Possibility of Firefly on the new CW?? by mcallen

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Possibility of Firefly on the new CW??

POSTED BY: MCALLEN
UPDATED: Thursday, January 26, 2006 13:19
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VIEWED: 14211
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Wednesday, January 25, 2006 6:44 PM

I've said it before and I'll say it again... we have to be persistant. But we also have to be patient. I don't think Joss has given up. He's just moved on to other areas right now like Wonder Woman. It's like his reply to the question about writers block. He said that he moves on to another script. That other script has to get done though doesn't it?

I seriously think that if Wonder Woman were to become something special. He'd be in some serious good water with Warner. And guess what Warner owns?

So we have to be Patient. Wait till we hear something from him. Wait till we hear that horn that there has been a cease fire. Until then... we have to sit here in our foxhole.

But we also have to be Persistant... that means we have to keep on converting. We have to send letters to directed people that we know, who know Joss.

Here I go rambling again...

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Wednesday, January 25, 2006 7:28 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Zoid, TheCollector, WereAllJustFloating:

Good points, all. I, like many here, am NOT ready to lay down arms and give up the good fight. That said, I'm a realist, not an idealist. :) If a second season of Firefly or a Serenity sequel movie got greenlighted tomorrow, we'd still have to be patient. Nothing will happen fast enough, if it happens at all. Like it or not, I think we're in it for the long haul - probably a few YEARS, not a few months.

Joss has a full plate right now, and he's contractually obligated to get some things finished before he can even really START on anything 'verse related. I've no doubt that when he gets stumped on a project he'll think about our Big Damn Heroes and lay out some story ideas, but the real work on any Firefly/Serenity project is still a ways off.

Does that depress me? A bit. I loves me some Firefly, and I want more stories from this 'verse. But I'm prepared to wait for that to happen. Joss will "move on" for a while, bide his time, and if and when he feels the time is right, he'll be back with us again. He's not deserting us; he's just prioritizing and waiting for his moment. It'll come. Meanwhile, we hold; hold 'til he gets back. :)

In the meantime, we can work toward making Firefly/Serenity a viable business case for some unsuspecting network/studio exec who's just discovering what we already know. We'll keep building the support, grassroots-style, and hopefully we can build this thing into an underground franchise just waiting for the right time to explode. Get new recruits to watch Firefly on SciFi when it airs again, get them to buy the DVDs of both the show and the movie, and get them to recruit yet more Browncoats. One fine day, some up-n-coming young network suit will stumble across us and realize that there's something there that might be worth exploring.

Mike

"Kaylee, find that kid that's taking a dirt nap with baby Jesus; we need a hood ornament."

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Wednesday, January 25, 2006 7:34 PM

FORGOTN

Ok, I know that Star Trek is a sour subject to many Browncoats but I think some things need saying.

1.Star Trek is a Thriving franchise with a rabid fan base that started from a failed TV show. A show that died due in good part to the horrible timeslot that it was given by a doubting network. Now they are the only TV series with an episode inshrined at the Smithsonian institute.
Lesson: TIME

2.Star Trek didn't become popular on its first airing, even though it did have a good response from those that did see it. The thing that saved Star Trek was the reruns. Star Trek TOS (The Orignial Series), the ENTIRE series, was aired multiple times a year for a few years before UP decided to chance a feature film.
Lesson: RERUNS ARE GOOD

3.The first Star Trek movie, titled Star Trek: The Motion Picture, bombed. Plain and simple. But the fan base was so large that evetually UP decided that another movie was in order
Lesson: IFFY MOVIE SALES ARE NOT A DEATH SENTENCE

4.As previously stated, the thing that kept Star Trek alive was the Fans. They were vehement, they were smart, and they were organized. The organized conventions, group showings of the shows, they wrote fan-fics and books, and they made sure the Gene Roddenbarry and the cast of the show knew that they still enjoyed the show.
Lesson: FAN ORGANIZATION IS A MUST

5.At the time that the stations decided to make another Star Treck TV series there was virtually nothing on prime time TV that fell into the SciFi genre, though SciFi movies, books, and magazines were all gaining in popularity. (Think Star Wars)
Lesson: THERE MUST BE A WHOLE IN THE MARKET

