Platinum, Credits and Trade: Money in the Firefly 'Verse by Kozure

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Platinum, Credits and Trade: Money in the Firefly 'Verse

POSTED BY: KOZURE
UPDATED: Saturday, August 28, 2004 20:22
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Friday, March 19, 2004 11:48 AM

Hola, Browncoats,

I did some background research for my Firefly-based board game and ran up against a few tidbits of information about the Firefly ‘Verse regarding currency. The thread about body armour and how much it would cost got me thinking about money again.

I've been looking at how much things cost and how much our favourite crew got paid. Specifically, I'm looking at the scripts for any reference to credits or platinum, the two major units (or medium for transferrence) of currency mentioned on the show.

CANONICAL EVIDENCE

In "Serenity", Mal demands and eventually gets "200 credits in platinum" for his stolen Alliance food rations. Presumably this price is marked down for being stolen goods and for selling out of desperation.

In "The Train Job" Niska gives them half up front and promises the other half later, but no amount is mentioned. The price of six crates of Pascaline B is described as a "tidy fortune".

In "Bushwhacked", hard-subsidies for fourteen plus families is described as being "about a fortune" but they are relieved of their salvage by the Alliance at the end.

In "Jaynestown", they pick up a job, but the price is not discussed. On the other hand, Jayne describes his heist as being "about 60,000, untraceable". I presume by this he means 60,000 credits, but he never actually says this, so it could be platinum. 60,000 of whatever he stole can presumably be a wealthy man's fortune and enough to be split between the hundreds of mudders in Canton and make Jayne a folk hero.

No money is mentioned in "Out of Gas", save that Jayne's cut of 7% is considered "standard" and has been raised to 10% cut by the beginning of “Serenity”.

In "Safe" Mal and the Grange brothers haggle over the price of the cows, ranging between 20 and 30 a head. No actual currency is mentioned. They finally settle on 25. It's hard to estimate how many cows there were; two dozen might be a good guess, for a total of 600 (24 x 25). Later, in a flashback, Simon Tam is shown to be freed by his father Gabriel for 2000 credits (the currency is mentioned specifically) in bail money.

In "Ariel" Simon rhymes off the price for several of his drugs: ivoprovalyn - 50 platinum (street value) then says "Maybe twenty credits". Propoxin - "maybe eighty", Hydrozapam "two hundred". At these prices, it's hard to imagine exactly how much money they would make off of this heist, but you get a comparative value from "War Stories"

In "War Stories" the money that everyone has left after spending a fair amount on personal binges (apples, etc.) is pooled to ransom Wash. This is described as being "...five times what you paid us for the train job." by Zoe. Thus the amount they would've made from the Train Job (presumably a small cut of the 'tidy fortune' for fencing the Pascaline D) was two fifths of the amount they got from the Ariel heist. It's interesting to note that not all of the medicine has been fenced by this point, as this is what Mal and Wash set out to negotiate with Bolles.

In "Heart of Gold" the crew is supposed to be paid "in trade" though I suspect that most of them ended up doing it out of loyalty to Mal and a sense of respect/friendship for Inara.

In "Objects in Space", Early mentions that the bounty for the Tams is "200,000", though once again, no units are mentioned.

SPECULATION

Credits vs. Platinum

Simon's off-hand estimations of the price of drugs in Ariel suggests a strange exchange rate - the price for ivoprovalyn is 50 platinum on the street, but he also gives a rough worth of 20 credits. This suggests an exchange of 50 platinum = 20 credits, or 1 credit = 2.5 platinum. This seems odd. One might guess that platinum is the preferred unit of exchange on the street and for shady deals... it seems to be a physical coin, as evidenced by the pouch tossed to Patience. Similarly, the coins seen to scatter on the ground in "Safe" would also fit with this model. Historically, however, a unit of hard currency (gold or silver in the American West) was generally valued at a higher price than paper money.

In other scenes (with betting on games or brief payments) paper money is seen. One can presume that these are "credits" which appear to be the medium of exchange for the Alliance (Gabriel Tam pays Simon's bail of 2000 credits).

