Browncoatsriseagain.com finished. by everyworldspinnin

Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
All I told the guy up front was that using PayPal for donations would lead to an account freeze and having fans’ money happily seized by PayPal for one ‘suspicion’ or another..

They had nothing to do with it as far as I understand it.

°°°°°°°°°°°°
http://www.byond-trax.com - my selfmade ambient/lounge/chillout music

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:55 AM

The sad thing is, if fan-money could be directed in a way that worked, I think an effort like this could really fund a tv-series.

I just did some math on the current poll running here at fireflyfans. Summing up the *minimum* yearly contribution people have voted for gives (if I get this right):
($100*0.3781 + $50*0.2289 + $40*0.1140 + $10*0.109 + $20*0.1066 + $30*0.0635)*7327

EQUALS $431'870; and thats only from people at this fatsite (well, discouting multiple votes, I guess...)

Well, I realize web-poll data is inherently inaccurate; but this at least gives some indication of the proportions we are talking about here...

In any case, I just don't understand why somebody cannot do this properly;

Set up an echonomical foundation with formalized rules stating that its wealth should be directed by its board of directors to be used to set up fan-based TV, and in particular act to get Firefly back. It would be best if the foundation could be created with official ties to a well known and trustable organization that partially shares similar goals, for example the EFF. In that case at least I would be convinced to donate some significant cash.

Generate enough media buzz, and wait for the money to roll in. When enough money has come in, the plan would be something like:
1. Buy the rights to the series from Fox.
2. Let the foundations board of directors hire organisatory people with experience in media production.
3. Let them hire Joss and supervise his production (just like an ordinary media company would do)
4. Release the episodes as freely downloadable files on internet and/or press DVDs selling for the cost of pressing + distribution. (That this is the goal should probably be documented in the foundation's rules)

Well, I'm sure people will flame me for all the errors in this buissniessplan... But it seems good to me :)

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 4:51 PM

ANONYMOUS1

Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
we’re stuck at square one, screaming Give our dedication another chance! into an uncaring darkness.

I think we are at square six.

Square one was when Firefly was cancelled.
Square two was when Joss got approval to make Serenity from Universal.
Square three was when Firefly was released on DVD.
Square five was when Serenity was released to theaters.
Square six was when Serenity was released to DVD.

We will not go back to square one unless they stop making the Serenity and Firefly DVDs. Everyone could not get to a theater, but we can all get to a store that carries the DVDs or Amazon.com . (Serenity UMDs at BestBuy maybe other stores) (Serenity VHS www.walmart.com $20.48)

Give our dedication time.

How many Serenity DVDs do you think they produced? Will they produce more--if we keep buying them?

Lots of gift giving opportunities out there. Birthdays, charity drives, libraries. Christmas time again.

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 5:34 PM

ZALIUM

that was a great idea but he don't develop it enough. if the main company like fox, universal, wb,... can't produce the tv show we want nothing stop us to produce it. The main idea it's to create a company that will produce what we want! the investor will be the consumer. the compagny will release the show over internet for like nothing about 2 to 5 buck an episode so nobody will put it on a p2p program or bittorrent and the tv show will also be deliver in dvd at the price of the market or below it. the fact is that major company did what they do to earn cash but this thing will just live to create good stuff and all the profit will be use for paying the employes and the development of product no more big profit useless, just enough to survive. like wikipedia... maybe wikitv ;)

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 6:01 PM

ZIIANARKIST

Quote:
Originally posted by CBY:
Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
All I told the guy up front was that using PayPal for donations would lead to an account freeze and having fans’ money happily seized by PayPal for one ‘suspicion’ or another..

They had nothing to do with it as far as I understand it.

No, PayPal had very little to do with it, as it wouldn't have been more than an hour's work converting donations to another credit-card acceptance system, but I warned him initially simply to say that should he continue, PayPal will stuff him simply because they can.

I'd be interested to know exactly what this 'producer' contact of his told him that finally discouraged his efforts. It would be enormously helpful in our efforts to show support for the series outside of forcing ourselves to buy merchandise and more and more DVD box sets. Not that buying more boxed sets is at all a bad idea.

Quote:
Originally posted by Anonymous1:
Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
we’re stuck at square one, screaming Give our dedication another chance! into an uncaring darkness.

I think we are at square six.