Now taking all of this into account, it is VERY likely that a new TV series will not be the next step. And that when we get a new series it MIGHT not have the same characters. (when Star Trek TNG was starting up the first thing they tried was reuniting the original cast but decided that too much time had past and replaced them with younger actors) The important thing is that we do not give up, we need to stay organized and we need to stay in the public eye. We can NOT dissapear to the networks. We also need to make sure that Science Fiction remains a viable genre. With Star Wars just ending and Enterprise being canceled there is no big SciFi franchise on top of the market. We have our opening. But more importantly we need to make sure that the genre itself is viable, both Science Fiction and Westerns. We need to frequent All SciFi movies and support All large franchises. Be they television or novels. We need to show the Tv Execs that FireFly isn't only the right show, but that now is the right time. As others around here have been saying, We need a Science Fiction rennasiance.

Just remember people, those who do not learn from the past are destined to repeat.

And I don't want to wait that long till i can return to the Verse.

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Wednesday, January 25, 2006 11:01 PM

ZOEHASZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by ForgotN:

Lesson: FAN ORGANIZATION IS A MUST

How is this to be done? I'm sure everybody agrees, and there are startup efforts at various sites and even on different forums on the same site, but true organization isn't happening.
How can that be achieved over the internet, where everything spins off into fragments and attention span is short?

Should we:
- call for a Firefly day, when all websites (including Whedonesque) keep a full-size "We want Firefly2" screen up on their homepage? (and also display instructions on what fans can do, like write, or go to a petition site or whatever).
- have a booth at every relevant convention where people can sign letters or postcards that are then immediately mailed to the TV stations?
- Elect a leader, maybe???? Is that a dirty word? Is there a chance without a leader?
- Is there someone left of those who organized the Variety article way back when who could help?
- uhm...

It's late, my brain is empty. There must be better ideas to get some organized momentum going.

"I'm not so afraid of losing something that I won’t try havin’ it." - Zoë

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Wednesday, January 25, 2006 11:07 PM

ZOID

Hi, Zeek.

Okay. As I predicted, your profile page shows you registered in June of 2005, about the same time that the ad campaign was ramping up. The difference is that you watched the show when it originally aired, fell in love with it (one presumes, although you did not so state) and testified to your friends.

Good on ya'! Still, if you'll notice, in my post I said most of the doomsayers would have join dates not earlier than mid-2005. Note the key word: "most". This differs in an essential way from an assertion that all of the woe-is-us crowd would be gleaned from the "thrill seekers", who are just trying to glom onto a real fanship to see what it feels like. Even old-timers can lose their religion; I only promised that I would stick with Firefly until the day I die, not that you or anyone else would.

Please also note that I am not deriding 'n00bs'. Like I always say, "Everybody was new once." My complaint is about n00bs (and other fair weather friends) with defeatist attitudes. Since I'm so fond of analogies, here's one to hopefully illuminate my position:

Lots of people go to church every Sunday. Some of them are true believers. For them, their faith is like breathing; it is essential to their nature. Like breathing, they won't stop doing it (i.e., believing) until the day they die, and can't stop doing it without dying. Ya' dig? Others who go to church are not so compelled. They go because it gives them respectability in the community and to make important business connections. It's called networking, and it's all the rage.

The parallels to be drawn from this analogy should be apparent; but in case they're not, I'll spell it out. Some who habituate this and the other Firefly boards love Firefly. Whether or not it ever comes back in their lifetimes is of no consequence. These believers, these Browncoats, still believe in the beauty of the story and characters, and can't stop. They could no sooner give up on Firefly than they could decide to stop breathing. Are we tracking?

Others who habituate these boards really have no clue what all the fuss is about. They just see a bunch of people who are fervent (and intelligent and witty and sexy, but enough about Mal-licious) about something, anything in their lives, and all of whom are having a party. So the 'no clue' types invite themselves to the party. People love following crowds, and becoming part of them. Hey, it's cool, because all are welcome. But, they're not believers.