As speculated by others, one can imagine a huge inflation rate and/or devaluation of Independent currency following the war. It can be easily imagined that platinum is the coin of trade on the Rim. Silver dollars were in high demand during the American Civil War for similar reasons - the runaway inflation of costs in the South and the North caused people to hoard and eventually laws were passed to prevent hording and encourage the use of paper money. Just to demonstrate that Firefly isn’t a precise retelling of the Reconstruction period, we should be reminded that the Confederates had a problem with too much paper money, not too many coins.

Payments, Values and Costs

At the beginning of Serenity, it seems like the money situation is tight enough that Jayne hasn’t been paid – “ten percent of nothing…” and Serenity won’t have enough money for fuel if the job doesn’t come through. The “200 in platinum” is tricky – does that mean that it’s 200 units worth of platinum, or two hundred credits worth of platinum? I’ve taken it to mean 200 credits worth of platinum. Apparently, given Mal’s contented expression at the end of “Serenity”, the 200 in platinum he got from Patience will be enough to keep the crew happy and the ship flying for at least a little while.

If 60,000 (platinum or credits, hard to say) is the amount stolen from Higgins, presumably a very wealthy man, and 200,000 is a massive ransom for the Tams, we have an upper end estimation of what constitutes a lot of money in the Firefly verse.

The bail paid for Simon being in a blackout zone (?) is 2,000 credits, which apparently gives even a wealthy man like Gabriel Tam pause (or at least enough to make him mention it).

One can make an estimate of the value of the haul from Ariel as being at least 20-200 credits per vial, or a quick average of around 100 credits for the three drugs mentioned. Multiply that by the literally dozens of vials dumped into the two coffin-sized containers, and you can begin to guess how much money was made. Even if you estimate (conservatively) that around 200 vials were taken at 100 credits apiece, they grossed 20,000 credits worth of drugs from the job. Of course, one wouldn’t get anywhere near the full value of the drugs fencing it… say the crew makes 10% of the haul at around a total of 2,000cr.

The crew then spends a small amount on apples and other goodies (a bucketful of apples must cost a bit less than a cow, which is between 20 and 30 credits), and then is forced to ransom Wash. If Zoe throws down roughly 2,000cr to Niska, then one fifth of that amount is 400cr, which is one half of what they would’ve gotten paid in total. Thus, one can estimate (conservatively) that the crew would’ve gotten 800cr total for the train job. If we accept that the price paid per head of cattle was given in credits, we have payment estimates for four jobs – 200cr for the salvage in “Serenity”, 600cr for the cattle shipment in “Safe”, 800cr for the train job and at least 2,000cr for the “Ariel” heist. Given that it takes 200cr or less to run Serenity for a few weeks, these amounts seem relatively consistent.

Of course, aside from the actual, canonical amounts, all of these values are estimations, so I could be far off the mark. I offer them only as speculation and suggestions of interest to the Firefly fan.

“Wheel never stops turning, Badger.” – Mal

“That only matters to the people on the rim.” – Badger

Kozure the Kamikaze Highlander

Proud Citizen of Canada-That-Was

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Friday, March 19, 2004 2:31 PM

KALIMEERI

Whew! SHINY!

Jen dao mei.

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Monday, March 22, 2004 5:22 AM

KOZURE

Quote:
Originally posted by kalimeeri:
Whew! SHINY!

Jen dao mei.

Yeah, I guess that was a little long. Oh well, it might come in handy for anyone who is thinking about an RPG based on the series.

Kozure the Kamikaze Highlander

Proud Citizen of Canada-That-Was

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Monday, March 22, 2004 7:50 AM

DELIA

Wow! I'm impressed. Thanks for an interesting read.

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Monday, March 22, 2004 7:52 AM

LODRIL

Regarding the exchange rates... I watched Ariel last night, so I was pondering that myself.

Generally, hard coin currencies have held value better than paper/credit currencies because they're easier to spend. In an economy with the one all-powerful government with fingers in everything, it's not hard to imagine that credits could be more valuable than hard coins. Since most transactions would require credits in such an economic system, coins would probably be cumbersome to trade for credits and not much use for everyday items.