By 'square one' I suppose I meant the physical efforts involved in reviving the television series.

I didn't so much like the way the movie turned out in that it was written in the context of farewell and good bye! and I would hope, should the series return, that Serenity be designated a different piece of a different continuum of the 'verse, if not just for the sake of bringing everyone back (Badger!) and alleviating the many difficulties the crew would now face in a post-Miranda-scandal and post-omigod-they-killed-Wash! 'verse, and damn whatever confusion it may cause to see Wash and Book alive again.

An opinion merely.

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 6:57 PM

ANONYMOUS1

Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
we’re stuck at square one, screaming Give our dedication another chance! into an uncaring darkness.

Quote:
Originally posted by Anonymous1:
I think we are at square six.

Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
By 'square one' I suppose I meant the physical efforts involved in reviving the television series.

You didn't think it was funny to say we are at square six?

Would you edit your post and put ****** over the spoilers or change it somehow? I figure there are like 6 billion people that we still haven't gotten to see the movie yet. Let's see 6 billion DVDs at $20 a piece...

Quote:
Originally posted by zalium:
if the main company like fox, universal, wb,... can't produce the tv show we want nothing stop us to produce it. The main idea it's to create a company that will produce what we want!

But what we want is Firefly or Serenity.

FOX owns the rights to Firefly. Universal owns the rights to Serenity. You cannot produce a Firefly show without Fox's permission or sale of those rights. Universal is going to decide if there is a sequel to Serenity.

Just keep spreading the 'verse. We just have to reach the tipping point.

And remember River can at least hear ghosts. Maybe she can see them too.

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 7:18 PM

Sorry I didn't see this thread earlier as the thread I started got banished to the troll dungeon (not sure it deserved that but I respect the judgement of the admins of this forum).

The producer that I talked to was not afffiliated with Firefly or Serenity. He has worked with some big names but that is for him to reveal if he wants.

He helped me see that fan money even if given to Joss represents a loss of power to the decision makers at the studios involved. They want full control over what they do and often will make decisions not based on logic, but the emotion of the moment. Films and TV shows often do not get made because the person in charge of the decision doesn't like the maker of the show (happens everywhere in life but is magnified in entertainment where relatively few shows are made versus not made).

So without Joss' approval my site could have caused him some damage if it continued. The dead albatross around the neck showing up at every pitch meeting (and not just Firefly/Serenity meetings either but everywhere in the Whedonverse).

So realizing this, I shut down the site as quick as I could. We were getting the slashot effect right as we were doing it too. I was afraid I was going to have to refund a lot of money.

In the end, we collected almost $1400 in 36 hours. Everyone got every one of their pennies back. If anyone here did not, please contact me and I will make it right.

So, what's next? Well, today we had a meeting with the fellow who started www.fireflyseason2.com. We are working out how we can help each other out and I hope that all of you go over there and fill out his short survey.

We will relaunch our website by next week outlining simple things every Browncoat can do to help and grow the site over time.

I have gotten countless e-mails and have tried to answer every one of them. There are a LOT of good ideas. I'm just another person on the internet just like all of you. Don't be afraid to try out your ideas. Now, don't make the same mistake I did and not clue in the fanbase (boy hindsight is 20/20 and I apologize again!) but try out your ideas all the same. The worst thing that could happen is you could be ostracized on an internet forum board. :)

Kindest regards,

Andrew
www.browncoatsriseagain.com

P.S. As I said, I'll be around. I love this 'verse and will continue to try to help it as best I can.

P.P.S. BIGREDBUTTON, I would appreciate it if you could find some time to talk to me. E-mail, phone, or IM. Thanks.

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 8:04 PM

BELOWZERO

Here's the problem: I am not sure we HAVE a lot of time. How long is the original cast going to hold out before they take other projects? How long is Joss going to keep trying to get this back on the air before he is involved in other stuff?

I'm just thinking, this can't take 10 years or we are gonna have "Firefly: The Retirement Years"!

I wish there was a way to know if what we are doing is even possible. I know nothing about Holly-weird and how this whole TV thing works. All I know is they keep canceling my favorite shows.

How do we know if anything we are doing is having any impact?

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 8:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BelowZero:
How do we know if anything we are doing is having any impact?

Short answer - we really don't.

