Weapons Of The 76th by DocJubal

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Weapons Of The 76th

POSTED BY: DOCJUBAL
UPDATED: Thursday, December 21, 2006 22:55
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Sunday, December 17, 2006 12:11 PM

As the official longarm of the 76th Independent Battalion is the G36, and all its variants, I thought I'd start this thread with some basic information for our volunteers, whilst I am awaiting my shipment for kitbashing.

"Kitbashing", for beginning propmakers, is the art of taking an existing model and altering it into something else... so-called, I suspect, because sometimes the temptation to knock your base model about the shop is all but overwhelming. *g*

About the G36. The real-life weapons system, the Heckler and Koch G36, comes in several flavors.
This weapon:

... is a good, clear picture of the G36K (either "kompact" or "karbine"; I've found varying designations for the K-model). The G36K has a middling length front grip, with four lozenge shaped vent holes a side, as shown on this Airsplat model:

If you're a purist, the standard rifleman for the 76th would carry this arm.

If you're on a budget, though, any of the shorter-barreled airsoft models will do. These have two holes on the forestock, and portray what in real life is the G36C ("commando" or ***really*** compact.

) Tristan has these pics to show:

Any trooper carrying these is doing right fine by themselves.

Here's a comparison view:

If you're a heavy weapon specialist, medic, or the like, I recommend looking for the G36C airsoft models put out by Double Eagle. They allow you to take the forearm guard and stock off, providing you a very very short weapon as your Personal Defense Weapon. (We'll speak of alternatives for the grenadier, anti-roller specialist, and the like later.)

For volunteers on a budget? Two other pieces of advice when Ebay surfing.

-- Look for the "spring" airsoft rifles; they are less expensive than the motorized airsoft rifles.
-- Make sure you look for a 1:1 scale model. Some airsofties are 2/3 or 3/4 scale, not full scale.

If there are G36Cs and G36Ks, what's the plain old G36?

This is a picture of the airsoft version of the G36. six vent holes, a long foreguard, long barrel. The real weapon has a slightly longer barrel forward of the grip, with a long flash hider.

Since the "average weapon" on the screen carried by Independents is a G36K (four holes), I recommend using models of G36s for sniper and LMG kitbashing.

Finally, there's the SL8, a civilian version of the G36, which makes a great looking sniper rifle if you properly repaint it:

Next: Sidearms of the Independents...

--------------------
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Sunday, December 17, 2006 4:13 PM

TRISTAN

Thank you for this, Doc! Looking good so far.
When I get the chance, I'll take some photos of the Double Eagle G36 with the barrel and stock removed. It really is a very compact little piece after that.

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Sunday, December 17, 2006 7:52 PM

NICODEMUS

Another variant of the G36 is the MG36.

Quote:

Details

The G36 family of weapons is an example of the new thinking in assault weaponry. They are constructed mostly of high strength polymers with metal used where appropriate. The MG36 is a light machine gun variant carrying 100 rounds in a single, dual ammo drum.
Real World Statistics

*
Caliber: 5.56×45 mm NATO
*
Action: Patented short-stroke gas piston
*
Country of origin: Germany
*
Design Company: Heckler and Koch
*
Upgrades: sights (laser-dot or telescopic)

So it's basically the full length G36 with a bipod and twin-drum magazine. Shouldn't be too difficult to kitbash one of these (says the guy who's never attempted to do anything of the sort).

**************
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Monday, December 18, 2006 2:16 AM

DOCJUBAL

Quote:
Originally posted by Nicodemus:
...

So (the MG36 light machine gun) is basically the full length G36 with a bipod and twin-drum magazine. Shouldn't be too difficult to kitbash one of these (says the guy who's never attempted to do anything of the sort).