Hard coins would be the currency of choice for more illicit markets, but for simple things, like food, credits would probably be the currency of choice.

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Monday, March 22, 2004 9:55 AM

DEBBIEBUK1

Thanks Kozure for all the thinking you did (not to mention writing it all down), I was going over the same ground for my silly monopoly game but couldn't get my head round the sums/ all the data.

Shiny in the extreme

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Monday, March 22, 2004 12:13 PM

KOZURE

Quote:
Originally posted by debbiebuk1:
Thanks Kozure for all the thinking you did (not to mention writing it all down), I was going over the same ground for my silly monopoly game but couldn't get my head round the sums/ all the data.

Shiny in the extreme

You're quite welcome. Anything to help out fellow Browncoats.

Costs, speeds and time are things that writers of science fiction/fantasy shows seem to have a lot of problems with. I've been trying to figure out the relative distances between "systems" mentioned in Firefly (for the record, I'm a proponent of the 'many-systems' model, not the 'one-system, many planets & moons' model - but I can see how the other concept might be possible) and times and destinations are somewhat fluid. I'm not sure if they ever mentioned prices in the "Show Bible", but they usually seem consistent with a 19th century feel (i.e. 200 credits is a fair amount of money in 2517, as $200 was in America around 1870). The only exceptions are Jayne's theft of 60,000 credits and the bounty on the Tams of 200,000cr, which seem like ridiculously high amounts.

It's hard to compare prices as well. The price per head of beef cattle ranges between $70-80 USD lately, which would imply that you can multiply Firefly prices (the Grange brothers paid 25 credits a head for the cattle in Safe) by three to get 2004 prices. Going by this rule, the 200 credits that Mal got for the salvaged food ration bars seems like peanuts ($600 USD?). If you assume that the price was 25 'platinum', then using Simon's conversion of 2.5 platinum per credit, you're paying 10 credits for a cow, and your conversion factor is 7 and Mal and company got the equivalent of $1400 USD for the rations. Conversely, if you base your prices on wages for the crew and fuel for a few weeks being 200 credits, most of the other prices mentioned seem too high or too low. The only things which seemed internally consistent were the relative payoffs for the jobs - a low risk salvage paid 200cr, while the high risk Ariel job netted them ten times or more that price.

Fortunately, in its short run, Firefly never had to deal with the notoriously bad math of Joss Whedon (by his own admission and from DVD commentary on the Angel and Buffy DVDs) when determining dates and people's ages.

Good thing no vampires were involved.

Of course, at least we don't have to deal with stardates.

Kozure the Kamikaze Highlander

Proud Citizen of Canada-That-Was

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Monday, March 22, 2004 1:08 PM

DITB

some of my thoughts:

sci-fi being bad for numbers (time, money, distance):
this is just pros and cons. putting in values for everything can be very dangerous. leaving them out will make some people wonder and puzzle, but won't hurt the native environment (it will only hurt when people are making their own spin offs

). simply, they leave (meaningful) numbers out because if they get them wrong it'll be much worse.

cows:
i don't think it's fare to compare the cattle to current beef cattle. for one, the current value takes into account factory farms. also, in firefly, those aren't necessarily strictly beef cattle. it's most likely the primary purpose, as clearly implied by mal, but i'd be surprised if the disreputable men don't get some dairy out of them first. there's also the fact that most current beef cattle aren't used for leather, as the firefly cows most certainly would be.

yeah, so i'm not really sure what i'm argueing about here, but i think some of those issues are important to consider. yup.

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Monday, March 22, 2004 1:20 PM

KOZURE

Very good points, DitB, especially considering the "damned if you do, damned if you don't" aspect of pinning down technological and economic numbers.

I'm frankly quite happy that Firefly never really fell into the "quantum foam /tachyon /nanite /particle-of-the-week" trap that a lot of other science fiction shows fall prey to. They don't discuss how a "standard radion accelerator drive" works - just that it is working or it isn't.

