NEVER is a big word... by XeroGravity

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

NEVER is a big word...

POSTED BY: XEROGRAVITY
UPDATED: Tuesday, November 8, 2005 11:52
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 8812
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Tuesday, October 18, 2005 1:00 AM

Goodbye Firefly. Thanks for Serenity.

It's over. Whedon is bigtime, the necessary funds were expended to shut-up the ravenous hordes of fans who howled for more. Give us wonder woman. give us whateverelse.

Was nice while it lasted. Someone call up that guy from Chud.com. He was right.

Paycheck... incoming. Firefly, outgoing.

XG

Mp divj yjomh sd htsboyu, yjr "Rstyj-yjsy-esd" kidy divld.

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Tuesday, October 18, 2005 1:11 AM

PATTYOBRIAN

I just hope he packs that DVD with lots of special features.

"...If you can't do summin' good... do summin' right."

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Tuesday, October 18, 2005 2:28 AM

UNCHARTEDOUTLAW

Someone wanna tell me where never was even mentioned?

http://unchartedoutlaw.blogspot.com - blog
http://firefly.firehead.org/norcalriviera - videos
http://www.cafepress.com/norcalriviera - store
http://www.fireflytalk.com - the new damn podcast

River: "So we'll integrate non-progressional evolution theory with God's creation of Eden. Eleven inherent metaphoric parallels already there. Eleven. Important number. Prime number. One goes into the house of eleven eleven times, but always comes out one. Noah's ark is a problem."

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Tuesday, October 18, 2005 3:51 AM

FOLLOWMAL

"I refuse to give up. I can't." - Joss Whedon on bringing back Firefly.

Come on XeroGravity... this series has been unpredictable and Joss is ALWAYS unpredictable.

Let's not give up hope entirely....

FollowMal

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Tuesday, October 18, 2005 3:58 AM

CALLMESERENITY

We're Browncoats. We never give up.

Serenity, First Officer of Destiny

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Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:11 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

I am thinking that Xerogravity was being flippant, at least that is my hope.

Personally my stance is to never say never where it concerns Firefly/Serenity or Joss. Plenty of folk said we would not get a DVD & we did. Even more said we would not get the movie & we did. Plenty of merchandise floating around when the detractors said we were done.

Nope. I ain't giving up.

__________________________________________

"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one."

Richmond, VA & surrounding area Firefly Fans:

http://tv.groups.yahoo.com/group/richmondbrowncoats/

http://www.richmondbrowncoats.org

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Tuesday, October 18, 2005 5:23 AM

THEREALME

Quote:
Originally posted by XeroGravity:
Goodbye Firefly. Thanks for Serenity.

It's over. Whedon is bigtime, the necessary funds were expended to shut-up the ravenous hordes of fans who howled for more. Give us wonder woman. give us whateverelse.

Was nice while it lasted. Someone call up that guy from Chud.com. He was right.

Paycheck... incoming. Firefly, outgoing.

XG

Mp divj yjomh sd htsboyu, yjr "Rstyj-yjsy-esd" kidy divld.

Well, perhaps you are of the opinion that Joss should work on nothing but Firefly for the rest of his life? That he should turn down lucrative deals for other work?

I am happy for him that he got Wonder Woman, and I am eagerly awaiting it.

Perhaps we will never see more Firefly. Perhaps we will. But I know that Joss loves it, and if he can, he will find a way to do it.

Someday. Somehow.

But that is no reason for him to give up all other pursuits. ESPECIALLY since (beyond all reason) it doesn't seem to be the blockbuster that I thought it was going to be.

The Real Me, First Officer of the Sereni-Tree

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 12:21 AM

PATTYOBRIAN

I wish Joss the best in whatever he does.
But I will continue do my part to keep fighting for Firefly/Serenity. Everyday, those stats for the movie include a ticket from me. It may not be much, but I'm staying aboard whether or not we can "pull up".

By the way...
UNCHARTEDOUTLAW, those videos are great! Who sings the Sundown song?

Also, I'm an idiot...
Let me fix that quote of mine.

"...If you can't do summin SMART... do summin right."

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 1:14 AM

CALLIOPE79

I want Joss to do other projects, and I'm looking forward to Wonder Woman, Goners, and whatever else he has up his sleeve... but I'm not going to give up on this 'verse.