However, as Sheperd Book told Mal "Believe in something". I choose to believe that we can make a difference and so will keep trying things that I think up and things that others think up as well.

Andrew
www.browncoatsriseagain.com

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:22 PM

SHINY

Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:
Sorry I didn't see this thread earlier as the thread I started got banished to the troll dungeon (not sure it deserved that but I respect the judgement of the admins of this forum).

Just FYI, the only way to get a thread to stop showing up on the front page when people post to it is to move it to 'troll country'. Sometimes mods will do this even if there isn't any trollish behavior if the thread is out of date, has inaccurate or misleading information, etc.

Just didn't want you to assume the mod(s) thought you were a troll.

---

I don't need a gorram back-spaceship driver!!!

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Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:59 PM

RUSSELL

i feel your pain. i started watching firefly when sci-fi aired it promoting serenity and was instantly hooked. i didnt find out until, oh... a week ago that the show was cancelled going on two years ago.

i watch about 4 hours of tv a week and firefly was one of the shows i couldnt wait to see. i sure hope they start the show up again. i need some closure. mal and inara, zoe minus wash, rain without the psychoness, jayne... just being jayne :)

maybe sci-fi will pick it up from fox or something. they have a way with things like that (sg-1, battlestar gallactica, tremors, etc...). you know they have a firefly bulletin board too right? if anyone can bring it back they can.

anyways... just had to comment. i dont think you will ever raise enough money to bring it back just for the simple reason that most people have never heard of it or seen the show. and youre not going to get money from but about .01% of the ones that have seen it. i think the best bet is to buy the dvd's. loan them to your friends, post on the sci-fi bulletin board a bit and cross your fingers.

funny though. i read this board and im sort of creeped out at all the people that cant face the fact that firefly has been cancelled and isnt coming back. then i realize - im one of them lol. please bring back firefly, please please please.

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Friday, January 20, 2006 1:04 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
No, PayPal had very little to do with it, as it wouldn't have been more than an hour's work converting donations to another credit-card acceptance system, but I warned him initially simply to say that should he continue, PayPal will stuff him simply because they can.

Even if you are right (everyone is allowed to have an opinion), what system would you use to accept international donations? Credit cards are not common there.

°°°°°°°°°°°°
http://www.byond-trax.com - my selfmade ambient/lounge/chillout music

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Friday, January 20, 2006 3:45 AM

SIMONWHO

It's true; outside of America people pay for goods and services with twigs and muddied leaves.

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Friday, January 20, 2006 4:03 AM

SIMONF

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
It's true; outside of America people pay for goods and services with twigs and muddied leaves.

I personally pay Amazon.com with wolf pelts from my hunting trips.

Though I would imagine International Money Orders would be acceptable for donating.

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Friday, January 20, 2006 6:55 AM

BIGREDBUTTON

Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:
P.P.S. BIGREDBUTTON, I would appreciate it if you could find some time to talk to me. E-mail, phone, or IM. Thanks.

Talk 'bout what? If you're looking to work towards the return of Firefly in a legitimate fashion (and the closing of your website indicated to me that you are) I'm willing to assist as I can.

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Friday, January 20, 2006 7:24 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
It's true; outside of America people pay for goods and services with twigs and muddied leaves.

Actually, we mostly use these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debit_card

Quote: In Germany and Belgium, many merchants, including most supermarkets, do not accept credit cards because of the higher fees charged by their banks. However, most merchants usually accept debit cards, because the fees for accepting them are much lower, for example in Germany 0.3% with a minimum of €0.08.

°°°°°°°°°°°°
http://www.byond-trax.com - my selfmade ambient/lounge/chillout music

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Friday, January 20, 2006 8:17 AM

BRITCHICK

Quote: In Germany and Belgium, many merchants, including most supermarkets, do not accept credit cards because of the higher fees charged by their banks. However, most merchants usually accept debit cards, because the fees for accepting them are much lower, for example in Germany 0.3% with a minimum of €0.08.

Um, that just means not everyone accepts credit cards, it doesn't mean that people in Germany and Belgium do not use them or do not have them. (And I've never had a problem using mine when i'm there)

A very large part of "there" (as in "Credit cards are not common there"), and certainly the parts of "there" which are likely to be interested in donating money to the cause, are as credit-card-crazy as the US.

I know I am!