You might be asking yourself at this point, "So what's the difference?"

The difference is that the 'play-acting' Christians don't throw comments around like, "Well, I don't think Jesus is coming back," or "You know, the disciples aren't getting any younger," or "I think God has given up hope on us and moved on to something else."

That's about as far as that analogy can take us. But to reiterate my point, it doesn't matter whether Joss is tired of Firefly; it doesn't matter whether F*x is hoarding the series or it's just that nobody else wants it; it doesn't matter if we never get another single frame of Firefly. The believers -- The Browncoats -- believe they will see Firefly again, because it's just not in them to let it go. I don't mean "they can't let it go because they would miss it,": I mean we can't let it go because it's a part of us.

One last experiment: Look down at your chest. Now, say aloud, "Heart, stop beating." Really mean it, too... Didn't work did it? Same thing with me and Firefly. Same thing with me and my love for my wife and kids.

When people die, there is a finality; but stories -- stories as good as Firefly -- never die. They live forever. They can be resurrected. As long as I live I will wait for the day Firefly returns, even if everyone else in the world has forgotten her...

Respectfully,

zoid

P.S.
The cast members are very young, so stop making them sound like candidates for Social Security. That argument is hogwash, not to put too fine a point on it. Adam is the oldest remaining -- barring Ron's resurrection -- and he could do 15 additional years of Firefly and still be a younger gunfighter than Connery in "Extraordinary Gents", if Firefly takes a full 10 years from today to return to network TV. Nat would be mid-forties, Sean an even four-oh and the rest in their mid-thirties. (NB: The philistine who behaves unchivalrously towards Gina will draw back a bloody stump.) You must be really young if you think that's "too old". You make it sound like Nat and Morena would be Hume Cronyn/Jessica Tandy old...
_________________________________________________

"I aim to misbehave." -Capt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity, a.k.a. 'the BDBOF'

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:07 AM

MILFORD

Quote:
Originally posted by werealljustfloating:
I'm aware of how significant a show Buffy was for the WB but I still stand by what I said in that post.

You and I both know that from our perspective the WB owes Joss more than they're ever likely to admit to. My original point was that, in fact, they don't have to see it like that, cos they're a TV network and essentially all they care about is profit, not art!

Still, werealljustfloating, I think you are mistaken, they DO owe Joss, but I think we're talking about different ends of the same stick. I don't think any of us would disagree that Joss put WB on the map and in fact they do owe him a debt of gratitude. However, that being said, you're exactly right, werealljustfloating, that the chances of them recognizing that gratitude is slim to none. Profits rule, while prophets like Joss are left by the wayside. So while I agree with you completely, that they are and will be only concerned with those things that will bring them the bucks, the truth of Joss's impact on the WB remains, whether they recognize it or not. For the record, you don't sound cynical at all werealljustfloating, just frustrated like the rest of us. Stay the course.

I love the parallels of Star Trek by the way, someone needs to get that message out to the networks and studios. At worst, they'll have to finally admit that they're not interested in the best show ever because they're petty.

Remember, that but for one trifling exception, the entire universe is made up of others.- Oliver Wendall Holmes

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 4:49 AM

FOLLOWMAL

Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:

P.S.
The cast members are very young, so stop making them sound like candidates for Social Security. That argument is hogwash, not to put too fine a point on it. Adam is the oldest remaining -- barring Ron's resurrection -- and he could do 15 additional years of Firefly and still be a younger gunfighter than Connery in "Extraordinary Gents", if Firefly takes a full 10 years from today to return to network TV. Nat would be mid-forties, Sean an even four-oh and the rest in their mid-thirties. (NB: The philistine who behaves unchivalrously towards Gina will draw back a bloody stump.) You must be really young if you think that's "too old". You make it sound like Nat and Morena would be Hume Cronyn/Jessica Tandy old...

Your entire post had me nodding and my heart swelling with pride, but the ending caused me to stand up here right in front of my computer and give you a standing ovation. No one else has said this that I've seen and I am grateful to you for pointing it out.

I'm not exactly a spring chicken, but heavens I'm not old either and the entire cast bar Ron is younger than I am. They and I have many good years yet!