As long as we keep fighting... Serenity keeps flying... and I'm not ready to quit the fight. I may never be, who knows? We've done it before, against ALL odds and I would hate to see us quit now.

I'm in this for the long haul...

~*~ Cheryl
The Nathan Fillion Archives:
http://www.apocalypse-monthly.com/nathan
CafePress Shops:
http://www.cafepress.com/ffserenityflan
http://www.cafepress.com/nfarchives

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 1:18 AM

BROWNCOATFAN1

Quote:
Originally posted by XeroGravity:
Goodbye Firefly. Thanks for Serenity.

It's over. Whedon is bigtime, the necessary funds were expended to shut-up the ravenous hordes of fans who howled for more. Give us wonder woman. give us whateverelse.

what do you mean its over? what kind of browncoat are you? i heard that joss was making a second move.

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 1:23 AM

ENGINEANGEL

I agree with all you travelers. Don't give up, people!!! They are signed on for two more movies if this one WORLDWIDE can make back the money they spent to make the movie. That means DVD sales as well. The numbers on the main page of this site are just the US numbers, so don't lose hope. USA has signed on to air Serenity in 2008 and SciFi might restart the series - it's just a money problem. There are soooo many options open to us right now!!!! Not to mention that god won't let us give up because we are so ... darn ... pretty. Come on, look at our chisled jaws!!!

keep flyin'
EngineAngel

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 5:08 AM

XEROGRAVITY

It's kinda hard not to wanna give up. He's got his fingers into (1) Wonder Woman ~ a movie that will likely have a decent take at the box office, enough to warrant a sequel, and (2) Goners. I have no doubt anything Whedon dips his fingers into will be entertaining, superbly done on every level, and likely successful.

BUT... let's assume 2 (or maybe 3) movies later his time is free to refocus on Firefly. By then, how many years will it have been (from now till then)? Think about it and you'll come to the same conclusion as me. A long damned time. That will likely be the death of the show I (and many of you) love.

Whedon built a cast of personalities I couldn't help but fall in love with, and a storyline that kept me totally glued to the screen. I've friggin watched the whole firefly series 3 times already. Not to mention 5 times viewing Serenity. Last count, 5 converts. 5 converts growing in enthusiasm and devotion. Myself, and those whom I've converted need more Firefly. Nothing worse than a story that hasn't been told thru to the end. Serenity only made me want more of it. Not some damned sequel. A return of the show.

He has proven himself to be that rare storyteller who can really tell a good story. He was wrongly robbed of the right to finish telling that story. The franchise that should be, is quickly becoming the franchise that "could've been". Universal OWNS the movie rights, and they also own SciFi channel. Why can't they re-air the episodes of the show during weekend primetime hours on SciFi channel where many will see it (and thus be converted)? If they did, the movie would bounce out another 8-10 million dollar weekend. They could, but they won't. Whedon is raw pure talent, and they want him to do their bidding. Forget this Firefly crap, we have other plans for you. I believe they are trying to kill off this show and refocus this fanbase.

If Whedon can't muster the determination to see it through with the dedication of a Lucas or a Roddenberry (whom he clearly surpasses in talent on both accounts), then why should I continue to pin my hopes on him? They both faced similar obstacles of people who wanted them to fail. Yet both (on the strength of a fanatical fanbase) pushed forward and succeeded beyond the wildest imaginations of their detractors. He could totally smoke the both of them in taking what to me is clearly the best work of his life, his one true calling (our beloved Firefly), and push it forward with a laser-like focus. I think the allure of being a hotshot movie director is about to drive away his hardcore fanbase. Success like his always undermines the talent.

XG

No such thing as gravity. The "Earth-that-was" just sucks.

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 10:52 AM

ENGINEANGEL

Quote:

He has proven himself to be that rare storyteller who can really tell a good story. He was wrongly robbed of the right to finish telling that story. The franchise that should be, is quickly becoming the franchise that "could've been". Universal OWNS the movie rights, and they also own SciFi channel. Why can't they re-air the episodes of the show during weekend primetime hours on SciFi channel where many will see it (and thus be converted)? If they did, the movie would bounce out another 8-10 million dollar weekend. They could, but they won't. Whedon is raw pure talent, and they want him to do their bidding. Forget this Firefly crap, we have other plans for you. I believe they are trying to kill off this show and refocus this fanbase.

