Who did River expect to step through the door? by ljosalf

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Who did River expect to step through the door?

POSTED BY: LJOSALF
UPDATED: Thursday, April 8, 2004 17:15
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Tuesday, April 6, 2004 3:22 PM

In the beginning of Safe, when River is babbling "no more tests", "dress me up like a gorram doll", followed by imaginative cussin' in Chinese, Simon reaches for his med kit which she seizes and throws towards the door...and the person stepping through it. The person who steps through the door is Mal and River says, surprised: "You're not him." Who did River expect to come through the door? She follows this up with her morbid and creepifyin' statement about the length of time it takes to drain the human body of blood given adequate vacuum producing technology. (She never after makes any complaints about what she is wearing, btw.)

So, who was River channeling in this scene? Was it one person or more than one?

Ljosalf

The voyage of discovery is not in seeking new landscapes but in having new eyes.
Marcel Proust (1871 - 1922)

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Tuesday, April 6, 2004 4:32 PM

SHINY

Perhaps a scientist/doctor from the academy who experimented on her? Perhaps her father?

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Tuesday, April 6, 2004 4:47 PM

LINDLEY

It just occured to me that I can't really picture River dressing herself in the morning. Its just a tad too......normal for her.

I wonder if Simon had to help her with that.....wouldn't that be strange for him.

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Wednesday, April 7, 2004 6:48 AM

SAMURAIX47

Quote:
Originally posted by Lindley:
It just occured to me that I can't really picture River dressing herself in the morning. Its just a tad too......normal for her.

I wonder if Simon had to help her with that.....wouldn't that be strange for him.

Not if he helped change her diapers when she was a baby or toddler. A big brother helping little sister picking out clothing to put on for the day. And the genius that she is she probably started doing it herself at an early age too. I don't see the mother as being the helpful type. Heck i sometimes have to do that for my 7 year old... ask her what she wants to wear, pull her shirts over her head, etc. So he's acting as big bro more than being doctor Tam, which we see in several episodes.

Even though it isn't a part of present day doctor training, more for nurses, I could imagine that doctors in FF 'verse get some better training on how to deal with patients in a more caring manner... basics like patient hygiene, helping change clothes, cleaning the patient, etc.

Jaymes

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Wednesday, April 7, 2004 10:10 AM

EMBERS

Also when you are caring for a sick friend or relative the whole 'privacy' thing become moot really quickly...you get used to a little nudity or changing bed pans or whatever pretty quickly...
So if River needs help occassionally (or constantly) I doubt if it really worries Simon, who is probably still just really grateful that she is alive and that he is helping her...

Altho I'll point out that some of her 'outfits' are a little weird...like the kind of things that 2-3 year olds come up with (skirts and sweaters that don't match or even look like they are for the same time of year)...

And I agree, I thought her head was at the 'school' and she expected some terrible scientist to walk in, so seeing Mal was a surprise to her.

'I'll be in my bunk'

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Wednesday, April 7, 2004 12:52 PM

LJOSALF

Interesting. Everyone seems to think River is experiencing a memory instead of something more immediate. Mal notes that the cussin' in Chinese is a recent innovation, something picked up in the months since River came aboard Serenity. (The translation is apparently something like: Stupid son of a drooling harlot and a monkey. See this terrific site: http://fireflychinese.home.att.net/episode1.html#sa)

Why not consider that Simon and Mal (and the audience) mistake some of River's weirder moments for echoes of her past instead of reflections of her present? The oddness of River's wardrobe, BTW, is likely due to it having been donated by the other three women on board as Simon doesn't appear to have planned far enough in advance to have women's clothing in his luggage at the beginning of the series. Might there not be someone else on board who could be thinking grumpily about being dressed up like a gorram doll? What about Inara? Put the speculation that Book is an Alliance agent and not a bonafide shepherd together with the "outfit" and it could even be Book. Heck, maybe Jayne is thwacking the cattle to take out some aggression 'cause he's been harking back to being dressed like a girl in his childhood.

River was enough in the moment to object to Simon giving her a "soother"; so, why wouldn't the person she expected to see step through the door be someone right there on the ship?

Ljosalf

The voyage of discovery is not in seeking new landscapes but in having new eyes.
Marcel Proust (1871 - 1922)

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Wednesday, April 7, 2004 1:33 PM

RHUTTNER

I don't think she was expecting someone to come in the door. I view her comment to be along the lines of someone being introduced as someone they are not, and getting found out.

I think the him she is referring to is her father, but she is seeing and recognizing Mal. She is just getting a 'father' vibe from him.

Now, jump to later in the episode when she tells Simon:

Quote:

You need to eat. Keep up your strength.
We won't be here long. Daddy will come
and take us home. And I'll get better.

And sure enough Mal comes and takes them home.

We've seen examples of her seeing the future. I think shes getting a father vibe off Mal, but doesnt understand why so she says "you're not him". Then after being captured she understands (but does not fully comprehend) more and accepts Mal as her father figure and Serenity as home.

Joss comments something like this in Serenity, but this is how I took it before the DVDs were released.

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Wednesday, April 7, 2004 4:32 PM

LJOSALF

Hmmmm! worth considering. I still think the Chinese cursing, the morbid and creepifying statement about draining the body of blood, and possibly the "Stupid s.o.b., dress me up like a gorram doll." accusation are readings from the crew. After all, your take on Mal feeling like "daddy" implies she was reading Mal before he walked in the door. Why not others in the crew?

Ljosalf

The voyage of discovery is not in seeking new landscapes but in having new eyes.
Marcel Proust (1871 - 1922)

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Wednesday, April 7, 2004 5:10 PM

RHUTTNER

Quote:
Originally posted by ljosalf:
After all, your take on Mal feeling like "daddy" implies she was reading Mal before he walked in the door.

No, I said she saw Mal, recognized him as Mal, and felt 'daddy'. Never said or meant to imply that she read him at all. It was an instant feeling. It is a foreshadow to the end of the episode.

Your statement, as well as the subject of this thread implies that she knew someone was going to come through the door. I disagree and I feel that she was surprised that he was there.

But, the comment about draining blood could be an indication she knows Book will be shot.

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Wednesday, April 7, 2004 5:13 PM

LINDLEY

"You can't just stick 20 needles in my head and ask me what I see!"

Hmm. The Alliance could have been testing her psychic ability. That adds credibility to the idea that her next statement would be "what she sees".

Heck, "you're not him" could just be a reflection of the fact that she was reading someone other than Mal a second before.

Actually....that first line could have been a read too. Does one of the crew have a needle phobia besides River? For some reason, I keep thinking Wash does, but I don't remember a specific line.

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Thursday, April 8, 2004 3:44 PM

WILDHEAVENFARM

Quote:
Originally posted by Lindley:
It just occured to me that I can't really picture River dressing herself in the morning. Its just a tad too......normal for her.

I wonder if Simon had to help her with that.....wouldn't that be strange for him.

On her better days, she probably does dress herself. And I don't think it would be too wierd for Simon; he would just shift into doctor-mode, where female bodies are entirely uninteresting.

Mary
Always a beast, never a burden.

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Thursday, April 8, 2004 5:15 PM

KARENKAY99

Quote:
But, the comment about draining blood could be an indication she knows Book will be shot.

i always figured she knew this because she learned it from blue hands and their very scary stick.

"They say the snow on the roof is too heavy. They say the ceiling will cave in. His brains are in terrible danger."

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