If you get one of the six-hole G36 airsofties, all you need to do is build a bigger magazine. Now, the occasional Hero Arms C-mag is out there on eBay, for 60.00 or so (plus s&h, of course)... however, another alternative suggests itself. One could make a "box magazine" instead of the double-drum. This is made easier by the fact that the G36 airsoft magazines have cunning little snaps on either side, so you can put 'em together side-by-side. Originally done to make it easier to do a fast reload -- since the full clip is right there, next to the one you emptied -- this would allow you to snap several together, cover 'em in cardboard or such, and hey presto! There's your box magazine.

After the holidays, I look to play around with various alternatives for the squad support gunners out there, and post the results here.

--------------------
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Monday, December 18, 2006 2:50 AM

DOCJUBAL

SIDEARMS OF THE INDEPENDENTS:

Our basic costuming rules set forth the G36 and its variants as the primary longarm of the Battalion, following the art direction of the original series.

That being said, the CO and XO recognized that many of us will have some pre-existing hall costumes, many of which come with prop sidearms. Consequently, the decision was made to allow personal sidearms of any reasonable type to be worn as part of the 76th's uniform, as long as the volunteer marches with a G36.

Let me start this off by reassuring the cash-strapped costumers among us -- you don't need a personal sidearm to make your costume work. One nice thing about the browncoat and vest is that hardly any belts, strapping, combat harness, etc. are needed to make a cunning 76'er costume. Think Civil War, not Desert Storm.

The lack of combat harness means, happily, that you don't need to spend money on filling up the harness with "soldier kit". Iff'n you have some props, great! But you needn't fret if you don't. Start with a simple brown leather belt... and then think about what to hang off it.

But let's say you're thinkin' to have a post-War hall costume as well as a 76th uniform. You want a fine sidearm at your hip. What to do?

We see a wide variety of pistols in the Sereniverse. This means, in practice, that almost any airsoft or prop piece would do in a pinch. However... y'all want a shiny piece, like the Cap'n carried, right? (I know you do.)

Some of you will have heard of http://www.quantummechanix.com/ ,Quantum Mechanix, the new prop firm which has been authorized by Blue Sun.... ummm, Universal... to issue props molded directly from the movie originals. They're offering a superb replica of Mal's sidearm. But the price is dear, at $249.00. I hope folks are buying this version, and showing Universal there's a market, but unless you're well-off, I think the price is too high.

Fortunately, there's another answer. Head over to eBay and look up Wilco Models. Better yet, let me point you there...

http://myworld.ebay.com/wilcomodels

This firm has a good reputation in the hobby modeling community for quality models at a reasonable price. They've decided to support the Browncoat community in a handsome way, with a goodly model of Mal's pistol... for only 40.00, plus s&h.

Now, you have to glue the grips to the frame, paint the thing... but that's a little effort for a fine prop, eh? And a MUCH nicer price than the prior one.

Another nice thing about Wilco? Look further in their listings. If you "want to be bad guys", they're also marketing a replica of Jayne's sidearm, based on the beautiful LeMat revolver. 45.00 plus s&h. OOOohhhhhhh... Now, this looks to be a mite more complicated to build, as they wanted the cylinder to actually move. (How fun is that?) But if you've built resin models, it's worth a look.

Speaking of Jayne... another option for the modeling challenged. Google around on "LeMat replica", and you'll find some replica weapons sellers with ranges of replica, non-firing, Civil War revolvers. Lemats can often be found at those stores. They won't have the toprail, or quite the same underbarrel, as Jayne's weapon, but they'll be quite close. About 60.00 a pop, near as I can conjure. Slightly more money, but you can slide it right into the (brown!) leather holster of your choice, no buildout needed.

Still speaking of Jayne... Jayne carried a bowie knife. If you feel a need to carry a knife on your costume, a Bowie would most fit the "look" of an Independent kit. Make VERY sure you secure the knife in your sheath, and secure it well. Trust an old Ren Faire hand -- there are people who WILL come up beside you and try and "see if the blade is real". DUMB people, but they're out there.

