'V' for copying Serenity by dog13000

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

'V' for copying Serenity

POSTED BY: DOG13000
UPDATED: Monday, April 3, 2006 03:11
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VIEWED: 8010
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Saturday, March 18, 2006 12:39 PM

Hey everyone, I went to see "V for Vendetta" last night. I was plesently suprised, as I have been with the other movies I have seen this year tat I thought were only going to be "eh"

Anyway... *SPOILERS*

At the end of the movie, "V" is surrounded by the evil dictators men. He pretty much says "if you guys shoot me I will have killed you all before you could reload"

The soldiers say "yea right," and fire on him.

V lives, says "MY TURN" and then kills them all.

Now, talk about copycats....V IS RIVER!!!!

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"Someone Ever Tries to Kill You, You Try and Kill Em' Right Back"
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Very Shiny: www.fireflystore.spreadshirt.net
Even Shinier (Is that even a word? It is now...): www.reversedrive.com
AIM: dog13000 YSN: reverse_drive2g
E-Mail: louis@reversedrive.com

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 12:47 PM

MBUHMANN

Considering "V for Vendeta" was a graphic novel back in 1989 maybe it was Joss who was inspired and borrowed the idea? Granted, I haven't read the graphic novel so I can't confirm this but whatever.

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 12:53 PM

DOG13000

i don't know if the line is even in the comic...

-----
"Someone Ever Tries to Kill You, You Try and Kill Em' Right Back"
-----
Very Shiny: www.fireflystore.spreadshirt.net
Even Shinier (Is that even a word? It is now...): www.reversedrive.com
AIM: dog13000 YSN: reverse_drive2g
E-Mail: louis@reversedrive.com

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 12:55 PM

MATTCOZ

Haven't seen it yet, but how can it be copying if it's based on material that was around before Serenity?

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 1:22 PM

CITIZEN

I know the guy who wrote the Graphic novel also wrote the Graphic Novel that League of Extrodinary gentlemen was based on, and between that and V was so pissed off he has refused to have his name associated with them...

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No beast so fierce but knows some touch of pity. But I know none, and therefore am no beast.

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 1:56 PM

JOCKOCKEYOCK

it was a comic not a grafic novle

The court of this obsession, is abstracted from possession which when the worlds of outside in fall.

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 2:04 PM

SEBA

They're the exact same thing. Will Eisner just decided to start using the term graphic novel as a way to give the medium some sort of criticial merit. The vast majority of "graphic novels" are just trade paperbacks of serialized comic issues, not original long-form entities. By the way, Alan Moore, the person in question, is from one of the most revered comics writers of the past 25 years, so I'd definitely suggest picking up some of his printed material, especially before seeing Hollwood ruin them. Start with Watchmen (something else they're planning on desecrating).

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 3:01 PM

SINGATE

I hate to burst your bubble but the phrase 'my turn' has been around for a long time. I'm sure there are numerous uses of it in film but the one I remember off the top of my head is in "The Lost Boys". Near the end of the movie David is beating the hell out of Michael then he says 'my turn' and proceeds to kill David.

Even though it's from twenty years ago maybe I should have added a spoiler alert.

Edit: I think I screwed up. The 'my turn' I was thinking of occured at the end of "Blade". Frost says it to Blade after he gets all powered up. Always mix up my vampire flicks.
_________________________________________________

We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far.

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 8:41 PM

STORYMARK

Alan Moore removed his name from "V" before he saw a script or any of the film. He removed it as part of a fued with DC comics over the right sto this and other comics he did with them.

He began a policy after the adaptation of his "From Hell" that he does not take money for movies based on his work, giving his share to the artists who drew the comic.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 8:52 PM

TRIO

Eh, i wasnt that impressed with the movie...i give it a 6/10

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 9:14 PM

MATTEBLACK

The similarity I noticed was between "V" and "the operative". Both were working to create worlds they did not feel they should belong to.

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 10:12 PM

ROLAND19

I thought V was a lot like Mal, cuz they're both guys. Yeah.

-------------------------------------------------
The hardest thing in this world is to live in it. - Buffy

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Saturday, March 18, 2006 11:39 PM

3HEADEDMONKEY

Quote:
Originally posted by Seba:
They're the exact same thing.

No. Comics are usually shorter, and span many months. Graphic novels on the other hand are usually longer. "Sin City", for example, is based on a graphic novel, not a comic.

