Sticky situation with new converts... by LadyKnight

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Sticky situation with new converts...

POSTED BY: LADYKNIGHT
UPDATED: Sunday, November 5, 2006 03:09
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VIEWED: 5596
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Friday, November 3, 2006 3:23 PM

I introduced this couple I know to Firefly. I think they were hooked from the time the other guy who was there when we started watching the pilot, and was making fun of it, left. Anyway...so, in under a month, they'd watched the whole series, and then the movie.

...then they wigged out.

What are we suppose to do about this? Wash's death, painful as it is to us, has to be worse for the new converts who are only just attaching themselves to these people, who see it as completly unnecessary and are suddenly alinated from the entire show! Now I'm scared to show the movie to all the other people I'm working on converting. I honestly don't know what to do about it.

I've got my mom's roommates's son's girlfiend on the hook now. As I don't have my disk 1 (lent it out over the summer to a girl who was leaving for collage...have serious doubts of ever seeing it again) I started her on "Out of Gas" and am moving on through the grittier eposodes, 'cause I know that's what she'll like. But what am I suppose to do when we've seen all the eposodes and it comes time to watch the movie...how do I know it won't alinate her too?

Is there some way of cautioning people for this? Like...this friend of mine and I are trading obsession introduction. She introduced me to Fire Emblem, I'm introducing her to Firely. (She's never seen an eposode, but can already tell off the top of her head which character I'm describing when I GM our firefly roleplays) and, while I THINK I know her well enough to trust that random character death won't ailinate her from the show as a whole (I've already told her people die in the movie...) how can I be sure?

and, most importantly, how can I get over this really bad phobia I've suddely developed of introducing new browncoat recruits to the BDM?

One day.
One mission.
One army of Browncoats.
On June 23rd, we aim to misbehave.
http://www.serenityday.org/

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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:00 PM

CALIFORNIAKAYLEE

I've actually had a fairly similar problem.

My entire family are Browncoats, but their opinions about the BDM vary greatly. We were all converted over the past year. My husband and I saw Serenity in the theater, and liked it but didn't rush out to buy the series.

Then a woman my dad works with loaned him her DVDs of the series. He and my mom started watching it, and absolutely loved it, so they bought me a copy for my birthday. My husband and I sat down and watched the series in the space of about three days. We thought it was much better than the BDM, and while we weren't surprised by some of the things in the pilot episode (what Simon is hiding, Kaylee doesn't die, etc), we overall enjoyed the experience of the series, and went out and bought the BDM on DVD.

Around that same time, my parents had introduced my three youngest siblings to the show, and they bought the BDM as well. They all *hated* it. With a passion. My sister called me and griped for a half an hour about Mal's suspenders being rubber in the movie. His suspenders! And don't even get her started on the topic of Wash's death!

The oldest of my brothers still hadn't seen the show or the movie, and we were determined to convert him as well. I called him up and told him in no uncertain terms that he needed to watch things in a very specific order, and not to listen to what anyone else in the family told him to do. I told him to watch in this order:

1. The pilot episode
2. The BDM
3. The rest of the series

I was on instant messenger with him the night he started watching, and after the pilot ep he told me that the show was really awesome, and then went straight to the BDM. After that, he said he liked the show better, but enjoyed the movie a lot, and was looking forward to watching the rest of the show. After he'd finished with the show, he watched the BDM again, and then called me. He said that he still really liked the movie, but preferred the show. Six months later, he still loves the BDM and watches it often (though not as often as the series, I think), and the rest of my family is still disappointed with the BDM, though I think my dad is starting to come around.

So there you have it, that's my recommendation. I think watching the show in such quick succession, followed immediately by the movie, can be a huge emotional let-down. Wash's death is that much more sudden and unfair, and all the small differences (ie, Mal's suspenders

) stand out more. Just like I wouldn't ask someone to watch Firefly without telling them that it got cancelled before the first season was even over, I don't think it's fair to subject a new fan to all of the series and BDM in such a short time frame without any warning about Wash.

My two cents, anyhow.

~CK

You can't take the sky from me...

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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:51 PM

TEACHDAIRE

I'm looking at a similar problem in a couple of weeks. I got my boss hooked with the pilot, he's limiting himself to 2 episodes per week, and will then watch the BDM. He's on OOG at the moment.

Help...

I've got a performance review next month...

-------------------------------------------------
For every battle honour, a thousand heroes die along, unremembered and unsung...

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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:53 PM

FLORALBUNNY

Hated the rubber suspenders, myself.
And trading in the amber Serenity glow for the
Prussian blue scheme. Yuck.
Was glad I'd been spoiled before watching BDM.
But it's still unforgiveable, the wastage of
two characters that way...
*gets grip on self*
Must. Stop. Now.

bun
~Bastards singed my turtle~

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:13 PM

LADYKNIGHT

Thanks for the reccomendation, CaliforniaKaylee. I'll keep that in mind.

Problem is, I don't have the pilot eposode available to me. Anybody know what I should do?