Next: Jubal finds (pictures) of grenades!

--------------------
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Monday, December 18, 2006 3:11 AM

FIREFLYGAL

I must say, Doc, your post is perfect, right to the point for what we're carrying. Great for the new recruit! And us "veterans" (who signed up a month ago)

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Monday, December 18, 2006 3:23 AM

DOCJUBAL

Quote:
Originally posted by fireflygal:
I must say, Doc, your post is perfect ...

In truth, ma'am, this isn't hard at all. The basic inspiration Joss worked from, and the very clear art direction provided in Serenity pt 1 and Message, make it very easy to do this sort of thing.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 5:18 AM

TRISTAN

Morning, weapons enthusiasts!
This is looking good! Lots of helpful info here...thank you again, Doc!

Quick note on the sidearms, and I am not trying to step on toes...it is not necessary to stick with the pistols of the BDH's. There were countless types of handguns used throughout the series, so just about any handgun will work. Airsoft and it's clones have literally hundreds of different types ranging from $5.00 up through a few hundred dollars apiece. The officers (myself and BWTP, actually) are probably going to be carrying the "combat" version of the P-99...extended barrel and extended magazine. It looks pretty good, and they are very inexpensive.
So, that's something else to keep in mind. Although I would not mind at all getting my hands on one of those QMX replicas....

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Monday, December 18, 2006 5:45 AM

DOCJUBAL

Quote:
Originally posted by Tristan:
... Quick note on the sidearms, and I am not trying to step on toes...it is not necessary to stick with the pistols of the BDH's. There were countless types of handguns used throughout the series, so just about any handgun will work.

Nary a toe stepped on, Colonel. It's a good point to reiterate.

Inexpensive is GOOD.

If you don't have a sidearm, you don't need one.

If you have a prop sidearm, it's already good enough, and follows the usages set forth in the series.

If you want a sidearm like the BDH's used, you don't need to spend in the triple digits.

Inexpensive is GOOD. After all, we need to get y'all TO Atlanta...

--------------------
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Monday, December 18, 2006 6:15 AM

TRISTAN

Thank you, Doc.
I guess I should have said the same thing you did...sidearms are not a necessity, so there's no pressure to get one. I would rather have an army of people without sidearms than have the possibility someone would not show up because they did not have one. I hope that made sense...

Oh, and if you do get a pistol, and don't have a holster, check with Saxon, who has a large number of holsters available: saxon1014@hotmail.com
Feel free to make you own, too!

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Monday, December 18, 2006 6:32 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

Okay, I stopped by the local paintball/airsoft shop Saturday and checked to see if they carry the G36K. Of course they didn't, but the counter guy is going to see if he can order it. They had two versions of the G36C on display, the $20 or so model that most here seem to be getting, and a higher end model that retailed for $65.00. This one was far sturdier and had a better heft in my opinion. I was tempted to buy it right there, but with Xmas shopping left to do I have put it off until after the 1st of the year. I want to wait to see if they can get hold of the K or not & what their price might be. I still have a K inroute that should be here this week.

I went ahead and started piecing together my kit for the parade this weekend and was wondering if there is anything equipment wise we can't carry. I have a D-guard bowie knife I want to carry due to the frontier feel of the blade and as an homage to the War Between the States influence of the series. I also have a couple of different airsoft pistols as well as my Mal replica pistol I may carry. Thanks to the shiny pattern I received from our CO, I will finally have a proper holster for my Mal pistol, so I may wind up carrying it since sources indicate that the Mal pistol was some sort of Independent issue sidearm.

I also have been looking at carrying some OD Green ammo pouches, a small med pouch, and a canteen. Nothing too bulky.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 7:06 AM

TRISTAN

BrownCoat1, thanks for the update. We are looking forward to hearing the details on the "K" version you get ahold of. The more I think about it, the more likely I am to get one for myself. Besides, that means I'll have more loaner weapons if I carry that one! Right? (Back me up here!