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Sunday, March 19, 2006 3:44 AM

SOLABUSCA

You're really completely out of your depth here, aren't you.

Sin City is based on a series of stories told in comic book format that have been collected into trade paperback/graphic novel format.

Allow me to direct you Wikipedia's Sin City entry:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sin_city

To wit:

Quote:
First published as Sin City in Dark Horse Presents issues #51-62 and 5th Anniversary Special (June 1991–June 1992), and reprinted as Sin City (The Hard Goodbye) (January 1993), The Hard Goodbye is the first comic book story that Frank Miller drew and wrote about the desperate denizens of Basin City/"Sin City". It was originally titled simply Sin City when it was released in the Dark Horse Presents Fifth Anniversary Special and issues Dark Horse Presents #51-62 , but it was given its own title in trade paperback form.

.j.

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Sunday, March 19, 2006 4:15 AM

JONUS

V for Vendetta is a movie everyone NEEDS to see. It is now my favorite movie.

I'm a Jedi.
I'm a Ringer.
I'm a BROWNCOAT.

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Sunday, March 19, 2006 5:48 AM

CHRISMOORHEAD

I didn't think it was all great, especially when compared to the graphic novel. The first half of the movie all the scenes felt rushed and consqequently, in my opinion, didn't convey as much information as they should have. The novel does a very dramatic and slow build up to finding little bits about who V "might" be and his possible motives as each different person.

Also, they made him too human in the movie. While they make his fascination with Evey very obviouse in the novel, he never breaks down and cries because of her. In my assumption, I think it's because he's lost a great deal of his humanity. It almost makes him seem god-like, and at the end of the novel he sets out with the full intention of being shot like, "This is how I've planned it to go", while in the movie it was the classic, "I'll do it because I must" hero type of thing.

In all I think it was a decent movie, but they comprimised a lot of the original genius for the sake of attracting more people and not losing the general populace's short attention span.

Have you ever:
Used your teeth as wire strippers?
Given yourself stitches?
Made improvised munitions with no base supplies?
Pissed in a canteen?
Gone a month without bathing?

If so, you MIGHT just be a !HOOAH MOTHERF*CKER!

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Sunday, March 19, 2006 6:16 AM

FINN MAC CUMHAL

Hollywood turned a piece of brilliant mature literature into a glorification of terrorism. I can see why Moore wouldn’t want to be associated with it. In the novel, V was portrayed as corrupt and immoral as the government he opposed, and Hammond was a young 16 year old girl that he brainwashed. The movie made it appear as if V were some righteous freedom fighter and Hammond was a much older and less impressionable women whom V shown the light. That's a poor interpretation. The theme of the novel was to contrast anarchy and fascism, not to portray one as better then the other. The novel was designed to make you think, the movie was closer to propaganda.

And on top of that it was boring. Throughout the movie I kept thinking, ‘Natalie Portman shaved her head for this?’

Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.

Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.

-- Cicero

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 5:16 PM

SEBA

Quote:
Originally posted by 3HeadedMonkey:
Quote:
Originally posted by Seba:
They're the exact same thing.

No. Comics are usually shorter, and span many months. Graphic novels on the other hand are usually longer. "Sin City", for example, is based on a graphic novel, not a comic.

3Headed...I have a degree in Sequential Art and have been making/reading comics & graphic novels since I was 5. I know the difference. As already mentioned, Sin City was originally a serialized comic before being released as trade paperback volumes.

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 5:22 PM

SEBA

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Hollywood turned a piece of brilliant mature literature into a glorification of terrorism.

Given Hollywood's recent craze of raping every source they can for original story material, I've come to expect little but garbage when it comes to these types of adaptations. The last one I honestly enjoyed was LOTR. And maybe Sin City, given Miller's insistance of quality, but really, Sin City was so close to the source material that I didn't really see a need for it at all when I could just pick up the book.

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 5:36 PM

KAYNA

I love my captain

Quote:
Originally posted by singate:
Edit: I think I screwed up. The 'my turn' I was thinking of occured at the end of "Blade". Frost says it to Blade after he gets all powered up. Always mix up my vampire flicks.

I don't know about Blade, it may be in there as well but you were right about Lost Boys. Except it was David who had the line. Micheal had just missed in an attempt to skewer David who then felt very superior and said it.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Op: You're fighting a war you've already lost.
Mal: Yeah, well I'm known for that.