And i believe you are being just a little paranoid. Believe me, i would know. I've been paranoid my whole life, I am a veteran of paranoia. SciFi shows Firefly on Fridays at a good time and they wouldn't want to move shows around if there is a large amount of people who watch them. Also, they have had a marathon of Firefly before.

Quote:

If Whedon can't muster the determination to see it through with the dedication of a Lucas or a Roddenberry (whom he clearly surpasses in talent on both accounts), then why should I continue to pin my hopes on him? They both faced similar obstacles of people who wanted them to fail. Yet both (on the strength of a fanatical fanbase) pushed forward and succeeded beyond the wildest imaginations of their detractors.

Okay, here I get seriously annoyed and kind of mad. Joss has more determination than anyone. After the series got cancelled, he vowed to the cast that he would find some way for the Firefly Verse to go on. He went to every channel he could think of, asking them to take up the show (and if it wasn't for the big budget Firefly required, i'm pretty sure SciFi would have kept the series going). He pitched ideas to anyone that would listen, and finally after 1 or 2 years of persisting, he pitched to Universal and got a movie deal (a trilogy if we don't lose hope and don't give up). Now we have our Verse back and if we stay determined, we could get 2 more movies and maybe our series back!!! So don't don't give up and don't tell Joss off. We helped bring about this movie as well, but only by staying determined ourselves and not losing hope.

keep flyin'
EngineAngel

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 12:03 PM

GRAVY

Being a new fan of Firefly - saw it for the first time 2 weeks ago, and have watched it 2 times more since then - I haven't been there for all the up's and down's but I just want to comend all of you Browncoats for being so loyal and sticking with the show. I know already I'll be a life long fan of the show and I'll do whatever I can to pitch in.

I live in Sweden, so Serenity hasn't even premiered here yet but I'll do whatever I can to get a few more people in to the movie theatres come November. Granted, the Swedish market is kind of small-ish (insignificant would be a better word) but I'll put up flyers all over town and do all kinds of guerilla acts just to make a few more people get hooked on Firefly/Serenity.

Ok, disregarding the enormous cheese-factor of my post I'm just trying to say that the fan base is still growing and every ticket, every DVD sale counts. I know my 2 weeks of following the show isn't exactly awe inspiring but it's really sad to see a lot of Browncoats losing faith :P

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 12:16 PM

SEVREN

Finally, some people with something positive to say. No offense XG, but lighten up just a little bit. How hard is it to stay positive? It costs nothing to stay optimistic. It costs too much to be negative and pessimistic (SP?). New fans like myself reading these posts will see messages like yours and ask "why bother" and move on to something else. Everyone who helped make this movie come about didn't do it by thinking all was lost. Nothin's written in stone, so enjoy what we've been given, and keep hoping and pushing for things to happen. Once Joss' (did I use the correct grammer there?) movie career takes off, he will have even more influence in hollywood, and that bodes well for the crew and 'verse of Firefly. Let's just keep moving forward, and stop being so negative!!

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 12:26 PM

MATWANG

I don't know if I can be too sad if it doesn't come back as a series.

I couldn't handle it being cancelled a SECOND TIME... and they probably would cancel it.

I have to tell you, as a VINTAGE FIREFLY FAN -- I still remember the day they canned it -- December 13th, I think it was, 2002. I got very drunk and was absolutely miserable.

Hell, frickin HBO cancelled CARNIVALE, for crying out loud!

Those BASTARDS!!!

(Go Joss!)

MaTwang

Carnivale -- it's not a show, it's a drug.

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 12:30 PM

SPIKEANDJEZEBEL

It has been reported many times that if a sequel is greenlit, Tim Minear may direct, with Joss producing and probably co-writing. There's no reason to assume that a second movie couldn't be made even if Joss is directing something else. After all, this is the man who oversaw three TV series at the same time.

"I have never understood why it should be necessary to become irrational in order to prove that you care. Or indeed, why it should be necessary to prove it at all." -Kerr Avon

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 1:07 PM

MAXGREMLIN

|Okay guys.

Hers is a little good news.

1. Serenity just climbed back into the top 10 in the US yesterday. May not make a huge difference, but it is something.

2. The Firefly DVD series is currently ranked number 5 overall at Amazon.com on its list of top DVD sellers. |Its ranked number 2 in the tv series category. |Not bad for a dvd collection released almost 2 years ago. Those are new fans buying the collection. |Probaly converted from watching the movie.