Like fireflyfans.net?
Help keep the site running.. Why not donate?
see links on homepage

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Friday, January 20, 2006 11:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by BigRedButton:
Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:
P.P.S. BIGREDBUTTON, I would appreciate it if you could find some time to talk to me. E-mail, phone, or IM. Thanks.

Talk 'bout what? If you're looking to work towards the return of Firefly in a legitimate fashion (and the closing of your website indicated to me that you are) I'm willing to assist as I can.

That's really what I wanted to know. I know the initial campaign offended you and others and I wanted to interview you as a sample of that group to see what I could do to mend those fences.

Andrew

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Friday, January 20, 2006 12:02 PM

BIGREDBUTTON

Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:

That's really what I wanted to know. I know the initial campaign offended you and others and I wanted to interview you as a sample of that group to see what I could do to mend those fences.

Andrew

I'd be glad to work with you. My ire was never about you, but about someone the community doesn't know collecting money to do something we'd already seen miserably fail with another series.

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Friday, January 20, 2006 1:54 PM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
It's true; outside of America people pay for goods and services with twigs and muddied leaves.

That is so sad. I 've also heard that in Scotland people even post their daily feelings on things called "Bogs."

Hold up! I just realized I have a lot, I mean A LOT, of muddied leaves in my backyard...

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.net

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Friday, January 20, 2006 2:03 PM

Adrew,

Quote:
He helped me see that fan money even if given to Joss represents a loss of power to the decision makers at the studios involved. They want full control over what they do and often will make decisions not based on logic, but the emotion of the moment. Films and TV shows often do not get made because the person in charge of the decision doesn't like the maker of the show (happens everywhere in life but is magnified in entertainment where relatively few shows are made versus not made).

Thank you for the clarification. But... Isn't this *exactly why* it is such a good idea with fan-sponsored TV? To put it bluntly: to take away power from the stuipd power hungry media gurus that forced changes in the show and cancelled it in the first place based on their "feelings"?

Actually, if someone had a trustable fun-raising campain for any series, be it "barbie horse adventures", I would donate just for the piviledge of giving the finger to the decision-makers who don't listen to the fans...

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Friday, January 20, 2006 2:15 PM

Have you guys considered the possible side effect that Joss could be finished in Hollywood by taking our money and take the piss out of the studios with it? I think this the point that was made here.

°°°°°°°°°°°°
http://www.byond-trax.com - my selfmade ambient/lounge/chillout music

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Friday, January 20, 2006 4:04 PM

HIXIE129

I do not believe that starting a firefly 2 fund is the way to get it done. Unless the sole purpose is to buy 10 million DVDs.

So, if that is not possible then the only option the fans have is to PICK IT, and PROTEST. The fans must get out and get signs and walk the PICK IT LINES.

ONCE THE FANS GET THE TV NEWS COVERING THE PICK IT LINES AND PROTESTS, then attention to the cause could be maximized..

WE COULD CALL FOR BOYCOTTS of sponors too.

Well, that is just my opinion.

Thanks
Hixie

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Friday, January 20, 2006 4:28 PM

TALLGRRL

Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:
Sorry I didn't see this thread earlier as the thread I started got banished to the troll dungeon (not sure it deserved that but I respect the judgement of the admins of this forum).

A noble effort there, but I think that in the meanwhile you should do some research. Maybe take some classes in TV production...especially on the money side...and find out what goes into making and producing a (network) TV show.
It seems that you found out that it's a little bit..no, it's more...complicated and involved than just raising some money.
Take care and good luck.

"Take me, sir. Take me hard." -- Zoe

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Friday, January 20, 2006 4:37 PM

TALLGRRL

Quote:
Originally posted by HIXIE129:
I do not believe that starting a firefly 2 fund is the way to get it done. Unless the sole purpose is to buy 10 million DVDs.

So, if that is not possible then the only option the fans have is to PICK IT, and PROTEST. The fans must get out and get signs and walk the PICK IT LINES.

ONCE THE FANS GET THE TV NEWS COVERING THE PICK IT LINES AND PROTESTS, then attention to the cause could be maximized..

WE COULD CALL FOR BOYCOTTS of sponors too.

Well, that is just my opinion.