)

As for what you can't carry...well, there is nothing that really springs to mind. Don't go overboard with the sidearms. I think one per person would be enough. I also think swords are out...I never saw one on any of the Independents. But knives, no problem.
Pouches, etc, sound good. Again, it's not necessary to have an ALICE rig or anything, but belt pouches for extra ammo would be great. I also noticed several of the Independents with shoulder bags which I figured were for ammo. This was verified by Mal in The Message when he pulled a magazine from his shoulder bag (even if the weapon was not a G36!). I have plans to design and build a few of that kind of bag out of leather, and will probably have a few extra to sell.

Hope that answers that.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 8:17 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

Consider yourself backed up Tristan.

I agree though, getting a K would allow you to have an extra weapon as a loaner if someone needs one.

I planned on only one sidearm as more would be cumbersome and ruin our attempts at a uniform appearance. I had considered a sword, but quickly discounted it as we are going for a field look. There may be a sword for dress uniforms for officers and NCOs, but that is a whole other topic and one that doesn't need to be broached right now.

I was going to skip the ALICE pack or even a buttpack to avoid encumberance and to prevent overheating in that lovely Atlanta summer weather. A shoulder bag is not a bad idea for clips & other items. It would give a frontier feel and be more in keeping with the feel of the show.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 9:32 AM

TRISTAN

BrownCoat1, thanks for that!

Now, of course, I'll end up with a G36 arsenal...

I did see several soldiers with the shoulder bags, so I thought they would fit in well. I may actually hit the costume shop tonight to play with leather bags and belt pouches...see what I can come up with. There may be photos tomorrow.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 9:54 AM

TRISTAN

I have just been perusing our message board off-site, and have come up with a ruling regarding peace-tying knives. (thanks to both Boomer and BrownCoat1 for the info)
When at a Con that requires peace-tying weapons, members of the 76th will use zip-ties (they come in black) to secure their edged weapons into their sheaths. This will prevent the possibility of all sorts of unpleasantness from occuring.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 1:55 PM

QUANDOM

Can the while color weapon proposed as a sniper rifle take a standard scope? My Crossman can on its top rail. A $20 scope is available for it.

Q

"The Spirit of 76"

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Monday, December 18, 2006 2:20 PM

DOCJUBAL

Quote:
Originally posted by quandom:

Can the while color weapon proposed as a sniper rifle take a standard scope? My Crossman can on its top rail. A $20 scope is available for it.

I don't own an airsoftie of the SL8 just now. However: if the model has an accurate copy of the top rail on the SL8, it should accept standard scope mounts easily.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 6:01 PM

TRISTAN

Doc, just popping in quick-like to post a photo or two of the "cut-down" Double Eagle G36 so y'all can see how compact it can really get. This was the one I thought might work for the medics, demo guys, etc.

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Monday, December 18, 2006 6:14 PM

NICODEMUS

That looks like it could almost fit in a modified thigh holster.

Having studied what's been said so far, my loadout is likely to be the cut-down G36 and a shoulder bag or (if funds and compatability allow) a harness of some sort loaded with demo gear. No knives in my loadout will mean one less thing to worry about.

**************
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Tuesday, December 19, 2006 2:49 AM

DOCJUBAL

GRENADE!

From a recent Prop Store Of London auction, fresh from the Big Damn Movie:

Some of you will have already seen this fine piece.
For them as haven't... enjoy!

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Tuesday, December 19, 2006 5:16 AM

TRISTAN

Morning, Nico.
Yes, I do think it would fit into a modified thigh holster. I had not thought of that...
As for the demo-gear harness, if you have an idea, I have leather. I enjoy building things, so I would be more than happy to see what we can come up with together.
The rest of your rig sounds like it's going to look good!

Doc! Whoo-hoo! Grenades!