One day.
One mission.
One army of Browncoats.
On June 23rd, we aim to misbehave.
http://www.serenityday.org/

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:33 PM

CALIFORNIAKAYLEE

If you don't think you're going to get that first DVD back, you could replace those first three episodes by buying the individual eps here: http://www.amazon.com/Serenity/dp/B000H4XMPY/sr=1-1/qid=1162611096/ref
=sr_1_1/002-7739866-7185662?ie=UTF8&s=digital-video

They're $2 each, and it works just like iTunes but with fewer technical restrictions (from what I've heard -- I've never used iTunes).

~CK

You can't take the sky from me...

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Friday, November 3, 2006 7:10 PM

LADYKNIGHT

SHINY! Thanks so much!

One day.
One mission.
One army of Browncoats.
On June 23rd, we aim to misbehave.
http://www.serenityday.org/

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Friday, November 3, 2006 7:59 PM

SIRI

As a new Firefly convert myself, I'd agree that seeing the movie first (which is what I did) might make it easier to take. I rented Serenity this summer from Blockbuster and while I thought it was a great movie - I guess I didn't watch the outtakes or commentaries - bc somehow I didn't pick up on the series.

I just discovered Firefly a couple of months ago after watching Buffy DVD and seeing Nathan playing Caleb on Buffy. I was so impressed with his acting that I was led to Firefly. Was immediately hooked and found this site.

I've watched the series twice and am going to watch Serenity again. When I watched it the first time I hadn't really gotten to know the characters in the same way as if I'd watched the series first. I'm glad I know about the deaths but it will still be hard to watch this time around.

If Firefly should get picked up and more episodes are made, there could be prequels to Serenity that could bring back the dead.

"Thread of life, gate to death, open heart, every breath."

Siri

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Friday, November 3, 2006 8:10 PM

KELAI

Well said -- my whole family saw the BDM before the series, and so introducing them to the BDM was no hurt for them because they hadn't seen the series first and din't develop any character attachments. After my dad watched the series, oddly enough he only developed a connection to ... Jayne. Makes fun of Washie and Simon.

Back on topic, I have a good friend who should be introducced to our 'verse by the end of the year -- she's a friend in a group of friends, so she's already heard us grieve over Wash, though I'm not sure she really listened.

'Sides she ain't the kind to cry or develop attachments.

Thanks for the advice -- might prove helpful in my browncoat recruiting future.

--
//breathe today So many lies s w i r l i n g
All A R O U N D You
you're S U F F O C A T I N G
the e m p t y shape in Y O U
s t e a l s your b r e a t h

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Friday, November 3, 2006 9:32 PM

MAGHAFFAR

I came to FF thru seeing the BDM first, so for me it was actually BETTER in a way... First off, losing Wash and Book was not the angst-grinder it would've been had I gotten attached to all the characters from the series first. The BDM stands alone as it's supposed to -- the incongruities between event sequences / plot lines isn't apparent if you see the BDM first, and then once you know how FOX made Joss & Tim jump thru hoops and how they got generally jacked around with the eps sequence, then watching FF on the DVDs is way better than having to sit thru the commercials, etc. from the original FOX airings.

Either you get hooked or at least intrigued by the BDM and check out the series and fall in love with the 'Verse -- or yah don't.

I've put the BDM on several times so far when friends drop in to hang out, and either they've already seen it (in which case I tell 'em it came from the "Firefly" TV series on FOX & if they want some free CD-ROMS of the shows to check it out, no problemo) or they will usually sit down and watch it. One guy remarked he'd seen it listed in theatres way back in sept. '05 but never saw it cuz it looked stupid -- those poster ads were not the greatest -- but was definitely impressed when it started going. So he's a "certainly interested" prospect.

So all in all, I think the BDM is a good intro to get people interested in seeing the series, in which case, the series should have an even better impact on them than the BDM. Was that way for me.

==================================================================
Jonathan M.A.Ghaffar - Your Firefly/Serenity MP3 Ringtone Smuggler!
Free MP3 uploader (PC) at: www.tonethis.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------
MAGhaffar@wayoftheseekers.com
http://www.WAYoftheSEEKERS.com
http://www.TombofJesus.com --> www.alislam.org

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Saturday, November 4, 2006 12:05 AM

EVILBUNGLE

I saw Movie first, then full series (about a year later) followed by Film again straiht away. coming from the series the film is a big let down! best way to introduce people in my opinion is to feed them slowly. I give people discs of the pilot, they then tend to go out and buy series on their own as they want more. once all the episodes are finished it can be hard to keep going, but don't we all feel that?

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Saturday, November 4, 2006 2:09 AM

ZZETTA13

LadyKnight I hear and understand your situation. I,myself have gotten my sister, her daughter and her boyfriend to watch the FF series. They completed the viewing in 2 days then wanted the BDM. Well I gave it to them. That was around 2 weeks ago and I haven't heard back. I'm thinking it's just because we're so ruttin busy.