Thanks
Hixie

"Pick it?"
Pick what?!
Do you mean PICKET?
And boycott who?
Sponsors are advertisers who buy advertising time (aka commercials) during a show's time slot.
Why are you talking about boycotting...and just who are you going to boycott...and for what purpose?
Take a deep breath, dearie.
The way to make sure Universal knows that we want a sequel is to make sure that Serenity (and Firefly) stuff that's licensed by the studio gets bought.
DVDs, CDs, novels, books, Hot Topic t-shirts (those are the ones that are licensed), RPGs, trading cards...
That's how they know that there's an audience for more.
That's what's going to make them decided whether they can make money off of a Serenity/Firefly franchise.
Not picket lines and the like.

"Take me, sir. Take me hard." -- Zoe

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Friday, January 20, 2006 5:13 PM

HIXIE129

Did you read the first 2 sentences I wrote! My first suggestions is to buy DVDs

Thanks

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Friday, January 20, 2006 6:39 PM

INFAMOUSX

Quote:
Originally posted by rhizod:
Adrew,

Thank you for the clarification. But... Isn't this *exactly why* it is such a good idea with fan-sponsored TV? To put it bluntly: to take away power from the stuipd power hungry media gurus that forced changes in the show and cancelled it in the first place based on their "feelings"?

Actually, if someone had a trustable fun-raising campain for any series, be it "barbie horse adventures", I would donate just for the piviledge of giving the finger to the decision-makers who don't listen to the fans...

For the first paragraph, I agree, although I acknowledge I'm not too well versed on the complicated workings here. In my layman's opinion, though, keeping over-confident fools from ruining a creator's vision has gotta be a good thing. On the flip-side, though, I'm not sure about Universal's interaction with Serenity's creation, beside Josh's comments on the DVD, but they sure as hell earned my respect for the good they done.

As for the second paragraph, I smell an Xbox and/or Penny Arcade fan.

I wish I could write well enough to write about aircraft.
-Ernest Hemingway

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Friday, January 20, 2006 7:37 PM

ZIIANARKIST

Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:
That's really what I wanted to know. I know the initial campaign offended you and others and I wanted to interview you as a sample of that group to see what I could do to mend those fences.

Well, I can't say I appreciate much being used as a test audience all the time [looks for DOUGP9] but it certainly wasn't offensive. The emotions that fundraisers inspire is similar to the feeling one gets when ringside watching rally races - it's always that one hill that sends every car sailing nose-first into the right-hand ditch; these blokes aren't generally given the option to rehearse the course beforehand, so it's just sort of depressing to see everyone react to an unknown situation in exactly the same way, with almost identical negative results.

I was honestly prepared to cheer you on, even throw in a few hundred bones every now and again, but your idea would only work if, like I said, strangers were able to put a lot of faith into an unknown intellectual property that wasn't already someone else's bunk darling.

Now, if you had an established director who could throw in his own money to build sets, hire a crew, writers, actors, etc. and this director could produce a pilot to be shown to the world via BitTorrent and the eDonkey network then solicit support, the idea might suck ... less, as the director and team would still be under pressure from the fans (the director would be answering to many many 'producers'). But at least there's a chance for said established directors to fulfill a few ho-hum obligations to big networks, make big network money, whilst saving his/her baby projects for direct-to-fanbase internet distribution. Said director would be at the mercy of the mob, but a mob that loves them, rather than a smoke-filled board room where a coupla snots consistently veto every proposition the director has to offer because they didn't like the guy's car.

An opinion merely, which is to say I have no idea what I'm talking about.

===============
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Friday, January 20, 2006 8:51 PM

ANONYMOUS1

Quote:
Originally posted by Tallgrrl:
The way to make sure Universal knows that we want a sequel is to make sure that Serenity (and Firefly) stuff that's licensed by the studio gets bought.
DVDs, CDs, novels, books, Hot Topic t-shirts (those are the ones that are licensed), RPGs, trading cards...
That's how they know that there's an audience for more.
That's what's going to make them decided whether they can make money off of a Serenity/Firefly franchise.

