) space, which, IMHO, occupies the dome-shaped space between the mess' roof and the outer hull (indeed, we glimpse this in one of those vertical tracking shots in OiS, where Early's eavesdropping from the outside). Also, you can see that the TIE-figher-window-looking skylight is recessed when viewed from the inside.

As for the corridor leading from the mess to the bridge, it needn't be inclined (as if such things need have any meaning in a ship with artificial gravity...but that's another conversation!). Actually, while the deck is parallel with the ship's longitudinal (long) axis, the cieling inclines upward (decent number of stairs up to the bridge, don cha know). If you look at a profile of Serenity (good view on the "sunset" shot of a grounded Serenity from the pilot, located somewhere on this site), you see that the ventral (bottom) portion of the ship's "throat" steps down twice. The first step allows space for that mysterious equipment room belowdecks from the main bridge area (accessed from the corridor through that hatch to port of the bridge staircase). The second "step" in serenity's profile is the space for the crew's berths (below the corridor's floor level, recall).

I would LOVE to see a 3D model of the interior. Actually, I seem to recall glimpsing just that, in OMR. When the chop-shop guys are discussing Serenity as it goes by the first time (the "you got a mechanic's half-awake" conversation), I think you can see a scan (akin to the holo-Imager in Ariel) which gives some fleeting looks at the relationship of interior to exterior. I must have another look at this, but I've never had the heart to stop the episode and break the narrative flow long enough to peer at a frame-by-frame, and can't get the "zoom" on my DVD player to work anyway. Others (e.g., those with DVD ROMs) might have a look and let us know if mine eyes did deceive me here. And maybe post some caps, if they're especially industrious (cf. my "WTD: shiny Serenity Screen-caps" thread...).

Do others agree with me on these rambling observations, or are my notoriously twitchy spatial skills mucking with me again?

Keep flyin'!

Department of Redundancy Department

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Monday, March 24, 2003 11:29 AM

KNIGHTNAVRO

I've been trying to piece together Serenity's layout myself, but I haven't had a lot of success. I'm missing OMR and OIS, which are prpbably the two best episodes for getting an understanding of the layout. It would help out if I knew the dimentions of a few things. For example, how long does everybody think Serenity is?

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Monday, March 24, 2003 11:41 AM

Knight;
I'm really bad at estimating such things. A good sense of scale could be had from looking at Jayne's tiny frame (and doesn't *that* sound like an oxymoron!) dangling from Serenity's "bomb-bay" doors in TTJ.

Department of Redundancy Department

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Monday, March 24, 2003 12:05 PM

Whoop. Just went back and looked at the screen from the chop-shop in OMR. No interior layout. Just some flashes of structural members, etc., with no depiction of interior partitions, floors, or the like. Looks like we need those 3D models after all.

Department of Redundancy Department

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Monday, March 24, 2003 12:07 PM

KNIGHTNAVRO

Actually, I've been basing my estimates on the shots of Jayne, Mal, and Zoe in front of Serenity in the teaser of Train Job and then comparing "known" sections to unknown sections in exterior shots. The thing is I don't trust my own estimates and want to see what other people are coming up with for length, width, height, length of the enginer pods...whatever.

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Monday, March 24, 2003 4:22 PM

Knight;
A bit of caution: It does not appear that all exterior shots with people in them are quite to scale. Most appear to be right, but there is one shot in OiS (BTW, some relatively low-res, RealPlayer copies can be found at http://versaphile.com/download/firefly.html Or else, I think TRS-80 might have a few DVD sets left), in which River drifts back from Early's ship, where it really looks like she and Mal are too large with respect to Serenity. In short, try to base your scale on a mental composite of as many shots as you can, and don't rely too heavily on any one shot. Just FYI.

Keep Flyin'

Department of Redundancy Department

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Monday, March 24, 2003 5:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Noocyte:
Knight;
A bit of caution: It does not appear that all exterior shots with people in them are quite to scale. Most appear to be right, but there is one shot in OiS, in which River drifts back from Early's ship, where it really looks like she and Mal are too large with respect to Serenity.

Ah HA! Actually, on looking at it, this may be the shot that makes it all work!