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 6:26 PM

MATTCOZ

Lost Boys, great flic. Gotta love any movie that has Jack Bauer, Bill S. Preston Esquire, and the two Coreys.

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 7:40 PM

SINGATE

Thanks for the follow up, guess my memory hasn't failed too badly. Haven't watched Lost Boys in a while. Did watch Blade recently and the line occurs just like I thought.

_________________________________________________

We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far.

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 7:46 PM

MEANGOLDFISH

V for Vendetta was a graphic novel (that they released in sections, ie: comics) long before Firefly was out, but the movie changed a lot. That whole scene where V attacks those guys and kills them before they reload is not in the book. Do I think that V for Vendetta copied Serenity? No, not at all.

Alan Moore doesn't attatch his name to any movies based on his work, as a rule. If you want to know how it should be, read it. I guess that's his whole thing.

I just see a lot of argument, and I thought I'd throw my two cents in there. I think it's a stretch to compare it to Serenity, a big one, that I think people just want there to be, but it isn't there.

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 8:26 PM

N0SKILLZ

Ok, so i havn't decided if i like this movie or not. Mostly cuz i'm not sure if those frakking Wachowski brothers, horribly butched a good comic(or graphic novel , whichever you prefer), just like they did to the Matrix.

Also, looking at how they stole things for their last movies, i think there is a good chance they stole things from recent movies, and such. Also there are to many paralells with current events to just be coincedence.

I'd really like to read the comics to come up with my own conclusion as to if it was good or not.

-------------------------------
RAF Lakenheath
Security Deputy of the Sereni-Tree
"I can't feel my Danger Zone" Jayne Muppet!
http://walkerboh.deviantart.com/

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 8:45 PM

MEANGOLDFISH

umm, well, the movie is quite a bit different than the book. they changed it to make it apply more to modern times, in the book, the government is more like nazi germany, with no gays, nob minorities, death camps, and so on. religion also plays a bigger part.

i don't see why you have to read the comic to see whether or not you thought it was a good movie. you can see how faithful it is, and stuff like that, but if it's a good movie, you should know before you go in and check the background stuff.

but they did a lot of things to make the story a lot more... movie like (?). if they would have just copied the book over exactly, it would have been a very boring movie.

the movie does keep the same spirit and feel that the book does, but it does it with more flash and style.

i found the movie to be a lot easier to relate to than when i read it, because our government is a lot closer to the one in the movie than death camps and "ethnic cleansing".

so, what one do i like better? i'm not sure, they're two very different animals, but at the same time, very similar. i think that they're both good, but i don't see myself reading it more than a few times.

and if you show an interest in graphic novels after this movie (like a few of my friends have), i don't suggest starting with V for Vendetta, it'll come off as quite boring.
Start with Watchmen, but then again, after that, everything else will seem like complete garbage (The Dark Knight Returns excluded)

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Saturday, April 1, 2006 11:04 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD

Has anyone else noticed the amount of uninformed morons out there thinking that this movie is equating the Fascist regime in the movie with the Bush administration? I even heard someone refer to the T.V. Propaganda guy (I forget his name, just that his nickname in the comic was "The Voice") as a parallel to FOX News. Considering what a main role he played in a 1980's comic, I find it hard to believe he was based off of the FOX News Network.

There's been a whole lot more from what I've seen and heard, too. People are takings stuff that was in the original graphic novel and talking about it like it was put in the movie to attack Bush. I for one cannot even believe so many people liked the movie at all, but it's even more annoying when the reasons they give are based off of totally inaccurate ascertains as to the intention of the film.

To me, it's speaking volumes about how baseless the hate people have for Bush is. I'm not talking about people who disagree with him or dislike him, or even those who say they flat out hate him, but those morons out there who have an absolute vehement hatred for him, who can't go a single day without giving a speech about how horrible he is... can they find nothing better to do with their time than look for insults in a Hollywood movie? Personally, I think that if you look too hard for evil that eventually you're just going to start seeing it in places that it doesn't exist.

Have you ever:
Used your teeth as wire strippers?
Given yourself stitches?
Made improvised munitions with no base supplies?
Pissed in a canteen?
Gone a month without bathing?

If so, you MIGHT just be a !HOOAH MOTHERF*CKER!