Yeah! Like:

Lots of this Universal Serenity stuff has a link to it on the home page of www.fireflyfans.net

Serenity movie:

Serenity Dvd-Widescreen
Serenity Dvd-Fullscreen
Serenity VHS-Fullscreen
Serenity UMD Video for PSP (Handheld Sony PSP Game Player)

Books:

Serenity by Keith R.A. DeCandido (novel based on the motion picture screenplay)
Serenity the Official Visual Companion
Serenity Role Playing Game -book not just for RPGers-
Serenity the Official Movie Magazine --can still find some hidden on the shelves in Suncoast stores, book stores, Comic book stores.

Music: Serenity soundtrack CD music by David Newman

Comic Books: Serenity 1,2,3 3 comics - 9 different covers -
or the graphic novel

Serenity T-Shirts at the mall Hot Topic stores.

Serenity My Turn 250169-004 XL
Serenity Logo 272754-004 XL
Serenity Browncoat 211458-004 XL

Serenity Movie Poster --saw two recently at a Suncoast store also see www.fireflyfans.net home page

Serenity Zippo Lighter from Dark Horse Comics

Serenity Ornament (model) from Dark Horse Comics

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Monday, January 23, 2006 8:12 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ZiiAnarkist:
Well, I can't say I appreciate much being used as a test audience all the time [looks for DOUGP9] but it certainly wasn't offensive. The emotions that fundraisers inspire is similar to the feeling one gets when ringside watching rally races - it's always that one hill that sends every car sailing nose-first into the right-hand ditch; these blokes aren't generally given the option to rehearse the course beforehand, so it's just sort of depressing to see everyone react to an unknown situation in exactly the same way, with almost identical negative results.

I was honestly prepared to cheer you on, even throw in a few hundred bones every now and again, but your idea would only work if, like I said, strangers were able to put a lot of faith into an unknown intellectual property that wasn't already someone else's bunk darling.

Now, if you had an established director who could throw in his own money to build sets, hire a crew, writers, actors, etc. and this director could produce a pilot to be shown to the world via BitTorrent and the eDonkey network then solicit support, the idea might suck ... less, as the director and team would still be under pressure from the fans (the director would be answering to many many 'producers'). But at least there's a chance for said established directors to fulfill a few ho-hum obligations to big networks, make big network money, whilst saving his/her baby projects for direct-to-fanbase internet distribution. Said director would be at the mercy of the mob, but a mob that loves them, rather than a smoke-filled board room where a coupla snots consistently veto every proposition the director has to offer because they didn't like the guy's car.

An opinion merely, which is to say I have no idea what I'm talking about.

Thanks for taking the time to write out a complete and thought out response. I apologize if it felt like test marketing to you. It certainly was started in that light.

The site relaunches later this week starting with simple ideas a Browncoat can use to keep the conversation about Firefly going.

More and bigger stuff will follow as the leads I have been given either play out or not.

Thanks again,

Andrew

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Monday, January 23, 2006 8:21 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rhizod:
Adrew,

Quote:
He helped me see that fan money even if given to Joss represents a loss of power to the decision makers at the studios involved. They want full control over what they do and often will make decisions not based on logic, but the emotion of the moment. Films and TV shows often do not get made because the person in charge of the decision doesn't like the maker of the show (happens everywhere in life but is magnified in entertainment where relatively few shows are made versus not made).

Thank you for the clarification. But... Isn't this *exactly why* it is such a good idea with fan-sponsored TV? To put it bluntly: to take away power from the stuipd power hungry media gurus that forced changes in the show and cancelled it in the first place based on their "feelings"?

Actually, if someone had a trustable fun-raising campain for any series, be it "barbie horse adventures", I would donate just for the piviledge of giving the finger to the decision-makers who don't listen to the fans...

I don't deny what you are saying - however Fox owns the rights to this TV show and we will have to play by their rules somewhat if we want to have any chance at all.

A brand new show, as you mention, would be a good vehicle as well for helping kickstart this new method of distribution.

Andrew

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Monday, January 23, 2006 8:23 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by CBY:
Have you guys considered the possible side effect that Joss could be finished in Hollywood by taking our money and take the piss out of the studios with it? I think this the point that was made here.

°°°°°°°°°°°°
http://www.byond-trax.com - my selfmade ambient/lounge/chillout music

Exactly why we stopped the campaign. It wasn't mine or anyone else's right to decide Joss' career path.

Andrew

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Monday, January 23, 2006 8:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Tallgrrl:
Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:
Sorry I didn't see this thread earlier as the thread I started got banished to the troll dungeon (not sure it deserved that but I respect the judgement of the admins of this forum).