" You hold. Hold til I get back." Mal

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 5:38 AM

GRIMJACK21502

Since we don't have any "official" CW websites or snail mail addresses, I left a request for Mrs. Dawn Ostroff at the UPN.com website to consider the inclusion of a Joss Whedon/Tim Minear project...you guessed it, Firefly. Dawn Ostroff is currently heading up UPN, so we are at least in the ball park by e-mailing there.

Can't hurt.

"And once you're gone, you can never come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black"
-Neil Young

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 7:46 AM

ZOID

FollowMal wrote:

Quote:
Your entire post had me nodding and my heart swelling with pride, but the ending caused me to stand up here right in front of my computer and give you a standing ovation. No one else has said this that I've seen and I am grateful to you for pointing it out.

I'm not exactly a spring chicken, but heavens I'm not old either and the entire cast bar Ron is younger than I am. They and I have many good years yet!

Well, here's some more supporting facts I uncovered, which debunk the need for cryostasis, as suggested by some: Should Firefly not come back for another 10 years (2016), Adam Baldwin, who will turn 44 on February 27th, would be 54. John Wayne (born 1907), by acclamation the greatest movie fighter ever, made 15 movies as the leading man from age 60 until his death in 1979. They were, in reverse order: The Shootist (1976), Rooster Cogburn (1975), Brannigan (1975), McQ (1974), Cahill U.S. Marshal (1973), The Train Robbers (1973), The Cowboys (1972), Big Jake (1971), Rio Lobo (1970), Chisum (1970), The Undefeated (1969), True Grit (1969) [for which he finally won the Oscar for Best Actor in a leading role], Hellfighters (1968), The Green Berets (1968), and The War Wagon (1967). That'd be a pretty impressive body of work, if it was an entire career, let alone for an over-60 male working exclusively in the action genre.

Is it a bit of a stretch to compare Adam Baldwin to John Wayne? Nah, I don't think so. Adam's got a better flair for comedy and self-deprecation than Wayne, but they're cut from the same mold in terms of physically intimidating screen presence. I can see Adam playing 'manly' (as opposed to 'grandfatherly') roles at least through his fifties. Clint Eastwood, who's not nearly as physically imposing as Baldwin, will be 76 this May 21st and made "Unforgiven" in 1992 at the tender age of 62 (the same age as Gene Hackman, his antagonist in the movie).

As far as the age thing goes, I'm (*stops to do the math, taking off shoes to assist in the calculation*) 47 years old until this July 17th. One of my Mom's favorite sayings that I recall: "It's not the years, it's the mileage." In which case I'm 153, cuz I've seriously worn the tread off.

But I think the cast will age gracefully. Nat will get more ruggedly good-looking, Sean will lose some of his boyishness (which can't hurt, imo) and all the ladies will become more refined and graceful. Unless, of course, someone gets the plastic surgery bug; in which case, all bets are off...

Respectfully,

zoid

P.S.
"Dual core processor" = zoid taking off shoes to do math.

_________________________________________________

"Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands. It hopes we've learned something from yesterday." -John Wayne, philosopher

"Every country in the world loved the folklore of the West - the music, the dress, the excitement, everything that was associated with the opening of a new territory. It took everybody out of their own little world. The cowboy lasted a hundred years, created more songs and prose and poetry than any other folk figure. The closest thing was the Japanese samurai. Now, I wonder who'll continue it." -John Wayne, artist (despite his own protestations to the contrary)

"...Well, I wanted to be a dirty fighter if that was the only way to fight back. If someone throws a chair at you, hell, you pick up a chair and belt him right back. I was trying to play a man who gets dirty, who sweats sometimes, who enjoys kissing a gal he likes, who gets angry, who fights clean whenever possible but will fight dirty if he has to. You could say I made the Western hero a roughneck." -John Wayne, on how he changed the cowboy image from the 'squeaky clean' of Tom Mix, Gene Autry, and Roy Rogers
(NB: This statement is strongly reminiscent of Jayne's declaration to Kaylee in Serenity, to my mind. It also reminds me more than a little of Malcolm Reynolds blindsiding Jayne with a wrench and preemptively shooting a war criminal who'd strafed civilians, women and children, rather than dragging him along as a prisoner.)