3. There are at least a dozen countries that haven't even premiered Serenity yet. The only other countries showing it are Portugal, the UK (#1 there), Australia, Russia and as of today France. Remember that cruddy Michael Bay film The Island only made 35 mil here in the US |(with a budget of a 120 mil). |In foreign sales it make like 125 mil. The final tally ain't in yet.

4. We have caused a big stir around this film. Alot of people have seen the film that would not have seen it otherwise if not for us. |

Plus, |I believe we alot more fans out there then we realize. We, along with all the critcs who gave the film such glowing reviews, caused a real stir. |Maybe it wasn't enough to get people to go to the movies during a time when people don't typically go to the movies anyway. But when Serenity comes out on |HBO or Video on Demand or shows up at the video store, people are going to think |"|Hey, thats that film all the critics were going on about." And they'll give it a try.

Thats one of the easiest things about being a Browncoat. All we have to really do is lead people to the 'Verse and let|Joss and company do the rest. This stuff sells itself. We just have to show people the way.

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 1:17 PM

MAXGREMLIN

Gravy....

Don't feel bad just because Sweden is a small film market. Believe me when I tell you EVERY TICKET COUNTS!!!!

|Put as many people into that theater as you can. We may be at the end of the road here in America so its up to you guys living in other countries to help keep our ship flying. Do whatever you can (within the law of course) to lead people to the 'Verse. After that its up to Joss and company to do the rest. And thats all it takes.

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 1:59 PM

11THHOUR

Kudos to the folks keeping the positive energy. We gotta take the long view here. Firefly/Serenity is building a bigger fanbase, slow but steady.

For those who read Joss's recent post as a resignation, or his moving on to other projects as abandoning the 'verse, well that's a load of cow manure! Part of Joss's association with Universal is to be involved with other projects beyond Serenity. Joss has been pouring his heart, mind and body into bringing back Firefly, and in making Serenity. This has been a years' long road and he did what he set out to do. The guy needs a break for a while. As much as he loves and is dedicated to the 'verse, it's time to step away for a while and work on something else.

Serenity is turned loose now to make it's way in the world. The momentum will keep building. All indications are that it will be making back its cost and then some... especially once the DVD is released. I tend to think that Serenity is establishing the broad fan base that will be ready for the future projects. A Serenity movie sequel, a mini series, or whatever, will enjoy a much faster profit because of the road paved by the first Serenity.

I'm as sure now that Serenity will continue as I was at the end of 2002 that Firefly would somehow continue.

11th Hour

________________________________________________

"Because teenage pranks are fun when you're about to die!" - Hoban Washburne

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 2:12 PM

CUB

Quote:
Originally posted by maxgremlin:
|Okay guys.

Hers is a little good news.

2. The Firefly DVD series is currently ranked number 5 overall at Amazon.com. Those are new fans buying the collection. |Probaly converted from watching the movie.

Or (like me) buying the DVD to see what the series was about before going to see the movie, and then finding out that the TV series was better.

And here's a positive point No. 5: Firefly is now the highest-rated show on the Sci-Fi Channel.

---

"If wishes were horses, we'd all be eatin' steak."

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 2:29 PM

JADEHAND

spikeandjezebel wrote:
Wednesday, October 19, 2005 12:30

Quote:
.It has been reported many times that if a sequel is greenlit, Tim Minear may direct,..

Yea Tim, that means no one else will die right?

Fun. I hope that Serenity moving back into the top 10 keeps her in the theatre a bit longer here. The market outside of the US is doing well. I trust the Browncoats there and the intelligent folk that have never heard of Firefly or Serenity who happen to find it, like so many of our newer members here. Serenity needs to do $80 million Globally, With DVD sales included? We have nearly 1/3 of that in the US Box Office already and people are worried? I'm not arrogant enough to believe the onus is solely on us to make Universal's goal.
......losing train of thought......I think we're in good shape, that won't stop me from going to see it again though. But, I'll see it again because it's sooo good and I want to see it again, not because "I have to save it."
Big thanks to everyone on cast and crew. I can hardly wait to see what happens next.
Cheers,
JadeHand

"You did what's right."
"Coming from you, that means....almost nothing."

Visit WWW.Marillion.Com for a better way to live
"Dreaming the dream that only the sleepless know."

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 2:54 PM

DONCOAT

Quote:
Originally posted by Cub:
And here's a positive point No. 5: Firefly is now the highest-rated show on the Sci-Fi Channel.