A noble effort there, but I think that in the meanwhile you should do some research. Maybe take some classes in TV production...especially on the money side...and find out what goes into making and producing a (network) TV show.
It seems that you found out that it's a little bit..no, it's more...complicated and involved than just raising some money.
Take care and good luck.

"Take me, sir. Take me hard." -- Zoe

Thanks for the acknowledgement and your points. I think the classes you mention are found in the school of hard knocks...:)

Andrew

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Monday, January 23, 2006 8:40 AM

MILFORD

Ladies and gents, there is absolutely no way Firefly will return to the airwaves for a couple of reasons:
1-First, all the head honchos at Fox who were there when Firefly was greelit an then destroyed are gone. The new set of executives are too busy trying to make their own mark on the TV landscape with such lofty offerings like Ice Skating with Farm Animals, or something like that. They have no interest in reviving something that someone else made.

2-Second, the cast would be almost impossible to recreate if the show were picked up by another network, say SciFi. They have signed TV contracts with other networks as a result of their exposure on Firefly. Nathan, for example, signed a deal with NBC. I know that NBC owns SciFi, but I'm not sure the others aren't contracted elsewhere. As much as I love SciFi, they simply don't have the funds to purchase those contracts and put the show back in production.

3-Last, we shot ourselves in our own foot with our excitement. Fox isn't going to lift a finger on Firefly as long as they are making money off of it without doing a thing. They've made tons off of a show they don't even have to pay for. I saw a breakdown recently that suggested Firefly made a modest @ $1 million profit per episode. When you combine that with production costs for the series, development, and pilot, you figure they just about broke even when they cancelled the series. Then, lo and behold, we went out and bought millions of dollars worth of DVDs of this show that cost them nothing. To quote another one of my favorite movies, they are sitting in the fabled catbird's seat. They have nothing to lose.

Our best bet is for a Serenity sequel, which given DVD sales and other fan interest is entirely reasonable. That's the direction for our efforts. I would trade all my worldly belongings to get Firefly on the air again, but it will never happen. It may be a result of an emotion decision, as some of you have suggested. But I imagine that, now, it is more of a financial decision. Am I happy? No, but I'm glad we have what we have.

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Monday, January 23, 2006 2:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by CBY:
Have you guys considered the possible side effect that Joss could be finished in Hollywood by taking our money and take the piss out of the studios with it?

Quote:
browncoatsriseagain:
[The decision makers] want full control over what they do and often will make decisions not based on logic, but the emotion of the moment.

Quote:
rhizod:
Thank you for the clarification. But... Isn't this *exactly why* it is such a good idea with fan-sponsored TV? To put it bluntly: to take away power from the stuipd power hungry media gurus that forced changes in the show and cancelled it in the first place based on their "feelings"?

Actually, if someone had a trustable fun-raising campain for any series, be it "barbie horse adventures", I would donate just for the piviledge of giving the finger to the decision-makers who don't listen to the fans...

Quote:
browncoatsriseagain:
I don't deny what you are saying - however Fox owns the rights to this TV show and we will have to play by their rules somewhat if we want to have any chance at all.

A brand new show, as you mention, would be a good vehicle as well for helping kickstart this new method of distribution.

Right; I'm (slowly) getting the point here... If fan based TV is echonomically feasible, it still has a kind of chicken-or-egg problem. Before the money collection project has grown so big that it is a power on the same scale as other media companies, it does more damage than service to the shows it promotes...

A new show is not really an option either, since general people would be much less inclined to contribute.

What would solve the problem is if some director/writer, like Joss himself, went out on the dangerous limb and started the project; pledging to his fans to donate. And, frankly, that is not very realistic; I don't think I'll would do that if I was in his shoes...

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Monday, January 23, 2006 2:31 PM

SERENITYFOREVER

Quote:
Originally posted by milford:

1-First, all the head honchos at Fox who were there when Firefly was greelit an then destroyed are gone. The new set of executives are too busy trying to make their own mark on the TV landscape with such lofty offerings like Ice Skating with Farm Animals, or something like that. They have no interest in reviving something that someone else made.

I think that's irrelevant. It doesn't matter who is calling the shots. If something comes across as a clear winner, studio executives won't pass on it. The bottom line is always... well... the bottom line.