Yes, I think Serenity may be smaller than we think she is.

Looking at Mal and River in that shot, they look like they're about the right size for the mess room. And I can also see that the mess doesn't cover as much of the lower deck as I thought.

Looking from the mess to the cockpit, you can see the the stairs to the cockpit are about one deck higher than the mess. This also fits with the outside shot in OiS. The cockpit extends aft a considerable piece from the windows.

I'm going to start compiling some comparisons over the next week. But now I have hope. (Although now the shuttles are looking awfully itty bitty... We'll burn that bridge later...)

Deck plans! I want deck plans! I'm a reformed Trekie for crying out loud! (Reformed Trekkie is kinda like saying Former Marine.)

Ok, I admit it. One of the biggest tragedies of Firefly being cancelled is that I'll never get my toy of Serenity to play with!

Bill
"We all know I'm the funny one."
"You ain't all that funny."

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Monday, March 24, 2003 6:16 PM

KAYTHRYN

This kind of figuring sounds like it might include some form of math. Leave me out. Why can't we just let some things be kind of flexible- just enjoy the moment. My guess is that not all views of Serenity match up. In some scenes she might appear bigger (The train job shot where Serenity was hovering near the edge of the cliff to pick up Jayne, Zoë, and Mal) and smaller in others (In Objects in Space where River floats down into Mal’s open arms).

-------------------------------------
JAYNE: What? She killed 'em with mathematics.
What else could it have been?

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Monday, March 24, 2003 7:25 PM

SLOWSMURF

Well, its pretty easy to figure out most of the length. Just mentally put the 5 topfloor sets(which might all be one big set, though I dont' think we ever see ALL 5 parts together, just 3-4 each way)

Those are relatively easy to get the scale.(not that I know, but if you are good at this ;))

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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 5:18 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SlowSmurf:
Well, its pretty easy to figure out most of the length. Just mentally put the 5 topfloor sets(which might all be one big set, though I dont' think we ever see ALL 5 parts together, just 3-4 each way)

My understanding is that they built all the lower decks as one set, and all the upper decks as another. That way you can go play in them with all kinds of shiny camera moves. (Note the use of present tense. I'm an optimist, I am!)

Now if someone could lay hands on those blueprints...

Bill
"We all know I'm the funny one."
"You ain't all that funny."

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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 6:02 AM

Hey! I just built a simhouse of Serenity. Actually, I built two, had to erase the first one due to game problems. The second one is bigger, so I did a better version of the serenity dining area, but I think I liked the look of the first one better. And I'm basing it on what little I know of the ship from watching (no math skills or serious extrapolation), also fitting it into the confines of the game (only 2 floors). I like it okay, although I'm sure it could be improved. My major annoyance, of course, is that the Sims only allows 8 sims per house, and Serenity houses 9 humans.

keep flyin' (Deg Deg)

Quote:
Originally posted by Alexandria:
I would definatly be interested in seeing a 3d layout of Serenity. I've been looking all over for one (I want to build a house for my Sims based on Serenity).

-------------------------------------------------Postholer: For digging holes for posts

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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 6:23 AM

KAYTHRYN

Quote:
Originally posted by Riverside:
My major annoyance, of course, is that the Sims only allows 8 sims per house, and Serenity houses 9 humans.

Pretend River is still in cryo. Maybe Simon was kidnapped again. Perhaps Inara left to become some rich dukes personal companion. Zoë and Wash could be off at some nude beach for a well deserved vacation. Kick one of them out and then it can account of their being only 8 crew members on board.

How were you able to make “Serenity” on Sims anyway???

-------------------------------------
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
Aristotle

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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 6:50 AM

Quote:
Ah HA! Actually, on looking at it, this may be the shot that makes it all work!

Yes, I think Serenity may be smaller than we think she is.

Looking at Mal and River in that shot, they look like they're about the right size for the mess room. And I can also see that the mess doesn't cover as much of the lower deck as I thought.