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Sunday, April 2, 2006 8:07 AM

MATTCOZ

Quote:
Originally posted by meangoldfish:
in the book, the government is more like nazi germany, with no gays, nob minorities, death camps, and so on. religion also plays a bigger part.

Umm... that was in the movie. Maybe they didn't focus on it as much, but it was all there.

Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisMoorhead:
Has anyone else noticed the amount of uninformed morons out there thinking that this movie is equating the Fascist regime in the movie with the Bush administration?

Oh I know, it's ridiculous.

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Sunday, April 2, 2006 9:07 AM

MEANGOLDFISH

Quote:
Originally posted by mattcoz:
Quote:
Originally posted by meangoldfish:
in the book, the government is more like nazi germany, with no gays, nob minorities, death camps, and so on. religion also plays a bigger part.
Umm... that was in the movie. Maybe they didn't focus on it as much, but it was all there.

yeah, it was there, but it was more like it was hinted at the whole time, it wasn't as in your face as it was in the book, which is what i meant, i guess i didn't say it clearly enough or something.

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Sunday, April 2, 2006 11:11 AM

PINGJING

Quote:
Originally posted by Seba:
They're the exact same thing. Will Eisner just decided to start using the term graphic novel as a way to give the medium some sort of criticial merit. The vast majority of "graphic novels" are just trade paperbacks of serialized comic issues, not original long-form entities. By the way, Alan Moore, the person in question, is from one of the most revered comics writers of the past 25 years, so I'd definitely suggest picking up some of his printed material, especially before seeing Hollwood ruin them. Start with Watchmen (something else they're planning on desecrating).

I actually recommend watching the movie before reading the graphic novel/comic. People tend to regard the original as the Bible, that it should be represented exactly as it was, but like Meangoldfish said, movies and comics are two different animals. What is portrayed as subtle and carefully developed in a comic simply can't be portrayed the same way in a movie. It's like we saw in Serenity - it's a short, two-hour time span, and the development of the plot has to fit in that time. Also, the medium is different. This is a live-action film we're talking about, which can't (and shouldn't) replicate the artistic interpretation of the comics. Actually, s long as people keep all of that in mind, it shouldn't matter which they read/watch first. But you should definitely allow yourself some time before jumping into the other version.

Julia

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Sunday, April 2, 2006 12:11 PM

REGINAROADIE

The line may be similar, but it's the intent behind it that separates the two.

River's "My turn" is a line that signifies her act of sacrifice, while V's "MY TURN" is more indicative of a sadistic pleasure.

Just saw V FOR VENDETTA on Friday. While it was a bit different from the original graphic novel, it still was an immensely satisfying film. I loved the ending, with Parlaiment Hill being blown up with Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture blaring over the soundtrack and Evey's last line. "He was Edmond Dantés. And he was my father, and my mother. My brother, and my friend. He was you...and me. He was all of us."

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
"I think one of the greatest things about modern America is the computerization of medical records. As a volunteer sheriff, I can look up anyone's psychiatric records and their surgical histories. Yeast infections. There are a huge number of yeast infections in this county. Probably...because we're down river...from that old bread factory."

Dwight - The Office - 209 - E-mail Surveillance

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Monday, April 3, 2006 3:11 AM

PSOLARIS

Quote:
Originally posted by singate:
I hate to burst your bubble but the phrase 'my turn' has been around for a long time. I'm sure there are numerous uses of it in film but the one I remember off the top of my head is in "The Lost Boys". Near the end of the movie David is beating the hell out of Michael then he says 'my turn' and proceeds to kill David.

Even though it's from twenty years ago maybe I should have added a spoiler alert.

Edit: I think I screwed up. The 'my turn' I was thinking of occured at the end of "Blade". Frost says it to Blade after he gets all powered up. Always mix up my vampire flicks.
_________________________________________________

No Singate, you're right...that line is said in The Lost Boys, only it's said by David. Michael and David are up in the air and Michael is pushing David backwards towards the deer antlers hanging up on the wall, only they miss and David looks at Michael and says "My turn." (it's one of my favorite movies...I know it by heart). It is also said in Blade by Frost in the scene you mentioned.

V is not copying anyone here...many movies use the same lines and phrases sometimes. If we all said that they can't use the same lines from time to time, we'd all be watching silent films again because they'd run outta cool things to say.

Psolaris

"Ten percent of nuthin' is...let me do the math here...nuthin' into nuthin'...carry the nuthin'"

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