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 8:38 AM

FOLLOWMAL

Thank you my friend, I'm proud to be holding the line with you!

John Wayne was my hero until Mal. I reckon Mr. Wayne would have liked Mal quite some bit.

I know my Daddy would have and he was a western fan. He would have approved wholeheartedly of our show and he would have gotten it too, even though he wasn't a scifi fan. He would have loved Serenity and the crew we all love so much.

I'm kinda charmed by both Nathan and Sean, being a lady and all, and I have to say some more miles on them will do them NO harm. And the ladies, well, they can only get lovelier.

I think there is just too much of a trend to only think that YOUNG will attract attention, or be good at something, when in reality it's the folks with miles on 'em who can make something shine!

Our cast shines! I'll be here waitin' for them to do it again.

That top quote by John Wayne was unknown to me, I am glad to have it.

" You hold. Hold til I get back." Mal

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 9:17 AM

TAMSIBLING

I still don't think CW is the way to go. Since it is a melding of the WB and UPN (think young, often shallow tv), I don't see Firefly fitting in with their current line ups. I mean, what would firefly be paired with? Even a seeming "natural" fit like Smallville, Supernatural or Charmed, would make these other shows pale in comparison to the beauty and wit of FF.

I want it back on TV, so bad I can taste the mudder's milk, but I don't know if CW is the network. To me, Sci-Fi has been growing the fan base, has the additional shows to pair it with (think Frackin' Galactica) and has proven that science fiction can be profitable.

All that said, tell me where to sign, who to write too, whatever and I'm there.

This must be what going insane feels like.

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 9:45 AM

MCALLEN

TAMSIBLING--

I'm with you. My first choice would be SciFi. Seems like Firefly would have the best chance of having a long-term home there. At this point, however, I'd take more of the 'verse wherever I could get it. Any network, a BD Sequel, whatever.

MAL: We're still flying.
SIMON: That's not much.
MAL: It's enough.

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 11:17 AM

GRIMJACK21502

If the Sci-Fi channel is to be our focus, what is the next logical step?

Beyond requesting Firefly on the website, is there someone in particular we could address to start the proverbial ball rolling?

I'm thinking if the Sci-Fi President of Programming received a couple thousand snail mails requesting a new Firefly series, that might get their attention.

We will hold...we hold till Mal gets back.

"And once you're gone, you can never come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black"
-Neil Young

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 11:23 AM

GRIMJACK21502

Someone else mentioned this on another thread...

How about we all go over to the Sci-Fi Board, register, and flood the place with Firefly talk?

What say you Browncoats?

We will hold...we hold till Mal gets back.

"And once you're gone, you can never come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black"
-Neil Young

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Thursday, January 26, 2006 1:19 PM

WEREALLJUSTFLOATING

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:

Joss has a full plate right now, and he's contractually obligated to get some things finished before he can even really START on anything 'verse related. I've no doubt that when he gets stumped on a project he'll think about our Big Damn Heroes and lay out some story ideas, but the real work on any Firefly/Serenity project is still a ways off.

Does that depress me? A bit. I loves me some Firefly, and I want more stories from this 'verse. But I'm prepared to wait for that to happen. Joss will "move on" for a while, bide his time, and if and when he feels the time is right, he'll be back with us again. He's not deserting us; he's just prioritizing and waiting for his moment. It'll come. Meanwhile, we hold; hold 'til he gets back. :)

Kwicko I couldn't agree with you more.

I'm not a "let-it-goer" by any means. I am however, a realist. Barring a Firefly-miracle of some sort, I really don't think a return to TV is likely to happen within the next 3 years (approximately).

Joss has a serious workload ahead of him that has little to do with the verse, so unless Tim Minear is given the reins to a new show before then, I think we have a ways to go...

Until then we have a lot of Jossy goodness to look forward to. I'm gonna sound like a Care Bear when I say this but the show is never really gone as long as we have it in our hearts.

_____

We're still flying.

That's not much.

It's enough.

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