This just might be the most significant statement that's been made in this entire thread.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Ain't about you, Jayne. It's about what they need.

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 3:10 PM

CAPTAINCASPIAN

from my experience with the industry most people do what Joss did.. Yes he probably is throwing the Firefly/Serenity project on the backburner but i think we'll see more.. Maybe no more of the show but i believe another movie..

As much as i really want to see Firefly back on the air, you can't blame him for taking other opportunities.. i mean he already knows what its like to have a hit tv series and run with it for countless seasons.. maybe he just doesnt want to do it again.. im happy for what little he did give of Firefly.. I wish there was more but such is life.. People come up with fantastic ideas and talk like its their brain child and then forget about it when something with a few more zero's behind it pops up on the radar..

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Wednesday, October 19, 2005 7:01 PM

PATTYOBRIAN

All I can say is...
I didn't make it to theater today to see Serenity. I missed a day. Like most, I keep going because I love the Verse. And of course, because every ticket counts. As long as it's at the theaters... that's where I have to be. It definitely feels incomplete. But it will never be the same for me. Not one series/movie has meant this much to me. It was a straight-shot through the vain... instant addiction! I will always hold a place dear for our BDH's and Joss. And all of you. We're all one BDFamily.
Keep Flyin'!

"...If you can't do summin smart... do summin right."

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Friday, October 21, 2005 6:37 AM

XEROGRAVITY

CaptainCaspian... most people in the industry "do what Joss did" when it comes to making good scifi. They also always end up on the ash-heap of directors making forgettable B-films of the most subpar quality.

2 people come to mind when I think of this scenario. Lucas and Roddenberry.

What idiots they were. How dare them not abandon their scifi brainchild for a more practical pursuit. Think of what they could have done with their film career if they'd have only had the common sense of a bug, and abandoned that silly scifi garbage. They could have produced epic tearjerkers that touch the heart. 12 Angry Men and a Baby.

Whedon won't make their mistake. He's bigtime now.

XG

No such thing as gravity. The "Earth-that-was" just sucks.

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Thursday, November 3, 2005 3:53 AM

CAPTAINCASPIAN

you cant blame him for wanting more money.. its how things work.. but i have hope that hell come back and make more serenity films.. i mean its not a Joss project either.. he did come up with the idea but it takes more than one person to make a hit..

Just dont give up on it.. Maybe this is the end but its better to be optimistic.. The show and Movie may be B list but its still amazing just like a lot of other cult classics out there..

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Thursday, November 3, 2005 10:16 AM

EMPTY

Quote:
Originally posted by CallMeSerenity:
We're Browncoats. We never give up.

Serenity, First Officer of Destiny

DAMN SKIPPY - we dont give up - we'll be back.

ALSO more of my charity spreading endevours...sorry once again to break up discussion but please help the post pals have a great Xmas; links in my signature

Haken needs a new development system. Donate.
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=5&t=3283

BE A SHINY POST PAL-Make it a Browncoat Christmas, http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=14527&m=200333#200333
FOR INFO ON HOW TO HELP
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--I INVENTED THE SPECIAL HELL!

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Thursday, November 3, 2005 11:11 AM

JAYTEE

I won't give up hope that someday the series will be resurrected but with Joss busy on other things and the more time goes by it seems less likely it will have all the original cast and probably not all the original writers that gave it the style it had. Joss is now working on Wonder Woman and I'm glad Hollywood is finally taking his creative genius seriously. I just hope that whoever he casts in the lead role has as much serious cleavage as Linda Carter does.

Jaytee

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Thursday, November 3, 2005 11:34 AM

QUEENOFTHENORTH

Speaking as a writer myself (who is completely in awe of Joss, I am not worthy, etc.) I don't believe Joss will ever give up on his baby. A writer doesn't give up on a world and characters near and dear to their heart. Sometimes it's good to take a step back for a while and move on to something else. You let the story ferment in your head and when you come back to it, it's that much fresher and more incredible. And I'm sure that's what Joss is going to do. We're all gonna be blown away by whatever he does next.

I give to you the Seeker of Serenity, the Valkyrie Warrior, the Gourmet Cook and the Truth Scoper.

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Friday, November 4, 2005 5:30 PM

XEROGRAVITY

I love that all of you love the storytelling abilities of Joss Whedon so much that you would go charging headlong off any cliff to the bitter end to see the firefly/serenity storyline thru.