I just looked again at that shot, and I fear your A-HA may be a mite premature. If they were supposed to be that size in relation to the ship, then one would have to stoop over to get into the mess hall (which one doesn't), and, though you had deferred this topic, I must point out that, per that (LOVELY, BTW)shot, there is no way one could stand upright in the shuttles. Indeed, given that the mess hall windows are above head-high, one's feet would have to be flush with the entrance to the port shuttle if we were to take that shot as accurate. Plus, there would be no room in Serenity's "neck" for the crew quarters (unless they were like those Japanese coffin hotels...which they're not).

Try this: Go to the same shot, and look at Mal. Imagine that his head comes up only to where his waist is in the frame. That, IMHO, is a more realistic size factor. It would work for the architecture of the bridge, it would make the cargo hold more than 1.5-2 storeys tall (which we know it is), and it would resolve the shuttle issue handily.

Quote:
Deck plans! I want deck plans! I'm a reformed Trekie for crying out loud! (Reformed Trekkie is kinda like saying Former Marine.)

Ok, I admit it. One of the biggest tragedies of Firefly being cancelled is that I'll never get my toy of Serenity to play with!

Right there with you, TallGuy, on all three scores. I'd heard mumblings about blueprints with the press kit, but have never laid eyes on any scans. I was toying (pardon pun) with the idea of scratch-building a model of Serenity, but lack the skills and workspace. She'd look mighty shiny on my desk, though

!

Lemme know what you think upon revisiting that shot; I really do think I'm on target here. Hell, we must allow even the mighty Zoic Studios a small error here and there!

Gotta run to work (oh yeah, THAT).

Keep Flyin'

Department of Redundancy Department

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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 8:46 AM

Actually, I left out Book. My intent is to create him outside the ship and just use a teleporter to have him there all the time. A lot of my stuff has been visitor-enabled, even beds, so he'll probably stick around for quite awhile.
I've been having a great time designing downtown areas for this neighborhood, too. The podunk town, the fancy Core area, and then the middle ground, a little core, a little frontier, w/ a generous dash of asian influence. Not done yet...but if you're interested, I can post them to my website when I'm finished, so you can have a look. Still decorating Serenity, and have started on a downtown bathhouse. :)

Quote:
Originally posted by Riverside:
My major annoyance, of course, is that the Sims only allows 8 sims per house, and Serenity houses 9 humans.

Pretend River is still in cryo. Maybe Simon was kidnapped again. Perhaps Inara left to become some rich dukes personal companion. Zoë and Wash could be off at some nude beach for a well deserved vacation. Kick one of them out and then it can account of their being only 8 crew members on board.

How were you able to make “Serenity” on Sims anyway???

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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 11:52 AM

MANIACNUMBERONE

You have intrigued me. I have started working on a layout. If it works out, I will post a link to it.

----------------------------------
Who's winning?
I don't know, they don't seem to be playing by any civilized rules that I know.
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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 12:27 PM

TALRIUS

Shiny!

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Tuesday, March 25, 2003 12:44 PM

ALEXANDRIA

My major annoyance, of course, is that the Sims only allows 8 sims per house, and Serenity houses 9 humans.

I know! i just pretended that Jayne got spaced (i was pissed at him for "Ariel" at the time) and left him off. Now that I've forgiven him (which didn't take long because he is so frellin' lovable). I think what I'm going to do is give Nara her own place right next door.
I love that sombody else is doing this!

--------
Postholer: for digging holes for posts

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Wednesday, March 26, 2003 8:22 PM

Okay, revealing quite a bit of ignorance here on the subject of Sims, but here goes...

Assuming one could make a Serenity Sim house, what would be the purpose/payoff? In short, what would be fun about that? Let me stress again, that I am familiar with the Sims in ony the most general sense (like Sim City, but with communties of individuals, varying in given personal and social parameters, striving to improve along certain indices of success from basic sustenance to social/interpersonal valences, yes?). Please let me know if I'm missing something fundamental here. Never played, and don't know anyone who has. So, no challenge, just curiosity; what's the appeal?

Also, how sophisticated/detailed could one make the Serenity interior? What kind of 3D modelling can be brought to bear here? It would seem to me that even the most rudimentary configuration would require some fairly serious flexibility in design capability (?)

Yadda-yadda. Must find suitable bribe for ME and/or Zoic to release "all the specs and diagrrrams!"

Keep Flyink!