As for cattle prices, I was just throwing those numbers out to demonstrate how difficult it is to compare prices - exactly as you make so clear.

Other factors that might affect the price: Jiangyin is probably a lot less accessable than your typical US cattle auction; the price is 'black market' in that Harrow didn't want the shipment widely known and Badger was involved for whatever reason; Mal haggles by an increment of five credits, which a large portion of the price.

All of the things you mention are very important to consider in relation to this topic.

Kozure the Kamikaze Highlander

Proud Citizen of Canada-That-Was

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Monday, March 22, 2004 1:51 PM

LJOSALF

Just to throw a new wrinkle into the mix--suppose that credits represent promissory notes from Blue Sun as opposed to official currency? A kind of McDollars originally created to permit trade in Blue Sun goods that became so reliable that, say, during the war they came to be used routinely for goods with manufacture or provenance other than Blue Sun. Thereby becoming a pseudo currency that came to be entrenched in the culture. More prevalent where Blue Sun products are more prevalent, i.e. The Core, and underwriting the continued power of the megacorp itself. The exchange rate could be pretty fluid depending on what you wanted to buy, where, and with which currency.

Just a thought although probably a red herring....

Ljosalf

The voyage of discovery is not in seeking new landscapes but in having new eyes.
Marcel Proust (1871 - 1922)

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Tuesday, March 23, 2004 4:45 PM

RANGER

Just a couple of thoughts on this issue. First is that I imagine that the difference between coin and credits is one of technology. They both serve the same purpose of providing a base against which local currencies can be exchanged. I think the core probably uses electronic banking with accounts being valued in credits, but transactions priced in local terms. Over time the credit became a currency value in and of itself with most people simply avoiding the messy problem of converting to local currency. On the rim, with no real communications infrastructure, the coin serves the same function. Metal coin (pick your metal) was issued as a safe means of exchange over local paper money.

As to setting comparative values, I think that gets tricky based on the very different natures of the economies in the core and on the rim. I think when Simon says that something is worth "50 platinum, maybe 20 credits" he is not making a direct conversion, but rather comparing the difference between the core, where meds are probably pretty easy to get and the rim, where the local supply is much more problematic.

One final thought to add even more confusion. Inflation or deflatin may have resulted in a radical change in currency values. They may actually be talking about two different values whent they refer to a given price. When a society goes through a significant revaluation of currency (which could have happened in the unification war) it's not uncommon for people to still refer to the old prices even though they may be off by quite a bit. In Yugoslavia in the 1980s people used to multiply prices by 1,000 for things because the money had been revalued at 1 new dinar for 1,000 old dinars. People kept using the old prices out of habbit, even 20 years later.

Just some things to mull over I guess.

Traveller, if you go to Sparta, tell them you have seen us lying here as the Law commands.

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Tuesday, March 23, 2004 5:38 PM

NIGHTTRAIN

Thats some very good observations, but my guess is that they just make up the numbers as they go along writing episodes and don't put too much thought into it. Like all that technical babble they just make up when kaylee starts talking about engines or ships.

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Saturday, August 28, 2004 8:22 PM

ROUTIER

Wow! I'm impressed with Kozure's detailed analysis - I was about to do one myself.

From first watching the series (which was only a few weeks ago) I've been mentally multiplying prices by 10 into equivalent US$, and it hasn't seemed too far off.

Have a look at:

http://www.fireflywiki.org/Firefly/FireflyMoney

There's another view of the credit/platinum issue here, together with a very nice image of one of those 100 credit/platinum bills. The Chinese characters on the right hand globe says "bank".

For relative costs of things, it would be interesting to look at the Old West as a comparison. Relative costs of things in 2002 are very different to even 50 years ago, so who knows what the relative costs of, say, transport vs food will be in 500 years time?

Something no-one has mentioned yet is the use of the term "square" for money. Can't remember the episode(s), but it was there. Must go back & look. Is this the same as platinum? Square ingots of platinum? Square banknotes?

So much to work out...

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