Wish I could say I believed Joss were as dedicated to that end as his fans. Ya know... Jim Jones didn't drink the koolaid. He only had it brewed. When his followers were lying in dying heaps of poisoned people, he tried to escape with a suitcase full of money.

His own Pretorian guard gunned him down. There his followers lay in ultimate blind devotion, and he was running off with the loot.

XG

No such thing as gravity. The "Earth-that-was" just sucks.

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Friday, November 4, 2005 5:42 PM

XEROGRAVITY

and BTW Queen...

that tagline is too damned sexy. stop it!

I'm gettin all hot and bothered here =p

XG

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Friday, November 4, 2005 5:52 PM

MIRAMEL

why is it that every one is so very ready to give up? i mean, even if it is unrealistic to hope, which im not convinced it is, how can being optamistic and doing our best to get what more we can HURT?

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Monday, November 7, 2005 5:40 AM

QUEENOFTHENORTH

Quote:
Originally posted by XeroGravity:
and BTW Queen...

that tagline is too damned sexy. stop it!

I'm gettin all hot and bothered here =p

XG

Oh *tosses hair* you are? I thought you'd like it. Just in case you were starting to cool off . . .

There ya go.

I give to you the Seeker of Serenity, the Valkyrie Warrior, the Gourmet Cook and the Truth Scoper.

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Tuesday, November 8, 2005 8:13 AM

XEROGRAVITY

I never cool off. Burning hot all the way till the grave. It's a car thing.

I dig 70's muscle cars but I drive a modernday Jeep Cherokee. Scratch modern from that sentence.

This may seem like I'm digressing but I'm not. Just trust me. It's germaine.

The engine in my pseudo-Jeep is reverse engineered to run like an engine should ~ or it's most of the way there... sorry jeeps once were those hardcore engine monsters you locked the hubs on and tore up the ground with, not this phony corporate electronic famnilycar-hybrid crap they sell today.

Mine is retooled to run like a real engine (or it's slowly getting there). My Cherokee engine ain't some bastardized piece of crap with cheaply manufactured parts, sensors and chipboards that control all the sensors and require a guy with a $1200 "high-tech" sensor tool to tell you what the ENGINE LIGHT "codes" mean (yeah I put old fashioned gauges in the dash ~ sort of.. long story). I got real heavy metal under the hood.

You prolly have no clue what I'm talkin about... hell I doubt I do anymore, but old school mechanics will.

Trying to live off the grid here.

Bottom line, my engine runs hot, and so do I. I'll go down in flames with it. The fooker is nitro-charge capable. Not that I plan on racing anyone but I just kinda like the option to be able to spin wheels if the need arises.

XG

My next big project is to screw with the electronics. Electric windows are very nice (and convenient), but I like a backup option of a manual crank if the circuit board fries, the wires are unexpectedly corroded by an alien death ray, or (GOD FORBID), shit happens. I still haven't made use of the electronic seat-warming option but electric heating elements in my seat (no matter how comfortable) just smacks of supreme gayness. Think I'm gonna have to rip the high tech seats out and replace them with some cosmic cheekchilling bucket seats.

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Tuesday, November 8, 2005 8:32 AM

XEROGRAVITY

PS ~ "manual crank" used to be a standard option on vehicles for you younger know-nothing folks.

They called it (back in the days of the ancients) a... (someone record this for posterity)...

a.. "roll up the window". It did'nt have a name. You looked at the person in the nearest seat and simply said "roll up the window". They'd grab the official vertical-adjustment handcrank tool actuated by a series of mechanically rotational crap (directly linked to the upward motion of the glass otherwise known as the window, by nonelectronic devices). Ah. Those were the days.

Pray a fuse never frys while the window is down if you know not of such magic. It will be stuck in such a position and the gods may bring rain or snow down as punishment for lack of obedience. You may end up paying many hundreds of dollars to replace the electronics in your vehicle door where these mystical devices of the gods live.

XG ~ 34 year old venerated ancient

No such thing as gravity. The "Earth-that-was" just sucks.

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Tuesday, November 8, 2005 11:52 AM

QUEENOFTHENORTH

Actually I just got a brand new Cobalt that doesn't have power windows but rather ancient hand cranks.

But then, I've never had a car with power windows.

I give to you the Seeker of Serenity, the Valkyrie Warrior, the Gourmet Cook and the Truth Scoper.

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