Department of Redundancy Department

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Thursday, March 27, 2003 6:36 AM

Okay. Well, there might be no fun in making a Serenity Sim House if you were a fan of Firefly but you find The Sims incredibly boring. However, for many people one of the chief attractions of The Sims is the creative process. Also, the idea that the purpose of the Sims is to strive to improve is slightly mistaken. In the original The Sims game (not including the new PS2 version or the online version), there is no way to win. You don't get points or rewards of any kind really. You build your little houses, create your little people, and then you have them live thier little pretend lives. You have control over them to some extent, but they also have some autonomy, from which actions arise based on their personality (which is divided up into groups of varying points), their intrests (ditto), and their needs (again, although this group is more fluid). However, for many of us Sim fanatics, one of the reasons the game remains fun and interesting, is the many creative people out there making new objects, skins, walls, floors, hacked objects and independent editing programs for The Sims. There are limitations on the 3D environments, but I personally have hundreds of skins, walls, and objects that I have downloaded, so a lot of variety in those parameters are possible. I am not a creator of any of these things, as I lack the skill, so my Serenity house is an object of interpretation, rather than exact copy, because I have to find representations of what I want the ship and it's environs, and inhabitants to look like. I have heard the Sims described like this, it is actually a 2D environment, with 3D people moving within it. Not sure if that is exactly true, but perhaps it is. Objects have only 4 angles and cannot be placed diagonally. Buildings in the Sims can only be one or two stories high.
Here are some examples of what some fans of Farscape have created.

http://www.junipersun.org/scapers.htm
http://www.farscape-one.de/Sims/index.html

and of Lord of the Rings

http://www.geocities.com/skinsforsims/index.html
http://www.mj-holmes.com/LOTRSkins.htm

Actually, I know of several skin or object makers who enjoy creating for the Sims so much, they don't really even play the game anymore, just create for it.

Okay, enough of my fangirl babbling. Hope this long-winded answer helped. Personally I would love a good floorplan of Serenity...it would certainly improve my Sims Serenity interpretation.

Quote:
Originally posted by Noocyte:
Okay, revealing quite a bit of ignorance here on the subject of Sims, but here goes...

Assuming one could make a Serenity Sim house, what would be the purpose/payoff? In short, what would be fun about that? Let me stress again, that I am familiar with the Sims in ony the most general sense (like Sim City, but with communties of individuals, varying in given personal and social parameters, striving to improve along certain indices of success from basic sustenance to social/interpersonal valences, yes?). Please let me know if I'm missing something fundamental here. Never played, and don't know anyone who has. So, no challenge, just curiosity; what's the appeal?

Also, how sophisticated/detailed could one make the Serenity interior? What kind of 3D modelling can be brought to bear here? It would seem to me that even the most rudimentary configuration would require some fairly serious flexibility in design capability (?)

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Thursday, March 27, 2003 7:07 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Noocyte:
Must find suitable bribe for ME and/or Zoic to release "all the specs and diagrrrams!"

I'd be in on THAT bribe!

Bill
"We all know I'm the funny one."
"You ain't all that funny."

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Thursday, March 27, 2003 8:22 AM

Finding myself always confused when watching the show about where everybody was going to and coming from and not really sure where everything was, I came up with this quick and dirty floor map.
Please NOTE: It is not to scale, and not even close to completely accurate. It does however give a person a general idea of how everything is set up. I didn't spend much time on it (and it shows) but hopefully it may help out somebody someday (it already helped me with my MUD).

here the link:

edited to say: Umm, I though it was a link, I guess it's the pic, Haken, please don't be mad at me..... I'm dumb

-The SpAz

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Thursday, March 27, 2003 12:01 PM

SLOWSMURF

Thats painfully simplistic, but theres no huge errors. Just things like the placement of the shuttles which aren't quite right.(more near the end of the cargo bay)

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Thursday, March 27, 2003 12:58 PM

Yes, very simplistic, just enough for me to get where's and how's. Unfortunately there are a few things I'm not clear on from watching the show, like where all the stairs in the cargo bay go, are there two entrances to the "north" hallway from the cargo bay? Where does the fuel go? Where exactly are the passenger dorms in relation to the engine? It's hard to ge an idea of how long Serenity is from the exterior shots, and I'm wondering if there's enough room for the common area and passenger dorms aft of the cargo bay. Uhh, too many questions. Who's working on building the scale model again? You'd think they'd have plans somewhere or a 3-d model that included outside and inside, something, anything...