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Tuesday, December 19, 2006 6:37 PM

TRISTAN

Doc, we are having a "Moving Party" to get info to the proboard...would you mind pulling the relevant info from this thread and posting a new weapons thread over there at your convenience?

No rush, just want to have it over there in case FFF goes down for a spell again.

Thank you!

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Tuesday, December 19, 2006 11:22 PM

DOCJUBAL

Jes' awaitin' the setup of the sub-forum for weapons, Colonel.

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Tuesday, December 19, 2006 11:33 PM

BABYWITHTHEPOWER

Quote:
Originally posted by Nicodemus:
Having studied what's been said so far, my loadout is likely to be the cut-down G36 and a shoulder bag or (if funds and compatability allow) a harness of some sort loaded with demo gear.

I have some extra bandoliers in my Army gear if you're interested in one or two. Here's a picture of what they look like:

They are the pouches on his hips. Each one has 4 pockets and each one could easily hold a grenade. I have several of these, one is going to RIMG and one to Tristan, though I should have extras if you want them.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Tuesday, December 19, 2006 11:34 PM

BABYWITHTHEPOWER

Quote:
Originally posted by DocJubal:
Jes' awaitin' the setup of the sub-forum for weapons, Colonel.

Done

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Wednesday, December 20, 2006 12:31 AM

DOCJUBAL

Thanks to our tireless XO, information on the weapons of the 76th can now be found here:

http://76thbattalion.proboards59.com/index.cgi?board=weapons

As updates occur, I'll post notifications here.

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Wednesday, December 20, 2006 1:03 AM

BABYWITHTHEPOWER

Quote:
Originally posted by DocJubal:
Thanks to our tireless XO,

I do what I can.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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Wednesday, December 20, 2006 1:49 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

Digging the close up of Jayne's grenade. Thanks Doc.

Now I will just have to get my prop making buddy to work on this little beauty for me. I could sure use two or three of these little beauties for my rig.

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Wednesday, December 20, 2006 2:04 AM

RIVERISMYGODDESS

Lookin' good y'all, lookin' good.

Tristan, thanks for the broken down shot of the Double Eagle G36. I am pretty sure that is what we medics are going to use, as having a little bit less cumbersone of a weapon would help us.

~jimi
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Wednesday, December 20, 2006 3:58 AM

TRISTAN

Morning, all. I am home ill today, so I will be on and off the boards when I can get to my computer.

Thanks for the shift, Doc, and thanks to the XO for creating a space for everything.

Browncoat1, I think we could all use some of those grenades!

RIMG, not a problem at all. If you need more photos, just let me know. The main issue I have with the Double Eagle is that the strap is WAY too short to be useful.

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Wednesday, December 20, 2006 4:21 AM

RIVERISMYGODDESS

As far as the strap goes, I had already planned to get/make a better one, as you pointed out when you first got your gun that it was pretty useless. I really need to go ahead and buy a couple.

~jimi
SFC Alexander, Chief Medic for the 76th Indepentent Army Battalion http://76thbattalion.homestead.com/index.html
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'cause the Roman Gods up to that point were crap. Jeff, the god of biscuits, and Simon, the god of hair-dos.

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Wednesday, December 20, 2006 4:39 AM

TRISTAN

Oh, yeah...I did, didn't I?

I am not sure if you have already thought about it RIMG, but I think the thin WWII-era M1 straps might work...

______________________________________
Commanding Officer of the 76th Independent Battalion

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Thursday, December 21, 2006 10:55 PM

DOCJUBAL

Just a little something to look forward to after the holidays...

With the permission of the CO and the XO, I'll be running a little contest next month.

Creativity will not only be required, but desired...

So, all you propmakers out there? Enjoy the holiday, and come back refreshed, rejuvenated, and ready.

See you soon!

--------------------
"Jubal 'Doc' Harris" // Bill Ernoehazy

SGT, 76th Independent Battalion

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Wanna?
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