Anyway,if your friends have become true bowncoats ask them to join this site. There are plenty of browncoats here that say Wash ain't dead. There's even a thread on here somewhere that has about 250 posts debating that very question. I see that you've even posted a theard yourself about what would happened and what our BDH would have become (?) had the series continued. Ask your friends to give you their thoughts on how they feel Joss should continue Firefly. Or they can write short stories of their own. There are tons of ways they can revive Serenity's pilot. Remember what Wash said. "I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch me soar." A leaf may touch the ground but can always be blown back into the air.

Z

"I've been to the desert on a horse with no name. It felt good to be out of the rain." America

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Saturday, November 4, 2006 3:27 AM

BROWNCOAT555

not sure what to say to a newbie about that but I do think the previously-mentioned idea of having a newbie watch the pilot first, Serenity second, and then the rest of the series is a good one.

storywise, it does make sense. Bok is not going to be of much help if Mal ends up fighting a new war...heck, Bok might actually be on the other side given his Alliance connections as alluded to in the series.

and Wash's death actually gives the Zoe character more depth. Mal, Zoe, and River are the main characters in this present story. Everyone else is a foil character, well-written though they may be.

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Saturday, November 4, 2006 3:56 AM

PUMAMANREDUX

folks have archived the F*x versions of the episodes online so this might help the poster with no disc one (ie LadyKnight)

http://tvlinks.voodeedoo.org/Firefly_links.html

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Saturday, November 4, 2006 4:18 AM

PDCHARLES

What happened? He see your face?

Don't fear the reaper...

If they are surprised, shocked, upset about Wash and Book, that means they care! ...and that means Browncoat!

Convert away!

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Saturday, November 4, 2006 7:27 PM

KELAI

Oh, I remember that thread, the one with the diagram of ALan with all his organs and area of impact?

Wash ain't dead in no way. he is in our hearts, zoe's heart, my heart, and that can't change nuthin'. Hope he is alive, in teh flesh though.

--

//breathe today So many lies s w i r l i n g
All A R O U N D You
you're S U F F O C A T I N G
the e m p t y shape in Y O U
s t e a l s your b r e a t h

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Saturday, November 4, 2006 7:30 PM

KELAI

oh, oh, here's the shiny thread ->

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=19261

--

//breathe today So many lies s w i r l i n g
All A R O U N D You
you're S U F F O C A T I N G
the e m p t y shape in Y O U
s t e a l s your b r e a t h

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Sunday, November 5, 2006 1:53 AM

ZZETTA13

mornin everyone

Kelai, I see that the "Wash is Alive and Well" thread has been bumped. I've always liked reading it.Ppl come of with some good ideas.

Anyhoo, since my sister has borrowed my Serenity dvd and I haven't heard from her in over 2 weeks I decided to give her a call. She was out shopping with one of her older daughters(she has 4). She tells me that the daughter that she is shopping with got very upset while watching Serenity and got up and walked out right after Wash's death.I never realized the emotions could get so strong in a newbie so I will have to rethink how I approach folks with the final chapter (so far) of the Joss verse.

Z

Mal " Kaylee. Kaylee, I've got a job for you."
Kaylee "I'm not talking to you captain."
Mal " No need for talk,come on."

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Sunday, November 5, 2006 2:32 AM

BROWNCOAT555

I just read PB's initial post about Wash still being alive and I wanted to respond here since reason has no place in that thread.

Yes, this is a work of fiction and, yes, Joss could bring Wash back. But that would be UBER-LAME. It would be fan service of the worst kind.

Think about it, the 2 least important characters died and they can always appear in dreams/flashbacks. Did you notice how Jayne said "Shepherd Bok used to say...". Now, there are two ways to just magically introduce story hooks "Shepher Bok used to say..." and "Wash, our former pilot, used to say...".

I liked the Wash character, he was an easygoing, playful character for the slower-paced TV series. Now, the franchise is on the silver screen and it moves much faster and goes into grimmer territory.

Killing off peripheral characters is part of that.

I do long for another TV series (new cast but exploring the Blue Sun arc as the main plot). That would rock.

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Sunday, November 5, 2006 3:03 AM

STEAMER

This thing with killing Wash off - I've always wondered if that's one of the reasons the BDM didn't do so hot at the box office, if fans of the show were so shocked and angered by the slaying that they refused to see it again and passed the word on to their friends. I knew about it before I saw the show or the movie, and I knew about it because I had read.... http://www.swartzer.com/writing/serenity2000.php
"Serenity in 2,000 Words or Less." Reading that better prepared me for THE SCENE, methinks. Just maybe might be an easier way to break the bad news to your converts....

Mal and Zoe catch
Wash off guard
"Take me, sir,
Take me hard!"
FIREFLY

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Sunday, November 5, 2006 3:09 AM

BROWNCOAT555

I agree that the death of Wash in the film is probably the biggest reason it did not make any money at the box office.

It would be like having Han Solo killed off in A New Hope...sure, he is not the main character but you start to like the guy and want him to be around for more than just one film.

Basically, Wash dying made sense if you look at Serenity as the second season of Firefly. But if you just look at it as a theatrical release, it was a bit harsh. In retrospect, it probably was a mistake, not for the story as a whole but just when it happened (i.e. during the first theatrical release).

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