Executives, whether at a TV or a movie studio are paid to make money. In both areas, it's done by putting stuff out there that people watch. If there's anything these guys can do, it's count beans. The fan base started small with TV. It grew with the DVD. It grew more with the movie. It's growing even now with the movie on DVD. With a steadily increasing fan base, and steadily improving profits, the venture becomes viewed as more profitable, which improves its chances for another go-round. I don't care what the studio execs' personal feelings are on the show, they aren't paid to say no to money.

I see only good that can come from sharing the DVDs of something I like with others, regardless of whether or not it translates into re-lighting the Firefly.

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Monday, January 23, 2006 3:47 PM

CHRISPV

Quote:
Originally posted by SerenityForever:

I see only good that can come from sharing the DVDs of something I like with others, regardless of whether or not it translates into re-lighting the Firefly.

Amen to that. After all, the worst that can happen is that you get to initiate some lucky soul into the Browncoats. The best that can happen, however, is that you make a convert, a sale, and one more vote to get Serenity into the air again.

No matter what, we win.

Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal, Fox!

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Monday, January 23, 2006 4:30 PM

MILFORD

My point was not that we should abandon all hope. Quite the contrary. My point was that we should focus our efforts on a Serenity sequel as opposed to a Firefly reupping. I completely agree that we should gain as many converts as possible, using force if necessary. I think Jayne would want it that way. However, in terms of a push for new stories, I think the chances of a big screen adventure are much, much greater than a little screen series. To be honest, I couldn't be more disappointed in that. I LOVED the movie, but at the same time I was a little saddened. I didn't think the characters came accross as well as they did on the small screen. I suppose that's Joss's fault for writing such interesting and multi-level characters. They were made for TV greatness.

No matter what, Serenity still flies in this house, and always will.

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Tuesday, January 24, 2006 1:22 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SerenityForever:
I don't care what the studio execs' personal feelings are on the show, they aren't paid to say no to money.

Which is why I originally started browncoatsriseagain.com thinking that we could appeal to that nature.

The problem here is that there are lots of interesting and new projects that will make the studios money as well so the execs aren't forced to choose Firefly or no money. It's Firefly or this other money.

Therefore their powerlust and politics come in to the light.

Andrew

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Tuesday, January 24, 2006 1:56 PM

Hei Andrew, is it true that you teamed up with the guy from the disputed "second season" project?

°°°°°°°°°°°°
http://www.byond-trax.com - my selfmade ambient/lounge/chillout music

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Tuesday, January 24, 2006 3:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by CBY:
Hei Andrew, is it true that you teamed up with the guy from the disputed "second season" project?

°°°°°°°°°°°°
http://www.byond-trax.com - my selfmade ambient/lounge/chillout music

Ty and I have met with him a few times. We are going to help him with his website.

He really is doing the things he says he is doing. I think he will do what has been advised on this board and just move forward and try to do it.

The worst that can happen is that Joss will say he is not interested and that will be the end of that.

The best case is that we get more episodes of Firefly and possibly a breakthrough in how entertainment is delivered.

BTW, our website will be back up this week with '10 things a Browncoat can do right now!'

I have an initial list that I will be putting up gathered from suggestions on this and other boards, but would love to have input on what would be the most effective things to do. So post 'em here and e-mail me.

Andrew

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Tuesday, January 24, 2006 4:05 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by browncoatsriseagain:
BTW, our website will be back up this week with '10 things a Browncoat can do right now!'

I have an initial list that I will be putting up gathered from suggestions on this and other boards, but would love to have input on what would be the most effective things to do. So post 'em here and e-mail me.

This might be the stupidest idea ever: but how about contributing money directly to Joss? If we make him bade in wealth without holding him to anything; perhaps he just picks up his favorite projects and sponsor them himself?

On the other hand... perhaps he just stops working and spend the rest of his life on a beach somewhere... Hmm, not good, :)

Quote:
Originally posted by CBY:
Hei Andrew, is it true that you teamed up with the guy from the disputed "second season" project?

If one puts 2 and 2 together it seems likely that the unnamed producer that called Andrew and talked him out of the Browncoatriseagain fund raising was 'Ace' from this "second season" project... (just my guess tho)

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Tuesday, January 24, 2006 6:36 PM