Harumph...

-The SpAz

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Friday, March 28, 2003 5:52 AM

ANND

For the most part, I understand the layout. The piece that doesn't seem to fit to me is the Engine room. From the inside, it's on the "3rd" floor but on the outside, it seems to be on the "2nd" floor.

Anyone else have a problem with this?

Ann

Some people juggle geese.

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Friday, March 28, 2003 7:02 AM

From what I can tell, you can look all the way down from the bottom of the stairs leading up to the bridge clear through the dining area and into the engine room. While the cargo bay may be two stories tall, there's nothing else (that I know of) on the second floor, basically making the first floor really tall, with serenity only having two distinct floors (that's also what I gather from the set descriptions). Does this answer your question?

-The SpAz

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Friday, March 28, 2003 8:02 AM

The more I read this thread, the more I think my understanding of the layout is entirely wrong.

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Friday, March 28, 2003 8:16 AM

ANND

Quote:
Originally posted by Werespaz:
From what I can tell, you can look all the way down from the bottom of the stairs leading up to the bridge clear through the dining area and into the engine room. While the cargo bay may be two stories tall, there's nothing else (that I know of) on the second floor, basically making the first floor really tall, with serenity only having two distinct floors (that's also what I gather from the set descriptions). Does this answer your question?

-The SpAz

Right, but if you look at the outside of the ship, where's the engine room? Is it inside the glowy part (the firely for Serenity)? In that case, It doesn't seem to make sense as being aft of the common room, I think it should be down a level (which it's clearly not).

Ann

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Friday, March 28, 2003 9:33 AM

After looking at an exterior shot, I see what you mean. I'm guessing it's actually not supposed to be in the glowy part, but it would seem that even it it wasn't the rotary part of the engine that's actually in the engine room itself would have to line up with the central part of the glowy thingy. (sorry for the overtechnical terms) Unless the dining area is much bigger than it looks, but that would but it on the same level as the shuttles, which doesn't work either. I dunno, I need to see a good full side view to totally understand.

-The SpAz

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Friday, March 28, 2003 11:23 AM

I'm working on sets of screen shots to try and line much of this stuff up.

I never figured that the engine room was in the center of the spinner. It's definitely on the upper deck. It's even higher than the mess room since there is a step up. (Well, the interconnecting corridor is. Now that I think on it there's probably a corresponding step down into the engine room.)

One of my other questions is, where does the ladder in the center of the bridge go? In Our Mrs. Reynolds someone says Saffron sealed "both entrances". So it obviously comes out somewhere else, but where? My guess is something that runs between the four crew berths and comes out on the upper deck of the cargo bay. But I don't recall ever seeing it.

Bill
"We all know I'm the funny one."
"You ain't all that funny."

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Friday, March 28, 2003 11:29 AM

Yes, that part has perplexed me too, but I think I've got it figured out. First, there are step leading up from the crew berths to the bridge, and if you look closeley you'll see a door next to the stairs. I beleive there's a scene in one of the eps that shows that door open with what look like more control panels similar to the one that Wash sits at. I don't know what that room is for, maybe it's some kind of navigation computer equipment room or something along those lines. Doesn't seem like many people go in or out of there, so there can't be anything to important there. I'll have to watch OMR again and look very closely, maybe I missed something.

-The SpAz

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Sunday, February 8, 2004 11:14 AM

GAIDHEAL

To put some speculation on Serenity's interior to rest, I've constructed some fairly accurate floor plans. These are based on screen-caps from all episodes and only represent Serenity's interior (the real world touchy feely stuff). I leave the CGI exterior to Zoic. I can only assume that they based their ship creation off the shooting set blueprints. I've left both images large to allow viewing of some of the finer details. I'm currently working on the side view connecting all deck levels.

Any questions about or discrepancies on these plans, please let me know.

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Sunday, February 8, 2004 11:25 AM